Regina's Multi-Purpose facility

[Migs]

Originally Posted by trueviking

as of now, neither does regina.

has the federal government been formally presented with the private funding as part of the request for financing?

Yes. That is a part of the process of the P3 application. Mr Cheveldayoff has stated several times that he is in constant communication with program officials as well as our local MP's giving them constant updates.

[Migs]

Originally Posted by trueviking

until it is announced, i will maintain my skepticism that the natural resource sector, the real estate industry and entertainment industry are going to pony up 10 figures for a football stadium. I do not see what their return on investment is.

For just a football stadium, I can see your point. For a multipurpose entertainment centre and urban revitilization project, that might be different. And given that you are in Winnipeg its not surprising that you don't understand the PR blitz that has been occuring in this province in regards to the potash industry.

That said, I too am anxious to see how it all plays out....

[thefourthtower]

Finance Minister Jim Flaherty makes a stop in Regina meeting with Saskatchewan businessesQuickly talked about funding for a new stadium and supporting another summer of storms

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ShareThisReported By Natalie Geddes
Posted January 19, 2011 - 1:23pm

The man who runs the country's wallet, federal finance minister Jim Flaherty, was in Regina Wedneday.

A number of Saskatchewan businesses have the ear of the minister during his fourth stop on a pre-budget tour.

The minister allowed media just a few questions before he went into the meeting with local organizations.

When asked if his ministry could support another summer of storms, he said the budget does have some flexibility and if they have to come to the aid of farmers in a disaster situation than they are able to do so and will do so.

As for funding for a new stadium in Regina, Flaherty said his ministry is curretly reviewing both their funding program and Saskatchewan's application. Reiterating a point made before by the Prime Miniser, with so many cities in Canada looking for help building a stadium of thier own the fed's need to be fair to everyone. 980 news

Flaherty was also meeting with his provincial counterpart, Saskatchewan finance minister Ken Krawetz.

[Bdog]

Originally Posted by Migs

ps, here is another little rumour I heard yesterday on coffee row (from a source not as 'in the know' as some of the others). Given that the PM hinted at a future program there is the possibility that our indoor facility will be constructed with the capability of adding a retractible roof at a later time. Crazier things have happend, I'm loving watching this whole drama play out

I realize that this is just a rumour, but how would a scenario like this work?

If corporate support is contingent on this being a year round facility; and,
If federal support is contingent on this not being just a football stadium,
then how could any plan that adds a roof later even be considered an option?

Wouldn't this just be the equivalent of building an outdoor stadium?

[Ruckus]

Originally Posted by Migs

Mr Cheveldayoff stated in a recent interview that he couldn't name names but hinted that the private sector contribution is coming from the natural resource sector, the real estate industry, entertainment industry, as well as corporate contributions (ie naming rights for the stadium/the roof/public squares/ped bridges as well as the donation from the hotel association and possible links to the tourism industry). Also in play is a 25year home lottery and other initiatives like a wall of fame brick purchse and bond purchasing/donations.

Just curious, are public realm improvement costs factored into the $430 million? Did the stadium study meaningful discuss those elements? (It's been awhile since I read that report)

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by Migs

For just a football stadium, I can see your point. For a multipurpose entertainment centre and urban revitilization project, that might be different. ....

yes of course migs...what i meant to say was that there are almost no examples of 35000 seat multi purpose facilities that were effective catalysts for urban renewal....their scale and intensity of use is not congruent with that goal....more often than not they are catalysts for parking lot development.

if you can provide an example otherwise, i'd love to research how they did it.



forgive me migs, but after a year of your confident proclamations not materializing, i will hold off until there is at least one other source for your claims.

i am confident they will build something.....i am personally skeptical that it will be the most expensive new stadium in canadian history....the issue is mainly the claims that you have been boasting here for so long.

its not even that you have inside information....its the unprecedented nature of almost everything you claim that makes it difficult to believe until it is announced by someone else....even if one or two of these issues were to materialize it would be amazing.


you have claimed the city of regina will pay an incredible sum of $75m.

you have claimed the feds will contribute $150m contrary to every statement they make and every historic precedent.

you claim casino revenues will be given to the project, despite there being no political debate over such a controversial idea.

you have claimed that $150m-$200m has been secured in private financing including an unbelievable charitable donation of $100m plus, given as a public relations gesture from the potash industry.....yet, they seem to not want to publicize their PR gift, as it is all being kept a total secret.

you have claimed that even if the feds do not contribute there is a magic cheque of $200m from somewhere waiting there to fill the gap....and if they dont need it it will just go back to where it came from.

you have claimed that they are telling the feds that they have secured 25% private financing when the minister himself speaks about it as a hypothetical amount that they 'are confident they can find'.

you have claimed that they have most of the money secured already, yet for some reason, they do not see the political advantage in announcing it to leverage public pressure on the federal contribution.



i wrote that line by line 'cause i know you will respond to each sentence....just making it easier for you.

