Large beer garden/dance area. Large indoor area for the public.

I suspect they are facing permitting / financing delays and are just keeping it open for a few more months. Hopefully it doesn't turn into another few months..

More delays..embarrassing.

Bait and switch.

Fraud, def wrongful or criminal deception that results in financial or personal gain...Alrighty I think we are there

"its not a "money thing" hello its always a money thing

https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilto...on-delays.html

Cirque du Soleil booking raises more questions about the timing of FirstOntario Centre renos, which will be more than two years behind schedule

We’re coming up on the third anniversary of city council choosing the Hamilton Urban Precinct Entertainment Group (HUPEG) to redevelop FirstOntario Centre. The teamsthat called it home have already bolted or are making plans to leave. Yet the downtown arena remains untouched and according to the city, it has yet to receive building permits or site plans.

And on Monday — two weeks after saying the Grey Cup festival could use the building in November — a Cirque du Soleil ice show was announced for mid December which suggests shovels aren’t going in the ground any time soon.

What’s going on?

“We’re closer than we’ve ever been,” says HUPEG president PJ Mercanti. “That’s, I think, the honest to goodness truth. We’re just about there.”

That answer sounds positive. But if you’re also thinking it sounds somewhat familiar, you’re not wrong.

When HUPEG was first chosen for the project in the summer of 2020 we were told construction could begin in the fall of 2021. By April of 2021, Mercanti — who has previously said COVID slowed the process — was saying negotiations to get things rolling were wrapping up quickly.

“We are very, very close,” he said at the time.

When a master agreement was signed with the city that June, a new expected start date of the fall of 2022 was announced. That October, the Oak View Group — led by former Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment boss Tim Leiweke — was brought on board as a partner. At that point, HUPEG partner Jasper Kujavsky said plans were being significantly upscaled but the final budget was just a month or so away.

By July 2022, he said site plan approvals and building permits should be ready by February 2023 and construction should begin after this past Bulldogs’ season ended. Maybe in June or July.

By February, Kujavsky tweaked the start time again.

“We’ll be under construction in the fall of 2023,” he said.

Yet the city says it hasn’t yet received any site plans or building permits. And a few weeks ago, the arena was made available for the Grey Cup festival in mid-November which means nothing will be happening before then.

Then on Monday, the Cirque du Soleil ice show was added for a four-day stay beginning a month after the Grey Cup. Which is going to mean construction won’t begin until sometime in 2024 at the earliest. And will surely raise even more questions. Such as, is there a new anticipated start date for the reno?

“That is an active conversation,” Mercanti says. “But the intent is for it to be as close to the Grey Cup wrap-up as reasonably possible.”

With the project slated to take 20 months, it should be finished sometime in the fall of 2025. Assuming it started right at the beginning of the year and everything remained on schedule. Which is a big ask considering how smoothly things have gone so far.

If HUPEG and OVG are partners in this, do they have a signed agreement in place?

“We’re working through the process with the city and in the … immediate future, more information and details will be made public,” Mercanti says. “But we are pleased with the progress that we are making and we’re very hopeful to have a conclusion to OVG’s formal engagement with the project in the very near future.”

OVG says it has no updates to share.

Has a construction company been signed on yet to do the work?

“That’ll be another one of the details that we’ll be making available to the public in the near future,” Mercanti says.

There’s no doubt this rebuild is a big task. Initially, the arena reno was going to cost about $50 million as part of a larger reimagining of that downtown area that includes Hamilton Place and the convention centre. Now the rink alone is going to be more than $100 million.

Mercanti says this isn’t a money issue. There are simply many layers that HUPEG is working through with the city and its partners. Much has been happening behind the scenes, including work on the architectural drawings and other preliminary tasks so the process will speed up once it gets going.

Let’s hope. Having no teams and few events there is already going to cost the city money. And here’s guessing all these delays aren’t exactly imbuing the citizenry with an overwhelming feeling of confidence about the whole thing.

Meanwhile, one more holdup that pushes a start date into March or April next year would mean the now-departed Bulldogs could’ve played their entire season at the rink rather than in Brantford.

That would be a bad, bad look.

I mean, maybe it will start fall 2023. Why couldn't they update the exterior facade at the same time that events happen inside. I see no reason why that couldn't happen. This Spec article is pure speculation, bad journalism.

