Regina/Winnipeg equivalents

[thurmas]

Inspired by the TO/MTL thread. This has been done AFAIK.

[esquire]

Cathedral Village = Osborne Village
Mosaic Stadium = IG Field
Delta Regina = Delta Winnipeg
Wascana Park = The Forks
Victoria East = Regent Avenue
North Central = North End
Regina Pats = Winnipeg ICE
Wascana View = South Tuxedo
Albert St N. = McPhillips St
Legislature = Legislature
Transitional Area = Bro Ass
Albert St. S. = Portage Ave W
Regina Bypass = Perimeter Highway
Casino Regina = Club Regent Casino
Downtown = Downtown
Whitmore Park = Assiniboia
Normanview = South St. Vital

[Docere]

Interesting. I sort of see Regina as a mini-Winnipeg, and Saskatoon as a mini-Edmonton.

[thurmas]

Humpty's=Robin's Donuts

[O-tacular]

Look at this can of worms that's been opened now. What's next: Springfield / Shelbyville equivalents? If anything Calgary and Edmonton have the strongest Bizarro World similarities. Even our News anchors have traditionally been doppelgangers of one another. Ultimately they're all just shades of Okotoks.

[esquire]

Look at this can of worms that's been opened now. What's next: Springfield / Shelbyville equivalents? If anything Calgary and Edmonton have the strongest Bizarro World similarities. Even our News anchors have traditionally been doppelgangers of one another. Ultimately they're all just shades of Okotoks.

Regina/Saskatoon and Calgary/Edmonton are definitely parallel universe versions of each other.

I'm jealous that Winnipeg doesn't have its own twin. I guess we have Brandon, but it's horrifically shrunken and stunted.

[kwoldtimer]

If this is to be a thread, could the spelling in the title be corrected, please.

[thurmas]

If this is to be a thread, could the spelling in the title be corrected, please.

My fat fingers on the phone are too lazy to correct it today

[DoubleK]

Regina/Saskatoon and Calgary/Edmonton are definitely parallel universe versions of each other.

I'm jealous that Winnipeg doesn't have its own twin. I guess we have Brandon, but it's horrifically shrunken and stunted.

Fargo?

[kwoldtimer]

St Paul?

[phone]

Edmonton/Saskatoon equivalents (other than obvious downtown = downtown etc):

Strathcona = Nutana
Yellowhead Trail = Idylwyld Drive
Whyte Ave = Broadway Ave
High Level Bridge = CP Bridge
Hotel MacDonald = Delta Bessborough
Jasper Place = Sutherland
Oliver = City Park
Alberta Ave = 20th St W
U of A Farm = U of S Research Plots
97 St NW = 22nd St W
Gateway Blvd/Calgary Trail = 8th St E
Sherwood Park Freeway = College Drive
Whitemud Trail = Circle Drive qua older urban freeway
Anthony Henday Drive = "Saskatoon Freeway" (ca. 2040)


I'm not as familiar with Edmonton as I am with Calgary, but as I consider Saskatoon to have, on balance, more in common with Edmonton than Calgary, I gave it a shot.

[thurmas]

Kuopio Finland is technically a sister city of Winnipeg

[Harrison]

Edmonton/Saskatoon equivalents (other than obvious downtown = downtown etc):

Strathcona = Nutana
Yellowhead Trail = Idylwyld Drive
Whyte Ave = Broadway Ave
High Level Bridge = CP Bridge
Hotel MacDonald = Delta Bessborough
Jasper Place = Sutherland
Oliver = City Park
Alberta Ave = 20th St W
U of A Farm = U of S Research Plots
97 St NW = 22nd St W
Gateway Blvd/Calgary Trail = 8th St E
Whitemud Trail = Circle Drive qua older urban freeway
Anthony Henday Drive = "Saskatoon Freeway" (ca. 2040)


I'm not as familiar with Edmonton as I am with Calgary, but as I consider Saskatoon to have, on balance, more in common with Edmonton than Calgary, I gave it a shot.

Having visited Saskatoon a few times and living in Edmonton, I agree with all of these. I would also add the U of S and U of A (obviously), but also the fact that Nutana/Strathcona, the unviersities as well as the downtowns are all on the same sides of the saskatchewan rivers, which is neat.

Nutana & Strathcona - south side
Downtowns - north side
Universities - south side

[Rico Rommheim]

Regina/Saskatoon and Calgary/Edmonton are definitely parallel universe versions of each other.

I'm jealous that Winnipeg doesn't have its own twin. I guess we have Brandon, but it's horrifically shrunken and stunted.

Haha poor Brandon. Do Winnipeg people dismiss Brandon as a tumble-weed hick town or is it largely seen as the province's legit 2nd city?


I do wonder though, is a province better off with one overwhelming primate city like Manitoba or is the two city model more optimal. Like, would manitoba be bigger today if it had 2 cities of 400K?

[Docere]

Brandon has a similar population to Grand Forks, North Dakota. It just isn't in the same league as Winnipeg, which dominates Manitoba (60% of the population).

[thewave46]

Regina/Saskatoon and Calgary/Edmonton are definitely parallel universe versions of each other.

I'm jealous that Winnipeg doesn't have its own twin. I guess we have Brandon, but it's horrifically shrunken and stunted.

Winnipeg is in a league of its own. It needs no twin, no competition, as the battle would be lost before it began.

Hell, it’s right there in the name: Winnipeg. In the manliest of provinces: Manitoba.

Really, what can one say? First ring road: Winnipeg. Team names: the Jets and Blue Bombers are an awesome Air Force duo for naming teams. What can one say for the rest of the country’s pithy team names? Blue Jays and Maple Leafs get sucked into Jets’ engines, losers. Floods? I think not, fools who live in places that worry about that. Red River Floodway means we tell where the river to go, not fret that it rises. Electricity: Manitoba has more hydro than Niagara Falls. Take that Ontario! Rail: CN and CP - both decided to make Winnipeg their gateway to the West, not fight it out.

As you see, it was truly not a place to be equalled, much less have a twin. Brandon is just something to let Western Manitoba feel better, like a Participation ribbon.

Winnipeg for the win!

[ue]

Brandon has a similar population to Grand Forks, North Dakota. It just isn't in the same league as Winnipeg, which dominates Manitoba (60% of the population).

Grand Forks has 103,000. I'm using the metro population here because unlike 'unicities' like Winnipeg and Brandon, a significant portion of Grand Forks isn't in the city limits (most notably, East Grand Forks across the state line in Minnesota).

City of Brandon is 51,000 and its "metro" population is 54,000.

I think Grand Forks is boosted by the presence of UND and cross-border shoppers to give it more amenities too.

As for Winnipeg twins... there isn't one. But, unlike a city like Saskatoon, which has clear siblings (Edmonton most strongly, and to a lesser extent Regina and Calgary), Winnipeg has more of an extended family, with cities to the west, south, and east that can remind you of it. It has shades of Southern Ontario cities like Hamilton and London (especially in vibe), which makes sense because a lot of the initial Canadian settlers came from Ontario. It also takes influence from the Midwest/Plains, and so you can see elements of it in Minneapolis-St Paul, Chicago, Kansas City, Fargo, Omaha, etc. And then as the prototypical 'Prairie' city, you can see its forms replicated across the Prairies, but most obviously in Edmonton and Regina. Regina is probably the closest to a mini-Winnipeg, but its vegetation is different and there's no real river, let alone rivers.

[urbandreamer]

Regina is a grown up Brandon, or 1980s London? I really liked both cities, although Saskatoon impressed me more. North end Saskatoon is very agricultural, like North Kamloops. Saskatoon overall reminds me of (1950s?) Toronto: vibrant downtown, residential streetcar suburbs with commercial strips. Brandon and Lethbridge very similar: grid downtown with great housing stock.

Winnipeg's Canadian twin is Edmonton: capital city ambition, ragged dumpy downtown, endless tree-lined residential neighborhoods, the river etc.

I also was surprised by Swift Current - the Revelstoke of the Prairies?

[Wpg_Guy]

Winnipeg picture thread: https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=245200

[Docere]

Grand Forks has 103,000. I'm using the metro population here because unlike 'unicities' like Winnipeg and Brandon, a significant portion of Grand Forks isn't in the city limits (most notably, East Grand Forks across the state line in Minnesota).

