Cities that most radically depart from and most closely resemble "typical" US demos

[Quixote]

Originally Posted by badrunner

It might have "grown up" since '83, but it ain't no scaled down LA. San Diego is a scaled down LA. Austin is a scaled down LA. Phoenix, despite being much bigger than those cities, still has a sleepy suburban feel.

San Diego and Austin (been to both) are nothing like LA.

San Diego is more Downtown and ocean-centric, and is mostly a city/metro of post-war SFH subdivisions built within hills. It's more like a Seattle.

Austin is a pretty typical mid-sized American metro with its downtown area situated along a river. I don't see it being all that different from a Memphis or Nashville.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Quixote

San Diego and Austin (been to both) are nothing like LA.

San Diego is more Downtown and ocean-centric, and is mostly a city/metro of post-war SFH subdivisions built within hills.

Austin is a pretty typical mid-sized American metro with its downtown area situated along a river. I don't see it being all that different from a Memphis or Nashville.

Memphis and Austin feel nothing alike, IMO. But Austin does feel like a smaller L.A. to me.

[JManc]

Austin feels nothing like LA. I would say it's closer to Columbus OH than anywhere else; state capitals anchored by huge flagship universities and healthy economies. I could see where someone would find some similarities between Austin and Nashville though. LA is very decentralized (like Houston) and spread out (also like Houston) where as Austin is more concentrated in its downtown area and sprawls a lot less.

[edale]

Originally Posted by JManc

Austin feels nothing like LA. I would say it's closer to Columbus OH than anywhere else; state capitals anchored by huge flagship universities and healthy economies. I could see where someone would find some similarities between Austin and Nashville though. LA is very decentralized (like Houston) and spread out (also like Houston) where as Austin is more concentrated in its downtown area and sprawls a lot less.

Yes, agreed. Other than hipster stores and restaurants, Austin feels nothing like LA. It's like Columbus meets Nashville.

[badrunner]

Austin is well known as the most West Coast-like city in Texas. The street level experience is very familiar, that's probably why it's a popular destination for transplants from here. Of course, it's nothing like LA in geography or layout, but culturally and politically the similarities are there. Denver is the other one that is often cited as having that West Coast feel and it's also a state capital with a major university. But any comparison will always be a stretch because LA defies easy categorization, it's just such a weird mashup of different eras and influences.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Austin is well known as the most West Coast-like city in Texas. The street level experience is very familiar, that's probably why it's a popular destination for transplants from here. Of course, it's nothing like LA in geography or layout, but culturally and politically the similarities are there. Denver is the other one that is often cited as having that West Coast feel and it's also a state capital with a major university. But any comparison will always be a stretch because LA defies easy categorization, it's just such a weird mashup of different eras and influences.

Yeah, Austin definitely has elements of L.A. I respectfully disagree with anyone who claims otherwise. Is it a dead ringer? Of course not, but there absolutely are similarities. And I've heard enough people say it to know I'm hardly alone in seeing that.

[TexasPlaya]

I can see Austin and LA, however Austin feels like a more scaled down Bay Area (keeping in CA). LA and Houston always seemed cut from the same cloth, the former being on a much grander scale.

[KevinFromTexas]

One thing I notice about Austin that you can tie us to LA is how sun loving we are. It's funny watching the city shut down in bad weather, but this place just hops when the weather is warm and sunny, which is a huge chunk of the year. I saw two girls zipping along on e-scooters today in downtown, and before one of them totally ate it and went over the handlebars after hitting a crack in the pavement or something, (she was ok, by the way), I was sort of reminded of how west coast the image looked of these two girls out and about goofing around on their rented scooters. I ride my bike downtown all the way from South Austin, and sometimes my favorite spots are annoyingly busy. The boardwalk, for example, was really busy last month between those two freak snowstorms we had. I saw people walking and jogging and riding their bikes. There was a girl on her road bike with her dog zipped up in her backpack looking over her shoulder. lol

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by badrunner

It might have "grown up" since '83, but it ain't no scaled down LA. San Diego is a scaled down LA. Austin is a scaled down LA. Phoenix, despite being much bigger than those cities, still has a sleepy suburban feel.