[Migs]

Originally Posted by trueviking

yes of course migs...what i meant to say was that there are almost no examples of 35000 seat multi purpose facilities that were effective catalysts for urban renewal....their scale and intensity of use is not congruent with that goal....more often than not they are catalysts for parking lot development.

Office for Urbanism disagrees with you. If you don't think its a good idea putting a year round entertainment facility in a 30acre vacant portion of land right beside downtown is a good idea, well that is your problem, not mine.

http://www.cicorp.sk.ca/assets/Docum...0Design%20.pdf

if you can provide an example otherwise, i'd love to research how they did it.

Off the top of my head, I think they have recently build brand new football and baseball stadiums beside downtown in both Seattle and Pittsburgh. (perhaps they are trying to kill their downtowns ) Also PAVCO must be crazy spending hundreds of millions of dollars renovating their downtown stadium that is located across the street from their downtown arena. lol. But seriously those are questions you should forward to Office for Urbanism. I am sure they'd love to respond.

forgive me migs, but after a year of your confident proclamations not materializing, i will hold off until there is at least one other source for your claims.

For someone like yourself who proclaims to know so much about the construction industry, you should also be aware of very common things called delays and due diligence. And if you are so concerned with the delays, contact Mr Fiacco, Mr Cheveldayoff, Mr Wall, Mr Scheer, Mr Hopson, and Mr Likuwski and I am sure they will once again state the same reasons for the delays that I did. Either way, a final date of the end of February has been set to make a final decision as to whether or not to proceed with the original plan. (I know you folks in Winnipeg can only go by what you read in the media, myself I actually live in this city and am aquantances with some of the principal players, do the math)

i am confident they will build something.....i am personally skeptical that it will be the most expensive new stadium in canadian history....the issue is mainly the claims that you have been boasting here for so long.

see above.

its not even that you have inside information....its the unprecedented nature of almost everything you claim that makes it difficult to believe until it is announced by someone else....even if one or two of these issues were to materialize it would be amazing.

Its funny you say that as the majority of things I state are exactly the same as the minister in Charge of this project? Weird how that works hey? Other than the fact I've heard 'off the record' that they are going to go ahead with or without the Feds, most of my claims are already on the record by stakeholders involved in the project.

you have claimed the city of regina will pay an incredible sum of $75m.

That was merely my opinion after somebody asked what I thought the funding formula might look like. Go back and read my statement for yourself.

you have claimed the feds will contribute $150m contrary to every statement they make and every historic precedent.

Huh? Do the simple math, the province is asking the feds for 20-25% of the pricetag (which is less than 150mil) and have stated several times that they'd accept less. Never once did I say the Feds would pony up $150mil for this project. The ironinc thing is that you say my claims are unbelieveable and then you pull things out of the air that were never stated to begin with.

you claim casino revenues will be given to the project, despite there being no political debate over such a controversial idea.

OK now this is getting ridiculous. The provicial govt has stated many many times that their portion of funding would come from Saskatchewan Gaming, which owns Casino Regina. Living in Manitoba, if you have a problem with the province of Saskatchewans decision to use this crown corp to fund its stadium then you obviously have too much time on your hands. Did you have the same concerns about the province of BC using a crown corp to fund its $500mil renos for BC Place stadium? If you are as bored as I think you are, google the mission statement for the Saskatchewan Gaming corp, like many in the govt (and opposition) have stated, its a good fit.

you have claimed that $150m-$200m has been secured in private financing including an unbelievable charitable donation of $100m plus, given as a public relations gesture from the potash industry.....yet, they seem to not want to publicize their PR gift, as it is all being kept a total secret.

Once again you pull things out of thin air. Where did I say that there was $150-200mil in private financing? Do you understand what 25% of $431mil is? Are you saying that Minister Cheveldayoff is lying to the other stakeholders when he says there is 25% in public financing? I wonder how he gets away with putting an imaginary number in an P3 application for Federal funding ? Also do you understand that it might be in a companies best interest to keep their partnership quiet until its actually confirmed to get built?

you have claimed that even if the feds do not contribute there is a magic cheque of $200m from somewhere waiting there to fill the gap....and if they dont need it it will just go back to where it came from.

Magic cheque of $200mil??????? What in the blue hell are you talking about? Grade 3 math, the province is asking the feds for as low as 20% of the pricetag of the project. In Manitoba, does 20% of $431mil really equal $200milllion? Wow.

you have claimed that they are telling the feds that they have secured 25% private financing when the minister himself speaks about it as a hypothetical amount that they 'are confident they can find'.

