UBC/UEL Updates Discussion

[Rusty Gull]

The University of British Columbia's Point Grey campus is undergoing significant changes, complete with new residential communities, overhauled infrastructure, improved faculty buildings and expansion to museums and other civic amenities.

UBC Winter Sports Centre
http://www.vancouver2010.com/images/venue_display/ubc_winter_sports_centre.jpg?

UBC Sauder School of Business
http://www.sauder.ubc.ca/AM/Images/newbuilding/images/LandingPage.jpg

University Town
http://www.universitytown.ubc.ca/images/utown_map.gif

University Boulevard
http://www.universitytown.ubc.ca/images/ublvd_1.jpg

Irving K. Barber Learning Centre
http://www.ikebarberlearningcentre.ubc.ca/images/swnight_new.jpg

[MistyMountainHop]

If you're going to post a poll, please post some pics. I'm too lazy to look for them myself.

[Jared]

Which development is university town? Is that the new tounhouse stuff over on Westbrook?

[Rusty Gull]

"The top students, teachers and researchers are attracted to campuses that have an energetic, intellectually stirring social environment where they can live and where they will be encouraged and inspired to do their best work.

Like all great universities, the University of British Columbia is evolving. A conventional commuter campus for much of its history, the university is returning to the original vision of its founding architects who in 1914 described "…a university city in an idyllic setting."

University Town residents will enjoy unparalleled learning opportunities amid breathtaking surroundings of mountains, sea and forest as well as back-yard attractions such as the world-renowned Museum of Anthropology, the internationally acclaimed Chan Centre for the Performing Arts and state-of-the art recreational facilities.

As the University grows with the creation of University Town, the three pillars of sustainability (ecology, economy, and community) are the foundation for the planning and implementation of all new academic buildings and residential neighbourhoods."

http://www.universitytown.ubc.ca/

[raggedy13]

I thought University Blvd was part of the University Town project. Isn't University Town the thing involving redoing University Blvd, redoing the SUB plaza, taking out the grassy knoll and putting in an underground bus loop, taking out the pool etc and putting retail and new buildings all along University between Westbrook and East Mall? Or is that something separate from University Town? Or is it just one of many components of University Town?

http://www.universitytown.ubc.ca/archcomp/exhibit_poll/TeamA/TeamA/Slide1.JPG

[officedweller]

I think University Town is at 16th and East Mall.

[The_Henry_Man]

I thought University Blvd was part of the University Town project. Isn't University Town the thing involving redoing University Blvd, redoing the SUB plaza, taking out the grassy knoll and putting in an underground bus loop, taking out the pool etc and putting retail and new buildings all along University between Westbrook and East Mall? Or is that something separate from University Town? Or is it just one of many components of University Town?

http://www.universitytown.ubc.ca/archcomp/exhibit_poll/TeamA/TeamA/Slide1.JPG

I saw a petition being passed around that's petitioning against the developing of the grassy knoll and the construction of the underground bus loop to generate revenue to pay for projects during one of my classes last week. I didn't sign it.

[fever]

My understanding is that UniversityTown is a marketing campaign designed to obtain student support for the development of market residential at the university. It's a vague collection of concepts that means something slightly different for each individual neighbourhood, but the basic point is to build market residential. The website (http://www.universitytown.ubc.ca/) provides many examples of how to use the word sustainability in a sentence. I'm not actually opposed to it. I just can't stand any material written by marketers, marketers themselves, and pr websites that don't say anything. Same thing with ecoDensity. It's not so bad if you actually read the official documents.

[Jared]

I saw a petition being passed around that's petitioning against the developing of the grassy knoll and the construction of the underground bus loop to generate revenue to pay for projects during one of my classes last week. I didn't sign it.

Ya, I noticed it too, they had a booth in the SUB plaza. I didnt bother signing it either.

From the looks of that rendering, it appears there's no convinient way to get from McInnis/Bus loop to East Mall without going all the way around the SUB (unless they have some strategically places doors, but going inside and then out again 20ft later will just slow everyone down). I'm also gonna miss that grassy knoll, its a great place to snooze/do hwk, if the weather is nice. Still, overall it looks like a good project.


Other ones to mention are the Biodiversity Reseach Center, between Biology and Kaiser building, (just starting pouring foundations), and the Chem Building, which is having its interior gutted and redone.

[squeezied]

hmmm the underground bus loop really appeals to me. owell, if it ever does get built, i'll probably be long graduated already

[radacal]

From the looks of that rendering, it appears there's no convinient way to get from McInnis/Bus loop to East Mall without going all the way around the SUB (unless they have some strategically places doors, but going inside and then out again 20ft later will just slow everyone down).


The rendering is a poor one - the eastern building does not butt up against the SUB.

[aastra]

Are they really going to replace the admin building with a lowrise condo building? That seems wasteful to me. Doesn't have to be a highrise but you'd think it would be at least as tall as the new building across the street.

Methinks that space between the gym and the lowrise condos would be a bit awkward.

[Rusty Gull]

Now updated with images from four of the projects...

[raggedy13]

^Thanks for the added info/images. I'm happy to see the University Town/University Blvd relationship cleared up... that is that University Blvd is a "neighbourhood" of the overarching University Town plan.

[Coldrsx]

i have a condo in hampton place...5735.

[Rusty Gull]

The Irving K. Barber Learning Centre could emerge as a darkhorse. It's starting to look very nice as construction progresses, and it could become an architectural focal point on the UBC Campus.

I've noticed that the MOA expansion has yet to receive any votes. This is actually a pretty big project - $52 million, at least. It should solidify the MOA as one of Vancouver's most notable cultural tourism destinations.

[Holden West]

New U.B.C. theological neighbourhood is less than divine TREVOR BODDY
From Friday's Globe and Mail
POSTED ON: 20/04/07 (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070420.revan-boddy-0420/REStory/RealEstate/)

http://images.theglobeandmail.com/archives/RTGAM/images/20070420/revan-boddy-0420/vanboddy20re1big.jpg

The University of British Columbia's theological colleges used to be set within a verdant park at the gateway to the campus. The colleges are still there, but now they have become almost invisible, lost within the latest of the residential neighbourhoods that have made the U.B.C. campus the Greater Vancouver Regional District's fastest-growing area. One of this city's most sublime sites has been densified, but the results fall far short of divine.

The story of how an academic theological precinct became a theological neighbourhood mainly home to residents without campus connections is one of the collision of worldly mammon with heavenly good intentions.

It all begins with special leases for college buildings granted in U.B.C.'s early years for each of the major Christian denominations: Roman Catholic, Baptist, Presbyterian, Anglican and United churches. So eager were campus officials to attract and keep theological colleges — the spiritual foundation for most older Canadian universities — they granted them leases running not the 99 years typical for other on-campus institutions, but for 999 years. Their future secure, a series of college buildings were then constructed from the 1920 through the 1950s on wide lawns backed with lush plantings, a serene, bucolic, and yes, meditative gateway to the campus along Chancellor Boulevard.

By the late 1990s, the theological colleges were facing both fading enrolments and failing buildings. With condo developments starting to rise all over campus, the college's long term leases turned out to be a hugely valuable asset, since exploited to the hilt. Under the terms of their leases, revenues generated by the sale of college properties to developers have gone not to general U.B.C. accounts, but to the colleges themselves, turning some of nation's poorer theological institutes into some of its richest. I have no problem with this windfall, but the resulting architecture and public spaces are a huge disappointment.

This is particularly apparent in the spaces and buildings around the Iona Building, the severe grey granite 1927 building for the United Church that long acted as the entranceway citadel for the entire Point Grey campus. The stern bearing and Collegiate Gothic style of this six-storey college is no match for the 14-storey Corus condo tower that now looms behind it. The tower was moved to this unfortunate location because of strenuous objections from residents in the long-established Endowment Lands neighbourhood to the north.

With a dazzling view of Burrard Inlet and the North Shore mountains, the space in front of the Iona Building should have become the key urban plaza for the mid-rise, medium density development that now surrounds it. Instead this space is ungainly, unsightly and undefined, but the blame for this lost opportunity has to be spread around. Campus planners and on-campus developer UBC Properties Trust talked about this as the hub for the new neighbourhood, but did not stand by their convictions through design and development. Intercorp, the private sector developer of three sides of this would-be square did not load retail functions and townhouse doorways around it, which might have enlivened this public space's edges. For its own part, the United Church college insisted on retaining a dozen parking spaces located at what is, by rights, the centre of the square. Vehicles stationed there now have one of the best views in the city, but then Hondas and Chevrolets don't have eyes.
Early plans for the neighbourhood show a grand boulevard with a rivulet-fountain proceeding from Iona's tower to Chancellor Boulevard. In a somewhat questionable appeasement to residents on the other side of this key campus access road, the new duplex housing along this edge are not only the smallest in scale, but also detailed with gables and period detail to recall suburbia — the suburbs of Calgary, it seems. [ooh, burn! ;)]
Formerly, U.B.C. visitors were greeted by vast lawns and quaint colleges; now they get a strip of Cowtown. What is worse, ungainly mock-bungalows at either side of the entrance of this road up to Iona now effectively reduce campus visitor's views of the college to milliseconds as they pass by on the main boulevard. As there are many ways this density could have been achieved without blocking views to the old building, I am obliged to ask: what profiteth it a theological college to gain a housing development, if it looseth its own presence?
The architecture and housing layouts completed to date by Intercorp and Bastion developments are the equal to or better than other recent condos on campus, but this is faint praise, as U.B.C.'s new housing design standards elsewhere are surprisingly low.