Austin has its own vibe and development pattern. It isn’t a scaled down anything.

Columbus and Nashville have similarities, as do Portland and Sacramento. Denver maybe. Los Angeles... no.

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Austin is well known as the most West Coast-like city in Texas. The street level experience is very familiar, that's probably why it's a popular destination for transplants from here. Of course, it's nothing like LA in geography or layout, but culturally and politically the similarities are there. Denver is the other one that is often cited as having that West Coast feel and it's also a state capital with a major university. But any comparison will always be a stretch because LA defies easy categorization, it's just such a weird mashup of different eras and influences.

Factually, Austin has fewer Californian in-migrants than any other major city in Texas.

http://www.austinindicators.org/2019...ion-on-austin/

Can you please give me some examples of culture and politics that you find similar? Los Angeles is very union driven, dominated by a minority and Jewish liberal elite, whereas Austin is dominated by liberal white corporatists and NIMBYism. Austin is very alternative, hippy, and college culture, with some bro-ishness thrown in for good measure, while Los Angeles is mainstream entertainment, ethnic mosaic, and internationalist/cosmopolitan.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by TexasPlaya

I can see Austin and LA, however Austin feels like a more scaled down Bay Area (keeping in CA). LA and Houston always seemed cut from the same cloth, the former being on a much grander scale.

I can see some similarities between Austin and the East Bay (both Berkeley and Oakland). Downtown Austin might also slightly resemble downtown San Francisco architecturally.

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by wwmiv

Factually, Austin has fewer Californian in-migrants than any other major city in Texas.

http://www.austinindicators.org/2019...ion-on-austin/

Interesting article. It seems that the "California Narrative" is a popular belief among Austinites themselves. Thanks for the local confirmation. Apparently there is something to it.

Originally Posted by wwmiv

whereas Austin is dominated by liberal white corporatists and NIMBYism. Austin is very alternative, hippy, and college culture, with some bro-ishness thrown in for good measure

lol you just described a huge swath of LA. It isn't some cultural monolith. That whole "bro culture" originates in SoCal beach cities. Alternative and hippy? Have you ever been to LA? That's the subculture that I grew up in... back in the 90s. The artsy murals, music festivals and hipster coffee shops (I once heard a popular LA radio station being streamed over the speakers there) in Austin all have a very West Coast vibe. Of course it's no longer unique in that regard, as that stuff is in every city nowadays, but Austin was there 10-15 years ago. That "California Narrative" goes back a ways. It's not something that exists in honkytonk Memphis or Nashville.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by badrunner

It's more like a scaled up Fontana than a scaled down LA.

I got the impression too. Phoenix is closer to the Inland Empire with some better/urban areas thrown in like Tempe, Midtown etc.
But in general, remined me of the Inland Empire.

Residential areas close to downtown/midtown Phoenix reminded me of parts of the SFV, but less busy. I forget their names, but they were within walking distance of the light rail on central avenue.

But like central/West LA? No.

[BnaBreaker]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Interesting article. It seems that the "California Narrative" is a popular belief among Austinites themselves. Thanks for the local confirmation. Apparently there is something to it.



lol you just described a huge swath of LA. It isn't some cultural monolith. That whole "bro culture" originates in SoCal beach cities. Alternative and hippy? Have you ever been to LA? That's the subculture that I grew up in... back in the 90s. The artsy murals, music festivals and hipster coffee shops (I once heard a popular LA radio station being streamed over the speakers there) in Austin all have a very West Coast vibe. Of course it's no longer unique in that regard, as that stuff is in every city nowadays, but Austin was there 10-15 years ago. That "California Narrative" goes back a ways. It's not something that exists in honkytonk Memphis or Nashville.

