Where Is The Rust Belt?

[Steely Dan]

^ detroit was not immune to the "face brick up front/common brick in back" phenomenon either.

it was a cost savings move that all fast growing cities that weren't blessed with excellent clay (like st. louis) employed at the time.

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3549...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3541...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3536...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4162...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192


you just don't notice it as much in detroit today because such a large amount of the city's vintage brick vernacular has been lost.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ detroit was not immune to the "face brick up front/common brick in back" phenomenon either.

it was a cost savings move that all fast growing cities that weren't blessed with excellent clay (like st. louis) employed at the time.

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3549...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3541...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3536...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4162...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192


you just don't notice it as much in detroit today because such a large amount of the city's vintage brick vernacular has been lost.

I thought this was common in every city of a certain age? There is still a lot of it left in Detroit.

[IrishIllini]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ detroit was not immune to the "face brick up front/common brick in back" phenomenon either.

it was a cost savings move that all fast growing cities that weren't blessed with excellent clay (like st. louis) employed at the time.

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3549...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3541...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3536...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4162...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192


you just don't notice it as much in detroit today because such a large amount of the city's vintage brick vernacular has been lost.

So much of Detroit (the multi family buildings) looks like the far north and far south sides of Chicago. They could have probably been interchangeable at Detroit’s peak.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I thought this was common in every city of a certain age?

it was, which is why i wrote the following:

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

it was a cost savings move that all fast growing cities that weren't blessed with excellent clay (like st. louis) employed at the time.

Originally Posted by iheartthed

There is still a lot of it left in Detroit.

well, i was speaking of what's left in detroit in relation to chicago. chicago has WAY more of its vintage brick multi-family vernacular intact than detroit does, which is why the effect of "face brick in front/common brick in back" is so much more visible in chicago today.

[pj3000]

Well then, what rustbelt city has the BEST brick?

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by pj3000

Well then, what rustbelt city has the BEST brick?

st. louis?

i know that's where chicago imported the lion's share of its red face brick from.

st. louis had such abundant high quality red clay for face brick that they could afford to put it on all sides of their buildings.

[suburbanite]

St. Louis has to be king.

Pittsburgh has a lot of nice deep red as well.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ detroit was not immune to the "face brick up front/common brick in back" phenomenon either.

it was a cost savings move that all fast growing cities that weren't blessed with excellent clay (like st. louis) employed at the time.

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3549...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3541...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3536...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4162...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4170...7i16384!8i8192


you just don't notice it as much in detroit today because such a large amount of the city's vintage brick vernacular has been lost.

For it to be noticeable some of the city's vintage brick vernacular has to have been lost. If all of it is gone, you won't see it, and if none of it is gone, you'll just see the facades.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by lio45

For it to be noticeable some of the city's vintage brick vernacular has to have been lost. If all of it is gone, you won't see it, and if none of it is gone, you'll just see the facades.

alleys, my good man, alleys.

>95% of chicago city blocks are bisected by alleys.

common brick ALWAYS went on the alley facade.




street facade:


source: https://www.chicagoreader.com/chicag...t?oid=74470739




alley facade:


souirce: https://www.chicagoreader.com/chicag...t?oid=74470739



And yes, those images are of the same building.

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by pj3000

Some of Toronto's "light industry" You could say these photos are historic photos of Buffalo or Erie or Cleveland or Toledo or Detroit, etc. and no one would be able to tell the difference.

Here's my fave: (from 1907)


https://www.qcyc.ca/node/72


Look at that lovely layer of smog.

[The North One]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ detroit was not immune to the "face brick up front/common brick in back" phenomenon either.

it was a cost savings move that all fast growing cities that weren't blessed with excellent clay (like st. louis) employed at the time.

None of that looks anything like Chicago common...

[The North One]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

well, i was speaking of what's left in detroit in relation to chicago. chicago has WAY more of its vintage brick multi-family vernacular intact than detroit does, which is why the effect of "face brick in front/common brick in back" is so much more visible in chicago today.

lol you're flexing here, what does this have to do with anything? I mean god knows there are tons of Chicago brick housing rotting right now as you type and Chicago has lost ungodly amounts of historical housing stock. So can we not? Pot meet kettle.

