Winnipeg Jets

[esquire]

I assume this is in line with the closure of Moxies.

There is no way they are adding 6000 more seats to the arena. That is an entire third bowl and would make MTS Centre among the largest arenas around at 21k seats.

I remember before 2011 there was a very extensive discussion at the JetsOwner forums about ways that the arena could be expanded, since it was felt at the time that the 15,000 seat capacity of the venue was a serious obstacle to the NHL returning.

One of the ideas floated there eventually ended up happening... the loges attached to the front of the 300 level.

Another idea that seemed plausible but that never happened was adding suites at the top of the 300 level, specifically at the ends of the rink where there is enough room (not so sure whether the sides could handle it). The graphics are gone from the interwebs it appears, but the idea was to punch out the walls at the top of those 300-level end sections and put in suites. It would be a bit like the upper ring of suites at Rogers Arena in Vancouver.

I wonder if something like that is still theoretically in the cards? It wouldn't add a ton to the seating capacity as such, maybe no more than 500 people give or take, but it would be premium seating that could generate fairly high revenues per seat.

[blueandgoldguy]

I remember before 2011 there was a very extensive discussion at the JetsOwner forums about ways that the arena could be expanded, since it was felt at the time that the 15,000 seat capacity of the venue was a serious obstacle to the NHL returning.

One of the ideas floated there eventually ended up happening... the loges attached to the front of the 300 level.

Another idea that seemed plausible but that never happened was adding suites at the top of the 300 level, specifically at the ends of the rink where there is enough room (not so sure whether the sides could handle it). The graphics are gone from the interwebs it appears, but the idea was to punch out the walls at the top of those 300-level end sections and put in suites. It would be a bit like the upper ring of suites at Rogers Arena in Vancouver.

I wonder if something like that is still theoretically in the cards? It wouldn't add a ton to the seating capacity as such, maybe no more than 500 people give or take, but it would be premium seating that could generate fairly high revenues per seat.

I remember that picture. They showed some areas punched out at the top of the upper deck on the north side of the arena.

I think a good comparable would be that punched out area they made for the organist at the top of the upper deck on the west side.

[bomberjet]

Seems like a lot of effort for "premium seating" that is directly behind the cheapest seats in the building.

[bomberjet]

Best seats in the building cost over $9k per seat. While those upper ends are below $3k.

Not sure what a suite runs these days, but I'm assuming at least $9k per seat.

There was not a single sell-out last season. Ticket contracts are gone. They're offering discounted mini-packs. Expansion likely out of the cards for decades. They also say there is zero interest in expanding, which also comes with major technical challenges.

[Jammon]

I remember that picture. They showed some areas punched out at the top of the upper deck on the north side of the arena.

I think a good comparable would be that punched out area they made for the organist at the top of the upper deck on the west side.

I don't see why there is a need for it at this point. It makes no sense to me. The NHL is declining in popularity. I just read that MLS has overtaken the NHL in terms of popularity and the NHL has now fallen to the 5th most popular league in North America. Southern teams are struggling to find support. Did you see the Florida game last night? Empty seats everywhere. Phoenix is a disaster. We're in a recession. Inflation is through the roof. I can't imagine any one would look at expansion at this point in time.

Plus, the seats in that arena are already crowded. We have one of the worst arena experiences from most arenas I've been to. I just don't see the need for more seats, but what do I know? I'm just a season ticket holder who gave up my seats along with countless others who cannot afford it right now.

[esquire]

Seems like a lot of effort for "premium seating" that is directly behind the cheapest seats in the building.

Premium seating is premium seating, regardless of where it's situated. I went to a Canucks game at Rogers Arena last month. I sat in the 300s which are fairly high up, but then you look up and see a ring of suites above you, way at the top. I'm sure they aren't charging nosebleed seat prices up there.

But that said, I take your point that demand levels are down somewhat. But I doubt the teams are struggling, even though there may be unsold seats these days, I bet revenue is as high as ever generally speaking (i.e. adjusting for covid). Ticket prices keep going up even though only a few cities always sell out without fail. These teams know what they're doing.

As an aside, one thing I find interesting is that existing season ticket holders get grandfathered at old prices while new ones pay the current rates. Considering that many seating price categories have gone up substantially since 2011, the pool of potential season ticket holders must be dwindling somewhat with those price increases. I don't think there are endless numbers of people ready to sign on for a whole pile of $500 nights out at a Jets game to replace the ones who have left.

[bomberjet]

Premium seating is premium seating, regardless of where it's situated. I went to a Canucks game at Rogers Arena last month. I sat in the 300s which are fairly high up, but then you look up and see a ring of suites above you, way at the top. I'm sure they aren't charging nosebleed seat prices up there.

But that said, I take your point that demand levels are down somewhat. But I doubt the teams are struggling, even though there may be unsold seats these days, I bet revenue is as high as ever generally speaking (i.e. adjusting for covid). Ticket prices keep going up even though only a few cities always sell out without fail. These teams know what they're doing.

As an aside, one thing I find interesting is that existing season ticket holders get grandfathered at old prices while new ones pay the current rates. Considering that many seating price categories have gone up substantially since 2011, the pool of potential season ticket holders must be dwindling somewhat with those price increases. I don't think there are endless numbers of people ready to sign on for a whole pile of $500 nights out at a Jets game to replace the ones who have left.

Is that true? I've been a season holder for 9 years now. We always pay the current price listed on the website. We have never been grandfathered old prices. Goes up every year.

[blueandgoldguy]

Best seats in the building cost over $9k per seat. While those upper ends are below $3k.

Not sure what a suite runs these days, but I'm assuming at least $9k per seat.

There was not a single sell-out last season. Ticket contracts are gone. They're offering discounted mini-packs. Expansion likely out of the cards for decades. They also say there is zero interest in expanding, which also comes with major technical challenges.

A few years ago, Chipman cleared up those rumours that the roof of the building could be raised to accommodate additional rows of seating. It can't.

The best they could hope for, is punching out the walls at the top of the upper deck or building seating/skysuites in the rafters opposite the press box. As was stated by Esquire that likely only increases seating by around 500, maybe a wee bit more.

If the demand is there for additional luxury seating that provides a unique view of the game (bird's eye) they would build it, I'm sure. They really don't have to pay for it anyways as TNSE gets approx. $6 - $7 million per year from those gambling revenues accrued from the Shark Club.