City of Brandon is 51,000 and its "metro" population is 54,000.

I think Grand Forks is boosted by the presence of UND and cross-border shoppers to give it more amenities too.

I stand corrected. So Manitoba's second city doesn't even reach North Dakota's second or third city (Bismarck is roughly the same size). That's how dominant Winnipeg is.

As for Winnipeg twins... there isn't one. But, unlike a city like Saskatoon, which has clear siblings (Edmonton most strongly, and to a lesser extent Regina and Calgary), Winnipeg has more of an extended family, with cities to the west, south, and east that can remind you of it. It has shades of Southern Ontario cities like Hamilton and London (especially in vibe), which makes sense because a lot of the initial Canadian settlers came from Ontario. It also takes influence from the Midwest/Plains, and so you can see elements of it in Minneapolis-St Paul, Chicago, Kansas City, Fargo, Omaha, etc. And then as the prototypical 'Prairie' city, you can see its forms replicated across the Prairies, but most obviously in Edmonton and Regina. Regina is probably the closest to a mini-Winnipeg, but its vegetation is different and there's no real river, let alone rivers.

That's a good description. Yeah, Winnipeg truly is a "crossroads" city and the first-generation Prairie city that others replicated.

[ue]

Regina is a grown up Brandon, or 1980s London? I really liked both cities, although Saskatoon impressed me more. North end Saskatoon is very agricultural, like North Kamloops. Saskatoon overall reminds me of (1950s?) Toronto: vibrant downtown, residential streetcar suburbs with commercial strips. Brandon and Lethbridge very similar: grid downtown with great housing stock.

Brandon and Lethbridge aren't that similar. Lethbridge is bigger (like twice the size), its university is too (and is located much further from the core), has totally different topography (dry, barren, hilly vs flat parkland). The only area they have some superficial similarity is in what you describe, which makes me wonder if your experience with both is through Google Maps. The vibe of Downtown Lethbridge is pretty different and it has a lot more going on. DT Lethbridge is anchored by the city's only mall and all the amenities that avails, DT Brandon has a dead mall akin to Portage Place. Lethbridge's core is busier and has more shops, restaurants, bars, and amenities. Brandon's has some impressive architecture but is pretty run-down by comparison. Lethbridge's economy is a lot healthier and the area is growing much faster too.

Winnipeg's Canadian twin is Edmonton: capital city ambition, ragged dumpy downtown, endless tree-lined residential neighborhoods, the river etc.

I also was surprised by Swift Current - the Revelstoke of the Prairies?

As someone extremely familiar with both Edmonton and Winnipeg, having lived in both, I do agree that there's a lot of similarities between the two, but not really in the ways that you describe and I would never describe either as twins. I'm guessing you haven't spent a lot of time in either because even for myself, I found the similarities greater initially, although they still felt distinctive in their own right. You don't get the weird doppelganger stuff that Edmonton and Calgary have.

What exactly is capital city ambition? Because I don't think either city has it. Edmonton has some ambition, but Winnipeg is probably the least ambitious city west of Ontario. They don't think big there, or at least they haven't since the Perimeter opened. Nearly every idea feels watered down and dull compared to what comes out of Alberta's cities, if there is even an idea at all.

I don't think Edmonton's ambition is related to being the capital. In fact, the city had about 25 unambitious years until about a dozen years ago. It was arguably in this period that Edmonton and Winnipeg were most alike, through the 1990s and 2000s. Edmonton's ambition, at least since the Second World War, comes from it being in Alberta and the bold culture that permeates (though is significantly stronger in Calgary) due to the oil industry. You see Alberta thinking a lot more boldly after the Leduc No. 1 discovery in '47 and by the 1970s it seemed like both Calgary and Edmonton were on crack due to the oil boom. Peace River could've been Alberta's capital and Edmonton still would've held the Commonwealth Games, built WEM, and erected the tallest building outside of Toronto.

Edmonton tries, but it often misses the mark. Winnipeg doesn't even try and feels content maintaining its status quo. I think that's the way I'd sum up the status of "ambition" in either city.

I wouldn't call either city's downtown a dump (ok, maybe I would call Edmonton's that as hyperbole for how far it's fallen through covid), but you're right to criticize them. Neither is particularly vibrant, despite recent investments. But they look very different. There is no Exchange District in Edmonton and the kinds of boutiques and such it offers doesn't really have a Downtown Edmonton equivalent, although 104th Street sure tries. There's no Forks, Broadway, Union Station, or Riverwalk equivalent either in Downtown Edmonton. Portage Place is a bit better than City Centre in terms of dead downtown malls, but it's close and 5 years ago, City Centre was doing better out of the two. Edmonton's Portage & Main equivalent, Jasper and 101st, is open to pedestrians and both of Downtown Winnipeg's main roads make Jasper Ave look like a quaint cobblestone street in a small French city. Edmonton's new downtown arena seems to be doing more than Winnipeg's, despite covid.

Winnipeg is smaller and feels it too. There just aren't as many amenities as Edmonton has and its palpable when living there. Winnipeg has the Shield and Edmonton has the Rockies for recreational opportunities, but the things people do are quite different. People don't hike in Manitoba, they're on a boat in one of the thousands of lakes the province has. Despite being and feeling smaller, there's a very obvious historic grandeur to Winnipeg that Edmonton lacks. Winnipeg is significantly older than everything west of it excluding cities that start with a V on the coast. Edmonton is incredibly new looking and feeling by comparison, which is probably one of its weaknesses, whereas Winnipeg's oldness is probably its greatest asset. Regardless, this fundamental difference in urbanism makes both cities pretty distinct.

The youth and art scenes are a bit different too. Winnipeg feels more "alternative" and is full of wannabe '90s indie rockers. It's not like these kinds of people don't exist in Edmonton, but their social spaces aren't as prominent and the vibe doesn't pervade as strongly. I mean, Alberta's premier indie music festival isn't even in Edmonton, it's in Calgary. I think Edmonton had more of this in the past, but I was too young to be involved in it. The young people in Edmonton seem less punk now, and more aspirational, leaning towards glossier things. It's little things. In Edmonton, trendy ice cream places like Kind and Yelo'd have become a big deal for 20-somethings come spring whereas in Winnipeg you have classic ice cream institutions like Sargent Sundae and Bridge Drive-In. There's still trendy-bougie ice cream spots in Winnipeg, but they don't figure as prominently. These differences are subtle and not something you easily pick up on, but there seems to be a stronger bourgeois element in Edmonton that influences the local culture, including youth and arts. Politically, even though Edmonton is the more leftist hub for Alberta, Winnipeg is more leftist. Both have seen an uptick in radical, grassroots organizing, but it seems much more developed in Winnipeg. There's also a lot more postering and graffiti for political messaging than in Edmonton.

Winnipeg's transportation planning is abysmal, even if its infill tends to look nicer. There's no highways, so the main streets are turned into the worst stroads you've ever seen. The city is a bunch of different municipalities rammed together with their own street layouts, so nothing really meshes like Edmonton's giant and roomy grid. Winnipeg has probably the worst public transit system of the "major" Canadian cities (though I have no experience with Quebec City's system) and there's not much attempt to make it better. Edmonton already has an LRT system, which it's rapidly expanding, is looking into BRT, and the buses generally run on time. Also despite all the rivers and creeks, Winnipeg seriously lacks bridges.

And the rivers? I mean, they both have rivers, but so does Calgary and Montreal, doesn't mean those two are tied at the hip. I get that both Edmonton and Winnipeg have rivers play heavily into the identity of the city and are major sites of recreation, but the way its done is totally different. Winnipeg is flatter than a pancake and so there's no generous river valley like Edmonton has, which is a bigger deal than the river itself there. But this flatness means you have the Forks, the River Walk, and generally a more accessible riverfront than Edmonton could ever hope to get. Winnipeg also has like 4 rivers (5 if you wanna include the floodway) to Edmonton's 1. Winnipeg does have a lot of big parks along the Red and Assiniboine, but its not this uninterrupted "ribbon of green" with extensive trails like Edmonton's river valley.

