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  #161  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 5:34 PM
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  #162  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 5:53 PM
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I like the proposal even if all of you "architecture as art" buffs say it is an eyesore. I always wanted to have the chance to work on something this size and if these developers keep coming up with these things, I may get my chance.

I think if the legs of this tower had some interesting design to go along with it, this tower would be more widely accepted.
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  #163  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 6:12 PM
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^"Architecture as art" buffs? Architecture is art, what else would it be? No amount of jobs justifies an eyesore along the lakefront.

I'd have to see further, more detailed renderings to make a determination as to whether that's what this building is, but I'm 100% certain I don't want to see it in the location for which it is currently proposed. Fordham Spire is a far superior building, and it's almost certain that both couldn't be built together.
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  #164  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 6:20 PM
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^"Architecture as art" buffs? Architecture is art, what else would it be? No amount of jobs justifies an eyesore along the lakefront.
I'd build an unpainted concrete block in the middle of millenium park if someone paid me to. I just like to see big structures proposed because one day, something will get approved and I'll get the chance to put my name on it.
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  #165  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 6:44 PM
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This was in the Sunday Trib. There was a night rendering of TT to go with it.

ARCHITECTURE

Invention can be a double-edged sword
New approaches to tanks, towers

By Blair Kamin
Tribune architecture critic
Published October 30, 2005


Last week did more than crown the White Sox as the champions of baseball. It proved the continuing validity of Mark Twain's observation about Chicago: "a city where they are always rubbing a lamp, and fetching up the genii, and contriving and achieving new impossibilities."

That spirit of invention was evident in two seemingly unrelated happenings: The City of Chicago's design competition for reusing historic water tanks and the disclosure that developers are proposing a 2,000-foot-tall broadcast tower for the lakefront. The competition produced some fresh and appealing ideas. The developers' plan is innovative, but far less persuasive. Invention, it shows, can be a double-edged sword.

Jointly organized by the city and the Chicago Architectural Club, the water tank competition sought new forms and uses for the rapidly vanishing industrial-age icons. It drew 182 entries from 19 countries and was judged by a 12-member jury headed by Santa Monica, Calif., architect Thom Mayne, this year's winner of the Pritzker Architecture Prize.

The jury wisely bypassed designs that went beyond a simplistic recycling strategy: retaining the historic water tanks, which originally held water for fire protection and manufacturing, and installing new uses inside them -- living quarters for yuppies and the like. It also wasn't seduced by eye candy, like the design that turned water tanks into likenesses of such celebrities as Michael Jordan.

Instead, the jury singled out plans that went down a more sophisticated path: echoing the historic silhouette of the tanks, but transforming them into something new, something that could be reproduced throughout Chicago. This was, as Twain put it, fetching up the genii.

The winner, by little-known Chicago architect Rahman Polk, who works for the firm of Hammond Beeby Rupert Ainge, actually offers a pair of plans.

One, meant to be placed atop the towers where the water tank has been removed, would install a wind turbine in an aluminum drum that echoes the tank's silhouette. Electricity generated by the turbine would power a citywide wi-fi network available to the public. Surplus energy would be routed into the city's electrical grid and credited to the building's owner.

Using a wind turbine

Polk's other design, meant for towers where the water tank remains in place, would use a wind turbine that revolves around the outside of the tank. The turbine would power LED screens attached to the outer surface of the tank's drum. The screens would display moving graphics day and night, an in-the-round version of the Crown Fountain. They might show emergency broadcasts, cultural exhibits, Amber Alerts.

This plan is a three-fer: Retaining the iconic image of the water tanks, conserving energy and providing a dazzling new beacon. Polk asserts that the turbines would be quiet, which would be a key factor in dealing with NIMBYs if the city ever decides to build the design.

There's no guarantee that that will happen, of course. The purpose of the competition was simply to solicit ideas. Still, it's a boon for Chicago when fresh ideas course through the city's architectural bloodstream. It keeps the old town young.

The same vitality is evident in the thoughtful second-prize design by Eric Hoffman of St. Louis, which suggests turning water tanks into bird refuges, and the third-place winner, by Francine LeClercq of New York, who proposes placing outmoded water tanks in a reflecting pool. The plan has a haunting beauty.