Cirque booked Dec 14 to 17, 2023.

Where are the wonderful savings to taxpayers for the gifted land to this outfit.

Open the agreement for all to see.

No contract with Oak View, no contractor, no plan.

Btw, met Radley. A more honest individual you will not meet.

Agree, met Scott a number of times, he seems pretty guinine / grounded. Should be no question that a reasonably detailed project plan be presented with the award of the facility management contract, along with penalties for delays. The community is completely in the dark, and the politicians I can assume will wash their hands of it. I could envision this crew handing it back to the city after years of further negligent.

Well the city no longer needs to pay for capital maintenance or operating costs(not to mention the much needed full scale reno cost) at the facility so wonderful savings to the taxpayer are happening as we speak.

HUPEG hears FirstOntario Centre anxiety
by PJ Mercanti, President of HUPEG
Friday May 26, 2023

https://www.thespec.com/opinion/cont...e-anxiety.html

As the leaders of HUPEG, we understand and share your concerns and are eager to address them as soon as possible.

Our commitment to invest a minimum of $50 million in the renovation of the FirstOntario Centre, including a new exterior façade and video board, comprehensive transformation of the lower bowl, expanded concourse level, and a new flexible curtaining system for the upper bowl balcony.

The restrictions governing our ability to comment publicly have also made it very difficult to comment more broadly on the complaints and criticisms levelled against us by former and current tenants of First Ontario as much as we might wish to. Beyond that, we can clarify a couple of items:

• There are no events booked at the Arena past Dec. 31, 2023, as the planning for the reconstruction of FOC is still scheduled for early in the first quarter of 2024.
• Our current stakeholder relations are in unison with the desire of Toronto Rock to return post renovations.
• We are hopeful that the Bulldogs will also want to return so that their fans can enjoy a world class environment for their favourite team.

We are deeply committed to this city and its future and invite your continued patience as we work through and look forward to being part of the changes that will bring new vibrancy to our downtown core.

the interesting part of that article for me is the 50million figure towards FOC. Hmmm didnt recently Jasper say at least 100, maybe 200m towards FOC.

50 million will basically be a coat of paint. For comparison, the 5000 seat OLG hall in Niagara cost 130 million in pre covid dollars.

The kool aid drinkers will say but look at how much they are saving the taxpayer. Truth is HUPEG is not a charity doing it for the money.

50 million is joke, agreed that will just be lipstick on a pig. :yuck:

Honestly don't think anything will happen on this file, sure it was envisioned being done with super cheap financing and that landscape has changed for the foreseeable future. Expect that this will get dragged out for as long as possible, and Hupeg will tap out noting unfavorable conditions.

also no mention of OVG (Oak View Group) who would be the real drivers of the reno. On the OVG website they list the FOC as their first Canadian project. No time frame mentioned.

Wonder if Vranich would’ve got this done quicker.

It would 100% be done by now with a nice coat of beige stucco on everything.

+ a bunch of retail units that will sit empty for years

Not to mention water leaking in on fans during rain storms

...and he'd also square up the roof design, eliminating those fancy curves, giving Copps a nice commie look. Finished in mismatched white and black panels ofcourse!

https://www.insauga.com/mississauga-...l-sports-team/

Rock will play the December slate of home games in Hamilton before moving to Mississauga for 20 months.

Bud Gardens in London is up for $33million in upgrades, and all this does is build a new warehouse at the back, refresh the Knights dressing room and update the kitchens and scoreboard. This for an arena half the size and age of FOC. If they aren't spending a couple hundred million on FOC, I think it will be a disappointment.

They said they would spend at least the $50m required by the contract. That doesn't preclude them from spending more.

Yes Ritsman, but the 50 m figure is right out of the mouth of Mercanti.

Previous releases hinted at spending more but this latest release was 50m.

"Our commitment to invest a minimum of $50 million"

He specifically said a minimum. Then also mentioned all the renos they plan to do, that will cost more than that. They may do a phased approach.

I suspect they will start with the inside, then perhaps once done, and start operating revenue service will begin the outside to pay for that portion of the plan.

Which is unfortunate because honestly the outside is the part we see the most often, but my hope is that the renovations make the inside a bit nicer and sound better so future concerts will be more likely to choose FOC.

