2 Robinson Ave | 2x89m + 2x102m | 2x28f + 2x32f | Approved

[phil235]

Originally Posted by LeadingEdgeBoomer

Re: The Sandy Hill Arena.

The Arena is old and energy inefficient. The City has long said that it wanted to get rid of/replace it. However, the land the arena sits on belongs to the NCC and is leased to the City. Sources at uOttawa have told me (I am a donor to Gee-Gee Sports) that the NCC has agreed to transfer/sell the land to uOttawa when uOttawa is ready to build a new Athletic Center on it (to replace the aging substandard Montpetit Hall). At the snail's pace that the university is gathering the resources for building an Athletic Center, it is still pretty far away.

Just for context, the city has used the "old and inefficient" argument as a pretext for getting rid of all of their single pad arenas in central areas. Sandy Hill Arena is actually in quite good shape and is probably the nicest rink in central Ottawa. It is identical to Kilrea Arena in Alta Vista (both built in the 70s I believe), which recently received a large investment in the form of a covered outdoor rink adjacent to the arena. If we saw fit to invest in that arena, not sure why Sandy Hill has been tagged as not viable.

It's really unfortunate that these true community rinks that are properly integrated into communities are endangered, and the only replacements are suburban-style multiplexes that are not accessible to those living in the central city.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by phil235

Just for context, the city has used the "old and inefficient" argument as a pretext for getting rid of all of their single pad arenas in central areas. Sandy Hill Arena is actually in quite good shape and is probably the nicest rink in central Ottawa. It is identical to Kilrea Arena in Alta Vista (both built in the 70s I believe), which recently received a large investment in the form of a covered outdoor rink adjacent to the arena. If we saw fit to invest in that arena, not sure why Sandy Hill has been tagged as not viable.

It's really unfortunate that these true community rinks that are properly integrated into communities are endangered, and the only replacements are suburban-style multiplexes that are not accessible to those living in the central city.

Part of the issue is that single pad rinks are inefficient when it comes to things like ice machines and zambonis. A multiplex with multiple sheets of ice can be serviced either by the same number of machines/zambonis or by a slightly increased amount. Servicing two sheets with the same equipment is more efficient than just one, etc. It's why single pads aren't really built new anywhere anymore.

The loss of local, inner-city rinks speaks more to where the sport of hockey is these days than anything else. It's mostly a sport for upper-middle class suburbanites, or is moving more in that direction.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

I would love a reimagining of the entire highway interchange and road network. So much wasted land.

There's no need for Colonel By and Nicholas to do the exact same thing for nearly a kilometre, and also for Colonel By and Queen Elizabeth to do the same thing as each other just on opposite sides of the canal. A road diet is in order.

[Dzingle Bells]

Originally Posted by JHikka

There's no need for Colonel By and Nicholas to do the exact same thing for nearly a kilometre, and also for Colonel By and Queen Elizabeth to do the same thing as each other just on opposite sides of the canal. A road diet is in order.

i was looking at this, this morning.

get rid of nicholas from the 417 to laurier and replace it with a linear urban park.

east bound off and on ramp for the highway can be accessed from lees avenue which already exist.

keep the west bound off ramp where it is but remove the portion that connects to nicholas.

west bound on ramp could stay where it is but could tighten up a bit.

a huge amount of open space would be created and a few pretty nice development parcels. way better financial use of land right next to an LRT station then a highway off ramp.

edit - also sorry mods, i realize we are getting off topic. feel free to send us to a new thread!

[phil235]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Part of the issue is that single pad rinks are inefficient when it comes to things like ice machines and zambonis. A multiplex with multiple sheets of ice can be serviced either by the same number of machines/zambonis or by a slightly increased amount. Servicing two sheets with the same equipment is more efficient than just one, etc. It's why single pads aren't really built new anywhere anymore.

The loss of local, inner-city rinks speaks more to where the sport of hockey is these days than anything else. It's mostly a sport for upper-middle class suburbanites, or is moving more in that direction.

Yes multi-plexes are more efficient in terms of staffing/zambonis, but the Kilrea example that I gave shows how those efficiencies can be gained pretty easily without losing a community rink. The multiplex is kind of the big box mentality of efficiency - outsource the inefficiencies to the users, such as making everyone drive much farther. It's also pretty inconsistent with the 15-minute neighbourhoods that we purport to be working towards. If we say that model, then we should be ready to invest in it.