Some of the best parts of the new development are the student residences that come in at double the condo area development of 1.2 times as much building as site area. Parking for these uses the Dutch idea of "Woon Erfs," with pavers removing distinctions between roadway, sidewalk and the stoops of flanking student lodgings.

This urban design idea and the residence architecture comes from Delft-trained architect Jan Timmer, commissioned directly by the university. Mr. Timmer saw the project through an early phase, but alas, the university did not retain him when designs and development plans got more specific — and in need of independent judgment — later on. Mr. Timmer is frank in admitting that the built result does not always rise to the hopes expressed in his own 2001 planning guidelines: "a dynamic interplay between economic, social, ecological and spiritual issues in the building of a sustainable community."

This is the most physically blessed and high profile of all the redeveloped corners of the U.B.C. campus. Too bad the neighbourhood's stewards at the UBC Properties Trust and university administration did not treat it that way.

[aastra]

I agree with much of that. Although I don't get his affection for "vast lawns." Some other sticky points for me:

...the severe grey granite 1927 building for the United Church that long acted as the entranceway citadel for the entire Point Grey campus.

This is a pretty serious exaggeration. I'd be surprised if 10% of the traffic into UBC came from that direction.

The stern bearing and Collegiate Gothic style of this six-storey college is no match for the 14-storey Corus condo tower that now looms behind it.

I know what he's saying, but we should keep things in perspective and remember that the buck ugly Gage Towers have been standing right there for 30+ years.

http://www.library.ubc.ca/archives/campus/gage.html

http://angel.library.ubc.ca/cgi-bin/getimage.exe?CISOROOT=/ubcnew&CISOPTR=7025&DMSCALE=85.71429&DMWIDTH=600&DMHEIGHT=600&DMX=0&DMY=0&DMTEXT=gage&REC=5&DMTHUMB=1&DMROTATE=0

http://angel.library.ubc.ca/cgi-bin/getimage.exe?CISOROOT=/ubcnew&CISOPTR=7031&DMSCALE=85.71429&DMWIDTH=600&DMHEIGHT=600&DMX=0&DMY=0&DMTEXT=gage&REC=1&DMTHUMB=1&DMROTATE=0

http://www.maps.ubc.ca/PROD/images/photos/836_a.jpg

Also, to claim the Iona building is "no match" for a modern highrise is a pretty serious slight against it, in my opinion. It must be about as tall as a 10-story residential building, no?

http://angel.library.ubc.ca/cgi-bin/getimage.exe?CISOROOT=/ubcnew&CISOPTR=30601&DMSCALE=100.00000&DMWIDTH=600&DMHEIGHT=600&DMX=0&DMY=0&DMTEXT=theology&REC=4&DMTHUMB=1&DMROTATE=0

[raggedy13]

Some of the best parts of the new development are the student residences that come in at double the condo area development of 1.2 times as much building as site area. Parking for these uses the Dutch idea of "Woon Erfs," with pavers removing distinctions between roadway, sidewalk and the stoops of flanking student lodgings.

I believe this part is talking about where I live... Marine Drive Residence, which has had one highrise tower and one lowrise (5 storey) building completed for about 2 years (this current school year being its second), with 2 more highrises under construction. I like the way it has this "Woon Erf" thing going on but the parking can be a bit ridiculous in that there are no marked spaces by my building yet everybody parks in various places and randomly gets ticketed. My sister had her car parked out front for 10 mins and came back to find a ticket while other people have parked their car for much longer and seemingly get no ticket. The stupid thing is that they don't have any signs up to tell you whether you're even allowed to park there or not or for how long etc. It's mostly used as a loading and pickup zone of sorts so ticketing generally isn't a problem but they should at least put some sort of signage up. Anywho, these are the best pictures I have of my residence. Unfortunately it looks like I haven't got any that show this "Woon Erf" concept. I guess I could take 5 mins and go take a pic of it right now but... maybe later.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g296/raggedy13/100_6662.jpg

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g296/raggedy13/100_6666.jpg

My place is the one with the stunning ground floor view of the fire hydrant.
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g296/raggedy13/100_6788.jpg

[Rusty Gull]

Nice location you've got. Close to the MOA, Nitobe Gardens, the Chan Centre, and of course, Wreck Beach.

[SpongeG]

re the theology developments - last time i drove through the campus, about 6 weeks ago i guess, that area was so unrecognizable

why someone would want to buy a $400,000 condo in a university and right next to a student dorm is beyond me - unless they plan to rent them out to students? why would you want to be a stones throw from students

[Rusty Gull]

^Well, why do people pay big bucks to live in student towns like Austin, Texas; Berkeley, CA; and Cambridge, MA -- among others? Living next to a university can put you in reach of great facilities, amenities, etc -- and in the case of UBC, some truly spectacular great outdoors.

With that being said, I'll be the first to admit that UBC is not really a college town. It's a patchwork of university buildings at the edge of the city. But with that being said, it has a lot going for it as a place to live... Well, as long as you own a car.

[Rusty Gull]

Some information about the Museum of Anthropology expansion project:

Located on traditional Musqueam land, the UBC Museum of Anthropology is renowned for its international collections, innovative exhibitions, and spectacular west coast setting.

Now, as we celebrate our 30th year in one of Arthur Erickson's signature buildings, we are embarking upon a major expansion, increasing our size by 50% by 2009, and creating unprecedented opportunities for research, teaching, and public enjoyment. This multi-million dollar project, developed in consultation with local First Nations and the UBC Laboratory of Archaeology, includes the creation of the Reciprocal Research Network (described elsewhere on the site). This virtual conduit for the exchange of collections information is being co-developed by the Museum and the Musqueam Indian Band, Sto:lo Nation, and U'mista Cultural Society.

The new facilities are being developed by UBC Properties Trust and designed by Arthur Erickson and Stantec Architecture. The project comprises several complementary components:

A re-designed Research Centre showcasing 15,000 objects and offering endless opportunities to explore cultural diversity
A new South Wing with state-of-the-art archaeology labs, a community research suite, open plan offices, and Library and Information Centre
A new, 5,800 sq. ft. Major Exhibit Gallery and multi-purpose public programming areas
A revitalized Lobby, expanded Shop and rental facilities, and Museum Cafe
Together with the RRN, these components will revolutionize access to objects by individuals, originating communities, and academics alike.

[Rusty Gull]

From the UBC website:

UBC's Transit Hub

UBC’s Board of Governors confirmed its commitment to the underground transit hub at University Boulevard and East Mall in May 2007. The Transit Hub is located in the area bounded by the Student Union Building/Oak bosque to the north, East Mall to the west, University Boulevard to the south and the Aquatic Centre to the east.

The 2003 UBC Campus Transit Plan examined 15 different options for transit routes and transit facilities on campus, and determined that the most appropriate concept included a transit station centrally-located on University Boulevard at East Mall. An at-grade transit station would have required a significant amount of land, and would have precluded any other uses in the area. Therefore, as part of the University Boulevard Neighbourhood Plan, it was decided to locate the transit station underground so that a public square and other uses could be developed at the surface. Locating the transit station underground will enable buses to avoid congestion and delays entering and exiting the Transit Hub.

Transit Hub Information Session

October 9, 2007, 12:00 – 5:00 p.m.
Michael Smith Laboratories, Room 101, 2185 East Mall

The campus community is invited to a drop-in information session about the Transit Hub. Information materials including display boards, FAQs and a PowerPoint presentation will be available. Campus and Community Planning and TransLink staff will be on hand to answer questions and provide information about implementation of UBC’s Transit Hub.

[Rusty Gull]

Campus construction continues to climb

University appeals to private condo market despite calls for affordable housing

OKER CHEN COMPOSITE PHOTO / The Ubyssey

by Amanda Stutt
News Writer

Tuesday, October 30th, 2007

For anyone who has been around at UBC for a while, it’s impossible not to notice the disrupted landscape. Some of the changes are pleasing and pastoral while others seem to be an eyesore. There’s no denying that the campus is under construction. So what exactly are the impacts to staff and students?

Most have probably heard of “U-Town”—the plan to take the remote and arguably isolated campus and turn it into a “university city in an idyllic setting.” Whether you’re on board or not, it’s happening.

Jan Fialkowski, executive director of the University Neighbourhoods Association, has utopian visions of what U-town can become and discussed a number of both realized and hypothetical scenarios.

“U-Town is…based on the Cambridge/Oxford model, where the philosophy is you study, you eat, you play, and you live where you go to school—it’s a seamless progression from one aspect of university life to another.”

Fialkowski has hopes to render the distinction between where you live and where you go to school obsolete and “have it all rolled into one…a situation where there are no borders.”

Fialkowski discussed plans for new amenities such as retail and office space, and proposals for a new pub on Wesbrook mall.

She viewed artist’s renditions on plans for U-Town at function put on by UBC Properties Trust. “They were very pretty pictures…very idyllic.”

She pointed out that new developments on Wesbrook Mall such as Fraser Hall are “totally geared toward student housing,” and additionally, Greenwood Common is rental housing geared toward students who want a different experience than institutional residential housing, as offered in Gage or Totem or Vanier.

“There are lots of students living in Hawthorne neighbourhood and Hampton,” she said, explaining that students rent from the owners or live in secondary suites.

She also said that there will be more employment opportunities on campus through the UNA once U-Town is fully realized and the UNA community centre is open to students.

“We’re committed to making sure that this works,” Fialkowski said as she explained the UNA’s broad plan to implement new initiatives through the U-Town messaging boards. One examples is a babysitting services for faculty who are hard pressed to find care. With students living in closer proximity and looking to make extra cash and faculty and staff needing care for young children, it could possibly forge new relationships between faculty and students.