Once they finish those renovations to restaurant in the basement and the Moxies space in the next year or two, we will see what comes next.

[blueandgoldguy]

I don't see why there is a need for it at this point. It makes no sense to me. The NHL is declining in popularity. I just read that MLS has overtaken the NHL in terms of popularity and the NHL has now fallen to the 5th most popular league in North America. Southern teams are struggling to find support. Did you see the Florida game last night? Empty seats everywhere. Phoenix is a disaster. We're in a recession. Inflation is through the roof. I can't imagine any one would look at expansion at this point in time.

Plus, the seats in that arena are already crowded. We have one of the worst arena experiences from most arenas I've been to. I just don't see the need for more seats, but what do I know? I'm just a season ticket holder who gave up my seats along with countless others who cannot afford it right now.

Florida is a result of 26 years without winning a single round of the playoffs and only a handful of playoff appearances. There is always a lag between a team's improvement and improved attendance. Not saying it shouldn't be better than it is, but it might get there.

Right now I think the NHL popularity is neither declining or increasing, it seems static at this point. The NHL received a huge increase in their national tv contract in the US and playoff ratings have improved this year. I think broadcasters are bullish on the NHL in the near future.

I'd love to see the methodology for this study that claims MLS is more popular than the NHL. IS that in the US in general? Specific cities? The ratings for MLS certainly haven't improved and they are likely to only see their national tv contract in the US increase to $150 million per year from the current $90 million per year they receive. That's a far cry from the $300 million they hope to receive.

As for expansion i had mentioned, I don't necessarily see that happening any time soon. There would have to be demand for it to happen.

[esquire]

Is that true? I've been a season holder for 9 years now. We always pay the current price listed on the website. We have never been grandfathered old prices. Goes up every year.

I don't have first hand experience with this, but I've heard people mention that they don't get the annual fee increases... I'm not sure if that means anyone is still paying 2011 prices, or if they are on 4/5 year contracts where the price doesn't go up during the term of the agreement, etc.

[blueandgoldguy]

They got rid of the multi-year contracts that locked-in guaranteed price increases. Now that those contracts are no longer available, they can increase prices as much as they want each year.

When the Jets signed a new 7-year deal with TSN for regional tv rights, they never released the details of the contract. I have heard it is a substantial increase over the previous one...most numbers I heard thrown around were $7 - $10 million per year for the old contract. Of course, TNSE wants the public to believe they need to sell out every game to be viable so I can see why they won't release the numbers to the public.

[esquire]

When the Jets signed a new 7-year deal with TSN for regional tv rights, they never released the details of the contract. I have heard it is a substantial increase over the previous one...most numbers I heard thrown around were $7 - $10 million per year for the old contract. Of course, TNSE wants the public to believe they need to sell out every game to be viable so I can see why they won't release the numbers to the public.

Honestly I think the Canadian fanbase is still so touchy after losing two teams in the 90s and almost losing more on top of that, that there is still a certain lingering fear that unless every game is sold out, we're in trouble. I guess the Canadian teams are in no rush to dispel that idea.

[bomberjet]

With the contracts. They stipulated a maximum of increase of 2% ( I think) year over year. The increase we saw always matched what the new contracts were signing for. Our price was never out of sync with what the contract prices were on their ticket website. Saying that, I don't know what the prices for say formerly P1 seats are or were. One could just go back into the previous years pricing and find out.

Now that they don't have the contracts, they can in fact raise the price to whatever they want. However, it seems for this coming year some prices are lower. My seats, upper deck corner, row 10-12, or whatever it is (formerly P6). Are cheaper than we paid last year. And the front row, loge, premium seating is over $9k per seat. Ouch.

[thurmas]

I believe it costs 105 or 110 million a year to run the Jets. If they get 30 million from us tv deal 10 million from local tv they still need to generate 60 or 65 million from game day and merch sales.

[esquire]

I believe it costs 105 or 110 million a year to run the Jets. If they get 30 million from us tv deal 10 million from local tv they still need to generate 60 or 65 million from game day and merch sales.

If you assume that the Jets average 15,000 seats at $150 a pop that's $94,500,000 Canadian from tickets alone over 42 games. To say nothing of F&B, merch, plus whatever else. Then factor in the subsidies. I would imagine the Jets are a handsomely profitable enterprise.

[blueandgoldguy]

I believe it costs 105 or 110 million a year to run the Jets. If they get 30 million from us tv deal 10 million from local tv they still need to generate 60 or 65 million from game day and merch sales.

They don't get $30 million from the US TV Deal annually. It works out to around $18 million or so per year. Of course, there is approx. $13 million per year from the Canadian TV deal.

The local tv deal is substantially higher than $10 million...like well over twice as much. Remember, years ago Ottawa received a regional tv deal that pays on average $33 million per year...and that is small market sandwiched between the 2 largest hockey markets in the world. Their regional ratings are smaller than the Jets. Winnipeg's regional ratings are the same or slightly higher than Calgary's despite the smaller regional population.

Jets annual revenues are approx. $130 - $135 million US and should be more next year thanks to the larger US contract, additional national revenue sources and no more COVID-related revenue issues. Saying that, the team would lose a few million if they are at the cap and fail to make the playoffs and thus, do not accrue any additional playoff revenue.

[bomberjet]

IIRC they were making about $2mil per home game from ticket sales a few years back. That pays for the players salaries.

I don't think they're flush with cash. But have to be making a profit.

[thurmas]

As the team only averaged 12,700 fans a game this year and had no playoff run they probably lost around 10 million this year i am guessing with salaries in u.s. funds and most revenue in cdn funds.

[Highwayman]

As the team only averaged 12,700 fans a game this year and had no playoff run they probably lost around 10 million this year i am guessing with salaries in u.s. funds and most revenue in cdn funds.

Doubtful as with that theory most NHL teams would have lost even more as most NHL teams would be very happy with almost 13k per game. Plus seeing as we have some of the highest ticket prices in the league it offsets the cdn dollar. And then take in merchandise money, beers sales which are huge, and then the tv deals. I bet they made $30 million. This team has never lost money since 2011 if you take out the COVID years as all teams lost money then.

[pegcityboy]

Thurmas not to shoot you down but lowest crowd of the the year was 12,700 , The Jets were mostly in the 13,500-14,000 a game , with some slightly bigger . I am educated guessing that the average was somewhere between 13,500-13,700.

