So proud of what all the Texas metros are accomplishing. Keep growing and shining!

I have no interest in having a city rivalry for the goal of bragging rights and brawls. My thing is to simply compare Austin to Houston and Dallas to see how far we've come to approaching their level of greatness because they are the next benchmarks we would come to in Texas when you're talking skylines.

Yea.

West to East: Uptown Houston to Downtown Houston is 6 miles and in between Uptown and Downtown there are several other skyline clusters that are merging. There's Greenway Plaza which has the RO mega-project with 8-12 highrises on its own and the Paramount as well as a few other highrises near Levy Park. Greenway Plaza is merging into Uptown to its west and on its east side it already has merged with the highrise cluster in Upper Kirby. Kirby Drive curves near the bayou and changes its name to Allen Parkway, which itself has a highrise cluster of its own and is the area of Houston that's seeing the most intense amount of development, so Upper Kirby is starting to merge with Allen Parkway. In Allen Parkway you have mega-developments like Hanover's Buffalo Bayou, which will have 4 highrises and a few other midrises. There's also Regent Square which will have 4 highrises (one already built now) and several midrises. The Allen, which has 4 highrises and a few midrises. And random other highrises in the plans for Allen Parkway. Currently there are only 9 highrises in Allen Parkway, it will become 24-28 highrises with these mega-developments on tap and all of these developments that I mentioned have already started construction. These are just the ones we know about, meaning there could be much more announced in the future. Allen Parkway's highrise cluster is only 1 mile away from Downtown and with the Allen it will start its merging process with Downtown.

Then North to South: Downtown Houston to TMC is 4 miles with only 2 neighborhoods in between: Midtown Houston and the Museum District. Midtown has 7 highrises in the works right now, with the tallest being around 650' feet a part of the Laneways development that will bring 5 highrises total (one already completed and the second about to start construction in site prep) and Museum District already has a skyline of its own which will rapidly expand with Museo Plaza (3 highrises w/ tallest being over 700' feet), the Parklane Towers (3 buildings, all above 30 stories with the tallest being 50 stories), and 5-6 other highrises planned in the area. Then to its south you have TMC which is self-explanatory because it's bustling with activity and several mega-projects of its own. Some of the more ambitious ones will extend TMC southward towards the NRG Sports Complex, so that skyline is beginning to stretch out and incorporate more territory.

From Uptown to Downtown and then Downtown to TMC is 10 miles of highrises and skyscrapers and inside that area are all 4 of HOU's largest skylines, employment centers, and business districts: Downtown, Uptown, TMC, and Greenway Plaza. Not to mention several other smaller skylines like Allen Parkway, Museum District, and the now skyclimbing Midtown.

The hold-up for HOU had always been Midtown, which was filled to the brim with lowrise and midrise construction but now with less available space is going upward into highrises and skyscrapers in a very aggressive way. Pretty much every proposal for Midtown in the last 2 years has been highrise or skyscraper, with a few midrises thrown in here or there, and that's going to continue because Midtown is HOU's hottest and most fun neighborhood.

Even further down the line is the skyline connecting with points in the west. From Uptown HOU going west to Westchase, Memorial City, City Centre, and Energy Corridor, but this is a much much much more longterm vision from here.

Uptown to Downtown and Downtown to TMC is more short-term and medium-term. I think within 25 years it will look beastly and continuous. Those gaps are quickly filling in. There's still plenty more to go, especially with connecting Allen Parkway with Upper Kirby and then Greenway Plaza with Uptown but those are being addressed as we speak.

All three cities are really different.

Austin will have one very large skyline in its core. It will go from South Congress then cross the river into Downtown then cross into the Capitol District and then into the UT/West Campus area. Actually, let me re-phrase my statement since it already does this but it will beef up even more, especially after the Statesman site in SoCo gets developed across the river. I think what we'll also see is more highrise and skyscrapers make their way east of I-35 too on the other side of the freeway from downtown and begin developing there as DT/SoCo reach their limit with available space. Going east will drive them towards that Oracle Campus, which would be great. Beyond that ATX will likely only have small highrise clusters elsewhere like the Domain area.

