For Egypt, a Fresh Start With Cities

[ukw]

Something Egypt has in common with the US is that it's not a very urban society. Only 46% of people live in cities.

This NYT article argues that Egypt is the only country that hasn't urbanized in the last 30 years. A prosperous Egypt can only be one which has more urban areas/cities.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/16/business/economy/16leonhardt.html?_r=1&hp


It would be easy to look at the images coming out of Cairo over the last few weeks and think of Egypt as a highly urbanized society. It would also be wrong.

When Hosni Mubarak took power in 1981, Egypt was indeed more urban than the rest of the world. About 44 percent of its population lived in cities. In East Asia, by comparison, only 26 percent of people lived in cities.

Since then, the cities of Asia have expanded rapidly, drawing in millions of peasant farmers looking for a better life — and, more often than not, finding it. Almost 50 percent of East Asians now live in cities. And Egypt? It is the only large country to have become less urban in the last 30 years, according to the World Bank. About 43 percent of Egyptians are city dwellers today.

This urban stagnation helps explain Egypt’s broader stagnation. As tough as city life in poor countries can be, it’s also fertile ground for economic growth. Nearly everything can be done more efficiently in a well-run city, be it plumbing, transportation or the generation of new ideas and businesses. “Being around other people,” says Paul Romer, the economist and growth expert, “helps make us smarter.”

[MolsonExport]

Something Egypt has in common with the US is that it's not a very urban society. Only 46% of people live in cities.

huh? Isn't America's population about 80% urbanized?

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/census/cps2k.htm

[Crawford]

Well, it's hard to imagine a bigger Cairo.

In terms of "feel", Cairo feels as big as any city on earth.

[babybackribs2314]

Well, it's hard to imagine a bigger Cairo.

In terms of "feel", Cairo feels as big as any city on earth.

I was in Cairo last June and when you get in from the airport, it's 10-20 story buildings for miles and miles. Ridiculous density and it just goes on and on. It doesn't have the tall buildings of NYC or even London/Tokyo but Cairo is very dense.

I'm not sure I buy this statistic, either. Maybe they don't live in official cities, but the only areas in Egypt that are really populated are immediately along the Nile--it's basically one big agglomeration, I'd say.

[photoLith]

I call bs on that figure, Im sure most of the people in Egypt live in cities or very near them.

[jtk1519]

huh? Isn't America's population about 80% urbanized?

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/census/cps2k.htm

That's the first thing I thought too. The US urbanized population (% of) is right behind Denmark, Sweden and Brazil and ahead of France, Spain, Switzerland, Italy, Greece and Japan.

[MolsonExport]

I call bs on that figure, Im sure most of the people in Egypt live in cities or very near them.

Nahh, they all live like Bedouins, roving around the desert with Camels and living in tents, rather like Jawas. ;)

[M II A II R II K]

There's already a plan in place to create 2 new cities outside of Cairo.

[M II A II R II K]

The problem with Egypt? Its cities


February 17th, 2011

By Philip Langdon

http://newurbannetwork.com/sites/all/themes/nun/logo.png

Read More: http://newurbannetwork.com/article/problem-egypt-its-cities-14119



When Hosni Mubarak took power in 1981, Egypt was indeed more urban than the rest of the world. About 44 percent of its population lived in cities. In East Asia, by comparison, only 26 percent of people lived in cities. Since then, the cities of Asia have expanded rapidly, drawing in millions of peasant farmers looking for a better life — and, more often than not, finding it.

Almost 50 percent of East Asians now live in cities. And Egypt? It is the only large country to have become less urban in the last 30 years, according to the World Bank. About 43 percent of Egyptians are city dwellers today.

This urban stagnation helps explain Egypt’s broader stagnation. As tough as city life in poor countries can be, it’s also fertile ground for economic growth. Nearly everything can be done more efficiently in a well-run city, be it plumbing, transportation or the generation of new ideas and businesses. “Being around other people,” says Paul Romer, the economist and growth expert, “helps make us smarter.”

Egypt has nothing like China’s Shenzhen, India’s Bangalore, South Korea’s Busan or, to go back further in time, our own Chicago — striving cities that have spawned thousands of new companies. Those cities become giant incubators for economic growth. They are the places where people learn to collaborate and to compete, where they can take advantage of the skills they already have and learn new ones, too.

The government and economy of Egypt, Leonhardt says, have largely failed at "giving their workers skills and forcing them to compete." In a dynamic, urbanizing country, workers are impelled to learn, team up, exchange, and achieve, the theory goes. In a non-urban setting, it's easier to stagnate.




http://newurbannetwork.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/full-content-width/Egyptgraph.jpg

[MolsonExport]

Garbage stats, me thinks. How could Egypt become less urban? where the hell is everyone moving to?

[Crawford]

Yeah, I don't believe it. Egypt is definitely urbanizing.

They're probably considering all the areas outside of Cairo's (rather small) city limits as "rural", which makes no sense.