[bomberjet]

To the point about NHL teams losing money. The NHL lost billions in revenue over the pandemic and this last season. The players owe the owners like a billion dollars through escrow and are paying it back over the next 5 years IIRC. They all "lost" a lot of money.

I'll see if I can find the article about it.

[bomberjet]

If you can get into the Athletic, this article explains it.
https://theathletic.com/3027401/2021/12/21/how-nhl-corporate-business-has-boomed-and-lifted-the-league-during-the-pandemic/

The players owe the owners $1 bil and will pay it off via escrow through the 23-24 season.

The NHL is taking 17% of salaries into escrow and using that to pay the debt off. So they players lose 17% of their salary, but were paid in full during the pandemic (or some portion of, I'm not sure what exactly the agreement they made was) when revenue was drastically lower.

Players typically put a portion of their salary into escrow every season and are paid back at the end of the year when actual revenues are known.

[thurmas]

Thurmas not to shoot you down but lowest crowd of the the year was 12,700 , The Jets were mostly in the 13,500-14,000 a game , with some slightly bigger . I am educated guessing that the average was somewhere between 13,500-13,700.

12700 is the average from espn this year it includes the games played to 0 fans which makes for the lower average

[Biff]

Apparently Dallas is in on the Trotz sweepstakes. The expected salary is in the $6-7m per year range.

[Highwayman]

Apparently Dallas is in on the Trotz sweepstakes. The expected salary is in the $6-7m per year range.

Philly is interviewing him today also. But even they don't think they can win out Winnipeg just for the fact his dad's here and whatnot and the only way to swoon him is with some ridiculous salary. And I'm sure the Jets can come up with a stupid salary since they had so much practice with per say Wheeler and the likes lol.

Also seeing as Winnipeg was first to interview him shows me that we are the most serious.

[craner]

I remember that picture. They showed some areas punched out at the top of the upper deck on the north side of the arena.

Didn’t they do something similar at the old Winnipeg Arena when the Jets moved to the NHL ?

[thurmas]

Didn’t they do something similar at the old Winnipeg Arena when the Jets moved to the NHL ?

They raised the roof and added 5000 seats on 2 upper decks so the arena went from 10500 to 15500 to be admitted to the nhl in the summer of 79

[YWG-RO]

Those upper decks were awful. Had to use old school TVs to remotely view the scoreboard as the sight lines were so bad. Steepest tiered seating I’ve ever encountered. Always feared I’d roll down.

[harls]

Philly is interviewing him today also. But even they don't think they can win out Winnipeg just for the fact his dad's here and whatnot and the only way to swoon him is with some ridiculous salary. And I'm sure the Jets can come up with a stupid salary since they had so much practice with per say Wheeler and the likes lol.

Also seeing as Winnipeg was first to interview him shows me that we are the most serious.

Hopefully his sentimental side gets to him. He's a great fit for Winnipeg.

[dmacc]

Those upper decks were awful. Had to use old school TVs to remotely view the scoreboard as the sight lines were so bad. Steepest tiered seating I’ve ever encountered. Always feared I’d roll down.

I remember going to a game with my mom who is terrified of heights. She walked down backwards clutching the railing and nearly in tears.

[CoryB]

Those upper decks were awful. Had to use old school TVs to remotely view the scoreboard as the sight lines were so bad. Steepest tiered seating I’ve ever encountered. Always feared I’d roll down.

But the upper deck seating at the old arena made it very hard for the person to obstruct your view by leaning forward. :hell:

[esquire]

Those upper decks were awful. Had to use old school TVs to remotely view the scoreboard as the sight lines were so bad. Steepest tiered seating I’ve ever encountered. Always feared I’d roll down.

In hindsight it was crazy. It was engineered so that in the upper rows, you could see the entire rink but nothing beyond the boards... you couldn't see fans in the second row above the ice on the opposite side because of the steel beam in the way. The advantage to the TVs for viewing the scoreboard projection was that you got to see replays after goals, the 1980s vintage scoreboard didn't have that capability :haha:

http://farm9.static.flickr.com/8615/30147713816_431f27c0be.jpg

Although the upper deck was still not as daunting as the south end seats (the ones 7-Eleven sold) that went incredibly high with few safety measures in place.

This demolition photo gives you some idea of how it looked... the rows kept going past the beams such that in the topmost rows you were sitting above them.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/02/e3/a1/02e3a1c5e5e54d18cfbc8a4cfeb599f8.jpg

[dmacc]

While we all take part in "Trotz Watch 2022", the Rangers are two wins away from giving the Jets a 1st round pick.

[esquire]

While we all take part in "Trotz Watch 2022"

I don't know about you, but for the last week I have been walking around Winnipeg with field binoculars and dressed like this, trying to spot Barry Trotz

https://www.daigletours.com/wp-content/uploads/clothing.jpg

[bomberjet]

They didn't so much raise the roof at old Winnipeg Arena, but built outside the original footprint. The original girders and such were still there, as we all could see right in front of your face haha

[esquire]

The old Winnipeg Arena was a truly fascinating building with its various layers added over the years.

[thurmas]

Reports out Scott Arniel is the backup plan if Trotz turns us down.

[blueandgoldguy]

He will get an interview. The job will hardly be handed to him if trotz picks another organization. There will be other candidates. I wouldn't call him the backup plan.

I wouldn't want Arniel as the coach...almost as much as I wouldn't want Carlyle as the coach. I followed the Columbus Blue Jackets thread on the hfboards when he was a head coach there, and he was pretty much a disaster. Few, if any, thought he was even adequate in his time there. He is an assistant coach at best.

[cheswick]

Reports out Scott Arniel is the backup plan if Trotz turns us down.

Athletic article (from within an hour of this post) says their sources say Arneil is a virtual lock to be brought in but will likely be as an associate coach.

[pspeid]

Athletic article (from within an hour of this post) says their sources say Arneil is a virtual lock to be brought in but will likely be as an associate coach.

IMO the next head coach has to give both players and fans real hope of a serious playoff run at some point. Having to hire a minor-league coach or a re-tread will put the Jets in danger of being not much more than a player development club for other teams.

I know some people feel Winnipeg should "just feel lucky" to have NHL-calibre talent to watch, even if it's on other teams. I have no doubt much of the league feels that way. Personally, though, I think the fan base needs to feel there is some real hope of a championship.