Winnipeg is older and smaller, Edmonton is bigger and newer. Edmonton has ambition whereas Winnipeg is content with the status quo. Winnipeg is more "alternative" whereas Edmonton is more of a misguided "aspirational" place. There's still a lot of similarities and vibes and whatnot, but because of all these differences, they could never be seen as twins.

[Acajack]

Back to the OP:

Banjo Bowl = Banjo Bowl

[Docere]

Winnipeg is very "mid-continent", yet firmly in the West, as there's no "midwest" in Canada.

[thurmas]

Gainer the Gopher= Buzz and Boomer

[thurmas]

"Experience Regina" = " You've got it Park Pontiac"

[ue]

Winnipeg is very "mid-continent", yet firmly in the West, as there's no "midwest" in Canada.

Correct, although Winnipeggers do have a weird affinity for associating themselves with the Midwest. And to be fair, due to the influence of the Dakotas, Minnesota, Illinois, etc there are some Midwestern vibes, not unlike parts of deep Southwestern Ontario, but it's still functionally a Prairie city. Not Great Plains. Not Midwest. Prairie.

[Docere]

The Prairies are a coherent Canadian region, yes.

And the Midwest makes sense in the US context, with the Great Lakes and rust belt flowing seamlessly into the farm belt. The corn belt running through the "I" states is its heart.

But in Canada, it obviously makes little sense to put Windsor and Winnipeg in the same region even if both have some "midwestern" characteristics.

[Hecate]

Winnipeg is in a league of its own. It needs no twin, no competition, as the battle would be lost before it began.

Hell, it’s right there in the name: Winnipeg. In the manliest of provinces: Manitoba.

Really, what can one say? First ring road: Winnipeg. Team names: the Jets and Blue Bombers are an awesome Air Force duo for naming teams. What can one say for the rest of the country’s pithy team names? Blue Jays and Maple Leafs get sucked into Jets’ engines, losers. Floods? I think not, fools who live in places that worry about that. Red River Floodway means we tell where the river to go, not fret that it rises. Electricity: Manitoba has more hydro than Niagara Falls. Take that Ontario! Rail: CN and CP - both decided to make Winnipeg their gateway to the West, not fight it out.

As you see, it was truly not a place to be equalled, much less have a twin. Brandon is just something to let Western Manitoba feel better, like a Participation ribbon.

Winnipeg for the win!

This was great. Winnipeg for the win. Lol.

Personally I think the thing that separates Winnipeg the most from other cities in western Canada is St. Boniface. It’s a small community, but incredibly tight knit, welcoming and supportive. Franco manitobaines are very proud of their history in the province, l’université is the oldest school in western Canada. Le cercle moliére is the oldest theatre company in Canada. Celebrating its 100th anniversary in a couple years. Are there other cities in western Canada where you can live and work and play in French?

[esquire]

Back to the OP:

Banjo Bowl = Banjo Bowl

Not to be pedantic, but the Labour Day Classic is Regina's equivalent to the Banjo Bowl ;)

[HomeInMyShoes]

Not to be pedantic, but the Labour Day Classic is Regina's equivalent to the Banjo Bowl ;)

:haha:

Broadway Avenue is College Avenue here (at least for the downtown sections of both.) Nicely treed center median roads. I like both a lot.

Pembina Highway is definitely Albert Street South or Albert Street North. Same soul-killing stroad.

[esquire]

Haha poor Brandon. Do Winnipeg people dismiss Brandon as a tumble-weed hick town or is it largely seen as the province's legit 2nd city?

Brandon is pretty small. It has some trappings of an urban area including distinct inner city vs suburban areas, large employers, a university, a high-profile sports team (WHL Wheat Kings), an airport, but for the most part Brandon hates urbanity... even though it has inherited a nice small city downtown, Brandonites hate it and do absolutely nothing to improve it, and it has been declining for pretty well the last 50+ years. Nothing excites Brandon more than a new big box store or chain restaurant opening up on the edge of town.

That said, there are certain parts of it that feel city-like and it's a bit of a mind-bender, where you feel dizzy and say to yourself "I am in a city... in Manitoba... but it's not Winnipeg... so weird..."

[ciudad_del_norte]

Brandon and Lethbridge aren't that similar. Lethbridge is bigger (like twice the size), its university is too (and is located much further from the core), has totally different topography (dry, barren, hilly vs flat parkland). The only area they have some superficial similarity is in what you describe, which makes me wonder if your experience with both is through Google Maps. The vibe of Downtown Lethbridge is pretty different and it has a lot more going on. DT Lethbridge is anchored by the city's only mall and all the amenities that avails, DT Brandon has a dead mall akin to Portage Place. Lethbridge's core is busier and has more shops, restaurants, bars, and amenities. Brandon's has some impressive architecture but is pretty run-down by comparison. Lethbridge's economy is a lot healthier and the area is growing much faster too.



As someone extremely familiar with both Edmonton and Winnipeg, having lived in both, I do agree that there's a lot of similarities between the two, but not really in the ways that you describe and I would never describe either as twins. I'm guessing you haven't spent a lot of time in either because even for myself, I found the similarities greater initially, although they still felt distinctive in their own right. You don't get the weird doppelganger stuff that Edmonton and Calgary have.

What exactly is capital city ambition? Because I don't think either city has it. Edmonton has some ambition, but Winnipeg is probably the least ambitious city west of Ontario. They don't think big there, or at least they haven't since the Perimeter opened. Nearly every idea feels watered down and dull compared to what comes out of Alberta's cities, if there is even an idea at all.

I don't think Edmonton's ambition is related to being the capital. In fact, the city had about 25 unambitious years until about a dozen years ago. It was arguably in this period that Edmonton and Winnipeg were most alike, through the 1990s and 2000s. Edmonton's ambition, at least since the Second World War, comes from it being in Alberta and the bold culture that permeates (though is significantly stronger in Calgary) due to the oil industry. You see Alberta thinking a lot more boldly after the Leduc No. 1 discovery in '47 and by the 1970s it seemed like both Calgary and Edmonton were on crack due to the oil boom. Peace River could've been Alberta's capital and Edmonton still would've held the Commonwealth Games, built WEM, and erected the tallest building outside of Toronto.

Edmonton tries, but it often misses the mark. Winnipeg doesn't even try and feels content maintaining its status quo. I think that's the way I'd sum up the status of "ambition" in either city.

I wouldn't call either city's downtown a dump (ok, maybe I would call Edmonton's that as hyperbole for how far it's fallen through covid), but you're right to criticize them. Neither is particularly vibrant, despite recent investments. But they look very different. There is no Exchange District in Edmonton and the kinds of boutiques and such it offers doesn't really have a Downtown Edmonton equivalent, although 104th Street sure tries. There's no Forks, Broadway, Union Station, or Riverwalk equivalent either in Downtown Edmonton. Portage Place is a bit better than City Centre in terms of dead downtown malls, but it's close and 5 years ago, City Centre was doing better out of the two. Edmonton's Portage & Main equivalent, Jasper and 101st, is open to pedestrians and both of Downtown Winnipeg's main roads make Jasper Ave look like a quaint cobblestone street in a small French city. Edmonton's new downtown arena seems to be doing more than Winnipeg's, though.

Winnipeg is smaller and feels it too. There just aren't as many amenities as Edmonton has and its palpable when living there. Winnipeg has the Shield and Edmonton has the Rockies for recreational opportunities, but the things people do are quite different. People don't hike in Manitoba, they're on a boat in one of the thousands of lakes the province has. Despite being and feeling smaller, there's a very obvious historic grandeur to Winnipeg that Edmonton lacks. Winnipeg is significantly older than everything west of it excluding cities that start with a V on the coast. Edmonton is incredibly new looking and feeling by comparison, which is probably one of its weaknesses, whereas Winnipeg's oldness is probably its greatest asset. Regardless, this fundamental difference in urbanism makes both cities pretty distinct. The art scenes are more divergent than ever in both cities too. Winnipeg is indie rockers wishing it was 1994 and radical grassroots activists. It's both more humble and more pretentious at the same time, but it's a lot more hipster-y and alternative than Edmonton these days. I think the main division is money here. Edmonton's art scene was grungier too, but it feels a lot more yuppie-influenced these days, aspiring more to Calgary and Vancouver than being a bigger, newer Winnipeg.