It seems Chicago was cursed with unattractive clay, I've never seen Chicago common in Boston or Toronto or any other city.

[edale]

Originally Posted by pj3000

Well then, what rustbelt city has the BEST brick?

Aside from St. Louis, I think Columbus might be the brickiest city in the midwest (debatable if it counts as rustbelt).

German Village, for the best example:
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9508...7i13312!8i6656

Cincinnati has a ton of brick buildings, and I never really noticed a big difference between the bricks used for facades vs those used on the rear or sides of buildings. For whatever reason, it seems like the brick in Cincy is painted more often than other cities, so it's kind of hard to tell about the overall brick color or quality on facades.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1115...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1111...7i16384!8i8192

[pj3000]

I had been to Columbus before, but this past spring and summer was the first time I spent extended periods of time there (was there for work from April to July). I really liked it. So much cooler of a city than I thought it would be (likely how most people think of it... bland and boring... but in reality, that’s not true at all). And lots of nice brick.

Not surprised that Cincy is so bricky. I think bricks just floated down (or up) the river.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

alleys, my good man, alleys.

>95% of chicago city blocks are bisected by alleys.

common brick ALWAYS went on the alley facade.




street facade:


source: https://www.chicagoreader.com/chicag...t?oid=74470739




alley facade:


souirce: https://www.chicagoreader.com/chicag...t?oid=74470739



And yes, those images are of the same building.

Sure, and thanks for the interesting info, but still, I think my point partly stands: if "tourists" like suburbanite and myself get to notice that the sides of the buildings are made of this unevenly-colored yellow common brick, it's almost certainly because there are frequent enough demolition gaps in the wall of facades lining the street, not because we've ventured into the city's alleys.

[galleyfox]

Originally Posted by lio45

Sure, and thanks for the interesting info, but still, I think my point partly stands: if "tourists" like suburbanite and myself get to notice that the sides of the buildings are made of this unevenly-colored yellow common brick, it's almost certainly because there are frequent enough demolition gaps in the wall of facades lining the street, not because we've ventured into the city's alleys.

Oh it's much more noticeable than that if you're paying attention. Beyond the front facade and street level, Chicago didn't give two flips about the visibility of common brick. If you had a 5-story building and a 10-story building next to each other in Chicago...too bad.

Look at Michigan Avenue. Common brick galore from the side where everyone can see. It's partially why the city is nonchalant about mixing architectural styles together. Most of its early grand architecture is already brick frankensteins.

[pj3000]

Pittsburgh seems to have a ton of yellow brick... mainly in older suburban areas 1920s-1950s

Do other cities have a lot of this? I find it rather ugly.

[suburbanite]

Another good enclave of red brick similar to the German Village in Columbus is Old Louisville. I forced my begrudging passengers to make a quick stop in the very under-the-radar city on our way to Nashville last year. Very nice residential area but it lacks a main continuous commercial corridor.

[Centropolis]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

st. louis?

i know that's where chicago imported the lion's share of its red face brick from.

st. louis had such abundant high quality red clay for face brick that they could afford to put it on all sides of their buildings.

St. Louis still had multiple grades of brick, and still often did the common/face brick type setup seen below:

https://goo.gl/maps/T75LRaSMTAV9P5yC6

although, not always:

https://goo.gl/maps/qfMKdwW3X3muhsYV6

then again, hard to figure out what is going on here:

https://goo.gl/maps/YBuwfrfBS7c8ADpD6

not the finest examples (like lafayette square or central west end) i could find but just dropped the google man somewhere quick.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by The North One

None of that looks anything like Chicago common...

there is no one chicago common brick. as i said earlier, it comes in a whole rainbow of colors (browns, tans, grays, taupes, oranges, yellows, pinks, salmons, etc.) sometimes all within the same brick, but often in more uniform fields like those detroit examples that i posted. the one thing we didn't have was a lot of consistently red clay like st. louis did, which is why chicago had to import most of its face brick.

Originally Posted by The North One

lol you're flexing here, what does this have to do with anything?

not flexing, just the truth.

chicago's common brick is so much more noticeable than detroit's because chicago has orders of magnitude more of it left.