[thurmas]

This team window has closed as a contender they now need to reboot for the next 2 or 3 years

[harls]

It sounds like they want Arniel regardless, but more than likely in an assistant capacity to start.

If Trotz is looking for front office work maybe he comes in and grooms Arniel as the successor for coaching and finds himself a job like head of hockey ops or something Shanahan like here.

[esquire]

It's interesting that Trotz is the guy supposedly coming in for a short time before riding off into the sunset with Arniel the long-term play right behind him, when the two are the same age.

[thurmas]

Arniel is nothing more than an old boys club buddy buddy rehire that is so rampant in hockey he brings absolutely nothing to the table that the team needs.

[CoryB]

If Trotz is seriously angling for a front office job that would give me serious pause if I was sitting in Chevy's chair deciding who to hire.

It would be interesting to see the team hit a triple and score Trotz-Arniel-Caryle for a bases loaded old boyz play.

[thurmas]

If Trotz is seriously angling for a front office job that would give me serious pause if I was sitting in Chevy's chair deciding who to hire.

It would be interesting to see the team hit a triple and score Trotz-Arniel-Caryle for a bases loaded old boyz play.

Might as well hire pokey and the bandit while they are at it

[esquire]

Might as well hire pokey and the bandit while they are at it

Sergei Bautin for director of scouting

[TimeFadesAway]

Those upper decks were awful. Had to use old school TVs to remotely view the scoreboard as the sight lines were so bad. Steepest tiered seating I’ve ever encountered. Always feared I’d roll down.

It was a unique experience, that feeling of falling even while you were sitting down.

[Highwayman]

Well I for one am tired of the Trotz holier than though attitude that he can just take his sweet was time. Like honestly. If you're not interested just say it. I keep hearing he's already got a preliminary deal with Vegas. If that's true then he should get off the shit pot and accept going to the only team in the NHL that will spit you out just as fast as they hire you.


On the flip side this Montgomery guy sounds good. He had a good season with the Stars and took them to the second round. He's played assistant coach to the blues. Jets are supposedly looking at him and he's their #2 pick.


Obviously I'd prefer Trotz.

[pegcityboy]

Jets looking at Tocchet as well , with Montgomery.

[bomberjet]

Trotz should be taking his time. No need to rush himself into something. There is nothing stopping teams from hiring another coach. There's a lot of talent out there right at this moment.

[Highwayman]

Some good news. Vegas hired a head coach. So least they are out of the Trotz sweepstakes lol

[thebasketballgeek]

Flyers probably getting Tortorella after Trotz declined what would have been the largest deal for a coach in NHL history.

Uh oh I’m getting too optimistic here thinking that Trotz to Peg could actually happen. Now that Vegas and Philly have filled their vacancies are there any other teams we need to worry about?

[Biff]

Flyers probably getting Tortorella after Trotz declined what would have been the largest deal for a coach in NHL history.

Uh oh I’m getting too optimistic here thinking that Trotz to Peg could actually happen. Now that Vegas and Philly have filled their vacancies are there any other teams we need to worry about?

Nashville. Likely a big one as he lives there in the off season apparently.

[Hockey]

Nashville. Likely a big one as he lives there in the off season apparently.

HC John Hynes is signed with Nashville already. In May 2022 Nashville announced that they had re-signed Hynes, along with his coaching staff, to two-year extensions.

[Biff]

Whoa, totally missed that announcement.

[harls]

Winnipeg brewery offers Barry Trotz free beer for life if he joins Jets

The story (https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/winnipeg-brewery-offers-barry-trotz-free-beer-for-life-if-he-joins-jets?fbclid=IwAR18suwFqKheQA09NPaLUPLBZy20CB7eOBVaD6FhUjiaTa75iUcnJOCc4kk).

[blueandgoldguy]

Just need a local 7-11 to step up and offer free slurpies for life and that will be a clincher.

[thebasketballgeek]

Not fully Jets related but Paul Maurice just got hired by Florida.

Dream scenario would be Trotz as HC and Brunette as assistant so that he can take the reins once Trotz goes into a management role full time (or retires)

[Biff]

I guess it is between Winnipeg and Detroit now. I would think Yzerman is a pretty good pull for a new coach based on his track record in building Tampa. The downside is I think Detroit is further away from making a serious cup run than Winnipeg would be. I don't believe Boston is a player for Trotz.

I still have a worry about a possible management role in Nashville.

[The Unknown Poster]

Detroit linked more heavily to Tampa assistant Lalonde.

Winnipeg only place Trotz had repeated interviews. I think its a done deal. We heard about the places that he declined or moved on from so if that was the case here, it would be out. Since it isnt, it means Trotz and Jets are either done or very much engaged.

It will get done.

[esquire]

After all this buildup, it will be soul crushing for the Jets fanbase if Trotz doesn't come here. What will we have left? Vigneault or Arniel with the same old cast of characters doing their thing in the dressing room?

[The Unknown Poster]

After all this buildup, it will be soul crushing for the Jets fanbase if Trotz doesn't come here. What will we have left? Vigneault or Arniel with the same old cast of characters doing their thing in the dressing room?

I think all the smoke points to just one fire. Now Wheeler is on some trade boards with the talk TN wants to make significant changes.

I do wonder if its a choice between Wheeler and Sheif or both. Because the Jets wont do that well in trading Wheeler but if they are trading both, its a major statement (and they will do very well in a Sheif trade).

[Highwayman]

Detroit linked more heavily to Tampa assistant Lalonde.

Winnipeg only place Trotz had repeated interviews. I think its a done deal. We heard about the places that he declined or moved on from so if that was the case here, it would be out. Since it isnt, it means Trotz and Jets are either done or very much engaged.

It will get done.

I also heard that the Jets offered him a management job after his coaching stint with the team. So that covers Trotz wish for a long term deal ending in management. They also are said to have offered more then the $7million he's was offered. I think it's a done deal.

I also find it odd that Wheeler is on the trade table. Almost like Trotz is telling management that this is what needs to go. I never dreamed that the Jets who are so loyal would put old man Wheeler up for trade. And supposedly there is interest in Wheeler even with his $8.3 million salary.

[thurmas]

What would they even get for Wheeler? They must be moving him so they can re sign PLD.