Houston has several highrise clusters and business districts and the major ones are being stitched together into one unit. Even though HOU is a decentralized city, it still has enough centralization to where its 4 major districts are all in the core of the city; downtown, uptown, greenway plaza, and TMC and in between these are even smaller clusters of highrises and business districts that are each doing their part in stitching it all together. This will run the course over the next 25 years as it infills in the spaces in between the business districts and inside the business districts. Beyond that the next avenue for HOU will be to then fill in and integrate Memorial City, City Centre, Westchase and Energy Corridor to the west and Greenspoint to the north. The former is very likely as all it needs is infill between Uptown and Memorial City, the latter is unlikely because between Downtown and Greenspoint is nothing but lowrise SFHs.

Dallas in the city is unilateral. It has one major continuous skyline already going from Downtown into Uptown and into the tollway area. But the DFW region has so many other medium to large clusters already and is developing even more in its suburbs and the other principle city of Fort Worth. Dallas' city skyline will be large and respectable but its sheer weight will be valued at the metro level, unlike Austin or Houston. Houston does have some highrise clusters in the Woodlands and in Galveston but its not the same as it is in DFW which not only has DAL and FW but also Irving, Plano, Frisco, etc all growing and developing their own clusters. Not to mention several other cities in DFW that are doing it on a smaller scale.

TX developments are fun to watch because you're never watching a repeat of one city onto the next.

All of this^^^^

However, I do think that if we can achieve rail transit that we will eventually see up zoning along the central spine north of the river stitching together the Domain to Downtown and West Campus into a single visually coherent, if patchy, skyline.

I’m thinking particularly about these developments and areas either directly or indirectly aiding via effect on future market pressures in this process:

The Grove
The Triangle
Old mental health campus potential redevelopment
Highland Mall
Crestview Station
Heritage neighborhood
Hancock area

Essentially, these areas are like the future mid rise infill equivalent to the areas between Chicago’s Loop and Uptown, very patchy, but from afar makes the two ends appear like a single skyline.

This is a fascinating discussion. Many of you are saying the same sorts of things that I've thought of or that have occurred to me over the years.

That visual comparison is interesting because it is actually forcing me to change my perception of which cities in Texas are the largest as a matter of general knowledge. The idea of Austin as equal in significance to Dallas and Houston is another foreign notion that I'll have to become accustomed to.

I can also foresee downtown Fort Worth surging to catch (or even surpass) downtown Dallas at some point in the future, what with its exploding population as of the latest census estimates, lack of large suburbs nearby on the same level as Dallas and the upcoming development potential once the Panther Island project is complete.

And what's to come of El Paso? Or Corpus Christi? Or Lubbock or Midland, etc.?
Lots of potential! :cheers:

Wow! I can't wait to see how all of these projects when completed will make the skylines look!

The big difference in central Austin is land value. Values are way higher than the other Tx metros and just behind NYC / SF. This forces density and large projects. Similar to dynamics in Vancouver.

I don't mean to take this forum further off topic, but I can see Corpus Christi getting its act together and becoming a major tourist destination. It's a scenic city right on the water and once the new harbor bridge is over it'll be a nationally recognizable skyline.

I've been saying this for almost 10 years.

Cool thanks! I wouldn't be surprised if they shot for tallest in Texas if they're so close, almost looks 1050 ish from the images. Really exciting.

Still more infill needed but Austin is on the right path. If the current pipeline of projects get underway then it'll hyperdrive Austin's skyline into its beastly future form. What Austin needs the most is a 900' footer or a supertall, if it can get that and fill in some more of the gaps in its skyline then it can say "I'm here" to Dallas.

Dallas skyline panorama
https://live.staticflickr.com/7825/4...40d4b23a_h.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/7825/4...40d4b23a_h.jpg

Austin skyline panorama
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...8993c36f_k.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...8993c36f_k.jpg

Projects like 6XG, BBVA, 5C, the Republic, the Travis towers, 90 Rainey, 44 East, Natiivo, and the Railyards towers will change Austin's skyline.

