NEW JERSEY | Liberty World Trade Center -TTII| 1,515 FT / 462 M | 115 FLOORS | VISION

[plinko]

morelight,

First off, a calmer perspective is much appreciated and I found your comments well thought out. But I honestly have to ask, what is the purpose of your organization at this point? In all seriousness?

In 2002, any sort of plan to re-build actually made some sense. Not necessarily the Belton-Gardner plan but something similar. All of the subsequent plans were and have been dissected ad infinitum on this forum over the past 8 years. You wouldn't believe how in depth some of the discussions were at the time (everything from truss design to fireproofing to parachutes).

But the simple reality is that a decision was made by those in power that the economics at the time wouldn't yield a re-build. Not an easy or simple decision (especially given the number of players who inserted themselves into the fray), but a decision no less.

And during 2003 and 2004 there still was time to convince the powers that be otherwise, that the Belton-Gardner plan was the best. And if it had such enormous backing (I'm not talking about Nebraska residents who sign petitions out of fear, but real development industry people), why wasn't it chosen?

Because it's an inferior plan and at best an unimaginative piece of architecture. You can argue that the economics of the current plan don't work either (and for that I'll somewhat agree), but from a basic programming standpoint (particularly in relation to the infrastructure), it doesn't work.

These are ALL arguments and debates we had in an entire forum for the WTC on this site for years. But at a certain point, MOST of us realized that the infrastructure of the bathtub, subways, utilities, etc had progressed to such a point that this notion of the rebuilt WTC just wasn't even possible anymore. That was in like 2005...

You can debate the merits of the architecture of the new towers as much as you want, we all do that (as I said, I don't particularly care for Child's 1WTC design), but the simple reality is that the 'twin' concept died a long time ago.

So I ask an honest question...what is it that your group seeks? Recognition as the 'what should have been'? I mean really? That's up there with the people who wish the South should have won the Civil War in my book. It just isn't reality.

I'd appreciate an honest answer, I think it might be interesting. BTW, believe me when I tell you that most forumers find great amusement at TwinTowersAlliance's rants in this thread. We've been there, done that. It's just been a couple of years since it's actually been a relevant subject. Since you actually seem to be speaking for the organization, I'm interested in your thoughts.

[Lecom]

Originally Posted by TwinTowersAlliance

The Twin Towers II can be built safly and fast that that crap that is gonna take 40 years to be completed.I lost my cousin on 9/11.and Im backing TTII project 110%.

Im not gonna continue arguing with you thick headed pricks.Im from New York City,and there is ALOT of support for TTII,and if you can't come to terms with the reality that the so called Freedom Tower 1WTC is gonna fail.then you have Issues.

Watch your mouth, kid. Name calling and trolling is not tolerated on this forum, and you're walking a fine line right now. Say something like "you thick headed pricks" again and we'll skip the warnings. And it's a really low and morally devoid move for you to use your cousin's memory to justify your individual point of view on an issue and pressure others to think like you. Guess what, I'm from New York too, and you have no right, none at all, to claim that you somehow represent all of this city.

morelight, I respect your mild attitude and trying to approach things in a peaceful manner. It's just that this forum is full of people who have been following construction projects all over the world for years, and they know the construction process very well, or at least well enough to know that this project has no way of going ahead, considering how far along things are now. Besides, you continually refuse to provide any specific data or names, which further invalidates anything that you have to say.

[KevinFromTexas]

I want the Singer Building back. Who's with me?

[twintowers2011]