[bomberjet]

Seems like Sheifele, Wheeler and Maurice old boys club is no more. Maybe all linked to Trotz and the past issues with this team. Clean house.

Obviously trading wheeler with zero salary retained would be best scenario. Probably be tough with his NMC 5 team trade list. Retaining some salary and getting a player back is probably better than a buy out.

I think they have the space to sign Dubois and keep wheeler. Between Copp and Stasnys salary, should be enough.

[Kinguni]

I think all the smoke points to just one fire. Now Wheeler is on some trade boards with the talk TN wants to make significant changes.

I do wonder if its a choice between Wheeler and Sheif or both. Because the Jets wont do that well in trading Wheeler but if they are trading both, its a major statement (and they will do very well in a Sheif trade).

I wouldn't miss Sheif at this point. His attitude went to shit after that playoff ending suspension. He's a real negative on the team.

[thurmas]

Elliott Friedman reporting PLD has told jets management he plans to test free agency in 2024 so looking like jets are in full rebuild mode now. Not sure if any players want to play here with our atrocious record of keeping star players long term.

[The Unknown Poster]

True North is an embarrassment at this point in how they've managed the Jets. Something obviously happened in the room and it was severe. And it probably started when Buff quit.

Scheif and Wheeler obviously had a major rift. Scheif wants out. Wheeler wants out. PLD comes here and suddenly wants out. Maurice quits mid-season (unheard of). Copp and Trouba wanted out. Statsny rips the team a new one in end of season interview.

Chevy gets a new contract. Uh huh.

Funny all the rumours indicate something major happened and no local media will even entertain the idea. They would all be aware of certain things.

They need to salvage the relationship with PLD.

But what they will do is look at two years of PLD and Scheif, both players who dont want to play here, and they will try to win in that window knowing they will lose both for nothing in 2024. Dont want to show up now? Wait til the team is in full tank and re build mode in two years.

[thurmas]

I know people don't like hearing this but it could be Winnipeg the city itself that is turning players off especially how rough and sketchy our downtown is especially post covid players likely want to be in nicer cities as we are always voted as the city visiting players hate traveling to.

[thebasketballgeek]

I know people don't like hearing this but it could be Winnipeg the city itself that is turning players off especially how rough and sketchy our downtown is especially post covid players likely want to be in nicer cities as we are always voted as the city visiting players hate traveling to.

I don’t think that’s the case remember Winnipeg is MUCH safer then most American cities, even ones that have an NHL team. The majority of American cities has a higher murder rate then Winnipeg. I mean remember there are teams in St Louis, Detroit, LA, Buffalo, Washington, Dallas, Philly, Chicago that have far worse problems regarding crime. Even Minneapolis has double our murder rate…

Winnipeg is also more walkable and has FAR more amenities in Downtown then American downtowns with cities that are 2-3x the size of Winnipeg so that’s not the issue.

The isssue is the weather, taxes, being a small market, and in the Jets case locker room issues. Not much to do with the actual city itself and what it provides contrary to the pessimism and extremely negative sentiment held by the majority of the citizens residing here.

[CoryB]

I also heard that the Jets offered him a management job after his coaching stint with the team. So that covers Trotz wish for a long term deal ending in management. They also are said to have offered more then the $7million he's was offered. I think it's a done deal.

I also find it odd that Wheeler is on the trade table. Almost like Trotz is telling management that this is what needs to go. I never dreamed that the Jets who are so loyal would put old man Wheeler up for trade. And supposedly there is interest in Wheeler even with his $8.3 million salary.

The speculation I have heard with Trotz wanting to transition into management is that a team willing to give him a larger say in what players are on the roster than a head coach normally has would definitely be put higher on his list of teams he was interested in. It is also fairly open knowledge that the Jets front office is a little light in both depth and experience compared to other teams so there is definitely room for Trotz to have something similar to a head coach/assistant general manager type of role in Winnipeg. Also if the Jets are willing to offer a role somewhat like that he may be willing to take less than the $7 million salary reportedly offered by Philly.


After all this buildup, it will be soul crushing for the Jets fanbase if Trotz doesn't come here.

TN: We are interviewing Trotz to be our next head coach.
Jets Fans: :cheers:
Trotz: I have decided to take the next season off from hockey.
TN: We are pleased to announce Randy Caryle as the next head coach of the Jets.
Jets Fans: :hell:

[esquire]

True North is an embarrassment at this point in how they've managed the Jets. Something obviously happened in the room and it was severe. And it probably started when Buff quit.

Scheif and Wheeler obviously had a major rift. Scheif wants out. Wheeler wants out. PLD comes here and suddenly wants out. Maurice quits mid-season (unheard of). Copp and Trouba wanted out. Statsny rips the team a new one in end of season interview.

Chevy gets a new contract. Uh huh.

Funny all the rumours indicate something major happened and no local media will even entertain the idea. They would all be aware of certain things.

They need to salvage the relationship with PLD.

But what they will do is look at two years of PLD and Scheif, both players who dont want to play here, and they will try to win in that window knowing they will lose both for nothing in 2024. Dont want to show up now? Wait til the team is in full tank and re build mode in two years.

Well put.

It is absolutely unbelievable how the organization squandered the immense potential that existed in 2017-18. One deep run and then it all fell apart with everybody running to the exits and jack all to show for it.

The local media is a joke, they are totally cowed by TNSE. I guess no one wants to risk losing the road trips to sunny destinations and the pre-game buffets. Anytime a story breaks about the Jets it's always the national media that does it.

Let's face it, the window is on the verge of slamming shut. After beating Edmonton in last year's playoffs I had hopes that the situation could be salvaged but it's becoming increasingly unlikely that will happen. Hiring Barry Trotz is the last chance to fix this before TNSE may as well fold its hand and start the total rebuild by turning into a draft lottery team for the next several years. And good luck selling season tickets when you're a 20 win team charging $200 per seat.

[esquire]

TN: We are interviewing Trotz to be our next head coach.
Jets Fans: :cheers:
Trotz: I have decided to take the next season off from hockey.
TN: We are pleased to announce Randy Caryle as the next head coach of the Jets.
Jets Fans: :hell:

Pretty well any coach hire other than Trotz would be a massive letdown at this point. It's interesting that TNSE didn't really pour cold water on the idea, because we're at a point now where Jets fans are expecting news of a Trotz hire and there will be big-time backlash if that doesn't happen.