Winnipeg's transportation planning is abysmal, even if its infill tends to look nicer. There's no highways, so the main streets are turned into the worst stroads you've ever seen. The city is a bunch of different municipalities rammed together with their own street layouts, so nothing really meshes like Edmonton's giant and roomy grid. Winnipeg has probably the worst public transit system of the "major" Canadian cities (though I have no experience with Quebec City's system) and there's not much attempt to make it better. Edmonton already has an LRT system, which it's rapidly expanding, is looking into BRT, and the buses generally run on time. Also despite all the rivers and creeks, Winnipeg seriously lacks bridges.

The rivers? I mean, they both have rivers, but so does Calgary and Montreal, doesn't mean those two are tied at the hip. I get that both Edmonton and Winnipeg have rivers play heavily into the identity of the city and are major sites of recreation, but the way its done is totally different. Winnipeg is flatter than a pancake and so there's no generous river valley like Edmonton has, which is a bigger deal than the river itself there. But this flatness means you have the Forks, the River Walk, and generally a more accessible riverfront than Edmonton could ever hope to get. Winnipeg also has like 4 rivers (5 if you wanna include the floodway) to Edmonton's 1. Winnipeg does have a lot of big parks along the Red and Assiniboine, but its not this uninterrupted "ribbon of green" with extensive trails like Edmonton's river valley.

Winnipeg is older and smaller, Edmonton is bigger and newer. Edmonton has ambition whereas Winnipeg is content with the status quo. Winnipeg is more "alternative" whereas Edmonton is more of a misguided "aspirational". There's still a lot of similarities and vibes and whatnot, but because of all these differences, they could never be seen as twins.

Some good points here. Not sure I would agree with all of it, but overall a good assessment. I think there are a lot of similarities between Edmonton and Winnipeg, but they are more cultural than city form and infrastructure. Edmonton and Saskatoon are probably have the closest parallels on that front. They are also probably the most similar in terms of geography and vegetation. As it's been said by others Edmonton and Calgary have a lot of similarities generally but I also find in terms of parallel areas/infrastructure they are pretty different, but you see the impacts of being the same size(ish) and being in the same province. There are some projects like the Jubilee Auditoriums or hospitals in both cities where the same design was used in each.

[rivercity]

What exactly is capital city ambition? Because I don't think either city has it. Edmonton has some ambition, but Winnipeg is probably the least ambitious city west of Ontario. They don't think big there, or at least they haven't since the Perimeter opened. Nearly every idea feels watered down and dull compared to what comes out of Alberta's cities, if there is even an idea at all.



This is so depressingly true.

[HomeInMyShoes]

This is so depressingly true.

Sleepy government town. I've lived in lots of them and Edmonton, Regina, Winnipeg and Ottawa to some extent are all that thing. There is a pace of life in the government centers that is different than Calgary or Saskatoon.

[Luisito]

Interesting. I sort of see Regina as a mini-Winnipeg, .

I was just about to say the samething. :haha:

[Rico Rommheim]

I lived in Edmonton for a few years during my childhood. Edmonton was always "the city of champions". It was proudly written on their banner when you enter the city from the airport. During my last visit 3 years ago I noticed that the banner changed from city of champions to "Alberta's capital city". True story.

[O-tacular]

I lived in Edmonton for a few years during my childhood. Edmonton was always "the city of champions". It was proudly written on their banner when you enter the city from the airport. During my last visit 3 years ago I noticed that the banner changed from city of champions to "Alberta's capital city". True story.

:haha: Kinda depressing to keep that slogan when you haven't won a major sporting event in decades. I think they actually voted to remove it because it was being mocked. The new sign should have said "Edmonton: City of Mullets". Or perhaps "Edmonton: A City" or even better "Edmonton: Stuccoland".

[Luisito]

:haha: Kinda depressing to keep that slogan when you haven't won a major sporting event in decades. I think they actually voted to remove it because it was being mocked. The new sign should have said "Edmonton: City of Mullets". Or perhaps "Edmonton: A City" or even better "Edmonton: Stuccoland".


Calgarians always have to throw shade on Edmonton. :(

[VANRIDERFAN]

Brandon is pretty small. It has some trappings of an urban area including distinct inner city vs suburban areas, large employers, a university, a high-profile sports team (WHL Wheat Kings), an airport, but for the most part Brandon hates urbanity... even though it has inherited a nice small city downtown, Brandonites hate it and do absolutely nothing to improve it, and it has been declining for pretty well the last 50+ years. Nothing excites Brandon more than a new big box store or chain restaurant opening up on the edge of town.

That said, there are certain parts of it that feel city-like and it's a bit of a mind-bender, where you feel dizzy and say to yourself "I am in a city... in Manitoba... but it's not Winnipeg... so weird..."

I was in Downtown Brandon last month. There is so much opportunity there but nobody, especially in City Council has the vision to make it better.

[ciudad_del_norte]

:haha: Kinda depressing to keep that slogan when you haven't won a major sporting event in decades. I think they actually voted to remove that slogan.

The city of champions slogan was actually derived out of a recognition of the response to the 1987 tornado, not sports. But that became less clear over time, especially since it was during an era of sporting success.

They intentionally removed the slogan a few years ago because it was stale , doesn't resonate, and most people didn't even know what it was from anymore. But not without some controversy, a certain part of the population was/is pretty attached to it.

[O-tacular]

Calgarians always have to throw shade on Edmonton. :(

Calgary's slogan is pretty lame too. A fucking Cowboy Hat and "Heart of the New West" before and now just: "Calgary: Be Part of the Energy".

https://i.cbc.ca/1.3706021.1470248671!/fileImage/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/original_780/heart-of-the-new-west-sign.jpg

https://i.cbc.ca/1.3705694.1550960561!/fileImage/httpImage/calgary-welcome-sign.jpg

We should update it to "Calgary: Home to the oldest arena in the NHL and stadium in the CFL". Or "Calgary: Come for the Corporate Event, Stay for the Tax Break" (Though municipal taxes are skyrocketing).

[O-tacular]

The city of champions slogan was actually derived out of a recognition of the response to the 1987 tornado, not sports. But that became less clear over time, especially since it was during an era of sporting success.

They intentionally removed the slogan a few years ago because it was stale , doesn't resonate, and most people didn't even know what it was from anymore. But not without some controversy, a certain part of the population was/is pretty attached to it.

Did they at least upgrade those depressing poo coloured wood signs off the QE2?

[Luisito]

LOL I was just joking but yeah seems like we could all upgrade our cities slogans. :cheers:

[ciudad_del_norte]

The signs are still there. I don't mind them actually. They are retro enough to feel a bit stylish again.

[O-tacular]

The signs are still there. I don't mind them actually. They are retro enough to feel a bit stylish again.

I don't mind the shape of the concrete supports but the signs themselves... :yuck:

https://i0.wp.com/mastermaq.s3.amazonaws.com/public/images/new/entrancesign_cbc.jpg

[Luisito]

Reginas slogan is "At least you're not in Winnipeg."

[esquire]

:haha: Kinda depressing to keep that slogan when you haven't won a major sporting event in decades. I think they actually voted to remove it because it was being mocked. The new sign should have said "Edmonton: City of Mullets". Or perhaps "Edmonton: A City" or even better "Edmonton: Stuccoland".

This reminded me of Fake Steve Armitage visiting Edmonton

https://soundcloud.com/ignitedsoul13/steve-armitage-edmonton-mike

This is only funny if you are familiar with CBC Sports and Edmonton :haha:

[O-tacular]

This reminded me of Fake Steve Armitage visiting Edmonton

https://soundcloud.com/ignitedsoul13/steve-armitage-edmonton-mike

This is only funny if you are familiar with CBC Sports and Edmonton :haha:

:haha::haha::haha:

"Sweatpants with good shoes.."