They may be looking for a new sponsor to help with the funding as well. I believe I had hear the sponsorship deal with First Ontario was ending. I'd love a different name also since First Ontario Centre, and First Ontario Place are very confusing names.

I don't know how Hamilton got 2 venues with the first 2 initials being F.O.

We should probably consider ourselves lucky this province isn't spelled 'Untario', right?

XD

There are acronym word plays for the "C" too. :haha: :cheers:

The Toronto Rock released a statement they will be playing their December 23 games at FOC, and maybe beyond that?

Not much new in the release of the documents other than OVG has not signed on.

Hamilton releases details on multimillion-dollar ‘entertainment precinct’ deal with downtown developers
Deal with a private group to overhaul arena and build ‘entertainment precinct’ has faced criticism over lack of transparency

By Matthew Van Dongen
Spectator Reporter
https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilto...-precinct.html

In the face of criticism over secrecy, Hamilton has released most of its agreement with a private group planning to renovate the city’s aging entertainment facilities and radically remake large swaths of the downtown.

The 84-page document, which is blacked out in some areas, provides details about a 49-year lease agreement signed in 2021 with the Hamilton Urban Precinct Entertainment Group (HUPEG) that promises a renovation of the city’s aging downtown hockey arena, concert hall and convention centre.

The city initially said it could not reveal contract details for commercial competitiveness reasons — but a newly elected council voted this week to release a redacted version of the original agreement.

“The new council and mayor have made it really clear that they have a mandate of transparency,” said tourism manager Ryan McHugh in an interview when asked why the document was released now.

The original deal was lauded by city politicians at the time because it promised no taxpayer dollars would be spent on either the rebuild or future operations of the buildings, which currently require a $5-million-plus annual subsidy.

In return, the consortium will operate the venues — and earn ownership of three downtown city properties with plans to create an “entertainment precinct” and build condos.

The deal has faced mounting criticism, however, as popular arena tenants like the Hamilton Bulldogs hockey team and Honey Badgers basketball club found homes elsewhere after apparent miscommunication over construction timelines.

At one point, it was also thought Hamilton’s Commonwealth Games bid might result in federal or provincial dollars being invested into the arena — but the city’s chances at hosting the event appear to have fizzled.

HUPEG president PJ Mercanti addressed some of that criticism in an op-ed in The Spectator last week, acknowledging residents want “greater clarity” on the details of the agreement.

“Given the taxpayer assets at play and the pride our community has in its teams and sports facilities, we get it,” he wrote, while adding he faced “limitation on what we can say publicly” due to confidentiality agreements with partners.

Some highlights of the information released Wednesday:

* The document says HUPEG will pay a $1 a year to lease each of the entertainment facilities it takes over. In return, it guarantees to invest a minimum $50-million into the arena renovation, $10 million into the convention centre, $2.5 million into the concert hall and a $2 million donation to a planned art gallery fundraising campaign.
* The consortium will use ticket surcharges to gradually build up a capital repair fund.
* The 2021-dated document does not reflect the important, recent change in the HUPEG partnership that added international heavyweight developer Oak View Group, which will take over renovations of FirstOntario Centre arena.
* No information about OVG was released, said city real estate head Ray Kessler, because negotiations over the arena and concert hall lease with the new partner are still being negotiated.

However, he noted the minimum arena investment noted in the master agreement — $50 million by HUPEG — is now out of date, because OVG has publicly pledged to add at least another $50 million on top. That means “the magnitude of improvements, to the lower bowl and overall, are going to be substantially more,” Kessler said.

The document says HUPEG will use “commercially reasonable efforts” to relocate the Salvation Army from its York Boulevard location — and that the city will help “facilitate” those efforts.

Neither the city nor HUPEG owns the shelter — and the Christian-based organization has previously said it has no current plans to move. McHugh said Wednesday the agreement does not reflect any desire on behalf of the city to see the shelter move — only an offer to “facilitate discussions” if desired.

The master agreement spells out that the renovation plan for the arena does not depend on Commonwealth Games funding becoming available from upper levels of government.

Shhh..listen carefully. That sound you hear is another nail in the coffin for FOC and downtown. Andlauer group to purchase Ottawa Senators.