“They already know each other,” said Fialkowski, pointing out that there would already be a relationship of trust established and that ideas like the babysitting service board would be mutually beneficial.

Joe Stott, director of Campus Community Planning, said that the main purpose of campus development is to benefit those who work and study on campus, and that there are both institutional and non-institutional (residential) developments that have been completed, with more in the works.

Stott said that a series of community plan memorandums of understanding between the GVRD (now Metro Vancouver) and UBC were consolidated in 2000.

“It defines how, in partnership with the GVRD, we would administer a regime of land use planning and development controls,” said Stott. “The bargain we have with the regional district is that half of our rental accommodation, about 10 per cent of the housing stock, would be non-market housing.”

Non-market housing is priced below market value, therefore making it more accessible for staff and students who would not be able to afford to rent or buy at market price.

“It’s not just students who worry about affordable housing,” Stott pointed out, “it’s also a faculty and staff concern as well.”

According to Stott, the university gives faculty and staff rental housing by providing land for free, paying what it costs to get a mortgage, as well as the operating fees, and then passing them on as rentals at below market value.

“Since the community plan was approved, there’s a commitment by the university to have 50 per cent of the new housing occupied by people who work or study at UBC,” said Stott.

UBC physics PhD candidate and BoG (Board of Governors) member Darren Peets is sceptical. His vision of U-Town is not quite as idyllic, and he raises issues surrounding what will happen when the other 50 per cent non-university members arrive to call U-Town home.

Peets believes that some concepts around U–Town contain flaws and wants the policies on developing non-institutional housing revisited.

“The way it’s being done…makes it unaffordable for people associated with the university,” he said, pointing out that aside from accessing rentals, many UBC community members would not be able to purchase a home on campus.

“A large portion of this is being done to make money, which means you want to sell for as much as possible… a large fraction of people working at the university are not in a position to afford [to buy property] at one and a half million [dollars].”

Peets believes that if the goal is to create a complete community, where people can live where they work, then “we’re not doing that.”

He also believes there is currently not enough affordable and accessible student housing on campus.

Peets also said that instead of asking students and faculty what they wanted or even what they thought, “consultation was run on the design, display, defend…and do it regardless of what they may think system.”

“University Boulevard stands out to me as an example of how [consultation] was done wrong,” said Peets.

He also believes that the $1 to1.5 million condo target market “may have a pretty abstract idea of what a university campus is. They may think a university campus is made up of a bunch of very quiet, very intelligent people walking around reading philosophy books pondering the meaning of life.”

The reality, as Peets argued, is that in large part, the campus is comprised of students who may be away from home for the first time and are more interested in parties, late night drinking, and “playing loud music at three in the morning…rather than standing around quietly under trees.”

Peets believes that complaints will be imminent.

“When you put apartments that start at one and a quarter million across the street from Totem Park residence, you’re putting people that are nocturnal and loud against people who are not nocturnal and are quiet,” said Peets, “and referees’ whistles’ blowing on the playing fields at nine in the morning on Sundays…to some people, that’s quite irritating.”

Peets also said that residents arriving with dogs would begin to use the university as a park when they walk their dogs and said there are no ‘pick up after your dog’ laws on campus.

Peets is concerned about possible future disruptions saying that “when these residents discover that the university is not what they thought it was going to be, they will attempt to change it.”

Peets said, “I think things could have been thought through a little more before they were done.”

[\/^~<0(_)\/{9]

construction will never stop on campus. when they finish one building they simply move the cranes and workers to a new location and start all over again.

[Rusty Gull]

From the Ubyssey student newspaper...

Trek park: paradise or parking lot?

Friday, October 26th, 2007

Congratulations! Knoll-Aid was full of more good, clean fun than we at the Ubyssey have had in a long time. In fact, yesterday’s Knoll-Aid went as well as any of its organisers could have anticipated. Students showed up, and the clouds (and cops) didn’t.

For the duration of the event, the Grassy Knoll was in fact used as a public space, and anyone who wanted could be a part of Trek Park. A range of musical acts played, from coffee-shop style single guitar players to a raging metal band in the afternoon composed solely of Totem Park and Vanier residents.

But behind it all, literally right behind the concert, was a ‘park’ that, while obviously tidied up, still has been looking pretty run down over the past weeks.

Water-logged couches, puddles of rotting leaves, and planter boxes filled with soaked cardboard and other bits of garbage all litter the place also known as “the people’s park”. Despite Trek Park activists’ best attempts to make the area a youthful, student oriented space to protest the University’s development of the Grassy Knoll, the outward appearance and lack of active involvement have left students confused by the wreckage sitting south of the SUB.

Erected on the first day of school, September saw Trek Park as a place where University Square and underground bus loop protesters could congregate to challenge UBC’s development. But once the rainy season hit campus, the fun filled protests turned into washed-out sod sitting in a parking lot.

Trek Park hasn’t kept up the well-maintained face it needs to be taken seriously. If the goal of the park was to change the course of campus construction, then it should have kept up its message. If the intent was to create a meaningful public space, more activities could have been planned. But it appeared to fizzle out, giving UBC developers the ability to say that Trek Park activism and student opposition to certain types of development had withered.

Instead of helping to create more dialogue on campus, specifically dialogue regarding University Square construction, the decrepit and haphazard image that Trek Park protesters are maintaining only delegitimises the issue in the eyes of the University administration and more moderate students.

While we admire what the Trek Park organisers are doing, the eyesore that is Trek Park is a symptom of larger problems. The fact that the park was able to erode makes it look like the University’s development doesn’t take precedence for students.

Furthermore, the promise of Trek Park serving as reclaimed public space didn’t seem to pan out: despite the success of Knoll-Aid, it never gained traction as a place where students could congregate, think among themselves, and pass the time free of the corporatist mindset that increasingly characterises much of UBC. Instead the site laid fallow, with several tired signs pointing to its promising beginning.

This speaks to the reality of Trek Park. There is a core group of students who actually care about the longterm future of this University, dedicated to saving the Grassy Knoll and everything it symbolises. But whether there actually are enough people interested in working on the issue of greenspace and going beyond simply signing a petition remains to be seen.

Oh, and when’s Knoll Aid 2?

[Rusty Gull]

Photos of the scene at UBC "Trek Park", courtesy Mosquito Coast:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2089/2036288407_0617351883.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2044/2036285537_d3a2875167.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2230/2036276771_5ee52ec315.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2332/2037080804_27364f92eb.jpg?v=0

[mr.x]

sounds like it was a hippy fest. the knoll is special, but isn't THAT special.

[johnjimbc]

I know this is a bit off topic, but I was struck just how similar that Iona building is to the main administrative building of Virginia Tech, my alma mater:

Photo from Virginia Tech University photo gallery (at www.vt.edu):

http://www.unirel.vt.edu/photography/buy/606933.jpg

I put link because I couldn't figure out how to add an actual image here.

Anyway, I just did an immediate double-take.

Cheers!

[Rusty Gull]

From the UBYSSEY:

The Student Union Building (SUB) opened in 1968 on the site of the old University Stadium. Forty years later, plans are being drafted to ‘renew’ the aging SUB. Architectural firm Cannon Design is serving as a renovation consultant for the project, and for its annual forum brought together architects, engineers and planners from 25 different nations to address design options and consult students.

Design professionals took input received from students analyzed costs, ultimately incorporating input into the new conceptual plans, which are supposed to reflect a more environmentally-friendly student space in comparison to the 1960s brutalist style of the current SUB.

Student consultation on the SUB Renew project will continue until January 2008, after which the proposal is to be introduced to the University’s Board of Governors for approval.

http://www.ubyssey.bc.ca/photos/071127sub1.jpg
http://www.ubyssey.bc.ca/photos/071127sub2.jpg
http://www.ubyssey.bc.ca/photos/071127sub3.jpg

[vanman]

^ I hate when architects put out renderings that are so abstract you don't know wtf to make of them.

[hollywoodnorth]

I fully agree..... WTF!

[deasine]

u have to have an urban planner's, architect's, or designer's POV to understand the renderings... usually, those sketches are done really quickly and really for the architect's reference and not for others

[hollywoodnorth]

u have to have an urban planner's, architect's, or designer's POV to understand the renderings... usually, those sketches are done really quickly and really for the architect's reference and not for others

thanks for the tip :tup:

[mr.x]

i saw those at the public display down at the basement of the SUB....if only it'll be done by the time i graduate...

[cjohnny4]

The SUB project is long overdue. When I first visited UBC in March of 2004, I was expecting to see great things. I had just immigrated to Canada from my college town of Bloomington, Indiana (Indiana University). I was shocked to find a sort of shoddy, poorly-maintained campus. The SUB did not improve my impressions. Everything from the brutalist architecture to dilapidated signage to couches with the stuffing falling out of them greeted me. Trash was overflowing, and the whole thing seemed very overcrowded. I did fall in love with The Pit, however! Haha.

But seriously, in addition to the need for a new, larger, brighter SUB, what is the deal with UBC's seeming inability to keep up the grounds around campus (a notable exception is the rose garden), control trash and graffitti, and just keep things looking nice? Instead, I see rusted out flag poles, storage bins right out in front of the SUB, poorly maintained lawns, and fliers and trash all over.

[Rusty Gull]

Activists vandalize Ponderosa Complex

by Brandon Adams News Editor, The Ubyssey

Tuesday, January 8th, 2008

A group referring to itself as the “Wreath Underground” has declared war on the UBC administration, vandalizing several University buildings at last term’s close.

In an e-mail received by the Ubyssey on December 20, the group claimed responsibility for several acts of vandalism on campus which occurred earlier that week.