[Wigs]

I don't mind the shape of the concrete supports but the signs themselves... :yuck:

https://i0.wp.com/mastermaq.s3.amazonaws.com/public/images/new/entrancesign_cbc.jpg

The sign reminds me of late 70s/early 80s subdivisions in Calgary :haha:

[Wigs]

Cathedral Village = Osborne Village
Mosaic Stadium = IG Field
Delta Regina = Delta Winnipeg
Wascana Park = The Forks
Victoria East = Regent Avenue
North Central = North End
Regina Pats = Winnipeg ICE
Wascana View = South Tuxedo
Albert St N. = McPhillips St
Legislature = Legislature
Transitional Area = Bro Ass
Albert St. S. = Portage Ave W
Regina Bypass = Perimeter Highway
Casino Regina = Club Regent Casino
Downtown = Downtown
Whitmore Park = Assiniboia
Normanview = South St. Vital

Bro Ass :D

[Docere]

Both Winnipeg and Regina have favored south sides.

[GreaterMontréal]

The rivers? I mean, they both have rivers, but so does Calgary and Montreal, doesn't mean those two are tied at the hip

True, and no city in Canada with rivers can be compared to Montreal. A fleuve is a giant river which flows into the sea.

The Fleuve Saint-Laurent has an average discharge of about 10,000 m³/s in Montreal.
The Bow River in Calgary , about 130 m³/sec.

The Richelieu River in Montérégie , 330 m²/sec.
The Saint-François River in Drummondville , 190 m³/s

The only River that would be comparable in Quebec would be the Saint-Maurice in Mauricie.

[esquire]

Bro Ass :D

Short for Broadway-Assiniboine ;)

[phone]

True, and no city in Canada with rivers can be compared to Montreal. A fleuve is a giant river which flows into the sea.

The Fleuve Saint-Laurent has an average discharge of about 10,000 m³/s in Montreal.
The Bow River in Calgary , about 130 m³/sec.

The Richelieu River in Montérégie , 330 m²/sec.
The Saint-François River in Drummondville , 190 m³/s

The only River that would be comparable in Quebec would be the Saint-Maurice in Mauricie.

Montreal certainly has the most impressive, widest, and heaviest river out of any city in Canada. But I don't think that it necessarily has the most impressive river valley. I mean that in the sense of a river that interacts with the city itself, rather than forming a boundary or impediment to it.

Yes, the Fleuve Saint-Laurent is a mighty river of continental scale, capable of receiving ocean freight, and is obviously integral to Montreal's essence. But I don't think that it functions civically in the same way as, for example, the North Saskatchewan River does in Edmonton, where the river is something that can be crossed by foot, and paddled down on canoe (without having to navigate much heavier boats!).

This is not a slight to Montreal but only an observation that depending on the scale of the river, its impact on a city can take drastically different effect.

[Wigs]

Short for Broadway-Assiniboine ;)

An unfortunate abbreviation

"Yeah, I just rented a new flat in Bro Ass" :haha:

[ue]

Some good points here. Not sure I would agree with all of it, but overall a good assessment. I think there are a lot of similarities between Edmonton and Winnipeg, but they are more cultural than city form and infrastructure. Edmonton and Saskatoon are probably have the closest parallels on that front. They are also probably the most similar in terms of geography and vegetation. As it's been said by others Edmonton and Calgary have a lot of similarities generally but I also find in terms of parallel areas/infrastructure they are pretty different, but you see the impacts of being the same size(ish) and being in the same province. There are some projects like the Jubilee Auditoriums or hospitals in both cities where the same design was used in each.

There's a lot of cultural similarities for sure, but I found that to be more true 15 years ago. Edmonton spent the 2010s getting back its mojo and feels a lot more dynamic, bigger, and energetic. In some ways, that means it's less "cool" than Winnipeg now, but there's still similar "feels" between the two. I think if you injected Winnipeg with a bunch of oil money it would probably act almost identically to Edmonton.

One other aspect to Edmonton is that it's very utilitarian and value-engineered, perhaps more obviously than any other major Canadian city. This has both good and bad aspects. For example, the city is very straightforward to get around, much more so than Winnipeg, but on the other hand, it's quite ugly when you take away the natural beauty of the river valley. You could chalk this up to being more city form/infrastructure, but I think it's also a reflection of the culture of both cities. Edmonton swings and misses because Edmontonians tend to have poor taste and prioritize convenience and efficiency, which means getting around is probably the easiest in Canada for >500,000 cities. Winnipeggers are marred by a status quo inertia but because of various legacies, tend to have significantly better aesthetic considerations than Edmonton. The most notable example of this is that you don't have as much cheap, value-engineered architecture as Edmonton, particularly in prominent locations.

I agree with you about Edmonton and Calgary. They're actually pretty different, but still share a lot due to proximity and politics. Peter Lougheed/Grey Nuns is another fun doppelganger. Calgarians act differently than Edmontonians, even if the latter seem to be aspiring to the former, it doesn't change the nature of each group. 17th Ave and Whyte Ave have had some cross-pollination of businesses too, but they look and feel different. Edmonton put all its eggs in one basket with Whyte, whereas Calgary has boosted main streets all around quite well, and now has vibrant urban areas with 17th/4th, Kensington, Inglewood, and Stephen. Bridgeland is getting there too. In Edmonton, 124th Street is still underwhelming, 20 years later. Calgary is a lot flashier and a lot more successful when it makes an attempt than Edmonton, but feels a lot more shallow too. The geography and vegetation is also totally different -- Edmonton's vegetation is closer to Winnipeg's actually.

Edit: I also wanted to say I changed some of my original post you quoted at the top of the last page. I thought about it some more and clarified my thoughts more regarding some cultural distinctions as I don't think I was as clear as I could have been. There's a fair amount of cultural similarities between Edmonton and Winnipeg, but if you spend enough time in both cities, there's certain things that are just a bit more prominent in one vs the other in the local culture, which is I think what I'm picking up on.

[O-tacular]

The sign reminds me of late 70s/early 80s subdivisions in Calgary :haha:

Absolutely! It makes me think of Temple in NE Calgary.

[Wigs]

Absolutely! It makes me think of Temple in NE Calgary.

Yes! Temple, Rundle, Whitehorn a lot of the Northeast older subdivisions :haha:

[urbandreamer]

There's nothing bold about Alberta. Fundamentally it's a redneck attitude that has more in common with rural Ontario than the GTA. Edmonton could be a newer bigger London, while Calgary is Kitchener Waterloo with some gaudy high rise office towers.

This Spring/Summer, I visited every city between Ottawa and Edmonton, Winnipeg and Victoria, North Bay and Calgary. To my mind, all cities NW of the GTA* have a hard-edged, down-at-the-knees vibe, with simmering racial tension between the colonizers and Natives, with downtowns that feel like they've succumbed to suburbanization. They're Canadian make-work projects, in the way that many American state capitals feel.

(*Except Vancouver outside of the DES)

[GreaterMontréal]

Montreal certainly has the most impressive, widest, and heaviest river out of any city in Canada. But I don't think that it necessarily has the most impressive river valley. I mean that in the sense of a river that interacts with the city itself, rather than forming a boundary or impediment to it.

Yes, the Fleuve Saint-Laurent is a mighty river of continental scale, capable of receiving ocean freight, and is obviously integral to Montreal's essence. But I don't think that it functions civically in the same way as, for example, the North Saskatchewan River does in Edmonton, where the river is something that can be crossed by foot, and paddled down on canoe (without having to navigate much heavier boats!).

This is not a slight to Montreal but only an observation that depending on the scale of the river, its impact on a city can take drastically different effect.

You can paddleboard on the St.Lawrence but I agree that it's not ideal, but we have other rivers in the GMA for more family oriented activies.

The Parc de la Rivière des-Mille-Îles sits between Laval and the North Shore.
https://www.parc-mille-iles.qc.ca/en/activities/summer/

f4Ad7oJZeWo

[O-tacular]

There's nothing bold about Alberta. Fundamentally it's a redneck attitude that has more in common with rural Ontario than the GTA. Edmonton could be a newer bigger London, while Calgary is Kitchener Waterloo with some gaudy high rise office towers.

This Spring/Summer, I visited every city between Ottawa and Edmonton, Winnipeg and Victoria, North Bay and Calgary. To my mind, all cities NW of the GTA* have a hard-edged, down-at-the-knees vibe, with simmering racial tension between the colonizers and Natives, with downtowns that feel like they've succumbed to suburbanization. They're Canadian make-work projects, in the way that many American state capitals feel.