On your second point, I don't really think that is the reason this is happening. First, community rinks are used for a lot more than hockey - lessons, figure skating, city programs etc. And second, most of the rinks we are talking about (Sandy Hill, Brewer, McNabb, Tom Brown) serve affluent areas that include the Glebe, Old Ottawa South, Wellington West, Westboro, so it's not that users with money don't exist in those places. But lastly and more importantly, how is it good policy to deprive less affluent areas of facilities while moving those to the suburbs where there is more money?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by phil235

Just for context, the city has used the "old and inefficient" argument as a pretext for getting rid of all of their single pad arenas in central areas. Sandy Hill Arena is actually in quite good shape and is probably the nicest rink in central Ottawa. It is identical to Kilrea Arena in Alta Vista (both built in the 70s I believe), which recently received a large investment in the form of a covered outdoor rink adjacent to the arena. If we saw fit to invest in that arena, not sure why Sandy Hill has been tagged as not viable.

It's really unfortunate that these true community rinks that are properly integrated into communities are endangered, and the only replacements are suburban-style multiplexes that are not accessible to those living in the central city.

Hopefully, a new uOttawa sports complex would include an ice rink that is accessible to the public when they don't use it. Hope the City and the Sens can work on a new Tom Brown arena at Bayview.

But yes, the City works really hard to empty out the core. Bernard Grandmaître arena in Vanier is being used as a shelter. There's not other space the City could have used?

Originally Posted by JHikka

There's no need for Colonel By and Nicholas to do the exact same thing for nearly a kilometre, and also for Colonel By and Queen Elizabeth to do the same thing as each other just on opposite sides of the canal. A road diet is in order.

Originally Posted by Dzingle Bells

i was looking at this, this morning.

get rid of nicholas from the 417 to laurier and replace it with a linear urban park.

east bound off and on ramp for the highway can be accessed from lees avenue which already exist.

keep the west bound off ramp where it is but remove the portion that connects to nicholas.

west bound on ramp could stay where it is but could tighten up a bit.

a huge amount of open space would be created and a few pretty nice development parcels. way better financial use of land right next to an LRT station then a highway off ramp.

edit - also sorry mods, i realize we are getting off topic. feel free to send us to a new thread!

Before we do anything to Nicholas, we need to build an east-end bridge to remove the trucks. For now, I would support removing Colonel By Drive in its entirety.

I've made my case in the past about Queen E. being a good medium term solution for transit to the Glebe and Lansdowne Park.

I would move these posts, but not sure if they should go in City of Ottawa, NCC, Roads and Bridges or somewhere else.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Hopefully, a new uOttawa sports complex would include an ice rink that is accessible to the public when they don't use it. Hope the City and the Sens can work on a new Tom Brown arena at Bayview.

Yeah, those scenarios are likely our best hopes, as the City seems unwilling to spend the money to even maintain the number of central rinks set out in its recently published recreation plan. Neither would perform quite the same function as a community rink though.

[LeadingEdgeBoomer]

Originally Posted by phil235

Yeah, those scenarios are likely our best hopes, as the City seems unwilling to spend the money to even maintain the number of central rinks set out in its recently published recreation plan. Neither would perform quite the same function as a community rink though.

I doubt that the university has another ice pad in mind for the new athletic complex. The first prority is to replace Montpetit Hall.It would eventually be torn down to make space for future buildings. So the new complex would contain improved gyms for court games like b-ball and v-ball;a competiton size swimming pool and a High Performance Training Center and a Sports Medicine unit. Might they do a 3P with a developer putting a tower above a podium that contains the Athletic Complex? It would be close to the high rises at 2 Robinson.

The idea of attaching a field house with an indoor track has been floated, but I do not know if they can fit that in. The university still has not said what they will do with 1 Robinson, and empty site that the university now owns.

The Campus Master Plan included the possibility of building a dock and boathouse on the river at Lees (page16) in order to develop a top notch rowing club at uOttawa. Maybe some day, but probably not soon.

[LeadingEdgeBoomer]

It looks like uOttawa is trying to make a deal with the developer to include student housing---plus a fitness and wellness recreation center at 2 Robinson.

I found this notice of intent on Merx.

UNIVERSITY OF OTTAWA – NOTICE OF INTENT # 2019061-NOI – Student housing and wellness recreation and fitness facilities.

NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN by the UNIVERSITY OF OTTAWA (the “University”) of its intention to enter into direct contract negotiations for the provision of student housing and wellness recreation and fitness facilities with one supplier:

PLACE DORÉE REAL ESTATE HOLDINGS INC
88 Albert Street, Ottawa, ON, K1P 5E9

Further to the University’s issuance of its Request for Information 2019061-RFI on October 2rd, 2019 for student housing and wellness recreation and fitness facilities, the University has determined that Place Dorée Real Estate Holdings Inc, also doing business as 2 Robinson Property LP, is the only known acceptable supplier capable of satisfying the University’s procurement requirements and desired result as described in the RFI.