While it may seem far-fetched to draw comparisons between the small skyline statement made by the water tanks and the enormous skyline presence of the proposed broadcast tower, something unites them: Like the tanks, the tower represents a new take on an old problem -- how to raise broadcast antennas into the sky.

Olive atop a toothpick

A conventional broadcast tower, like the CN Tower in Toronto, resembles an olive stuck on a toothpick, a giant post with the bulge on the top that houses restaurants and an observation deck. But New Haven, Conn., architect Cesar Pelli and New York structural engineer Charles Thornton are suggesting something more like a tripod, with three pairs of tapering concrete legs and a big empty space between them.

In their plan, prepared for developers J. Paul Beitler and LR Development Co., the legs would form a platform for a so-called "candelabra" of three broadcast antennas. The tower would enable local television broadcasters to upgrade their transmitting systems. It would be located near Navy Pier, between Grand Avenue and Illinois Street on the west side of Lake Shore Drive, just a few blocks north of the proposed 2,000-foot hotel-condo tower by architect Santiago Calatrava. There would be restaurants and an observation deck near the top, parking at the bottom.

If you read Tuesday's paper, you know that I'm no fan of this plan. It's a cartoonish vision of the future. Its massive concrete legs utterly lack the grace of the Eiffel Tower's steel lat-icework.

So why not use the water tank competition as a model for articulating the future of broadcast towers in Chicago? Summon architects and let them have at it.

Is there a better site for a freestanding tower? Why even build a freestanding tower? Why not simply renovate the existing antennas at Sears Tower and the John Hancock Center? Could different materials (steel rather than concrete) produce a better result?

Fortunately, Chicago's officialdom isn't giving this plan the same embrace it accorded Calatrava's twisting tower. Asked about the broadcast tower by the Tribune's Gary Washburn, Mayor Richard M. Daley had this to say: "I am not in favor of it or against it." Other proposals are expected, Daley said.

Good. That means there's time to mull alternatives -- and time to solicit the best possible designs.

How about if the city follows its own example and re-does its exemplary ideas competition for water tanks, this time as an ideas competition for the broadcast tower? Let the best minds win rather than simply doing what's expedient. When we rub the lamp, we want the genii to be breathtaking.

----------

bkamin@tribune.com
     
     
  #166  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 7:18 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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Originally Posted by kayosthery
I'd build an unpainted concrete block in the middle of millenium park if someone paid me to. I just like to see big structures proposed because one day, something will get approved and I'll get the chance to put my name on it.
^That's too bad.

You'd want your name on a piece of crap?

There's famous, and then there's infamous. The latter one is undesirable
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  #167  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 7:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2PRUROCKS!
This was in the Sunday Trib. There was a night rendering of TT to go with it.
Can anyone scan it please? I'd like to see this.
     
     
  #168  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 8:42 PM
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Originally Posted by the urban politician
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayosthery
I'd build an unpainted concrete block in the middle of millenium park if someone paid me to. I just like to see big structures proposed because one day, something will get approved and I'll get the chance to put my name on it.
^That's too bad.

You'd want your name on a piece of crap?

There's famous, and then there's infamous. The latter one is undesirable
I think we can all agree that The Sears Tower is a great building and many people like the way it looks and appreciate its architecture. Does anyone remember who built the thing.... without looking it up on the internet... Didn't think so!

To be a part of a building as tall as this one proposed is what I'm interested in. This thing would have a set of engineering challenges all its own that anyone could be proud to have worked on or taken part in. I'm not an architecture "guy", I'm a construction worker turned manager and I like to build them, the bigger the better.

Don't get me wrong, I would be equally as happy to work on a building deemed an architectual wonder or masterpiece. Those are few and far between though and I'll have to settle for the shish-ka-bob skewer for the time being!
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  #169  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 9:29 PM
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^Do you mean, who built it or who designed it?

Yes, I know both, right off the top of my head. What real skyscraper fan wouldn't?
     
     
  #170  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 9:57 PM
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I might be wrong but I believe that Adrian Smith of SOM designed it for the Sears Corp and I didn't look that up.
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  #171  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:14 PM
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The main inspiration behind Sears Tower was engineer Fazlur Khan, who designed its "bundled tube" system. He was part of a SOM team lead by Bruce Graham. And yes, I remembered that off the top of my head.
     