(*Except Vancouver outside of the DES)

Yes, the rest of Canada west of Ontario is Mordor. Albertans are just orcs pillaging the Shire. Our sewage canal glacier river water feeds the Colonial pit mines of suburbia.

[O-tacular]

Totally the same!

https://live.staticflickr.com/8107/8639847769_6016602fe5_b.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/34/Downtown_Calgary_2020-3.jpg/1200px-Downtown_Calgary_2020-3.jpg

[ciudad_del_norte]

There's a lot of cultural similarities for sure, but I found that to be more true 15 years ago. Edmonton spent the 2010s getting back its mojo and feels a lot more dynamic, bigger, and energetic. In some ways, that means it's less "cool" than Winnipeg now. But there's still similar "feels" between the two. I think if you injected Winnipeg with a bunch of oil money it would probably act almost identically to Edmonton.

One other aspect to Edmonton is that it's very utilitarian and value-engineered, perhaps more obviously than any other major Canadian city. This has both good and bad aspects. For example, the city is very straightforward to get around, much more so than Winnipeg, but on the other hand, it's quite ugly when you take away the natural beauty of the river valley. You could chalk this up to being more city form/infrastructure, but I think it's also a reflection of the culture of both cities. Edmonton swings and misses because Edmontonians tend to have poor taste and prioritize convenience and efficiency, which means getting around is probably the easiest in Canada for >500,000 cities. Winnipeggers are marred by a status quo inertia but because of various legacies, tend to have significantly better aesthetic considerations than Edmonton. The most notable example of this is that you don't have as much cheap, value-engineered architecture as Edmonton, particularly in prominent locations.

I agree with you about Edmonton and Calgary. They're actually pretty different, but still share a lot due to proximity and politics. Peter Lougheed/Grey Nuns is another fun doppelganger. But Calgarians act differently than Edmontonians, even if the latter seem to be aspiring to the former, it doesn't change the nature of each group. 17th Ave and Whyte Ave have had some cross-pollination of businesses too, but they look and increasingly feel different. Edmonton put all its eggs in one basket with Whyte, whereas Calgary has boosted main streets all around quite well, and now has vibrant urban areas with 17th/4th, Kensington, Inglewood, and Stephen. Bridgeland is getting there too. In Edmonton, 124th Street is still underwhelming, 20 years later. Calgary is a lot flashier and a lot more successful when it makes an attempt than Edmonton, but feels a lot more shallow too. The geography and vegetation is also totally different -- Edmonton's vegetation is closer to Winnipeg's actually.

Yeah I'd mostly agree to that. I do thnk Edmonton has been pivoting in culture, politics, and identity over the last 10 years. Although I think in some ways that has moved the city away from Winnipeg, but in other ways towards.

Winnipeg is pretty good at not trying to be something it isn't. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, it comes with a certain groundedness, but it can also be limiting.

Calgary refuses to limit itself, but in doing so it can feel like it is striving to be whatever it can to retain status leading to that sense of shallowness.

I feel like in the late 90s/early 00s Edmonton managed to latch onto some of the negatives of both of these. Loosing relative status to Calgary, and the inertia that came with it - but still trying to hold onto something that that was fleeting. That was the period of the greatest Calgary aspirations. But out of that also developed a groundedness that I think draws it closer to Winnipeg, and away from Calgary. However, a period of (mostly) rapid growth and money also offsets the intertia and bolstered the more Calgary-like optimism and simultaneously pulls it away from Winnipeg in many ways.

Not to say Edmonton is some perfect balance- it still struggles to find that line - often awkwardly - but is getting better.

There are also historical/cultural histories with the zone of fur-trade/Métis/agriculture/Ukranian/catholic settlement influence that Edmonton and Winnipeg share compared to the ranching/dryland/Scottish/RCMP/American/protestant history that is more pronounced in southern Alberta. These don't dont fully address the complexities of any of these places in 2022, but they crafted the form and funciton of the social and political institutions that continue to influence them today.

[thurmas]

YQR burgers= George's Burgers

[thurmas]

Pizza= Slurpee

[ciudad_del_norte]

There's nothing bold about Alberta. Fundamentally it's a redneck attitude that has more in common with rural Ontario than the GTA. Edmonton could be a newer bigger London, while Calgary is Kitchener Waterloo with some gaudy high rise office towers.

This Spring/Summer, I visited every city between Ottawa and Edmonton, Winnipeg and Victoria, North Bay and Calgary. To my mind, all cities NW of the GTA* have a hard-edged, down-at-the-knees vibe, with simmering racial tension between the colonizers and Natives, with downtowns that feel like they've succumbed to suburbanization. They're Canadian make-work projects, in the way that many American state capitals feel.

(*Except Vancouver outside of the DES)

oof. As much as hate the way western alienation has been co-opted and weaponized by the conservative movement in Canada - posts like this remind why it is actually a real thing.

[Wigs]

oof. As much as hate the way western alienation has been co-opted and weaponized by the conservative movement in Canada - posts like this remind why it is actually a real thing.

How someone seriously thinks this way and wrote that post (you replied to)... I'll never understand :facepalm:

[Wigs]

Pizza= Slurpee

Ex-per-i-ence RE-GI-NA... Pizza:D

I still can't believe someone made this :haha:

74B5kMLNd5Q

[thurmas]

Ex-per-i-ence RE-GI-NA... Pizza:D

I still can't believe someone made this :haha:

74B5kMLNd5Q

2022 Grey Cup theme song

[ue]

Yeah I'd mostly agree to that. I do thnk Edmonton has been pivoting in culture, politics, and identity over the last 10 years. Although I think in some ways that has moved the city away from Winnipeg, but in other ways towards.

Winnipeg is pretty good at not trying to be something it isn't. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, it comes with a certain groundedness, but it can also be limiting.

Calgary refuses to limit itself, but in doing so it can feel like it is striving to be whatever it can to retain status leading to that sense of shallowness.

I feel like in the late 90s/early 00s Edmonton managed to latch onto some of the negatives of both of these. Loosing relative status to Calgary, and the inertia that came with it - but still trying to hold onto something that that was fleeting. That was the period of the greatest Calgary aspirations. But out of that also developed a groundedness that I think draws it closer to Winnipeg, and away from Calgary. However, a period of (mostly) rapid growth and money also offsets the intertia and bolstered the more Calgary-like optimism and simultaneously pulls it away from Winnipeg in many ways.

Not to say Edmonton is some perfect balance- it still struggles to find that line - often awkwardly - but is getting better.

There are also historical/cultural histories with the zone of fur-trade/Métis/agriculture/Ukranian/catholic settlement influence that Edmonton and Winnipeg share compared to the ranching/dryland/Scottish/RCMP/American/protestant history that is more pronounced in southern Alberta. These don't dont fully address the complexities of any of these places in 2022, but they crafted the form and funciton of the social and political institutions that continue to influence them today.

I'm not sure if you saw before I edited my post, but I changed some of what I originally stated that reflects:



The youth and art scenes are a bit different too. Winnipeg feels more "alternative" and is full of wannabe '90s indie rockers. It's not like these kinds of people don't exist in Edmonton, but their social spaces aren't as prominent and the vibe doesn't pervade as strongly. I mean, Alberta's premier indie music festival isn't even in Edmonton, it's in Calgary. I think Edmonton had more of this in the past, but I was too young to be involved in it. The young people in Edmonton seem less punk now, and more aspirational, leaning towards glossier things. It's little things. In Edmonton, trendy ice cream places like Kind and Yelo'd have become a big deal for 20-somethings come spring whereas in Winnipeg you have classic ice cream institutions like Sargent Sundae and Bridge Drive-In. There's still trendy-bougie ice cream spots in Winnipeg, but they don't figure as prominently. These differences are subtle and not something you easily pick up on, but there seems to be a stronger bourgeois element in Edmonton that influences the local culture, including youth and arts. Politically, even though Edmonton is the more leftist hub for Alberta, Winnipeg is more leftist. Both have seen an uptick in radical, grassroots organizing, but it seems much more developed in Winnipeg. There's also a lot more postering and graffiti for political messaging than in Edmonton.