[cheswick]

Pretty well any coach hire other than Trotz would be a massive letdown at this point. It's interesting that TNSE didn't really pour cold water on the idea, because we're at a point now where Jets fans are expecting news of a Trotz hire and there will be big-time backlash if that doesn't happen.

I don't get the Trotz hype. It's not like he's Scotty Bowman. I mean I get he's been in the league a long time and has won a cup but there are other coaches out there with similar pedigree. Claude Julien has a cup and a superior points % than Trotz as one example. Dan Bylsma was just hired in the AHL so not available anymore but he's won a cup and has a .615 win percentage in the league. There are lots of long tenured coaches if that's the way to go. Not sure what makes Trotz so special.

I mean someone was joking about Carlyle above, not like his coaching record is inferior to Trotz.

[esquire]

^ Look at Trotz's record, it speaks for itself. Except for Nashville's first few years as an expansion team, his teams have consistently been in the playoffs and more often than not win a couple of series if not more.

[Highwayman]

True North is an embarrassment at this point in how they've managed the Jets. Something obviously happened in the room and it was severe. And it probably started when Buff quit.

Scheif and Wheeler obviously had a major rift. Scheif wants out. Wheeler wants out. PLD comes here and suddenly wants out. Maurice quits mid-season (unheard of). Copp and Trouba wanted out. Statsny rips the team a new one in end of season interview.

Chevy gets a new contract. Uh huh.

Funny all the rumours indicate something major happened and no local media will even entertain the idea. They would all be aware of certain things.

They need to salvage the relationship with PLD.

But what they will do is look at two years of PLD and Scheif, both players who dont want to play here, and they will try to win in that window knowing they will lose both for nothing in 2024. Dont want to show up now? Wait til the team is in full tank and re build mode in two years.

Scheif said he didn't want out. Sure it sounded like that at the end of the season as he was upset like any pro sports player would be. They all were in fact.

Since then Scheif has stated publically he doesn't want to be traded. So maybe don't go with rumours from the end of the season.

Since when does PLD want out ? Seriously, is this new you got from the Athletic or some other half baked web site which always bashes the Jets.

I was reading on Sports net and other reputable sites that they say Winnipeg has the best shot at landing Trots as they are already a built team. Unlike the other current suitors. They praised PLD and Conner and Scheif and Ehlers and helle. I know some people on here are so obsessed with Chevy and the Buff situation. Buff wanted to retire. He has retired. Have you seen him in the NHL since ? No. Yes his longgggggggggg drawn out going away mess was uncalled for and that didn't exactly help the Jets or management. And how does Chevy keep your forwards and star goalie and the D we had with only so much money???? Please enlighten me to this so I can understand how a CAP team has extra money???? We had to let players go. We are lucky we locked in the ones we did.

Also this Paul Maurice crap that he quit. Give me a break. He got fired and they were gave him the dignified way out. As TN always does. If we were say TO he would have been fired publically.

And even without that saviour Paul coaching we still sucked with Paul 2.0 and people cried again at Chevy saying we lost Paul. Omfg. Paul was the reason we sucked. And Paul taught Lowry how to be a coach. Same game plays rest of season. Same loyalty to the old folks club.

Trotz isn't going to give the old folks like Wheeler a good time. And I'm pretty sure TN already has the paperwork done with Trotz. Remember TN is always a very silent organization and keeps things under wraps. And the fact that they are entertaining the Wheeler trade is a good sign Trotz is already calling the shots as no one in the organization would date upset Wheeler.

And honestly if him and Scheif were traded. Good riddens. We'd definitely get a good return and the locker room issues would be gone.

As for PLD. He's just like any other star player. Weighing out his options. But he's never once said he doesn't want to be here. He's actually happy here. And he if anyone knows what it's like to be on a team that treats you like crap. I expect PLD is waiting to see what happens to Wheeler also as PLD should imo be the next captain. And maybe that's what he'd is asking for in his contract? Maybe that's also why Wheeler trade is now an option. As we all know Wheeler would SULK if he lost that C.

[cheswick]

Scheif said he didn't want out. Sure it sounded like that at the end of the season as he was upset like any pro sports player would be. They all were in fact.

Since then Scheif has stated publically he doesn't want to be traded. So maybe don't go with rumours from the end of the season.

Since when does PLD want out ? Seriously, is this new you got from the Athletic or some other half baked web site which always bashes the Jets.

I was reading on Sports net and other reputable sites that they say Winnipeg has the best shot at landing Trots as they are already a built team. Unlike the other current suitors. They praised PLD and Conner and Scheif and Ehlers and helle. I know some people on here are so obsessed with Chevy and the Buff situation. Buff wanted to retire. He has retired. Have you seen him in the NHL since ? No. Yes his longgggggggggg drawn out going away mess was uncalled for and that didn't exactly help the Jets or management. And how does Chevy keep your forwards and star goalie and the D we had with only so much money???? Please enlighten me to this so I can understand how a CAP team has extra money???? We had to let players go. We are lucky we locked in the ones we did.

Also this Paul Maurice crap that he quit. Give me a break. He got fired and they were gave him the dignified way out. As TN always does. If we were say TO he would have been fired publically.

And even without that saviour Paul coaching we still sucked with Paul 2.0 and people cried again at Chevy saying we lost Paul. Omfg. Paul was the reason we sucked. And Paul taught Lowry how to be a coach. Same game plays rest of season. Same loyalty to the old folks club.

Trotz isn't going to give the old folks like Wheeler a good time. And I'm pretty sure TN already has the paperwork done with Trotz. Remember TN is always a very silent organization and keeps things under wraps. And the fact that they are entertaining the Wheeler trade is a good sign Trotz is already calling the shots as no one in the organization would date upset Wheeler.

And honestly if him and Scheif were traded. Good riddens. We'd definitely get a good return and the locker room issues would be gone.

As for PLD. He's just like any other star player. Weighing out his options. But he's never once said he doesn't want to be here. He's actually happy here. And he if anyone knows what it's like to be on a team that treats you like crap. I expect PLD is waiting to see what happens to Wheeler also as PLD should imo be the next captain. And maybe that's what he'd is asking for in his contract? Maybe that's also why Wheeler trade is now an option. As we all know Wheeler would SULK if he lost that C.