Okay, I think all of you "1 WTC" supporters are hypocrites. You say that we are just a small group of people with wacky dreams. If that is so, then how come every poll that has been taken has been in support of the Twin Towers? How come every news segment that has happened regarding the WTC site has supported rebuilding the Twin Towers? Most of the people who have been presented with the decision of what should be built at the site were in favor of rebuilding the towers. In fact, it seems that the only people who really support this plan are the people who came up with it and you forumers who have nothing better to do than to criticize what most people want. The reason our group of supporters isn't that large is because most people don't know about whats going on. I bet if every single person in the US knew about what was going on, they would want the Twins to be rebuilt. I really think you people are missing the whole point. Rebuilding these buildings is the American way. If the White House or the Capitol Building or The Statue of Liberty or Mount Rushmore or any other American icon was destroyed, would we build something that looks NOTHING like how it did? Probably not, and for you people who say that rebuilding them would be "acting like it never happened", well thats what the memorial is for! The memorial represents what happened on that day, and the new Twins right next to it represents how we responded. And yes, it could be completed in three to four years. If you people forgot, the WTC construction started in 1968 and the second tower was topped off by 1971, and to say how impossible this project is is insane, because the original WTC was faced with a number of challenges, and what happened? THEY OVERCAME THEM AND ENDED UP BUILDING THE TALLEST BUILDINGS IN THE WORLD AT THAT TIME AND WHAT WAS TO BECOME AN AMERICAN ICON! In closing, I would like to say that whatever happens, happens. Nothing is impossible to accomplish, and I feel that they will ultimately end up being rebuilt. Again, MY OPINION! But if you want to criticize me some more, go ahead. I don't care what you blind people think. I have my opinion, AND THATS ALL I NEED!

[photoLith]

Rebuilding the twin towers would be a jackass move, talk about people reliving that day over and over again whenever they saw them. This will never happen and the person that posted this forum is delusional in thinking.

[Lecom]

Originally Posted by twintowers2011

I don't care what you blind people think. I have my opinion, AND THATS ALL I NEED!

Then why the hell do you bother sharing your opinion with us "blind people"? Or do you just love to hear yourself talk, if even only on the Internet?

You got some nerve calling us hypocrites. And that's great that all you need is your opinion, because no one else here, or anyone outside your tinfoil hat wearing buddies, needs it.

[Aleks]

Originally Posted by twintowers2011

Okay, I think all of you "1 WTC" supporters are hypocrites. You say that we are just a small group of people with wacky dreams. If that is so, then how come every poll that has been taken has been in support of the Twin Towers? How come every news segment that has happened regarding the WTC site has supported rebuilding the Twin Towers? Most of the people who have been presented with the decision of what should be built at the site were in favor of rebuilding the towers. In fact, it seems that the only people who really support this plan are the people who came up with it and you forumers who have nothing better to do than to criticize what most people want. The reason our group of supporters isn't that large is because most people don't know about whats going on. I bet if every single person in the US knew about what was going on, they would want the Twins to be rebuilt. I really think you people are missing the whole point. Rebuilding these buildings is the American way. If the White House or the Capitol Building or The Statue of Liberty or Mount Rushmore or any other American icon was destroyed, would we build something that looks NOTHING like how it did? Probably not, and for you people who say that rebuilding them would be "acting like it never happened", well thats what the memorial is for! The memorial represents what happened on that day, and the new Twins right next to it represents how we responded. And yes, it could be completed in three to four years. If you people forgot, the WTC construction started in 1968 and the second tower was topped off by 1971, and to say how impossible this project is is insane, because the original WTC was faced with a number of challenges, and what happened? THEY OVERCAME THEM AND ENDED UP BUILDING THE TALLEST BUILDINGS IN THE WORLD AT THAT TIME AND WHAT WAS TO BECOME AN AMERICAN ICON! In closing, I would like to say that whatever happens, happens. Nothing is impossible to accomplish, and I feel that they will ultimately end up being rebuilt. Again, MY OPINION! But if you want to criticize me some more, go ahead. I don't care what you blind people think. I have my opinion, AND THATS ALL I NEED!

haha, post of the year award! And of course you only have your opinion. Nobody is financing the rebuilding. And you have no proof that it will be built. YOUR OPINION!

But anyways, we're hypocrites? I bet you didn't even care for the WTC until 9/11. Unlike the hundreds of forumers in this site who have loved architecture, criticized it, and studied it for much longer than 99% of the people on the TTA site.

[twintowers2011]

I bother because I have a right to. This is a forum where people can give their opinions. You act like if people don't agree with you then they don't belong on this thread and that they are stupid. I have stated my opinion concerning this whole thread. You just asked me a question and I answered it. What more do you want? Oh! That's right. You want me to agree with you. Well, it ain't gonna happen.

[twintowers2011]

And actually, I always admired the WTC and always wanted to go to the top, but I never got a chance. And I never said I had facts about the rebuilding, but I did give you facts about previous polls.