The University has decided not to call for a request for proposals or competitive process for the following reasons:

Place Dorée Real Estate Holdings Inc is the owner of the land known municipally as 2 Robinson Avenue, Ottawa ON, located in close proximity to the University of Ottawa’s main campus, consisting of approximately 246,376 square feet and 1 million square feet of development potential which could include student housing (land is zoned for residential use), wellness recreation and fitness facility and enhances the University’s vision for the development at the south end of the University’s main campus, connecting to the University’s 200 Lees campus.

Place Dorée Real Estate Holdings Inc. is experienced in mixed use projects (combined residential uses and large-scale commercial uses) that would allow 2 Robinson Ave to be developed into a project consistent with the University’s need for student housing and wellness, recreation and fitness facilities.

**Project type: PLlase note this document is being posted as an NOI and not an ACAN - the selection dropdown didnt include the NOI and as defaulted to ACAN.

For more information, please order full document from Merx

[Harley613]

I'm sure this development will rise at the same time as they tear down the Marchand, Stanton, and Thompson towers as well as the low rises along King Edward. This looks like a direct replacement for the old stock that is slated for demolition in the University's plan.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by LeadingEdgeBoomer

I doubt that the university has another ice pad in mind for the new athletic complex. The first prority is to replace Montpetit Hall.It would eventually be torn down to make space for future buildings. So the new complex would contain improved gyms for court games like b-ball and v-ball;a competiton size swimming pool and a High Performance Training Center and a Sports Medicine unit. Might they do a 3P with a developer putting a tower above a podium that contains the Athletic Complex? It would be close to the high rises at 2 Robinson.

The idea of attaching a field house with an indoor track has been floated, but I do not know if they can fit that in. The university still has not said what they will do with 1 Robinson, and empty site that the university now owns.

The Campus Master Plan included the possibility of building a dock and boathouse on the river at Lees (page16) in order to develop a top notch rowing club at uOttawa. Maybe some day, but probably not soon.

Like the idea of a dock. Field houses are becoming pretty standard at big schools, so hopefully they find a way to make it work. There would be no shortage of potential community users for that.

I was wondering why the university could justify a third ice surface. That said, from the city’s perspective, replacement of Sandy Hill should be a condition of getting the site.

[LeadingEdgeBoomer]

Originally Posted by phil235

Like the idea of a dock. Field houses are becoming pretty standard at big schools, so hopefully they find a way to make it work. There would be no shortage of potential community users for that.

I was wondering why the university could justify a third ice surface. That said, from the city’s perspective, replacement of Sandy Hill should be a condition of getting the site.

I doubt that replacement of Sandy Hill Arena is a condition of getting the site. The City does not appear to want to do so and they do not own the land, the NCC does--and talking to peeps at uOttawa, they seem sure that they have a deal to get the NCC land. The uni will need all the available land if they ever build a Field House, along with the b-ball courts and pool complex. A field house has a big footprint.

So, in the coming years you could have the Minto Sport Complex with a new Athletic Center (with or without a field house) across the street. Next to it, 2 Robinson with a student residence and fitness and recreation facilities for the general student population. Across the highway you have Gee-Gees Field and the winter Dome. I hope they develop better pathways to connect these athletic facilities.

Harley wrote:

I'm sure this development will rise at the same time as they tear down the Marchand, Stanton, and Thompson towers as well as the low rises along King Edward. This looks like a direct replacement for the old stock that is slated for demolition in the University's plan.

Montpetit Hall and The Jock Turcot University Center will eventually go too. That opens up a lot of space in the center of the campus. A larger modern Uni Center would surely be one of he first things they would want to build. The idea of having recreation and fitness facilities, in or near a new residence at 2 Robinson is something they might want to do with any future new residences and a new uni center. These satelite recreation sites would serve the general
university community, while the facilities on Mann Avenue would also serve Varsity teams and elite athletes.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by LeadingEdgeBoomer

It looks like uOttawa is trying to make a deal with the developer to include student housing---plus a fitness and wellness recreation center at 2 Robinson.

I found this notice of intent on Merx.

If this comes to pass, might as well tie in the redevelopment of the Sandy Hill arena for a massive sports complex podium. Hope they can still fit some basic retail services to serve the thousands of students who will live there.

[SL123]

Brownfield Grant Application Approved
https://pub-ottawa.escribemeetings.c...ab=attachments