I believe PLD "wanting out" is coming from Friedman. Basically it's being reported that PLD wants to go to free agency in 2 years after his RFA period is up. So he's not willing to sign long term.

[esquire]

I believe PLD "wanting out" is coming from Friedman. Basically it's being reported that PLD wants to go to free agency in 2 years after his RFA period is up. So he's not willing to sign long term.

Which would be an organizational disaster for Winnipeg. We gave up Laine and Roslovic (who wanted out themselves, of course) for PLD. To have PLD as a glorified rental who'd walk out at the first given opportunity would be absolutely awful for the Jets.

I don't know what the hell has happened with this team to cause seemingly everyone to want out all of a sudden, but something crazy is going on and we are not getting the story.

[CoryB]

I mean someone was joking about Carlyle above, not like his coaching record is inferior to Trotz.

I like to joke that the Jets are going to get Carlyle as their next coach but the sad part is there is a lot of truth behind that. If we were talking about a player that was a little past their prime instead of a coach we all know that is exactly what Chevy and TN love to add to their roster. That Caryle got his pro coaching start under Chipman and the old-boys loyalty club that is TN you know without question he was on the short list before Trotz became available.

The other reality with Caryle is he went to the playoffs 8 of the 13 (61%) seasons he started the season as a head coach. And half of those seasons they won at least the first round of the playoffs including one cup win.


Compare that to Maurice with with 9 appearances over 23 seasons (39%) and only advancing past the first round 4 times and no cup wins as a head coach. Just because Maurice lucked into a situation making him a relatively young head coach at 28 giving him a lot of career wins doesn't necessarily make him a top level coach.

Compare that with Trotz who also coached 23 seasons with 14 play off appearances (60%), advancing past the first round 8 times and winning the cup once.

There are lots more numbers that could be crunched to compare coaching records but Maurice was never the diamond that TN and the loyal Jets fans tried to claim.

Heck I joking sent a text to a friend late in the season with a picture of the player banners in the arena rafters saying "leaked shortlist of the Jets head coach candidates".

I had also called for Trotz as the next head coach before the season was up and got laughed at by a few people as "he's under contract in New York". It definitely feels a little suspect that it was easy to see that road as a possibility and then magically it opened up. Perhaps TN owes a favor or two to the Islanders...

[thurmas]

We just have to accept we are the Buffalo Sabres of the central division

[esquire]

We just have to accept we are the Buffalo Sabres of the central division

Tickets are going to be a hell of a tough sell if that's the case...

[thurmas]

Tickets are going to be a hell of a tough sell if that's the case...

Maybe thats the tough medicine true north needs to face to get out of their old boys club mentality

[CoryB]

We just have to accept we are the Buffalo Sabres of the central division

That is just it, the Jets need to aspire to be the Penguins of the Central division instead of the Sabres or instead of trying to copy the Panthers by scooping up just past their prime players from other teams.

[Gadzookz]

Well, as per Darren Dreger so much for Trotz..

[thurmas]

Well, as per Darren Dreger so much for Trotz..

All that time waisted on him. Bring on Alain Vigneault I guess jets are in for a long messy rebuild now good thing the Bombers success these days gives us something to enjoy rather than the continued mediocrity of the Jets.

[thebasketballgeek]

Hellebucyck and Scheif can probably fetch 4 first round picks + some A prospects. Even if we keep our current core I just don’t think they have the talent to win a cup.

Re-sign Dubois, trade our veterans, and tank for Bedard.

I stand by this statement, but add a Dubois trade as well. We can be the OKC Thunder of the NHL and stockpile a bunch of top picks and prospects with the assets we currently have.

There’s no reason to compete anymore our window is officially closed. There’s a generational prospect waiting for us next year with another elite prospect (Mitchkov) as a good consolation prize.

[esquire]

I have a feeling we're going to go through an awkward period of pretending we aren't tanking when in reality this upcoming season is over before it even began.

Honestly, just go into full tank mode and at least you'll have something to show for it instead of coming in 10th in the conference for the next 5 years.

[thurmas]

I have a feeling we're going to go through an awkward period of pretending we aren't tanking when in reality this upcoming season is over before it even began.

Honestly, just go into full tank mode and at least you'll have something to show for it instead of coming in 10th in the conference for the next 5 years.

Sounds like a return of jets 1.0 from struggling for that last playoff spot every year and having mediocre attendance

[Highwayman]

Well, as per Darren Dreger so much for Trotz..

Well I have as much respect for Trotz now as Wheeler.

He dragged this out through all these teams and then in the end after we were about to hand him everything on a silver platter he wants to take a break from coaching. Like FFS. Maybe just have said that when you got fired instead of screwing multiple teams over just to see if you could get a big payday. Maybe New York was right to fire him. Maybe we don't know the whole story.

What happened to our second choice for coach ?

[esquire]

Sounds like a return of jets 1.0 from struggling for that last playoff spot every year and having mediocre attendance

Being mediocre is the worst thing possible, and the Jets 1.0 were pretty much specialists in that. Better to come in dead last for a couple seasons and load up on talent. It's not like the place is going to be packed to watch a 22nd overall team.

[thurmas]

Being mediocre is the worst thing possible, and the Jets 1.0 were pretty much specialists in that. Better to come in dead last for a couple seasons and load up on talent. It's not like the place is going to be packed to watch a 22nd overall team.

How fitting then if Arniel or Carlyle comes back to continue the tradition from player to coach

[CoryB]

Per multiple professional sports journalist sources the Trotz watch is over in Winnipeg.

Time to get that Caryle watch fired up. When it happens watch for that crazy spin on how great it is to get a coach of his caliber, he has a long history with Winnipeg and how he wants to give back to the city that gave him a chance to start his pro coaching career, etc. It's going to be almost as heavy a spin on how great a coach Maurice is but with a few more stats to actually support it.

[esquire]

Per multiple professional sports journalist sources the Trotz watch is over in Winnipeg.

Time to get that Caryle watch fired up. When it happens watch for that crazy spin on how great it is to get a coach of his caliber, he has a long history with Winnipeg and how he wants to give back to the city that gave him a chance to start his pro coaching career, etc. It's going to be almost as heavy a spin on how great a coach Maurice is but with a few more stats to actually support it.

Like I said yesterday:

Pretty well any coach hire other than Trotz would be a massive letdown at this point. It's interesting that TNSE didn't really pour cold water on the idea, because we're at a point now where Jets fans are expecting news of a Trotz hire and there will be big-time backlash if that doesn't happen.