I think we're mostly agreeing. There was a notable shift in Edmonton's vibe over the past 10 years, due to the boom, but before that there was a lot more similarities between Edmonton and Winnipeg. Both cities were plagued by a kind of inertia and a sense of inferiority due to being left in the dust by others. Although even Winnipeg isn't as stagnant as it was then, the overall vibe of that city now is still a lot more like those days than in Edmonton. You could argue that True North Square is a (massively) scaled down version of the Ice District, but the sheer difference in scale is still very important and says a lot about what's going on economically and culturally in both cities.

The crux of it is that Edmonton has become more outwardly bourgeois and you can tell its trying to be like Calgary a bit, even though it's really not going to happen. This has shifted the culture away from being more like Winnipeg's, which is a bit grimier (in a good way), as Edmontonians get enticed by trendy gimmicks. 15 years ago, both Edmonton and Winnipeg had their best days behind them, even if those periods were different (1900s-1910s and 1950s for Winnipeg; 1970s-1980s for Edmonton). Today, the difference is that Edmonton had a new period of innovation and growth that made people forget about looking back. Winnipeg is still looking back.

Overall, I think Edmonton is kind of a blend of Calgary and Winnipeg, with its own unique quirks as well. It has the money and drive of Calgary but lacks its boldness. Edmonton seems bolder than Winnipeg, but within the Alberta context it may as well still be Winnipeg 2. Edmonton still isn't Calgary and I don't think it ever will be, no matter how aspirational it gets, because Edmonton is still fundamentally a different place. Like you mention, there's the shared cultural history of the Parkland Prairies between Edmonton and Winnipeg, but there's also other thing too, like the blue collar undercurrents of both cities, the government-university-healthcare economic centrality, etc. Even if they've shaken off the dust, both cities are still has-beens. Winnipeg is not really peers with Vancouver, Calgary, or Edmonton anymore, and Edmonton is still less prominent than Calgary. Thus they both still have an inferiority complex, even if Edmonton has done a better job of hiding it lately. This doesn't have to be a bad thing either; Montreal is a has-been relative to Toronto, but its arguably one of the best cities on the continent as a result.

You pick up on another important thing regarding Winnipeg: its groundedness. Winnipeg knows what it is, and has a better sense of place as a result. I don't know if Edmonton knows exactly what it is yet, but it isn't as successful as Calgary or Toronto at being limitless. But you're right, this groundedness can make Winnipeg a bit more limited and willing to rest on its laurels.

[Wigs]

2022 Grey Cup theme song

Definitely :D a true 'banger'

[Docere]

Have to pull out the stats again, but I recall the "blue collar/white collar" difference between Calgary and Edmonton being quite evident but Regina and Saskatoon were basically identical socioeconomically.

2021 occupation and education stats are out next week I think.

[Wigs]

Have to pull out the stats again, but I recall the "blue collar/white collar" difference between Calgary and Edmonton being quite evident but Regina and Saskatoon were basically identical socioeconomically.

2021 occupation and education stats are out next week I think.

Despite Regina having more downtown office space, shiny glass buildings downtown, to my eyes Saskatoon looked like the wealthier city. This was 8 years ago too before River landing, Remai museum were built.

[Docere]

That's the perception, I think.

A lot of people contrast "blue collar" Houston and "white collar" Dallas - in reality, there's little difference.

[Hali87]

Present-day Winnipeg is culturally and functionally part of the prairies but I do find that there's a fairly distinct "assimilated inland New France city" typology which in Canada would also include Thunder Bay and Windsor, and to a lesser degree Ottawa; in the US, Minneapolis-St. Paul, St. Louis, Detroit, Buffalo, Louisville, and maybe a few others. There are common themes that show up in these cities' layouts, street names, block dimensions, colour palettes, and overall image/ethos. There are architectural similarities, especially in their early highrises, but also through other eras.

There are very small hints of this in Edmonton but not really anywhere else on the Prairies. Regina kind of feels like Winnipeg-minus-that to me. Edmonton feels largely of a different era.

[esquire]

You could argue that True North Square is a (massively) scaled down version of the Ice District, but the sheer difference in scale is still very important and says a lot about what's going on economically and culturally in both cities.

I won't argue that Ice District is bigger than True North Square, but "massively scaled down" is an overstatement, IMO. If TNS had taken the Ice District approach of basically stacking an office tower on top of a residential tower, it would have resulted in a show-stopping new tallest tower similar to Stantec. That didn't happen, but there is still a hell of a lot there... TNS already has two towers built and occupied, one under construction and two more to go. Let's not forget the other True North affiliated development across Portage (Centrepoint) with a hotel tower, condo tower and offices. So 7 towers total, with the possibility of more down the road. And all that happened without having to give True North a king's ransom like Edmonton did to Katz.

[ue]

I won't argue that Ice District is bigger than True North Square, but "massively scaled down" is an overstatement, IMO. If TNS had taken the Ice District approach of basically stacking an office tower on top of a residential tower, it would have resulted in a show-stopping new tallest tower similar to Stantec. That didn't happen, but there is still a hell of a lot there... TNS already has two towers built and occupied, one under construction and two more to go. Let's not forget the other True North affiliated development across Portage (Centrepoint) with a hotel tower, condo tower and offices. So 7 towers total, with the possibility of more down the road. And all that happened without having to give True North a king's ransom like Edmonton did to Katz.

True North Square has 2 short towers and 1 under construction. The Ice District has 2 tall towers and none under construction. The amount of buildings isn't that different. Both have more planned, not just TNS. Like in Winnipeg, there's also other new towers adjacent to the Ice District property (Ultima and Encore condos) and the affiliated Edmonton Tower that houses CoE employees. The number of buildings isn't that different, but Edmonton's are taller still.

Even if you wanted to argue that the square footage was identical, the way that Ice District is designed is a lot more "big city" feeling and substantial. The Ice District has Loblaw City Market, while True North Square has Hargrave Street Market. Both required a lot of municipal subsidization to come about. There's a lot of weird similarities between the two, but Edmonton's is much more grandiose.

[urbandreamer]

Both TNS & Ice District are mediocre: somewhat flashier in Edmonton, but of similar architectural merit you see in Ontario's suburban cities like Mississauga, Brampton, Hamilton, Scarborough or downtown Kitchener. Out of scale with the historic surroundings, utilizing bland materials and derivative designs, windswept at grade. Akin to a jacked up Ram parked next to a Citroën DS.

[Docere]

Regina's Germantown sounds like a mini-North End:

http://digital.scaa.sk.ca/gallery/regina/east/germantown.html

[BlackDog204]

Interesting. I sort of see Regina as a mini-Winnipeg, and Saskatoon as a mini-Edmonton.

That's an insult to Saskatoon.

[BlackDog204]

True North Square has 2 short towers and 1 under construction. The Ice District has 2 tall towers and none under construction. The amount of buildings isn't that different. Both have more planned, not just TNS. Like in Winnipeg, there's also other new towers adjacent to the Ice District property (Ultima and Encore condos) and the affiliated Edmonton Tower that houses CoE employees. The number of buildings isn't that different, but Edmonton's are taller still.

Even if you wanted to argue that the square footage was identical, the way that Ice District is designed is a lot more "big city" feeling and substantial. The Ice District has Loblaw City Market, while True North Square has Hargrave Street Market. Both required a lot of municipal subsidization to come about. There's a lot of weird similarities between the two, but Edmonton's is much more grandiose.

I've been to both areas, and the Ice District, although larger, looks cold and out of place. There is nothing but homeless shelters, and crime infested areas to the north and east. It almost looks like there is an invisible line, going from a massive complex to a shanty town. If that makes the Ice District "much more grandiose" I will stick with the TNS any day of the week. Edmonton, in general, is just a dirty city that has a massive inferiority complex to it's world class provincial counterpart, 3 hours south on the QE2.

[ue]

I've been to both areas, and the Ice District, although larger, looks cold and out of place. There is nothing but homeless shelters, and crime infested areas to the north and east. It almost looks like there is an invisible line, going from a massive complex to a shanty town. If that makes the Ice District "much more grandiose" I will stick with the TNS any day of the week. Edmonton, in general, is just a dirty city that has a massive inferiority complex to it's world class provincial counterpart, 3 hours south on the QE2.