With the way Andlauer was treated by our trusted stewards at City Hall, who could blame him giving the finger to the Hammer.

Having met Michael, congrats on getting the Sens.

How is this "a nail in the coffin for FOC and downtown"....

Not sure how this is related to FOC. It's not like it was either Ottawa or the Bulldogs at FOC.

If he doesn't return (or sells the Bulldogs) another owner either AHL or OHL will gobble up the vacant space. Newly renovated arena in a highly sought after market (for OHL/AHL standards) will be an easy sell.

:tup:

I don't know why you were suspended. I do appreciate divergent views on many issues, but this post made no sense to me.

There was some back and forth between FrootLoops and Ritsman. I think it was Ritsman's post that was out of line. Curious why FrootLoops got suspended instead.

Fruitloops did something offensive on another thread which has since been deleted.

Usually when people get suspended the offending post is deleted as it didn't meet the forum's rules.. so you can't find the evidence. He was basically insulting Ritsman for no real reason from what I recall.

Yeah but then Ritsman made some pretty offensive comments himself.

I'm not a moderator but people often won't get suspended from one comment alone, unless it's particularly egregious.. Ritsman perhaps broke the rules as well but Fruitloops probably had a larger history of offending posts.. three strikes and you are out, so to speak.

Will be interesting to see what he does with the Bulldogs now and I haven't read but assume he gets Belleville (AHL) as well in the deal?

Either way, he may even sell off the Bulldogs but it really doesn't mean much of anything in regards to the renovations.

He could leave the Bulldogs in Brantford and shift Belleville to Hamilton, or put the Bulldogs in Belleville and shift the Belleville Senators here..

We'll have to see.

My bet long term is Hamilton ends up with an AHL team in Copps post-renovations.

It's hard enough to establish a fan base when you keep switching out teams, but I think it makes it harder when the league also keeps changing. I think they should aim for another OHL team instead of going back to AHL again.

I hope we get an AHL team. Hamilton had a huge loss when we lost an AHL team to OHL.

When you look at the attendances over the years of either franchise, neither did awesome in Hamilton. I mean the AHL did better in Hamilton than they are doing Belleville, but the big club doesn't look at the AHL team as a revenue generator. If anything, Belleville will move closer to, or actually to, Ottawa, not back to Hamilton, too have their players close by. I speculated in the Ottawa forum that they could even move into the Canadian Tire Centre after the Sens move to their new arena, assuming they build one. Or share the new 67's arena at Lansdowne, or even the new Slush Puppie Centre in Gatineau.

Tbh I'm not a sports guy whatsoever, but I enjoy attending the occasional hockey game. OHL games are just sad to attend. It's deserted. It feels like I'm watching a contact house league game with beer prices the same as an NHL game.

Group providing update to councillors September 20th.

https://www.thespec.com/news/hamilto...460f5b7d7.html

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...lton-1.6966975

Rock will play entire season in Hamilton... Wow, given that playoffs can go to the start of June, this project is just wasting away

lmao wow, this thing isn't happening. Wouldn't be surprised if interest rates caused the project to be unviable, and they're trying to now wait out the BoC until prices drop back down. Lame.

Maybe "The Family" isn't ready to pull the trigger. :cool:

The Brantford Bulldogs must be happy they've left. More likely for good now.

This thing gets sadly more comical by the day, with Spec article today noting.....

“While the announcement of the Toronto Rock’s upcoming season may have created some confusion, I want to assure the Hamilton community that the team’s schedule, as well as the shows we will be announcing in the coming weeks, has no bearing upon the progress of the proposed arena project,” OVG Canada president Tom Pistore said in a statement. “Preliminary work starting early in the new year can begin while the team is still playing, for example: external elements like signage and paint, clubs that are not currently in use, and an inactive concourse.”

The inactive concourse they are relating too is ground level... correct? Isn't this the level where team dressing rooms and equipment is held?

I thought the proposal was to create a new concourse, similar to that of Scotiabank arena for the lowerbowl with the existing concourse being used for suites and the upper bowl.

I really hope we get some sort of insight next week...


Also I really hope we get a new facade... If they just slap on some paint and call it a day would be absolutely on par with what I'd expect city hall to do.