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  #8881  
Old Posted Nov 6, 2023, 8:05 PM
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ILUVSAT ILUVSAT is offline
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Originally Posted by FrankLloydLeft View Post
...I still don't see this as the doom and gloom some on Airlines.net are making it out to be for us. It's not a good look by any means, but I don't think these routes contributed heavily to our overall growth in the way our recent international grabs have.
I agree. This move says more about AA than it does about AUS or Austin. And, anyone trying to tie this move with a depression in Austin's economy (or housing prices) is quite ignorant.

AA reported an operational loss of more than half a billion dollars last quarter. They are also investing billions into expanding DFW (they want to serve 100M PAX by 2030).

Also, AA has been known for decades to not really plan for the long-term. They like to through stuff at a wall and see what sticks.

I also believe it was mentioned, way back when this massive ramp-up occurred, that most of the routes may not work. It was a complete shock as to why AA was doing this. Well, I'm pretty sure multiple flights a week to Bozeman, Jacksonville, Memphis, Oklahoma City were not making money!

I will say: cutting this many at once was about as surprising as adding them basically all together. However, the overall affect on total PAX will be pretty minimal.

I do hate that AUS will, at least temporarily, loose links to Costa Rica, Bahamas and a future route to Montego Bay, Jamaica.
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  #8882  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 6:53 PM
StoOgE StoOgE is offline
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I dont see any way to spin this as anything but bad for the port. I mean yes there are external factors but we just lost a lot of direct flights that we wont get back for a long time.

I expect we're going to lose more international routes as well and we'll see airlines start giving us larger planes flying to hubs more often to serve the needs of the growing city and less directs to smaller and mid size markets
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  #8883  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 8:04 PM
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Originally Posted by StoOgE View Post
I dont see any way to spin this as anything but bad for the port. I mean yes there are external factors but we just lost a lot of direct flights that we wont get back for a long time.

I expect we're going to lose more international routes as well and we'll see airlines start giving us larger planes flying to hubs more often to serve the needs of the growing city and less directs to smaller and mid size markets

I completely disagree and shall not conform with an alarmist attitude. Several of the cut routes are still served by other airlines at AUS. So, the overall hit is not as bad as you make it.

Again, this has a lot more to do with the airline than it does with any aspect of Austin. With AA's lack of scheduling more through passengers at AUS to these smaller markets - the whole "experiment" was doomed to fail. This was in no way AUS' fault or doing.
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  #8884  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 9:20 PM
FrankLloydLeft FrankLloydLeft is offline
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Originally Posted by ILUVSAT View Post
I do hate that AUS will, at least temporarily, loose links to Costa Rica, Bahamas and a future route to Montego Bay, Jamaica.
Thank you! Yes, those are routes that likely could have worked well still, but overall with an impending recession, can see it as preemptive for when leisure routes tighten up.

Overrall though, this is better for the cuts to be leaked like this all at once vs a series of cuts over time and dragging out the coverage of Austins "leakage".
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  #8885  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 9:29 PM
FrankLloydLeft FrankLloydLeft is offline
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Originally Posted by StoOgE View Post
I expect we're going to lose more international routes as well and we'll see airlines start giving us larger planes flying to hubs more often to serve the needs of the growing city and less directs to smaller and mid size markets
I can't wait for the 777s to take us to Dallas and A380s to Houston.

For real though, no one is saying this is good for the port, but it's by no means going to lead to our international routes being cut considering only BA is tied to Americans network.

KLM and WestJet are tied to Delta ( Virgin was too.rip)
Lufthansa and Copa go with United

Neither have a large presence or are making major moves to have one currently, even with Deltas Delta connection flights to RDU and CVG
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  #8886  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 11:16 PM
LightChop LightChop is offline
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Despite Delta being a distant (for now) #3, AUS is one of the airline’s largest non-hub stations. In July it was the 8th largest in the system in daily departures.

It might not seem like much compared to AA but the airline has a meaningful presence in AUS.
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  #8887  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 6:17 AM
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  #8888  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 3:21 PM
atx-adam atx-adam is offline
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City of Austin is taking over the South Terminal:

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The South Terminal will be transferred over to the Department of Aviation. All airline, vendor and business operations remain under LoneStar Airport Holdings, LLC until the transfer is completed. The terminal will continue to be operational until the required removal, which is expected to happen in 2025.
Things are going to get even more tight once Frontier and Allegiant move back to Barbara Jordan.
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  #8889  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 4:15 PM
freerover freerover is offline
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Originally Posted by atx-adam View Post
City of Austin is taking over the South Terminal:



Things are going to get even more tight once Frontier and Allegiant move back to Barbara Jordan.