“We, the warriors of the Wreath Underground claim responsibility for the recent targeted acts of vandalism on campus,” states the e-mail, which goes on to claim specific responsibility for acts of vandalism on both the Ponderosa complex and the Old Administration building.

“The first of these attacks hit at the Old Administration Building where the Board of Governors and higher administration have their offices…Our second target was the central building in the Ponderosa complex where the Board had its last significant meeting.”

Immediately after the attack, the Old Administration Building had several boarded up windows. The windows at the rear of the Ponderosa complex still bear signs of vandalism: the large panes of glass are peppered with over a dozen golf ball sized holes.

In their e-mail the group points to a lack of student consultation regarding development on campus as one of their primary motivations for their vandalism.

“We signed petitions. They were trashed. We laid grass and built ourselves a paradise. It was paved over and SUVs stand on Trek [Park’s] grave,” the e-mail states, continuing, “We put on a festival and invited President Fucker but he never showed. And we tried to play their game. We let them suck us into their process. We went to their consultation sessions. We sat and we waited our turn to speak. It never came.”

The e-mail’s authors demand that the administration “refinance”, “reconsult”, and “rezone.” They finished by saying: “we will push these fuckers until they concede every inch. This is our declaration of war, declared here in public.”

Trek Park organizers Stefanie Ratjen, Jasmine Ramze-Rezaee, and Nathan Crompton, said that they did not know who was involved in the vandalism, but while they indicated that they were somewhat concerned about Wreath Underground’s decision to vandalize University property, they agreed with the group’s demands.

“The ‘refinance’, ‘reconsult’, and ‘rezone’ is something that the Trek Park protesters have been advocating for for some time. The rhetoric used is a bit stronger,” said Stefanie Ratjen, who emphasized the University’s role in the conflict.

Nathan Crompton also said that the attacks needed to be taken in context, saying that the University became the first aggressor when it demolished the ‘Trek Park’ which had been built by students near the Grassy Knoll.

“The University, in its own way, has kind of launched into a type of war against the park in destroying [it],” said Crompton, “I hope that if this is at all depicted as a form of violence or something, that it’s done in the context of the University’s own aggressive bulldozing of the park.”

While UBC Campus Security was not available for comment before press time, Staff Sargent Kevin Kenna of the UBC RCMP detachment said that the incidents were being investigated.

“We’re investigating this and we intend to follow up as far as we can,” said Kenna. “Currently we don’t have any suspects, however if anybody out there in the general public has any information we’d appreciate hearing from them.”

[mr.x]

what a bunch of retards....

[Rusty Gull]

The plans for a new UBC student union building are moving along. A presentation is apparently slated for next week. Stay tuned for details...

[nathan6969]

^^Are they actually building anything new...I thought it was just renovations...

[mr.x]

^^Are they actually building anything new...I thought it was just renovations...

I've seen drawings before that show a huge tower that sort of looks like a mini-Central City that will be the new SUB.

[Rusty Gull]

UBC Campus & Community Planning invites you to attend a design workshop as part of Phase 4 of the UBC Vancouver Campus Plan Review.

Campus & Community Planning is in the middle of a six phase process to develop a new Campus Plan that builds on an evolving physical form and incorporates the values of Trek 2010, the University's vision statement.

After extensive consultations with the campus community last year on ideas and issues of importance for a Campus Plan, we are now developing some physical layout options community further consultation and discussion in the Fall 2008.

To help generate the draft physical plan options we are inviting individuals with a specific interest and expertise related to campus land use development. The design challenge for workshop participants is to accommodate future growth while addressing ideas taken from
the broader community in previous phases of the planning process. Additional briefing material will be forwarded to those people interested in attending.

The design workshop will be held on 3 different dates to accommodate as many of the participant’s schedules as possible. Please pick one of the following workshop dates:

Pick One Date: Monday March 10, 2008
Monday March 17, 2008
Tuesday April 1, 2008
Time: 9:00 am to 4:00 pm
Location: Auditorium, Asian Centre, 1871 West Mall

To confirm your attendance at one of the design workshops, please email stefani.lu@ubc.ca or call Stefani Lu at 604‐827‐3465 by March 1.

For more information about the UBC Vancouver Campus Plan Review, please visit www.campusplan.ubc.ca.

We hope to see you there.

Lisa Colby
Manager, Policy Planning
UBC Campus and Community Planning
604‐822‐2089

[deasine]

Hey now that's a good day (my spring break). I'm attending that one =)

[Rusty Gull]

From the Ubyssey:

Irving K Barber Learning Centre opens its doors

http://www.ubyssey.ca/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/irvine-k-barber-kellan-h-copy.jpg
(photo from Ubyssey)
by Brandon Adams with photos by Kellan Higgins

Tuesday, February 26th, 2008

Nearly five years after the project began, Main Library’s transformation into the Irving K. Barber Learning Centre is nearing completion. Phase II opened it’s doors to students on February 25th and almost immediately the building was filled.

Construction on the Main Library complex began late in 2003 with the commencement of Phase I, rebuilding the section of the building which houses lending collections and archival facilities. Phase I was completed in August of 2005 and soon afterward, the south wing of the library was demolished in order to begin construction of Phase II, the section of the library largely dedicated to study space.

Simone Neame, the centre’s program and services coordinator, said that the student response to the new building was overwhelmingly positive. One student, said Neame, even claimed that the library was the ‘best’ he had ever seen.

The Learning Centre, said Neame, is designed not as a mere extension of the library but as a distinct space for student use.

Open until 1am on Mondays through Thursdays, the Learning Centre is equipped with a significant amount of seating space and a cafe. Neame also mentioned that there is a possibility that the hours will be extended if there is a demand from the student body. She said that the Learning Centre would have space for academic peer support and AMS Tutoring services.

Arts One student Alyssa Arbuckle was pleased with the new building.

“It’s awesome. It’s beautiful,” said Arbuckle, “It’s freezing but it’s beautiful.”

The Irving K. Barber Learning Centre is currently open to student use, with the official opening on April 11th.

[Rusty Gull]

MEDIA RELEASE | MARCH 04, 2008
Oldest UBC building gets extreme makeover

As the University of British Columbia celebrates its first Centenary, the oldest building on its Vancouver campus reopens today with new state-of-the-art research and learning facilities and its historic charms intact.

The renewal of the Chemistry Building is the latest project of UBC Renew, a $120-million partnership between UBC and the provincial government designed to breathe new life into older buildings on B.C.'s oldest and largest university campus.

Construction of the Chemistry Building began in 1914 but halted due to World War I and didn't resume until 1923, following the historic Great Trek, when 1,200 students marched from 12th and Cambie to the Point Grey campus, urging the provincial government to continue developing infrastructure at UBC. On March 7, UBC marks its first century since the 1908 passage of the University Act that created the province's first post-secondary institution.

NB: Historic and current photographs of the Chemistry Building and video of the Great Trek student protest are available at www.publicaffairs.ubc.ca/download

Major discoveries have been made in the building, including the first noble gas compound and technology that led to the creation of QLT, UBC's best known spin-off company.

"The Chemistry Building is synonymous with UBC's history," says UBC President Stephen Toope, who joins Advanced Education Minister Murray Coell in the official opening.

"The historic photo of students congregating in the concrete skeleton of this building epitomizes our student activism and the birth of the Point Grey campus. Restoring its past grandeur and modernizing the facility, all the while improving safety and sustainability, is what UBC Renew is all about," says Toope.

One of the three buildings in the original 1912 campus plan - the other two are the Library and the Power Plant - the Chemistry Building features B.C. granite on its façade in the Collegiate Gothic style, complete with copper scuppers and gargoyles, and traditional oak trimmed interiors, all of which have been preserved in the Renew process.

The renovation also includes new lecture theatres, student space, open laboratories with enhanced safety features and a building seismic upgrade.

"We've partnered with UBC to restore and upgrade the Chemistry Building under an innovative funding agreement called UBC Renew that is preserving the environment, taxpayers' dollars and UBC's architectural heritage," Coell said. "The result is that students and faculty have access to state-of-the-art chemistry labs where researchers can work together in a safe, productive environment."

In addition to preserving a heritage landmark, the Chemistry Renew project incorporated sustainable practices that saved $15.9 million in costs, diverted 323 tons of solid waste from land fills, and prevented 1,155 tons of carbon emissions from being released into the atmosphere, compared to constructing a new comparable replacement building. For more information on UBC Renew, visit www.lbs.ubc.ca/renew.

[\/^~<0(_)\/{9]

http://www.publicaffairs.ubc.ca/media/releases/2008/mr-08-023.html

Media Release | Mar. 3, 2008
Blue Whale Skeleton Finds Permanent Home at UBC: Canadian First
The skeleton of a blue whale that washed up on Prince Edward Island 20 years ago will have a permanent home at The University of British Columbia’s new Beaty Biodiversity Museum.

The Museum, scheduled to open in late 2009, will be the first attraction in Canada to exhibit the skeleton of the largest animal ever to have lived – bigger than any dinosaur. The UBC exhibit will be one of only five in North America.

Note to editors: Photos of Trites’ preliminary dig and the 1987 beached whale are available at www.publicaffairs.ubc.ca/download. Video footage of the 1987 beaching and December 2007 preliminary dig are available by contacting Catherine Loiacono. For more information on blue whales and biodiversity, www.beatymuseum.ubc.ca.

At 25 metres long, the blue whale skeleton will be showcased in a glass atrium facing Main Mall, at the heart of the university. The exhibit will be the centrepiece of an educational outreach program and collection of more than two million specimens of mammals, fish, shells, fossils, insects, birds and plants.