Red River/Concordia/41st/35 and Hancock Center should also be upzoned a la Rainey and West Campus. I bet if you surveyed homeowners there a majority would want to sell.

Whoo Boy! You obviously don't know that neighborhood. They are some of the worst NIMBYs around. They fought tooth and nail against the Concordia / University Park development. In retrospect, they had good reason to be suspicious of the developers, but they also frequently go to battle with St. David's Hospital of all things.

I don't know what to do about SA. We're growing in size both population and area but the skyline is still flat. Just a couple 200 footers. Don't get me started complaining about our airport and lack of direction...

I feel your pain even though I love to visit San Antonio. Feel free to vent in Austin threads since it's not allowed in the S.A. sub-forum. :)

No question about the growing Austin skyline but on that Dallas pan it doesn’t show the right section of the skyline such as Reunion Tower and the Victory skyline area.

Still though, SA's downtown is second to none Texas in terms of historic beauty. Just need to start filling up those big parking lots.

I'm from Corpus, live in Austin, have all my family in Houston and yet still San Antonio, in my opinion, has the best downtown in Texas. It's the only city where I hope that there's no more skyscraper construction, but rather low-rise, dense infill. Along with that infill there should be architectural codes and guidelines that preserves the Spanish architecture. That'd be great and would make it a major tourist destination in my opinion

Austin really needs an i35 bypass for all the truck traffic

Austin has SH-130, a toll road that runs from Seguin, Texas, 80 miles north through East Austin to Georgetown. The problem is, the trucks choose not to use it. Just short of banning trucks from I-35, there's no way to encourage them to use it. For one thing, it's a toll road and there's nothing motivating them to choose to pay to use it, and it's kind of in the middle of nowhere, though, in true Texas style, it's being developed. I agree, though, the trucks are bad. We drove I-35 last night from north of downtown to our house in South Austin, and with some construction going on, it was down to a crawl. I counted 97 18 wheelers on both sides of I-35 from just south of downtown to our exit in South Austin. That was in the span of maybe 20 minutes.

At it's worst how bad has traffic on I-35 gotten during rush hour through Austin. I'm in the Temple/Belton area. I-35 can be a little congested but nothing like down there.

They should ban noisy trucks — the property values would increase (further) in that whole red river/ East Austin area north of 6th.

No need for a major north south export import thoroughfare should go through central Austin (anymore)

Anyhow was there recently, Austin is looking great u guys should be proud

Engine brakes are already banned. I agree about the trucks. I-35 is a blessing and a curse. The trucks aren't fun, and Austin tends to get blamed for the traffic on I-35, even though it's the state that maintains it (TxDot). Not to mention a lot of the traffic on I-35 is just passing through.

I drove to Dripping Springs and back today on 290, and from Oak Hill to Dripping, it was wall to wall cement trucks, 18-wheelers, and wide loads blocking traffic. It was a nightmare. There's construction along much of the route from Oak Hill to Dripping, so the truck traffic makes sense. You can't get away from it in this metro.

Yeah, Dripping Springs is being developed into cookie cutter neighborhoods. Traffic is gonna be fun out there. It's telling when every evening most of the traffic on I-35 is headed south (out of Austin) back to the suburbs.

I lived in San Antonio and traveled to Arkansas about every month. I used 130 one time, and that was just for the novelty of driving 89 with cops passing me. Its route is horrible for avoiding Austin traffic heading to SA. It veers south on its southern portion instead of continuing west towards SA.

According to ole Google, if I leave at 8am today, a trip from DT SA to DT Austin would take:

1 hour 20 mins-1 hour 50 mins I-35
1 hour 30 min- 2 hours 10 min 130

If I expand the trip from DT SA to downtown Temple, the roads are almost identical in time.

Why would anyone on Earth looking at those economics(time and money) and pick the toll route? Its intentions are not the current realities. It now has just become a route for sprawl on the eastside , which hey, isn't a bad deal seeing that its vastly underdeveloped compared to the other sides of Austin.

Ban trucks on an extremely important international highway route? Where should this traffic go?