Remember we have the bus gate coming online. I imagine that can support more flights per day than a regular fixed gate since the planes are parked far away from the terminal.
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  #8890  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 7:50 PM
ATX2030 ATX2030 is offline
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Originally Posted by atx-adam View Post
City of Austin is taking over the South Terminal:



Things are going to get even more tight once Frontier and Allegiant move back to Barbara Jordan.
The port has already pushed the date to 2026. Another 2 years to build the cross field taxiways. Once they are completed then construction can begin on the new concourse. Would be shocked if the new concourse is operational before 2031-32.
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  #8891  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 8:06 PM
freerover freerover is offline
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Originally Posted by ATX2030 View Post
The port has already pushed the date to 2026. Another 2 years to build the cross field taxiways. Once they are completed then construction can begin on the new concourse. Would be shocked if the new concourse is operational before 2031-32.
The port can't push the closing date of the south terminal and build the new taxiway bc they overlap. I think you might have read his post wrong.
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  #8892  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 9:48 PM
ATX2030 ATX2030 is offline
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  #8893  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 11:08 PM
freerover freerover is offline
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Originally Posted by ATX2030 View Post
well shit
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  #8894  
Old Posted Nov 9, 2023, 6:53 PM
Scuba Scuba is offline
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Originally Posted by FrankLloydLeft View Post
IF Delta's still considering filling their market gap with AUS, this is the flinch they've been waiting for.

With the second concourse expansion taking so long, and capacity continuing to be a major issue, freeing up the space from these routes could allow Delta to get a better footing in AUS in the long run.

If not, I still don't see this as the doom and gloom some on Airlines.net are making it out to be for us. It's not a good look by any means, but I don't think these routes contributed heavily to our overall growth in the way our recent international grabs have.

BNA, PDX and RDU are all flying markets similar to ours, and we are not seeing them experience a major growth in routes from any legacy carrier at this time.

Hell, this might entice Breeze to take a stab at flying to AUS with our gates less stressed with these cuts.

The only airports Delta still calls "focus cities" are AUS and RDU/Raleigh-Durham. Delta has pretty much mystified us by doing mostly nothing at Austin even though they say "focus city"

Dont know much about BNA/Nashville, but I do know they've been slow to rebuild RDU's Delta schedule. To their credit at Raleigh, I think they're now up to 6 international airlines to Europe, Canada, and the Caribbean, nothing yet to Mexico. I read they just announced Lufthansa and Air France recently took over the Paris flight from Delta.
real estate news places say the housing market at RDU is doing better than AUS in terms of holding value and appreciation, but the office market there is worse off than Austin in terms of coming back after COVID. they are down there with Chicago and San Francisco, not that bad off on the lists, but more negative than most cities. Lots of permanent WFH people there.
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  #8895  
Old Posted Nov 9, 2023, 7:21 PM
FrankLloydLeft FrankLloydLeft is offline
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Originally Posted by Scuba View Post
The only airports Delta still calls "focus cities" are AUS and RDU/Raleigh-Durham. Delta has pretty much mystified us by doing mostly nothing at Austin even though they say "focus city"

Dont know much about BNA/Nashville, but I do know they've been slow to rebuild RDU's Delta schedule. To their credit at Raleigh, I think they're now up to 6 international airlines to Europe, Canada, and the Caribbean, nothing yet to Mexico. I read they just announced Lufthansa and Air France recently took over the Paris flight from Delta.
real estate news places say the housing market at RDU is doing better than AUS in terms of holding value and appreciation, but the office market there is worse off than Austin in terms of coming back after COVID. they are down there with Chicago and San Francisco, not that bad off on the lists, but more negative than most cities. Lots of permanent WFH people there.
Yeah Delta's done nothing beyond offering those two non hub connection routes, but that hardly should be considered a focus city. Hoping they jump at this chance to start anything more substantial before the second concourse is online, especially as they're likely hurting for loyalty in Austin compared to AA and SW.

Referred to those markets more in general of how the legacy airlines are serving them, but yeah RDU is more like AUS than BNA at the moment. If anything it solidifies my stance that this AA cut won't have as major affect on international routes as some project.

Yeah with with WFH still riding strong, it feels like the legacy airlines are confused on if they can succeed domestically by shifting to leisure like they did during the later half of lockdown, or if theres a bounce back to business travel on the horizon.
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  #8896  
Old Posted Nov 13, 2023, 3:42 AM
LightChop LightChop is offline
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Originally Posted by Scuba View Post
Delta has pretty much mystified us by doing mostly nothing at Austin even though they say "focus city."
Delta took a step back and watched while AA sunk a ludicrous amount of capacity into AUS. In AA's effort to thwart Delta they embroiled themselves in a fare war with long entrenched Southwest. Remember in late 21/early 22 when Southwest and AA were announcing new routes and increased frequencies within a day or two of each other?

In the end, American ended up competing against its own DFW hub. Their poor Q3 results likely pushed their decision to cut AUS down. I seriously doubt more than one or two of their non-hub routes will be around by the end of next year.
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  #8897  
Old Posted Nov 14, 2023, 10:22 PM
ATX2030 ATX2030 is offline
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American Airlines' dip in Austin service could mark opportunity for competitors
Several gates may be up for grabs

https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/n...mpetitors.html

By Mike Christen – Staff Writer, Austin Business Journal
Nov 14, 2023

Prime real estate is up for grabs at Austin-Bergstrom International Airport as all airline operators renegotiate agreements to lease gates.