“Visitors will be awed by the blue whale's size,” says Wayne Maddison, Museum Director and UBC Professor of Botany and Zoology. “More importantly, the whale will help us tell the story of biodiversity to the public – how the earth’s species are interconnected ecologically and genetically.”

Blue whales inhabit both the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans. UBC’s specimen beached and died near the town of Tignish, PEI. The Canadian Museum of Nature arranged for its remains to be buried on provincially owned land near Nail Pond, 11 miles away. The Canadian Museum of Nature and the Government of PEI are supporting UBC’s efforts to exhume and display the national treasure.

“Through the collaboration of two provinces and world-class museums, Canadians from coast to coast will have an opportunity to fully appreciate this magnificent animal,” says Andrew Trites, a researcher at the UBC Biodiversity Research Centre and Director of UBC’s Marine Mammal Unit. Trites is leading the exhumation and preparation of the skeleton.

Trites conducted a preliminary dig last December with help of volunteers from the University of PEI. His team, including master skeleton articulator Michael deRoos, will exhume the skeleton this May and transport it across Canada to UBC, where it will be prepared for display. The Museum plans to launch a naming competition this spring.

The Museum will be the first public institution in Canada to focus exclusively on biodiversity research and education. Skeletons of a killer whale, a minke whale, and a Steller sea lion, part of the Museum’s Cowan Vertebrate Collection, are currently on display at UBC’s Aquatic Ecosystem Research Laboratory, next door to the Museum site. The skeletons were salvaged by Trites and deRoos, and articulated by deRoos.

Background: Blue Whale Finds Home at UBC
About the Blue Whale
The blue whale is the biggest animal ever to have lived on earth – bigger than any dinosaur.
It is longer than two 40-foot long school buses parked one behind the other.
A blue whale’s heart is the size of a car, and the arteries connected to the heart are large enough for a human baby to crawl through.
The blue whale is also the loudest animal. At 190 decibels, a blue whale’s call is louder than a jet (140 decibels), and much louder than a person can shout (70 decibels). A sound clip is available on the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration web site.
Blue whales inhabit every ocean on the planet, and travel from frigid polar waters, where they feed, to warm tropical waters, where they give birth to their calves. In spite of their great size and range, we know very little about these gentle giants.
The blue whale is listed as an endangered species under Canada’s Species at Risk Act. It is also on the IUCN (The World Conservation Union) Red List of endangered species. There are estimated to be 4,500 blue whales left in the world, down from 350,000 before whaling activities began.
About Biodiversity
Biodiversity is the variety of life. It is the range of genetic, species and ecosystem diversity in an environment. Estimates of the total number of species range from 3 to 100 million. Only 1.9 million species are known to science, and vast numbers have yet to be documented. Expeditions to remote tropical areas in New Guinea, Africa, Asia and South America continue to find previously unknown species, including new species of birds, fruit bats, butterflies, and frogs. Closer to home, many species new to science remain to be found in Canada, and recent work has documented new fishes, fungi, and insects.

About UBC’s Beaty Biodiversity Museum
The Beaty Museum, scheduled to open in late 2009, will be unique in making its scientific collections available for public viewing through a combination of museum exhibits, hands-on discovery labs, educators' resources, and public presentations. The Museum will serve as an invaluable link between the world-renowned scientists at the Biodiversity Research Centre and the public. It will also serve as the outreach arm of the Research Centre. For more information visit www.beatymuseum.ubc.ca.

[Rusty Gull]

For those at or close to UBC today:

Campus and Community Planning:

Transportation Open House:

Update on the Strategic Transportation Plan, Transit and Campus Traffic Calming Projects
Thursday March 13, 2008
1:30pm – 7:30 pm
SUB

[Rusty Gull]

The Ubyssey
Editorial

Prepare yourselves, old people are comin’

‘Campus lifestyle seniors residence’ set to break ground by summer

Tuesday, March 18th, 2008

There’s something brewing on the South Campus, and it’s old. Really old. 65+ old.

It’s called Tapestry, and according to its website, “it’s a six-storey midrise offering residents a campus lifestyle seniors residence.”

While we at UBC have varying opinions on the benefits and drawbacks of South Campus development, the one thing we can all agree on is that UBC should remain primarily a student environment. If development has to happen, and UBC behaving as if it certainly does, then let it be developed with a student focus in mind.

And that mean parties, drinking, late nights, and, inevitably, noise.

UBC sells houses in South Campus to garner its income. It leases each property, often for 99 years, to generate revenue which it invests for a healthy return. Thus it makes money off the endowment set aside in the 20th century, guarantees a return of the property a hundred years from now when UBC might desperately need the land, and ensures that it can physically grow its infrastructure as UBC becomes an international school.

However good it may be to sell this land, why is a retirement home being constructed amongst the largest population of university students in Metro Vancouver?

UBC is a place of higher learning. Professors and staff aside, its core demographic is 18-25 year olds with a smattering of graduate students. Over 45,000 students either live on campus or commute to the Point Grey area to attend classes. Why then is a retirement home being planned for the campus neighborhood?

Instead of facilitating a campus community around the student lifestyle, UBC Campus and Community Planning has created an upscale community on University land, retirement homes included.

Construction and expansion at a university is inevitable, especially considering the amount of research being conducted at UBC. With the growth of the Canadian population and the larger international student base, it is no wonder that the University is looking towards these options to grow its infrastructure. The problem is the social cost students incur in order for the University to grow.

It is commonly believed that UBC lacks a sense of campus “vibe”. Everyone feels it. The students feel it, professors feel it and the recently re-established Radical Beer Faction (RBF) feels it. What should have been created many years ago in the form of student housing and green space the university is attempting to create now with chain retail space, condos, and perhaps even a retirement complex.

So, why is UBC bringing the old into a place of youth while the things which most of the senior population did as young adults is being stamped out of UBC?

UBC has become a campus where the fun goes to die. With the tightening of Campus Security and UBC RCMP, in addition to the lack of Special Occasion Licenses (SOLs) to allow parties, and the sharp decline in the number of beer gardens in the last few years, it seems UBC wishes to pacify its student population.

Students are not being significantly considered when major, community-changing plans are being instigated. Within the last several years, the old fraternity row and the area between the RCMP and 16th avenue have all been demolished to make way for high-cost commercial housing. The price of these units puts it far out of the range of the average UBC student and brings more non-students into the community.

Why is UBC bent on becoming a small town? What benefit does this bring to students that the University is supposed to serve? A retirement complex is not a good fit for this campus. This is another clear sign that UBC is becoming less and less of a student-oriented space—and that won’t change unless we do something about it.

[quobobo]

Bloody Ubyssey. Hopefully I'll remember to opt-out of their fees this year.

Having lived on campus for a year, I think I'm entitled to say this: life on campus is dead boring, and inconvenient to boot. It's a good experience for first year, but they'd have to pay me to go back.

Why is UBC bent on becoming a small town? What benefit does this bring to students that the University is supposed to serve?

I don't know, convenience? Maybe it would be nice to have more than 10 people on campus during the weekend? Better shopping than the Village with its one tiny and expensive grocery store?

These people clearly haven't ever had to make the really-bloody-long walk (15-20 minutes from Totem/Ritsumeikan/Marine Drive) to the bus loop from most residences , wait 5-10 minutes for a bus, and then take a 10 minute bus ride just to get groceries. I envy UT and McGill for not being located in the middle of nowhere.

[mr.x]

Thunderbird fields being redeveloped

Vancouver Courier
Published: Thursday, March 20, 2008

VANCOUVER - Two artificial fields, a baseball diamond, running track and greenway are among the amenities planned for the redevelopment of Thunderbird fields at the University of B.C.

The fields are east of Thunderbird Stadium, north of 16th Avenue between East Mall and Wesbrook Mall.

"We have to move our baseball team's practice facility from Nat Bailey Stadium to the campus because of the logistics of getting there," said Bob Philip, director of athletics and recreation at UBC.

"It's something we planned to do quite a while ago, to build an artificial field and to build a baseball park that could be used by our team and also as a recreational facility."

The fields are now being used for various purposes by the university and the community, including intramural soccer, varsity soccer, and field hockey. Philip doesn't expect the uses to change.

[Rusty Gull]

Ubyssey Editorial
To renew or not to renew?

Is bigger better?

Tuesday, March 25th, 2008

The week-long AMS referendum starts today, and among the other topics up for vote, such as the U-Pass price increase, is a controversial proposal: the SUB Renewal project. The project aims to address what is perceived to be significant failings in the current Student Union Building.

The AMS states that building was designed for a student population of 20,000, and is not serving the needs of a population more than double that size, as well as being lacking in terms of sustainability targets and commuter needs.

The project is still in the pre-planning phase. No architectural plans have been finalized and no figures about the project have been cemented. The issue up for referendum, however, is whether students are willing to pay for the project to move forward. If 4500 students vote yes over the next week (and another 4500 don’t vote no), then next year all UBC students will have a mandatory $20 fee. The year after, the fee will be $30, then $40 the year after, and so on up until the fee is $110 in 2017.

And there is no firm number for the total cost of the project. The fee will simply be ongoing, and in addition to its $110 cap, the fee will also be adjusted by the cost of living index, until the costs of the project are fully paid off.

We at the Ubyssey are of two minds about the project. On the one hand, we who work in the windowless, lightless bowels of the current SUB clearly recognize the need for a new space without broken washrooms and asbestos filled walls. On the other hand, this is a substantial fee increase, especially from an organization purportedly representing students in reducing student and tuition fees. Here are two perspectives on SUB Renew:

Point: Been to a good party at UBC lately? Met anyone interesting at a student event? Know of a good spot to hang out and chat with new people?