[Swede]

^Wouldn't surprise me if those stats were calculated using old muinicipal borders. From Wiki:
With a population of 6,758,581[6] spread over 453 square kilometers (175 sq mi), Cairo is by far the largest city in Egypt. With an additional ten million inhabitants just outside the city, Cairo resides at the centre of the largest metropolitan area in Africa and the eleventh-largest urban area in the world.[7]

[Trantor]

That's the first thing I thought too. The US urbanized population (% of) is right behind Denmark, Sweden and Brazil and ahead of France, Spain, Switzerland, Italy, Greece and Japan.

the problem is that what is considered a urban area and thus who lives or not in an urban area varies according to country. There is no global statistic, since statistics are supplied by the countries themselves, each one with different standarts.


you guys shouldnt be THAT impressed with the brazilian statistic for example.


please, check this Wikipedia article for urban area definitions around the world
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_area



in Brazil, the definition for urban area is completely unrelated to size or density. ALL brazilian territory is divided in municipalities (there no square cm of brazilian territory which doesnt belongs to a municipality).

and EVERY municipality has an area that is considered urban, based on the facilities that it offer.

[BnaBreaker]

I'm not sure what the World Bank's definition of "urban area" is, but whatever it is, I'm guessing it's somewhat flawed. There must be some sort of population threshold they're looking at, which as we all know, is flawed logic. High population doesn't necessarily make a place "urban" just as low population doesn't necessarily make a place "rural".

Egypt may only have a few cities of over a million people, but as was pointed out earlier, but roughly 99% of it's 79 million people live within a mile of the Nile, which combined is an area roughly the size of West Virginia.

So, while Egypt may be lacking in large cities, it is in no way lacking in dense urban villages that are crammed relatively closely together. Even "rural" villages in Egypt have some kind of urban community structure to them.

[Nowhereman1280]

Then again Cairo has a population of 16 million in the whole urbanized area. That accounts for a good deal less than a quarter of the 80 million citizens of Egypt. Alexandria (4 million) and the few other metropolitan areas don't come close to Cairo's size, thus the other 60 + million have to be living somewhere...

[Trantor]

I'm not sure what the World Bank's definition of "urban area" is, but whatever it is, I'm guessing it's somewhat flawed.

how can you judge which definition of urban area is flawed or not?

[BnaBreaker]

how can you judge which definition of urban area is flawed or not?

go have a beer

[Trantor]

go have a beer

you can also have a beer in rural areas!!! :D

[M II A II R II K]

These plans have been on the table.



To Catch Cairo Overflow, 2 Megacities Rise in Sand


August 24, 2010

By THANASSIS CAMBANIS

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/08/25/world/asia/25EgyptMap/25EgyptMap-articleInline.jpg

Read More: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/25/world/africa/25egypt.html?_r=2&sq=cairo&st=cse&adxnnl=1&scp=1&adxnnlx=1282838411-c+XPZwqqkMT8z






Luxury homes were being constructed at the Allegria subdivision in 6 of October City in the dunes outside Cairo. One million people live in the new city.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/08/25/world/EGYPT-1/EGYPT-1-articleLarge-v2.jpg




An agent displays a model of the planned Westown development to a potential buyer in 6 of October City this month.

http://imgur.com/WeABZ.jpg

[ametz]

you can also have a beer in rural areas!!! :D

Oh...but in Egypt, it's not so easy to have a beer in rural areas. I traveled an hour each way in the middle of that god forsaken country for a couple glasses of mediocre wine. For about 10 minutes of that trip, I was convinced I was going to be appear on CNN the next morning with a bag over my head, shouting denouncements in monotone (turned out my driver just wasn't especially outgoing. Egyptians, in my experience, are unfailingly polite and when you run across one who isn't, especially when you're being carted through backwater towns in the middle of the desert....scary!)

[Trantor]

Oh...but in Egypt, it's not so easy to have a beer in rural areas. I traveled an hour each way in the middle of that god forsaken country for a couple glasses of mediocre wine. For about 10 minutes of that trip, I was convinced I was going to be appear on CNN the next morning with a bag over my head, shouting denouncements in monotone (turned out my driver just wasn't especially outgoing. Egyptians, in my experience, are unfailingly polite and when you run across one who isn't, especially when you're being carted through backwater towns in the middle of the desert....scary!)

tell them you are brazilian and that you know Ronaldinho or Pelé. You will get smiles and handshakes even from Taliban fighters. :haha:

[ametz]

Actually, their American tourism dried up after 9/11 and I was among a very few Americans there. They were falling over one another to be nice to me (even the people who weren't trying to sell me something). Americans used to be their largest single group, and we spent the most money per person to boot. I'm pretty sure that's not the case any more. Overall, Egypt is NOT a good place to get a beer, or be a woman. I hope that changes along with everything else, because I have nooooo plans to go back until it does (Although I think everyone should go once).