[Lecom]

Originally Posted by twintowers2011

I bother because I have a right to. This is a forum where people can give their opinions. You act like if people don't agree with you then they don't belong on this thread and that they are stupid. I have stated my opinion concerning this whole thread. You just asked me a question and I answered it. What more do you want? Oh! That's right. You want me to agree with you. Well, it ain't gonna happen.

No, dude, we are not trying to stop you from expressing your opinion, nor are we trying to convince you. We just don't care about your opinion, because you go about it in a douchy manner. "I don't care what you blind people think. I have my opinion, AND THATS ALL I NEED!" Well this works out, cause we don't care about your opinion either.

But keep expressing it, and if you haven't noticed it yet, you guys are already being mocked in several other threads on this forum.

[Aleks]

haha, I noticed that too Lecom. So anyways, why do you guys want it done by 2011? Is it because of the two 1's? So it makes 11 like twin towers?

And wow, I was gonna type the same thing Lecom! Weeird!

[twintowers2011]

Originally Posted by Lecom

No, dude, we are not trying to stop you from expressing your opinion, nor are we trying to convince you. We just don't care about your opinion, because you go about it in a douchy manner. "I don't care what you blind people think. I have my opinion, AND THATS ALL I NEED!" Well this works out, cause we don't care about your opinion either.

But keep expressing it, and if you haven't noticed it yet, you guys are already being mocked in several other threads on this forum.

Okay, if you aren't trying to stop me from expressing my opinion and if you don't care about it, then why the hell do you continue to criticize everything I say? If you truly didn't care about my opinion, then you wouldn't even reply to it. So obviously you do care about it. And I'm being a douche? You better look over this whole thread again because I see A LOT of "1WTC" supporters who are being more of a douche than I'm supposedly being! And why do I care that I'm being mocked? I'm not out here to impress anyone, just to say what I have to say.

[twintowers2011]

Well 2011 is significant because it's the 10th Anniversary. But it's really not THAT important. Just that they get rebuilt. (For me anyway)

[Lecom]

Originally Posted by twintowers2011

Okay, if you aren't trying to stop me from expressing my opinion and if you don't care about it, then why the hell do you continue to criticize everything I say? If you truly didn't care about my opinion, then you wouldn't even reply to it. So obviously you do care about it. And I'm being a douche? You better look over this whole thread again because I see A LOT of "1WTC" supporters who are being more of a douche than I'm supposedly being! And why do I care that I'm being mocked? I'm not out here to impress anyone, just to say what I have to say.

Okay, I apologize for everything I said. I deeply care about your opinion and am considering supporting your cause. It is obvious that the Twin Towers II will start construction in the next month or two, and I was being a douche when I stated otherwise. Please tell me more.

[Aleks]

All you're saying is opinions. No facts. People aren't responding to your opinions. They're responding to your lack of knowledge about the WTC and on your attitude.

[Lecom]

Originally Posted by Aleks

All you're saying is opinions. No facts. People aren't responding to your opinions. They're responding to your lack of knowledge about the WTC and on your attitude.

I think that you should stop being so mean to us and face the fact that the Twin Towers will be rebuilt very soon! Don't you know that each and every New Yorker wants it, and some unlicensed amateur designer is a visionary that will save America?! If you disagree, then you're a hypocrite. I'd give you some more websites to visit to learn about our cause, but they're all under construction.

[twintowers2011]

AGAIN, I DIDN'T SAY I HAD FACTS! AND I DIDN'T SAY I KNEW EVERYTHING ABOUT THE WTC! You people are puting words in my mouth! Oh, yes. My attitude sucks while your attitudes towards me are perfect. You just continue to show your close-mindedness! I am open minded towards what you guys are saying, but I don't agree with it. Then you put me down for not doing so, and I'M the one with the bad attitude?

[Buckeye Native 001]

Originally Posted by twintowers2011

I bother because I have a right to. This is a forum where people can give their opinions.

Last time I checked, and granted I'm no moderator, this forum wasn't a democracy. Never has been, never will be.

[Aleks]

Caps=yelling and yelling is mean.

And if you're so open minded then why don't you give a good look at the current and only WTC design? Why do you still want the old twin blocks even though they're gone and a new architectural style has come into out time?

[twintowers2011]

Well me and several other people seem to be doing it just fine.