If your answer is yes to any of the above, the context is not school events, in all probability, but facebook. Compared to just about any other major school in the continent, UBC’s school community and school spirit could be best described as lacklustre. And while building a shiny new SUB isn’t going to fix all of our problems, you can be damned sure that if the Chinese Varsity Club isn’t spilling out of its five square foot room, they’ll be able to attract more members and hold better events. And if the Pottery Club isn’t stuck in the back end of nowhere, then maybe people might get to see the truly awesome stuff they produce more than once a year. And don’t get us started on the Bike Kitchen being stuck down a flight of stairs, or the suicide-inducing offices of student organizations that have no traces of sunlight.

This is not a case of bigger for the sake of being bigger. This is simply a case of being big enough for everyone. Big enough to allow clubs to rally student spirit. Big enough so that people don’t avoid the SUB due to crowding.

And now, with the U-Town project grinding onward, is the perfect time to integrate student life with the future of the university. If we wait on a new SUB, U-Town will make the SUB irrelevant—who wants to hang out in the windowless basement when there is a shiny new cafe/bistro/corporate edifice down the street. If we allow SUB Renewal to go forward the SUB will co-ordinate with U-Town making it a center point of student activity.

Counter Point: Here’s the thing. We are not opposed in principle to a new and renewed SUB. We fully realize that the current building is old, cramped, dark, fully of hearty asbestos, periodically invaded by birds, and generally not all that great.

But there’s something to be said for financial prudence. And that, sadly, is what the proposed SUB Renew plan is lacking.
Let’s start with the bare numbers. Yes, it’s true that the fee will start out small. But it’ll grow to $110 dollars within the decade. And while not publicized, there’s a niggling detail in the funding plans that includes an increase, year after year, based on the rate of inflation. So the publicized $110 maximum really isn’t a maximum—it’s the ground level. The fact is, we really have no idea how much students might be paying for this in twenty years from now.

Just think: how would you feel if you currently paid $110 for the SUB we have now? The new SUB is planned to cost $120 million, and if the newly planned SUB will be completed in 2014, student fees will be paying it off for something like 35-40 years. By the time 2048 rolls around students will be paying for a hideous and outdated SUB that will most likely be as bad as our current sub is now.

Effective governing is about making tough decisions. Choosing what is necessary, and what is merely desired. For those in the AMS, it’s easy to hear all of the excellent ideas for a revamped SUB—more social space, greater sustainability, sleeping pods, and the like—and then agree that nothing is worthy of being cut from the project. But then again, they aren’t the ones that will be paying over $100 every year for this building.

Students generally don’t pay for things they can’t afford. We scrimp, we scrounge, we go with the cheaper option nine times out of ten, because we tend to accept that at the age of 20, we can’t always get what we want.

There’s a lot of improvements that can be made to the SUB—but they can be done progressively over time. $15 of our student fees already go to a capital building fund to improve the SUB. If we doubled that fee, then there would be approximately $1.5 million available annually to renew the SUB. That could be the sustainable, practical solution that wouldn’t add an extra burden on future generations of UBC students.

[flight_from_kamakura]

Bloody Ubyssey. Hopefully I'll remember to opt-out of their fees this year.
...
These people clearly haven't ever had to make the really-bloody-long walk (15-20 minutes from Totem/Ritsumeikan/Marine Drive) to the bus loop from most residences , wait 5-10 minutes for a bus, and then take a 10 minute bus ride just to get groceries. I envy UT and McGill for not being located in the middle of nowhere.

mostly, i'd say u of t works because of the annex and kensington market; mcgill works because of the the ghetto (and to a far lesser extent, because of the towers in the square mile). proximity to chinatown makes u of t more interesting; promixity to downtown actually makes mcgill less interesting. the point is that the ubyssey is 100% right that ubc's god-forgotten campus is not going to be improved by importing a bunch of old people and yuppies. and those chain shops aren't going to help either. they need to massively increase the number of students who are on campus, and massively increase the quality/quantity of activities to keep them there. berkeley is a small town, and the area that most students spend most of their time in is no larger than the endowment lands area - and it works, damn it works. ubc, the administration has made planning decisions so inane as to border almost on incompetent. all the housing out there is cheap. the fraternity houses will be torn down soon because of shoddy building and poor site selection. there's no life, the nimby oldsters control the pace of development and ubc has done everything in their power to bring in more nimby oldsters. it's terribly terribly frustrating, and i'm glad the ubyssey (which the administration types tend to pay attention to) is sounding the alarm (albeit 5 years too late).

[quobobo]

"chain shops aren't going to help"? Most trips off campus are to go to Safeway at Sasamat or Macdonald. Everyone I know with a car makes semi-regular trips to a Superstore. The most frequented stores in the village (or at least for me and the people I know) are Staples, the liquor store, and McDonalds. Students want cheap and convenient.

As for "old people and yuppies", they're the people who can afford to buy market-priced housing in this city. Such is the way of life. I'm not sure how you want UBC to fund a massive increase in students living on campus and activities for them - that's a ton of money that I really don't think the university has. I don't want to fund it as a student who lives off-campus, and I don't want to pay it as a taxpayer either (tuition at UBC is already hugely subsidized).

I also have no idea why you're calling them all NIMBYs, since the only opposition to development I've ever seen around here has been from students. Anything that isn't a new building for classes or student housing is automatically opposed by some very, very vocal members of the student body (including the Ubyssey).

[Rusty Gull]

The main problem is UBC's location.

Unlike some of North America's great university campuses, it is nowhere near a traditional student ghetto -- the kind of neighbourhoods that have cheap housing, lots of student activity/flavour, nearby nightlife, and lots of character.

So instead, we have a campus that is hemmed in by the ocean on three sides, and an uber-rich neighbourhood on the fourth.

I agree with Quo on at least one point: for those who actually spend any reasonable amount of time at UBC, the addition of "evil chain stores" such as Starbucks, Shoppers, etc has been a blessing.

[flight_from_kamakura]

Such is the way of life.

i don't think you quite get how badly this school is run.

the low rise covenants on the single-family homes right along univ. blvd and the university's idiotic low rise housing schemes in the areas closest to campus (excepting 2 towers) are foolhardy in the harshest and most classical sense of the word.

the endowment lands are not currently subject to any of vancouver's zoning and development restrictions, and as such, the school had (and has) the liberty to develop these areas as its administrators saw fit.

they developed a vision that balances historical residential development with a broad goal of moderate densification. they also wanted to make money.

had the university's planning people and decision-makers taken stock of the most blaring deficiencies of ubc campus life, and had they possessed the sense to survey organically-developed campus villages and ghettos the world over, and had they then sought to apply the fruits of these intellectual labours to their development schemes, they would have developed much more aggressively height-wise.

how about building 20 or so towers of varying heights between university and 16th, ensuring that tower podiums constitute a retail wall along university from acadia strait to university (and to east mall with u-town) and along westbrook from university (but one day, from 4th) to 16th. here again, a large stock and resonable sizing of retail spaces (all at grade, with street entrances) would have kept rents reasonable and ensured a variety of businesses.
this would have had negative consequences on the values of homes in the area, but this is a net positive, as it would hasten redevelopment.

a flood of development would have to have been carefully modulated, but the net results should have been smaller units in very high density neighborhoods that would have become primarily rental stock. abundant stock would have kept prices low enough that the apartments would have been excellent long term investments for companies and individuals (there'll always be students), but high enough that ubc would see an impressive return. and as such, it would have met ubc pecuniary and land development goals, while creating a real campus neighborhood. moreover, developed off of the highstreets a lot more, in the neighborhoods, with cornerstores and corner pubs. large lot destination shopping (regardless of whether its incoming or outgoing) hurts good neighborhoods and kills of sickly ones, so it's not a matter of getting a safeway closer to campus. it's about developing density and allowing for development of supporting and servicing commercial spaced, which is to say, about creating a real community as a way to building a neighborhood.

moreover, a scheme along these lines could have spared the development of the ubc farm area of pacific spirit park - a development most would see as utterly senseless had they no knowledge of the ignorance of ubc's money-grubbing masters of development.

in sum, they should have turned the place into a village... a completely different vision that would have yielded completely different results. and it wasn't unrealisting, and it wasn't too much to ask or to expect. the school is plain badly run.

[quobobo]

I agree, denser and taller buildings would be fantastic. That said, UBC seems to be doing no worse than city hall on that front (which is to say pretty badly, fair enough). I find it hard to blame UBC in particular when the "preservation of every aspect of our existing neighbourhoods at any cost!!!" idea is so pervasive across the entire region.

[radacal]

The UBC Law Building is going to be replaced with a new building. CEI Architecture with Diamond and Schmitt Architects has been given the commission.

[mr.x]

The UBC Law Building is going to be replaced with a new building. CEI Architecture with Diamond and Schmitt Architects has been given the commission.

that's great news.....the existing building is quite dingy, and a bit small.


btw, I absolutely love Irving Barber.

[Rusty Gull]

UBC students arrested after development protest bonfire

VANCOUVER — Nearly 20 people at the University of British Columbia face a series of charges including assaulting a police officer and resisting arrest after a protest escalated into a confrontation and arrests.

Police arrested students rallying Friday in support of a peer who was blocking a fire hose being used to douse a protest bonfire.

About 100 people with Students for a Democratic Society and Trek Park for People gathered outside UBC's Student Union Building to demonstrate against the redevelopment of a nearby grassy knoll, a popular student hangout, for a bus loop.

A release from the society said a woman was told she was violating a bylaw by blocking the hose.