The negotiations are happening as one of the largest airlines that operates from the Austin airport plans to shrink the total number of destinations that it directly serves from the Texas capital, which could create an opportunity for other carriers to fill the void in the coming year. American Airlines Group Inc. (Nasdaq: AAL) earlier this month confirmed it plans to pull 21 of the 46 destinations that are currently offered from ABIA.

The Fort Worth-based airline leases five gates for preferential use — meaning the airline has exclusive rights to use them — and two of the airport’s 11 shared gates, according to airport representatives.

It appears that American Airlines will maintain its agreements until they expire next year, meaning it will continue to have the exclusive rights to five gates. ABIA officials confirmed that negotiations are currently taking place for a new set of agreements for all carriers that are set to take effect on Oct. 1, 2024. It remains undetermined how long the lease agreements would be; however, ABIA representatives said these agreements range from five to 20 years across the industry.

It's unclear whether American will continue to hold the same number of leases when the new agreements take place. Representatives of American Airlines did not respond to requests for comment. If American Airlines decides to lease fewer gates, then an opportunity would open up for another airline to expand at the Austin airport.

ABIA, which has a total of 34 gates, also maintains multiyear use and lease agreements with Southwest Airlines Co. (NYSE: LUV), United Airlines Holdings Inc. (Nasdaq: UAL), Delta Air Lines Inc. (NYSE: DAL), JetBlue Airways Corp. (Nasdaq: JBLU), Spirit Airlines Inc. (NYSE: SAVE) and Alaska Airlines Inc. (NYSE: ALK).

“These use and lease agreements establish airline payments, their rent, fees, charges and calculation methodologies, as well as their use of gates and other airport-owned facilities like office spaces," said Sam Haynes, ABIA’s communications manager. An airline may qualify for a preferential use gate if the airline’s average gate utilization is at least 800 seats or seven departures per day, Haynes said.

ABIA anticipates a 7% decrease in daily departing flights in the months ahead because of American Airlines' cutback in service.

In February 2024, American is set to fly to 33 destinations with an average of 56 daily departures. That is 18 fewer flights per day than during the same month in 2023 when the airline had 74 daily departures, according to scheduling data shared by ABIA.

"It's minimal impact," Haynes said. "We are still busy."

This year, the airport remains on track to surpass the 21 million passengers that passed through the facility in 2022. That means that, even though American is cutting back, demand for flights here is still record-breaking strong.

ABIA recently experienced its busiest day on record on Oct. 23, the day following the annual Formula 1 race at the Circuit of The Americas, when a total of 43,243 passengers were screened through security.

But the scene isn't all rosy at the airport. Virgin Atlantic recently cut a nonstop route from Austin to London, citing a softened tech sector.

Currently, American is the airport's second busiest airline. In 2022, it served about 26% of all passengers in and out of the facility — a total of about 5.4 million passengers. It is only second to Southwest Airlines, which operated about 38% of all flights out of ABIA in 2022, carrying more than 8 million passengers, according to the airport’s monthly activity report.

As Austin's largest passenger carrier, Southwest has been steadily growing its service and accommodations in recent years. It has more than a four-decade legacy of offering flights from Austin.

The Dallas-based airline might be the most likely candidate to use the opportunity to expand its local presence, but representatives are coy about the opportunity when asked publicly.

“Austin became the ninth Southwest city in September 1977 and we’ve worked consistently since to offer a hometown airline schedule that serves Central Texas air travelers, and those who visit the heart of the state through ABIA with an unmatched combination and value and hospitality," stated Brad Hawkins, a spokesperson for Southwest when asked about the possibility of the airline expanding its offerings in Austin. "Across those nearly five decades, other carriers have fallen in and out of love with Austin. Our nearly 1,000 People based around our operation at Bergstrom, and their colleagues around the country are all proud of our consistency of investment in being a faithful community partner in Austin.”
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  #8898  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2023, 5:36 PM
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ILUVSAT ILUVSAT is offline
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Interesting. Another piece of evidence that Virgin's exit from the Austin market is not due to the "tech" sector.

Virgin has delayed (again) its South American launch...

https://aviationweek.com/air-transpo...american-debut


I think the airline is really in financial trouble. We shall see...
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  #8899  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2023, 3:15 PM
Werdman89 Werdman89 is offline
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Jet company JSX leaving Austin-Bergstrom International Airport
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Private jet company JSX is leaving Austin-Bergstrom International Airport and will move operations to Austin Executive Airport next month.

A spokesperson for the public charter operator told KXAN News the move will happen Dec. 14 but declined to comment further.
https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/n...Pos=0#cxrecs_s
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  #8900  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2023, 3:44 PM
drummer drummer is offline
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I've often wondered if some of the smaller companies that operate out of AUS will eventually move out. Is that something on the radar or will they always be there? Thinking of all of the smaller places along Emma Browning Ave.
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