As I said, they should build a truck bypass and force trucks to use it

Or do you think the city be more accommodating to trucks? Maybe they should tear down those new midrises in East Austin and build a couple of truck stops and truck weigh stations in downtown Austin since trucks are so all important

“A truck stop instead of st peters
Yeah yeah yeah yeah ...”

The problem is where would you put the bypass? If I was playing Simcity this would be easy, I would fix 130 and make it free. But that probably ain't gonna happen. So dealing with current realities, the idea of transferring truck traffic(or the majority of it) is about zero.

I think most people forget those truck don't all just drive through Austin. Many are delivering goods TO Austin. How many trucks a day does it take for just one grocery store, much less all of them? How about Amazon? How about every other industry in this fast growing town?

It isn't new information - but maybe surprising to some. It was stated at the ULI presentation this morning that 70% of traffic on I-35 is local.

Hazardous goods are already not allowed on I-35. TxDOT / CTRMA has experimented with lowering tolls on 130 to lure truck traffic with some limited success. Construction on I-35 will probably convince trhough trucks to use 183 or 130, but a lot of trucks are going to points in between those roads connections to I-35.

How long before ATX gets a 1000 footer?

Unless there is a surprise announcement, the ATX East Tower seems like the best bet. But I suspect it will be around 900'. The site plan could be filed any day now.

Assuming the renderings we’ve seen are what is currently planned, the west tower appears slightly taller than the Austonian which would be around 700 ft. The east tower is about 30 floors taller so I think it’s a 1000 foot building.

The tallest tower in the rendering (ATX East) won't be like the actual tower because the rendered tower includes office while actual tower is all residential. I'm basing my 900' number on the site footprint and the number of residential units and likely parking levels, not on the marketing rendering.

Agree 100%. Perhaps the most unflattering angle I've seen of downtown + uptown.

Is this "skyscraperpage", or "historicbeautypage", though? I personally could care less about the latter, and S.A. should be embarrassed about the state of its skyline, particularly for a city of its size.

Hate to say it, but until S.A. attracts more progressive elected officials, residents and business leaders, I think its skyline will continue to be a lost cause for the foreseeable future.

We have enough buildings proposed now to give us 115 buildings over 200 feet. That doesn't sound too exciting, but the year I was born, we had a whopping 9 buildings in that bracket with two more under construction. We also had a whopping 51 high rises back then, compared to almost 250 now.

https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/n....html?ana=kxan

Boomtown for sure! Go Austin!

It's crazy to think that we have more high rises under construction and proposed now than the total number Austin had the year I was born. We're basically adding the number that Corpus Christi and El Paso have combined, and that includes every single building over 115 feet of theirs.

Wow that is crazy to think about! Austin’s growth is phenomenal.

What I love so much about what's happening in Austin is that most of the highrises being built are downtown instead of spread across the city in multiple highrise districts. I know some may disagree but I think Austin's downtown is shaping up to be the liveliest and most heavily populated of Texas' major cities.

I think that is indisputable. San Antonio is pretty lively at River Walk level, but the street level is comparatively quiet. Downtown Dallas and Houston are quite sleepy in comparison to Austin.

This is true. For now. Austin does have a nice vibe to it.

Totally agree!!

It for sure is!

I've done a horrible job keeping up lately - grateful to you guys who keep things updated on here. Just curious - and not trying to do the city vs city thing... but how many highrises are currently under construction/seriously proposed in Austin's downtown/West Campus, etc., compared to, say, Houston or DFW downtown areas? And, for the sake of fun...let's include Uptown/Little Elm in Dallas and perhaps some surrounding areas in Houston. Is that fair? Thinking more of central core area rather than CBD alone. I know that's a bit ambiguous.

With that, current urban populations of each - the real reason for my curiosity as per the discussion above.


I'm impressed with downtown Austin. We've been back in Texas for a while now, actually, and have split our time between Austin and DFW. I've spent some time in both downtown areas. Fun stuff is happening all around, for sure. At the same time, we've been staying in the suburbs and have thoroughly missed the walkability of Asian cities....