"(the woman) was grabbed by an RCMP officer and thrown to the ground, pinned, and handcuffed. Her face was literally shoved in a puddle of mud while an RCMP officer sat on top of her," the release said, describing it as an "uncalled act of police aggression."

The society said another student was immediately arrested for questioning the police action.

It said the detentions led to students forming a human chain in protest.

As a result, the release said, 26 students were arrested after 30 police cars from throughout Metro Vancouver arrived on the scene.

However, RCMP Cst. Annie Linteau with RCMP's E Division said only 19 people were arrested at the scene.

She said they received a call from campus security and the Vancouver fire department for assistance of dealing with the large crowd and bonfire.

"Upon their arrival, the firefighters deemed the fire to be unsafe and asked for our assistance to move the protesters," she said.

When they protesters were told to move, Linteau said "they banded together against the police and prevented the fire crews from putting out the fire."

At this point officers from Vancouver and Richmond detachments were called in the deal with "combative" protesters.

When one man was arrested and put in a police cruiser, the protesters banded around the car. Police then made their arrests.

University students belong to the Alma Mater Society, the school's student association.

Society vice-president of administration Tristan Markle called on university president Stephen Toope to condemn the arrests.

He called the arrests a "collective punishment" for students who have been protesting development on the campus.

Police were expected to issue a news release on the situation on Saturday afternoon.

Bahram Narrouzi, of Trek Park for People, told station CKNW the students did nothing wrong.

"We even didn't touch the police car," Narrouzi said. "We were only singing and dancing around the car."

[mr.x]

^ what time did that happen? I walked by the knoll at 3 that day, and there was this large group of people gathering under a tent and some girl was singing some crappy hippy song.


They need to get a life.



http://z.about.com/d/animatedtv/1/0/N/T/sp902_Die_Hippy_Die.jpg

[quobobo]

100 students? I went by there a couple times on Friday and I saw around 50 tops each time. Somehow I'm guessing that number came from the protesters.

The protesters are really, really getting on my nerves. There seems to be a lot of overlap between the people who protested against 18-story condos on University Boulevard (largely the original reason for the underground bus loop - to allow convenient retail for these towers near ground, from what I understand) and the people who protest the underground bus loop. Yes, financially an underground bus loop probably isn't a great idea. Why? Because you complained so much that UBC removed from the plan the condo towers that were essentially funding it!

Here's a good example of how crazy these people are: http://www.sdsubc.ca/campaigns/free-public-space-at-ubc-university-blvd-for-students/newublvdpamphlet.pdf


At first, the University was determined to move the transit hub underground in
order to transform the centre of campus into a shopping mall. The original Uni-
versity Blvd development plan included 18 story condo towers, and since it was
necessary that the condo owners have amenities close by, plans placed stores at
the centre of campus. But all experts agreed that the transit hub ought to remain
at the centre of campus (where it was at the time). Therefore, the University
decided to divert tens of millions of dollars into moving the bus terminal under-
ground. WIth dollar signs in their eyes, they were of course blind to sustainabil-
ity issues.


The administration proposed replacing mostly empty, useless, and ugly outdoor space (seriously, have you tried to sit down on the knoll during the 90% of the school year where it's too cold or too wet?) with quite dense residential and commercial space, and these students call them "blind to sustainability issues"? This puts to rest the notion that most NIMBYs are old and retired...

On a different note, I agree with mr. x2 - Irving Barber is fantastic. The main lobby or whatever it's called is gorgeously done, and there's tons of general purpose space (I was easily able to find a seat for studying around noon on a weekday! This is a first!). I don't have high hopes for the little café in it (it's run by UBC food services after all), but I'll give it a try sometime.

[mr.x]

^ I was actually against those towers, not because of NIMBYism but because I didn't think it was right for University Boulevard - that it should remain as public, student, and educational space. But now that you mentioned the retail portion of it, I'm gonna have to retract my opinions....too bad it was canceled.

I nearly puked reading that pdf file you posted....did a university student actually write that?

These students have absolutely no idea about what they're fighting for. The university should really just steamroll ahead and ignore these students.

Though I have to admit, they do have some valid points....such as why they're not putting the trolleys underground as well or why they're not waiting for Translink's UBC SkyTrain plans.



I haven't tried out the cafe at Irving. It has only been open for a few weeks, but it already has decent business.

[quobobo]

Yeah, I'll agree that they have a few decent points. Not putting trolleys underground is a little odd, but I don't think it's a really big deal. Putting the diesel buses underground is still saving a lot of space, and it's not like the project is useless unless all the buses go underground - every bit of space saved counts. As for Skytrain connectivity, I seem to remember someone from UBC saying that the new Millenium Line will connect with this transit hub somehow, but I can't find the exact quote (I think I read it on this forum though) so I'm not sure what's going on there.

That said, I still do think they're all loony, just looking for a cause to champion, and would oppose this project even if the (real) problems were sorted out. For every sensible point they make, they make one like the following:

Pollution: apparently, there would be a giant noisy fan sucking the bus fumes out of the bus bunker - to be excreted from a giant smoke stack on top of the shopping mall.

[mr.x]

Yeah, I'll agree that they have a few decent points. Not putting trolleys underground is a little odd, but I don't think it's a really big deal. Putting the diesel buses underground is still saving a lot of space, and it's not like the project is useless unless all the buses go underground - every bit of space saved counts. As for Skytrain connectivity, I seem to remember someone from UBC saying that the new Millenium Line will connect with this transit hub somehow, but I can't find the exact quote (I think I read it on this forum though) so I'm not sure what's going on there.

That said, I still do think they're all loony, just looking for a cause to champion, and would oppose this project even if the (real) problems were sorted out. For every sensible point they make, they make one like the following:

Yea, someone did mention that the transit hub will connect to the future SkyTrain station somehow.....but imo, it would require a design overhaul. The existing underground loop plan is to have a staircase descend to an island platform. The only way to have direct SkyTrain connectivity is to have the train platform below the bus loop: another staircase that descends to the second underground level to the platform.


There are ways to hide those "smoke" stacks. They make it sound like as if huge plumes of black smoke will be billowing out of it. The Vancouver Olympic Village has a hot water gas boiler plant, and it will have flues that will be 8-storeys high. They are uniquely disguised, with so that one probably wouldn't notice them being smoke stacks. They will have LED lights atop, and most of the exterior will be made out of stainless steel:


posted by officedweller
http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/5764/56726130tl1.jpg

[dreambrother808]

another silly aspect is the fact that if the buses are above ground, all of that pollution is still getting dispersed into the atmosphere. however, with a stack the point of exit can be made much higher, and therefore above the general breathing space of the pedestrian.

these students are naturally young and naive. they have yet to realize that blindly reacting against everything out of idealism is just a means to neutralize your entire argument. unfortunately, the self-righteousness that goes along with these kinds of protesters is pretty much impossible to penetrate with any other kind of reason.

they use terms like "giant noisy fan" and "giant smokestack" as if they are creating some kind of exaggerated fairy tale monster. give some actual dimensions, some actual proof of the noise level, not just rhetoric and scare tactics.

[mr.x]

"giant noisy fan" and "giant smokestack"

I'm surprised they haven't associated what is being planned with these:
http://images.jupiterimages.com/common/detail/39/83/23518339.jpg
http://i.treehugger.com/images/2007/5/24/SmokeStack.jpg

[Tom Bombadil]

Is it really that important to have the bus loop connect with SkyTrain? How many people will be transferring? UBC is the destination for those arriving by bus or train.

[eduardo88]

Is it really that important to have the bus loop connect with SkyTrain? How many people will be transferring? UBC is the destination for those arriving by bus or train.

UBC is a big campus tho, people need to have the option of transfering from skytrain to bus and vice versa

[quobobo]

UBC is a big campus tho, people need to have the option of transfering from skytrain to bus and vice versa

I have never seen more than a couple people on those campus community shuttles, and I don't know anyone who's been on them more than once or twice. Besides, putting them roughly halfway in between the bus loop and the Skytrain would make it roughly the same as it is now.

I think Tom Bombadil is right, as long as they're both in relatively central areas I don't think it really matters whether the buses and trains are connected.

[worldwide]

bunch of idiots protesting the bus loop... im sure they would prefer a bunch more parking lots instead

[dreambrother808]

but why aren't the police and firefighters nice to me when i light a big bonfire in the middle of campus? ;) did you see them playing up their so-called injuries on the news? the video they shot that supposedly captured the police brutality showed pretty much nothing of the sort, just standard protesters refusing to leave and having to be forcibly removed. thinking that you can light fires in public and not listen to the police and firefighters in the aftermath is ridiculous.

i went to ubc and have memories of the grassy knoll, but really it's not that major. it's a crappy little hill with some grass on it. that's all.

[Tom Bombadil]

i went to ubc and have memories of the grassy knoll, but really it's not that major. it's a crappy little hill with some grass on it. that's all.

I believe UBC has already stated that the grassy knoll will be remade after the bus loop is done. This was in response to earlier petitions.

[mr.x]

I believe UBC has already stated that the grassy knoll will be remade after the bus loop is done. This was in response to earlier petitions.

wtf....yea, i hate this city. might as well rename it to hippy central.

PAVE THE KNOLL!
KNO TO THE KNOLL!

[Tom Bombadil]

From the UBC website:

"Full details are available in a report approved by the Board of Governors in November, which explicitly seeks to 'retain more of the existing character of the landscaping already in place, most significantly through the re-creation of the grassy knoll.'"

[dreambrother808]

this makes the protesters look even more ridiculous and out of touch. the saddest part is that protest is important and should be taken seriously when there is genuine injustice. ridiculous people like this make an impression in the public's mind about protest in general, a bad one.