The TNSE PR staff sure have their work cut out for them now.

[thurmas]

I am hearing Montgomery or Derek Lalonde in the running maybe Vingneault a long shot from his Canucks days and Chipman running the moose back in the day

[thurmas]

Atleast if the Jets hire Montgomery or Brunette they get a younger coach who actually wants to be here and prove himself.

[Highwayman]

I am hearing Montgomery or Derek Lalonde in the running maybe Vingneault a long shot from his Canucks days and Chipman running the moose back in the day

Yes Montgomery. That's the other one. He has a pretty good record from what I looked up. Maybe he is the answer. Maybe Trotz really wasn't the best idea. Must be a reason all the other teams didn't keep trying to get him and went on to hire other coaches.

Funny thing. Reading the Panthers and Maurice. They think they won the lottery lol.:shrug:

Im not worried about PLD either. He's doing the smart thing tbh. He had a great year. He obviously wants top dollar. So saying he wants to test the free market in 2 years just gets other teams interested and that raises his asking price. He'll probably stay but we will end up paying more. Just pray it isn't a long term Wheeler one where we get sucked punched in the end. I really would like to see PLD as captian. I think the guys look up to him. And they definitely do not look up to Scheif or Wheeler. I'd still like to keep Scheif though as I think of Wheeler were gone he'd be a way better player and person. Wheeler has been toxic to this team. He's not a bad player. But his ego is way to big.

[thurmas]

I think I would take Montgomery he had a good record in Dallas and in St Louis he did well and could help bring their defensive philosophy here which we badly need

[thurmas]

https://www.defendingbigd.com/2019/6/26/18744242/dallas-stars-jim-montgomery-coaching-philosophy-and-how-the-roster-needs-to-fulfill-it-puck-moving

Montgomery’s Coaching Philosophy and How The Roster Needs to Fulfill It

As the free agency window gets closer and the Stars look to reshape their roster for the 2019-20 season, what will the 2020 Dallas Stars look like? A quote from head coach Jim Montgomery last year has stuck with me and has been making me wonder what some of those internal discussions may sound like between management and the coaching staff regarding the type of players they want to bring in. Last year, Matthew DeFranks spoke with Montgomery and quoted the following:

“Montgomery said he doesn’t think in pairs. On a three-player line, he wants a puck possession player, a puck pressure player and a scorer. He uses the Benn-Seguin-Radulov line as an example.

”On a line, a scorer needs to go with a puck possession guy,” Montgomery said. “Ideally, that third guy is a puck possession guy that does all the details and the habits right that create turnovers for the other two to do their magic. If you look at when Rads is going, Rads is a puck possession guy and also a guy that creates turnovers because of his puck pressure. Seggy’s a spiner. And Jamie Benn is a puck possession power guy.”

”If you look at other lines right now, if you look at Boston’s line,” Montgomery said. “Pastrnak is a sniper. Bergeron and Marchand are both puck possession and incredible puck pressure guys. That’s why their one of the best lines, because they’re consistent with their habits and their details.

”Colorado, 29 is the sniper. Rantanen is the puck possession guy and Landeskog is the detailed guy. He’s getting rewarded with goals because he’s doing things really well.”

I find this actually quite interesting for two reasons that stick out. The first being that mostly it seems as if the common thought process is having a forward pair then supplying that duo with a support piece to create a forward line. Montgomery obviously forgoes this and instead looks for complete lines of three that have a specific chemistry — puck possession/playmaker, shooter, and puck pressure/two-way player.

The next thing that has stuck with me — and one that is noticeable when the Stars are playing up-tempo — is his concentration on puck pressure. Montgomery loves players with closing speed and who are efficient in creating turnovers in the offensive and/or neutral zone. Some players are better at it than others and it’s a quality that is not easily measured through statistics. Although Montgomery and the Stars blended themselves as a defensive, shut-down team around the midway point of the 2018-19 season, the Dallas head coach has preached since the beginning that he envisions his team being a “relentless, puck-pressuring team that makes plays all over the ice.”

The big question to consider — does Montgomery run back the same defensive structure with a heaping of icings and forwards back to negate chances? Or will we see a more up-tempo team that is aggressive in the forecheck and neutral zone, taking time and space away from the other team and creating offensive chances from turnovers and defensive zone exits? Montgomery mentioned this season that with the roster he had to work with, a team structured around defense works best — and it did. But with the recent trades, I believe Montgomery and GM Jim Nill are working diligently on creating the identity of a roster that fits Montgomery’s philosophy more accurately.

Cogliano & Hartman
The two big trades with term that the new Dallas Stars have made are Devin Shore for Andrew Cogliano and Tyler Pitlick for Ryan Hartman. I believe what these trades tell the fans is actually pretty compelling. At face-value, they don’t say much. Both trades are for bottom-six players of pretty equal value, but it’s their qualities that really revolve around Montgomery’s coaching philosophy.

Cogliano, as many Stars fans have now seen, has excellent speed, which in return makes him very valuable in pressuring the puck. This was evident on the penalty kill this season where he was very effective, due to his pure speed and smart positioning, at closing out and disrupting players as they retrieved the puck. Shore never really had that pure speed that Cogliano possesses and was more of an all-around support player. Cogliano better fit the bill and with his time in Dallas this past season has brought important qualities that the coaching staff like to see: possession and pressure with speed.

On Monday, the Stars announced a trade for Ryan Hartman by way of sending Tyler Pitlick to the Philadelphia Flyers. Again, at first glance this is a depth player for a depth player. But it’s the underlying qualities of Hartman that better reflect how Montgomery wants to shape his team to be going forward. Out of 338 forwards, Hartman ranked 14th in the league in penalties drawn. He was described by hockey media online as a cheaper Antoine Roussel that hounds the puck and gets shots on net. His 8.22 shots per hour would have put him second on the Stars this past season, just above Alexander Radulov’s 8.03. Again, equal players in Pitlick and Hartman, but Hartman more closely embodies what Montgomery wants out of his players — being able to pressure the puck. Hartman also has the quality as a shooter for one of Montgomery’s lines (puck possession/playmaker, shooter, and puck pressure/two-way player), which is something the Stars desperately lack.

[thurmas]

Still no jets coach man this is depressing how no one wants to come here or stay here