I'd agree that there isn't really a "California Narrative" in Nashville, but if part of that narrative in your book is hipster coffee shops, music festivals, and artsy murals then perhaps your perception of Nashville needs a refresher, because for better or for worse, it has all of those things in droves, and that 'vibe' is pretty ubiquitous there these days, and has been for quite a few years. But it is a bit more approachable and down to earth there, if that's what you mean by "honkytonk."

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

I'd agree that there isn't really a "California Narrative" in Nashville, but if part of that narrative in your book is hipster coffee shops, music festivals, and artsy murals then perhaps your perception of Nashville needs a refresher, because for better or for worse, it has all of those things in droves, and that 'vibe' is pretty ubiquitous there these days, and has been for quite a few years. But it is a bit more approachable and down to earth there, if that's what you mean by "honkytonk."

I never said those things didn't exist elsewhere. Read what I wrote again. Anyway it's really a matter of degree. We're not talking absolutes here. Culture is hard to quantify in that way, but Texans themselves often remark on the West Coast leanings of Austin. It's nothing new. Nobody says that about Memphis.

And there's really two different questions here that people are confusing. If you asked me to name the cities that most closely resemble Austin, LA would not be on top of my list. There are other cities like Nashville and Columbus that are more similar. But if you asked me to name the cities (outside of CA) that most closely resemble LA, Austin and Denver would be near the top of the list. Of course, the other alpha cities plus maybe Miami and Houston would be on the list as well, but those aren't really "scaled-down" versions of anything, so I'm not counting those. Think about it, what other cities really resemble LA?

[JManc]

Originally Posted by badrunner

It's more like a scaled up Fontana than a scaled down LA.

I mentioned Inland Empire but PHX being a pretty large metro, there were some similarities to the LA area as well. Just less glitzy. At least to me.

[Camelback]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Think about it, what other cities really resemble LA?

Not too many, probably none in the entire world resemble the best known parts of LA. I would say that parts of Phoenix, Las Vegas, San Jose, San Diego, East Bay come close. They're all in the same region. From downtown LA to the Bay and Phoenix is 350 miles. Las Vegas is about 230 and 250 miles away from LA and Phoenix.

Parts of the Valley and parts of the other Valley resemble each other. Also parts of suburban Orange County resemble parts of suburban East Valley of Phoenix. Everything down to the stop lights, curbs, arterials, overhead electrical wires, car culture.
https://goo.gl/maps/goV2DmVNSPk2Pchk9
https://goo.gl/maps/HyP7SGfS8adTu2Qj7
If there weren't labels on the images, then it would be hard to determine which is which.
https://goo.gl/maps/vRJWScz8LUafTSfV7
https://goo.gl/maps/AJA3oZJbNa7Mk3s98

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by badrunner

Think about it, what other cities really resemble LA?

Detroit

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by Camelback

Not too many, probably none in the entire world resemble the best known parts of LA. I would say that parts of Phoenix, Las Vegas, San Jose, San Diego, East Bay come close. They're all in the same region. From downtown LA to the Bay and Phoenix is 350 miles. Las Vegas is about 230 and 250 miles away from LA and Phoenix.

Parts of the Valley and parts of the other Valley resemble each other. Also parts of suburban Orange County resemble parts of suburban East Valley of Phoenix. Everything down to the stop lights, curbs, arterials, overhead electrical wires, car culture.
https://goo.gl/maps/goV2DmVNSPk2Pchk9
https://goo.gl/maps/HyP7SGfS8adTu2Qj7
If there weren't labels on the images, then it would be hard to determine which is which.
https://goo.gl/maps/vRJWScz8LUafTSfV7
https://goo.gl/maps/AJA3oZJbNa7Mk3s98

Yeah I mean you could find similar looking intersections in Texas and Florida as well. Which is to say that the unremarkable suburban parts of sunbelt city A look just like the unremarkable suburban parts of sunbelt city B. No surprises there.

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Detroit

From the 20s to the 60s the urban cores of the two cities probably looked somewhat similar, but they took quite divergent paths in the decades since. I think I once called LA a mashup of Detroit, Miami and Houston on here.

This could be an alternate universe Detroit:

• Video Link