     
  #172  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:16 PM
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Yup.
     
     
  #173  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:28 PM
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^ You guys are totally missing his point. Obviously we all know who designed it, what firm he was at. but who BUILT the thing?
     
     
  #174  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by VivaLFuego
^ You guys are totally missing his point. Obviously we all know who designed it, what firm he was at. but who BUILT the thing?
Giant Ants.
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  #175  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayosthery
I'd build an unpainted concrete block in the middle of millenium park if someone paid me to. I just like to see big structures proposed because one day, something will get approved and I'll get the chance to put my name on it.
Well thank god you have neither the financial resources nor the power to get such things approved...

And why, exactly, would you want your name on an eyesore anyway?
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- Nicolai Ouroussoff, New York Times
     
     
  #176  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayosthery
I think we can all agree that The Sears Tower is a great building and many people like the way it looks and appreciate its architecture. Does anyone remember who built the thing.... without looking it up on the internet... Didn't think so!
The architect was Bruce Graham and the engineer was Fazlur Khan... and I've been able to tell people that off the top of my head since I was 8 years old. That pairing also produced the John Hancock Center, and one of the two buildings can be found in just about every book of 20th century architecture or engineering.

Don't blame us for your ignorance of design.
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"Architecture is the art of balancing values: economic, aesthetic, public, private. It always involves compromise, and few architects would deny that the client's desires take precedence. But the best architects understand that they also have an obligation to the public welfare, no matter who is paying their bills. That often means investing time in educating clients rather than simply acceding to their desires."

- Nicolai Ouroussoff, New York Times
     
     
  #177  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2005, 10:59 PM
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The reporter Kamin above was comparing the tower to the grace of the Eiffel tower.

What a foolishly irresponsibly muttered statement!

The Eiffel Tower was considered an eyesore back then by the Parisians and was to be dismantled but fortunately those plans did not go through.

He is one of a long line of critics who may deride Caesars Palace in Las Vegas because it lacks the artistry of the Roman Coloseum in Rome.

This tower may go through revisions and time will tell how it is received. The world doesn't just revolve around buildings with multiple floors such as hotels and office towers. Many of them are boring boxes.

The skyline of Chicago won't continue to look the same forever and new ideas come to play. Nothing wrong with a tower in that city. A tower can look a bit different and can be artistic. It is for the general public. Observatories on top of office buildings don't make for the best observatories.

This tower will provide the highest vantage point to view off in Chicago and also a vantage point different than Sears.

Too many people are afraid of change.
     
     
  #178  
Old Posted Nov 1, 2005, 12:39 AM
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Here's one for you:

If you had the choice, which would you rather have? (ONLY pick from these options):

Current Tall Tower @ 2000 ft



OR


Former Miglin-Beitler Skyneedle @ 2000 ft



Both by Pelli and involved Beitler, one in 1988ish and one in 2005.
     
     
  #179  
Old Posted Nov 1, 2005, 2:59 AM
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One is practical and one is not. I think most would like the needle better, though.
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  #180  
Old Posted Nov 1, 2005, 3:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyguy
Here's one for you:

If you had the choice, which would you rather have? (ONLY pick from these options):

Current Tall Tower @ 2000 ft



OR


Former Miglin-Beitler Skyneedle @ 2000 ft



Both by Pelli and involved Beitler, one in 1988ish and one in 2005.
We wouldn't be comparing apples with apples. One is an "antenna" with very limited extra use and the other one is actually a skyscraper. The only thing they share in common is the fact that they're tall and slender.
Of course if we had to pick either one, most people would probably pick the skyscraper but we're talking about two totally different things.
As I mentioned in my last post...I don't think we have detailed enough renderings to form an opinion at this point, but I don't think that having a very tall antenna like this in Chicago is necessarily a bad thing. The one thing I like about this antenna is that it doesn't really look like any other famous antenna in the world, whether is CN Tower in Toronto, the Space Needle in Seattle or Sidney Tower in Sidney.
I will say though that I'm not totally sold on the location where they want to build it and in this respect I agree with Chi-town. I think the Fordham Spire would look better on its own.
We'll see!
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