You clearly lack reading comprehension skills. The juxtaposition between the Ice District and the areas directly north (not east, which is just more downtown office towers, so clearly you are out of touch with reality) has nothing to do with the grandeur. Maybe re-read what I said.

It's also quite hilarious that you're coming from Winnipeg and complaining that Edmonton is dirty. Winnipeg is probably the only city where its citizenry will look to American cities for cleanliness. So many Winnipeggers talk about how they finally made it to Minneapolis and couldn't believe how clean it was by comparison. :haha:

It's not like Downtown Winnipeg doesn't have hard contrasts between "rough" areas and shiny new development, either. True North Square is just not one such place because its in the heart of the middle class office worker downtown. But Red River College and the lofts and new infill of the western Exchange sharply contrasts Centennial, one of the poorest neighbourhoods in the city. You see a similar thing with the northeastern part of the Exchange around Cibo/Mere and this (https://goo.gl/maps/C3PMrZdy4FTKmd7d6) harshly juxtaposing Point Douglas. Meanwhile shelters like Main Street Project and the Salvation Army are just north of the Manitoba Museum and the Canada Games Sports Centre on Main Street. Ellice between Hargrave and Balmoral is also a sharp "border" in a similar way to 105 Ave in Downtown Edmonton. Buildings like Portage Place face away from Ellice as if its the back-end afterthought in a way similar to MacEwan University faces away from 105th. In both cases, you have major downtown revitalization projects on the south side of the street and run-down, immigrant and refugee heavy low income residential on the other.

Get over yourself. Both Edmonton and Winnipeg are shitholes in their own ways.

[harls]

S. Halsted St - Chicago (https://goo.gl/maps/WqwfJZaxAbw6ZZRL7)

Osborne St - Winnipeg (https://goo.gl/maps/p9ZsTgChSPagQmj18)

I drove through Chicago on S. Halsted in 2004. It reminded me so much of Winnipeg. Maybe Osborne is a stretch, but I am sure there are streets like Halsted in Winnipeg that I have forgotten (Academy, maybe?)

[MolsonExport]

Ex-per-i-ence RE-GI-NA... Pizza:D

I still can't believe someone made this :haha:

74B5kMLNd5Q

oh man, that is so bad. It has the quality of a grade-7 AV project.

like this (made when London was completely in the Dumps, no doubt only because of a "Can't Do" Eastern attitude). I don't think they could make something as bad on purpose:

--344fV3JCc

This is actually way, way better, despite being a parody:
ysmLA5TqbIY

[phone]

oh man, that is so bad. It has the quality of a grade-7 AV project.

I mean, it’s outwardly satirical, and the makers (Americans who passed through once) have confirmed as much. I’m saddened that you think this would actually be an official tourism video….

[esquire]

S. Halsted St - Chicago (https://goo.gl/maps/WqwfJZaxAbw6ZZRL7)

Osborne St - Winnipeg (https://goo.gl/maps/p9ZsTgChSPagQmj18)

I drove through Chicago on S. Halsted in 2004. It reminded me so much of Winnipeg. Maybe Osborne is a stretch, but I am sure there are streets like Halsted in Winnipeg that I have forgotten (Academy, maybe?)

I can see the Winnipegginess of Halsted but it looks like the West End or North End. Academy projects a slight poshness that I am not seeing anywhere on that corner of Halsted you posted.

[MolsonExport]

I mean, it’s outwardly satirical, and the makers (Americans who passed through once) have confirmed as much. I’m saddened that you think this would actually be an official tourism video….

I figured as much, but you would wonder by reading the commentaries in the youtube video. Don't be saddened. I did not probe information about who the makers were, as I am in no rush to visit Regina. (no offense intended to Regina, which I have been to 4 times).

[BlackDog204]

You clearly lack reading comprehension skills. The juxtaposition between the Ice District and the areas directly north (not east, which is just more downtown office towers, so clearly you are out of touch with reality) has nothing to do with the grandeur. Maybe re-read what I said.

It's also quite hilarious that you're coming from Winnipeg and complaining that Edmonton is dirty. Winnipeg is probably the only city where its citizenry will look to American cities for cleanliness. So many Winnipeggers talk about how they finally made it to Minneapolis and couldn't believe how clean it was by comparison. :haha:


I don't understand how a Winnipeg/Regina thread got to be about Edmonton, but trashing Winnipeg in comparison isn't going to win many friends. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

[thurmas]

You haven't seen Regina until you've been to the Turvey centre

[Wigs]

I figured as much, but you would wonder by reading the commentaries in the youtube video. Don't be saddened. I did not probe information about who the makers were, as I am in no rush to visit Regina. (no offense intended to Regina, which I have been to 4 times).

Molson, I hope "Ex-per-i-ence Re-juy-nuh" with the background music is in your head for the rest of the month :haha:

[harls]

I have experienced Regina. Lived there in 2001.
Now I will forward that video to my Saskatchewan friends who have most certainly heard it.

[lio45]

Remind me again, what’s Edmonton’s answer to Winnipeg’s Bro Ass? :D

[lio45]

It's also quite hilarious that you're coming from Winnipeg and complaining that Edmonton is dirty. Winnipeg is probably the only city where its citizenry will look to American cities for cleanliness. So many Winnipeggers talk about how they finally made it to Minneapolis and couldn't believe how clean it was by comparison. :haha:Winnipeg isn’t alone. It’s fairly typical to be shocked by how clean the closest big US city is (Boston) by contrast with what we’re used to (Montreal).

I’d guess maybe Van->Sea produces a similar effect too but I’d let the locals confirm. My ex-gf visited both back to back (first time in both cases) years ago, and that was her impression, but, anecdotal at this point.

[MolsonExport]

I was disappointed with Seattle on my two visits. I had expected it to feel much larger than Vancouver. Certainly the skyline gave me such an impression but the scene at the street level was much more sedate. And the city's rapid transit was several orders of magnitude worse than Vancouver's. Maybe things have changed since my last visit.

[lio45]

My guess is that my ex-gf went to the older parts of Vancouver (Gastown -> she stumbled upon the DTES) expecting them to be the interesting/vibrant/touristy areas, then contrasted that with whatever the vibrant parts of Seattle looked like at the time, and found the latter cleaner.

Which is why I'm pointing out it's anecdotal and a sample of one whose methodology (personal tourist habits) I have not fully validated, as I wasn't there on that trip (but I can guess).

[hipster duck]

oh man, that is so bad. It has the quality of a grade-7 AV project.

like this (made when London was completely in the Dumps, no doubt only because of a "Can't Do" Eastern attitude). I don't think they could make something as bad on purpose:

--344fV3JCc

Are you sure that a band with the name "Jim Chapman's Incontinentals" isn't a joke?

[MolsonExport]

^It was commissioned by the city. I only wish it were a real joke, instead of being an unintended one. Chapman's band is a real one.

[harls]

I can see the Winnipegginess of Halsted but it looks like the West End or North End. Academy projects a slight poshness that I am not seeing anywhere on that corner of Halsted you posted.

'Winnipegginess' should be a word. :D

Yeah, Academy is a bit more upscale than Halsted. It was a bad example.

Maybe more McGregor-ish (https://goo.gl/maps/3wpnauckW5VakNQd6).

[thewave46]

'Winnipegginess' should be a word. :D

Yeah, Academy is a bit more upscale than Halsted. It was a bad example.

Maybe more McGregor-ish (https://goo.gl/maps/3wpnauckW5VakNQd6).

Winnipegginess (adj):
1. A grizzled hardiness borne of a harsh environment; yet resolute in averageness and unpretentiousness.
2. Yeah, it’s cold here, there are mosquitoes, and we’re the butt of most jokes. At least we didn’t have to sell our kidney to buy a shoebox condo, losers.

[O-tacular]

Are you sure that a band with the name "Jim Chapman's Incontinentals" isn't a joke?

Are they sponsored by Depends?

https://i5.walmartimages.ca/images/Enlarge/548/358/6000202548358.jpg