[mr.x]

KNO TO THE KNOLL! A DEMONSTRATION!
All we are saaaaayiiingg is build bus loop now!



Where: in front of the hippy camp
When: Friday, April 11 - from 12:30 to 1 pm


Hello all supporters of the cause,

This Friday, aka the last day of classes and the "Block Party," we will be having a rally in front of the hippie camp and the knoll.

It will begin around 12:30-1 in the afternoon. We will meet there and organize everyone at that time.

Signs, shovels, a megaphone and other supplies to help get our message across will be brought. We encourage those of you who wish to join us in protest to make your own signs.

On that note: please keep the signs reasonably clean and classy, we won't be taken seriously if we have signs laced with profanity.

We will stage a symbolic "dig-up", as well as other activities to get our message across.

Also be prepared to "discuss" the issues with those who will inevitably argue with us.

I urge all of you to come out this friday, and lets send a message to those hippies!

If you have any questions or suggestions, please message me.
Also, if you have any sign ideas, message me and I'll try to incorporate the ideas into our signs.

And as always
Kno to the Knoll, Build Bus Loop Now, P.F. Changs!


-----------------------

The hippies have rebuilt their shanty town in the parking lot. Think of how much more convenient it would be if instead of soggy furniture and a hill, we had more retail! Maybe even a PF Chang's! Or a Taco Bell!

And the benefits of an underground bus loop cannot be overstated. There would likely be interesting construction projects and impressive cranes to look at for months as they built it, and afterwards we would have a new bomb shelter to hide in, in case the terrorists came.

In all seriousness, it would also make a pretty effective SkyTrain station when they build that one day after we have all left UBC.

----------------------

It has become all too easy for those covering the controversy regarding the future of the knoll and University of B.C. campus development plans to frame the issue as a contest between the interests of powerful developers and university administrators and those of helpless students. This will likely continue with the coverage of the disorder and inevitable conflict that came as a result of a clearly unsafe bonfire being lit in the middle of campus last Friday.

That is a shame. The silent majority of students recognize that their interests are indeed served by a plan that will improve transit efficiency, add badly needed capacity to a choked campus housing market, and improve the sadly lacking retail choices on campus. That same silent majority recognizes the value of respect for the rule of law and the good men and women who enforce it.

Until this past weekend, "Trek Park" was little more than a nuisance to most students. Now it is fast becoming a symbol for the kind of unacceptable chaos and mob rule that one hears about at some other universities. In light of that, I doubt the majority will be silent for much longer.

[nathan6969]

I walked by the construction site around the knoll today, and honestly, i don't know why these guys bother to protest, just sit back and it'll take them another 15 years to ever get this thing built. It seems like they rolled all this equipment in back in the summer, but it doesn't look they've really done anything. Not only has this been debated for the last decade, but all they seem to have done in the last 8 months is move a bit of soil around on the surface.

[quobobo]

^^ I'll probably go to that.

[mr.x]

I have class, but to anyone here that is going don't just bring a shovel....bring a bulldozer!

[SpongeG]

has anyone read todays 24 hours - the letters section - lol

not in favour of UBC protesters

haha

[worldwide]

mrX i wish i could go but i have to take some dumb math proficiency test on friday so i can take stats this summer and finally get a real job in planning.

somebody needs to show those dumb asses whats up. i swear they just protest shit cause its the thing to do

[Rusty Gull]

Saturday » April 19 » 2008

UBC students approve higher fees to pay for new building
Green $120-million student building will replace aging facility

Chad Skelton
Vancouver Sun

Saturday, April 19, 2008

Students at the University of B.C. have voted narrowly in favour of a big fee increase in order to pay for a $120-million student building that will be bigger and more environmentally friendly than the current 1960s-era facility.

UBC's student association, the Alma Mater Society, has been working for the past year on a proposal to replace the aging Student Union Building -- or SUB -- where campus groups hold meetings and students socialize.

The AMS convinced UBC administration to chip in $40 million if students paid the remaining $80 million.

Financing would require each student to pay a special $20 "SUB renewal" fee next fall. The fee would rise by $10 each year after that until 2017, when it would max out at $110.

That fee would then stay in place until the debt from the new building is completely paid off, something the AMS estimates won't happen until 2044.

In late March, the issue was put to UBC students in a referendum.

About 14,000 students voted -- roughly a third of all students -- with 55 per cent voting in favour and 45 per cent against.

AMS president Michael Duncan, a fourth-year math student, said he was happy students voted in favour of the proposal, saying the current building doesn't meet the university's needs.

"It's pretty gross. It was built back in the 1960s and it is a concrete bunker," he said. "It's a very confusing building and hard to get around. ... It's a maze. You can't find where you're going."

Duncan said the society hopes construction can begin on the new building in a couple of years and will be operational by 2014.

It will be built south of the current SUB, so that the old building can continue to operate while the new one is under construction.

The new building will be 280,000 square feet, compared to the current 205,000.

The AMS has pledged that the new building will be energy efficient and friendly to the environment.

However, aside from a few conceptual drawings, there aren't yet any detailed plans of what the new building will look like, or what energy-saving features it will incorporate.

The way the new fee is structured, the current students who approved it will not bear its full, $110-a-year brunt.

The AMS thought that was fair, said Duncan, since most students attending UBC today won't get to use the new building.

Duncan acknowledged many students were opposed to the size of the fee increase.

"Yes, it's a huge fee, but there are ways to justify it," he said.

An editorial on the issue in the UBC student paper The Ubyssey last month agreed that the SUB needed some renovations, but questioned whether such a costly alternative was required.

"There's something to be said for financial prudence," the editorial stated. "And that, sadly, is what the proposed ... plan is lacking."

cskelton@png.canwest.com

© The Vancouver Sun 2008

[radacal]

^ "south of the current SUB" - over the proposed underground bus terminal?

[squeezied]

"It's[the sub] pretty gross..."

true that!!!

[flight_from_kamakura]

thanks for the awesome news about the referendum.

one of the greatest things about the ams building a new sub will be that it *won't* be a university project. and as this is the case, for $120 million on 280,000 sqf, we should get a very very nice building.

[Tom Bombadil]

I wouldn't assume that the university will take a hands off approach to the new SUB project. They are putting in $40 million and the land. This will be a university project on some level I imagine.

[quobobo]

Can someone please assure me that the blue tint on the windows of Ike Barber's lobby is temporary? It's probably the only thing I don't like about the building.

[flight_from_kamakura]

I wouldn't assume that the university will take a hands off approach to the new SUB project. They are putting in $40 million and the land. This will be a university project on some level I imagine.

don't try to depress me pal.

[Coldrsx]

I love the basment of SUB...so quintessentially university student.

[mr.x]

To members of KNO TO THE KNOLL

Today at 9:43pm
Hello Kno to the Knollers,

This is just a reminder to all of you that Kno to the Knoll will be holding a good ol' fashion pub night tomorrow at Koerner's Pub at 7:30-8pm.
We hope you will all come out and join us in peaceful protest against the knoll and those hippies, who are apparently holding their own protest this same night.

Build Bus Loop Now! P.F. Changs for all!





BTW, the hippies who were "oppressed" by the police a few weeks ago are crazy enough to make a documentary about it [warning, watching this will kill brain cells]:
Z2WYr_7zyhs





A must see. The SDS (knoll hippies) swarming former Liberal MP for UBC/Point Grey. As he's trying to listen to hear them out, they shout allegations with a megaphone at him. Remember; its all about democracy and student voices.

Behold the magnitude of stupidity.
RAeECKQydV8
Don't you love how these guys don't even let him respond, and they feel intimidated if they don't use a megaphone? Typical hippies.




Somebody get China to roll in the fucking tanks.

[lightning]

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/spyro2/SUB_Renewal_280x180.gif

here's a animation of one of the concepts prepared by Cannon Design

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/spyro2/SUB_Renew_animationgif.gif

the main building has a curved glass facade, will be five storeys in height and have a green roof (which will probably not be accessible to the public), the knoll will be moved a bit south, probably be some retail space, lots more student space and the pit pub may be moved there too

[fever]

awkward

[mr.x]

It really is awkward....and the knoll??? gah.

[dreambrother808]

I work at UBC everyday and am rather impressed by this SUB redesign. However, kowtowing to the ludicrously naive demands of the knoll protesters is beyond me. Someone needs to teach these kids that a simple hill is not THE issue of our times signifying so conclusively the triumph of corporatism over the general good. Get fucking real. It's a hill at the university, which as a student I remember sitting on only once or twice. Meanwhile the proposed underground bus loop and related development represent a major improvement on campus, in terms of not only accessibility for transit but also for the interminably lackluster esthetics of that whole area as well.

[dreambrother808]

Perhaps if we all grew up in West Van or Point Grey and felt such a burning, image/ego-driven need to posture ourselves as promoters of the social good we would fall under similar illusions as to what that really entails.

[Yume-sama]

Well, at least the knoll protesters will have stories to tell their grandchildren if they indeed do decide to procreate and cause another Earth killing human to be born.

[mr.x]

Perhaps if we all grew up in West Van or Point Grey and felt such a burning, image/ego-driven need to posture ourselves as promoters of the social good we would fall under similar illusions as to what that really entails.

I grew up in Point Grey all my life.

[flight_from_kamakura]

lol, you guys and your knoll protesters.

anyway, thanks lightning, i was wondering how it all turned out. this is actually something i'm pretty excited about, the sub really is a scandalous bit of blight, and it'll be fantastic once it's a bright, interesting space. hopefully this doesn't go the way of 'university town'...

[Coldrsx]

strangely awesome