Weird hey that Mr Flaherty (Minster of Finance for the Govt of Canada), who was in Regina yesterday, stated yesterday on the radio that he was very impressed with the private commitment to this project. Maybe he should be calling out Mr Cheveldayoff for using the 25% number publically if its untrue. Just because you weren't there, doesn't mean it didn't happen.

you have claimed that they have most of the money secured already, yet for some reason, they do not see the political advantage in announcing it to leverage public pressure on the federal contribution.

Have you been under a rock?? The province has been putting public pressure on the feds for months. Another disadvantage of you looking from the outside in I guess.

[trueviking]

you can try to use the fact that i dont live in saskatchewan as an argument to support your ridiculous claims, but until at least one of the things you have said over the past year comes true, your credibility is no better than mine....you claim you have the inside scoop but so far that has been meaningless....5 more weeks until we find out if this is yet another deadline that will come and go.

ever think your 'sources' are telling you what you want to hear?

if the province announced that they indeed have most of the funding in place it would put much more public pressure on the feds to be included....if they actually had 25% of the funding as a private gift, they should announce it to pressure them into publicly justifying why they are not involved.....if all your claims are true but are for some reason being kept a secret then the province needs a lesson in public pressure.

i didnt ask what cities built downtown stadiums...i asked which has been a successful urban development catalyst.....you cant provide one.

yes...pittsburgh and seattle are wonderful examples.....jane jacobs would be proud of this urban character in pittsburgh.....seattle looks the same....and these facilities are used way way more than the regina one will be....any other examples?

[SHOFEAR]

two things:

The irony of TV pointing out the foolishness of migs's "inside scoop" when he has a history of doing the same re the return of the nhl to Winnipeg.

and

TV (and others) pointing out the massive flaws with everything surrounding this project is not much different from what numerous people do re the return of the nhl to winnipeg... except RTD isn't taking it personally and throwing a hissy fit. See RTD, it's nothing personal against any region, just an attempt by somebody who isn't wearing blinders and rose colored glasses to educate and *gasp* present an opposing viewpoint.

carry on...

oh, and for what it's worth just to reiterate something i said many many pages ago, yes, football stadiums in urban areas are a bad idea.

[Bdog]

Surely Migs, you must be joking about downtown stadiums. You saw the picture of Pittsburgh, now here is Seattle's:



But what do we know, we're just simple folk from Manitoba with no understanding of stadiums (sorry, multi-purpose facilities), fiscal realities, or the Regina context (where aparently bidding wars in the tens of millions are taking place between potash companies for naming rights, and the ever-lucrative public opinion). Interestingly enough, it's not just Manitobans who have expressed their conerns here, but many from your own province as well.

Migs has now resorted to a new tactic:

1. Someone asks legitimate questions about the stadium, or the bold claims he has made.
2. Migs responds by saying "I'm only repeating what has been said many times by the key figures" (even though at the time he made the claims, he says it was off the record, secret informant type stuff)
3. Migs ends with "Well, I guess you're calling [insert name here] a liar", whether it's Cheveldayoff, Harper, Office for Urbanism, Scheer, Flaherty, etc.

So, when you said it was a "done deal" last year, who was telling you that? Was it Chevy? Harper himself? Darian Durant?

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by Bdog

Surely Migs, you must be joking about downtown stadiums. You saw the picture of Pittsburgh, now here is Seattle's:



But what do we know, we're just simple folk from Manitoba with no understanding of stadiums (sorry, multi-purpose facilities), fiscal realities, or the Regina context (where aparently bidding wars in the tens of millions are taking place between potash companies for naming rights, and the ever-lucrative public opinion). Interestingly enough, it's not just Manitobans who have expressed their conerns here, but many from your own province as well.

Migs has now resorted to a new tactic:

1. Someone asks legitimate questions about the stadium, or the bold claims he has made.
2. Migs responds by saying "I'm only repeating what has been said many times by the key figures" (even though at the time he made the claims, he says it was off the record, secret informant type stuff)
3. Migs ends with "Well, I guess you're calling [insert name here] a liar", whether it's Cheveldayoff, Harper, Office for Urbanism, Scheer, Flaherty, etc.

So, when you said it was a "done deal" last year, who was telling you that? Was it Chevy? Harper himself? Darian Durant?

Have you ever been to Seattle? Quest Field and Safeco Field (which is next door to the south of Quest are well within walking distance of downtown Seattle. Just to the north of Quest field is Pioneer Square, tons of bars, shops, Pike place etc. The two stadiums complement the downtown area of Seattle.

[Migs]

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

Have you ever been to Seattle? Quest Field and Safeco Field (which is next door to the south of Quest are well within walking distance of downtown Seattle. Just to the north of Quest field is Pioneer Square, tons of bars, shops, Pike place etc. The two stadiums complement the downtown area of Seattle.

Come on VRF, don't bring common sense into the equation.

[Migs]

Originally Posted by trueviking

you can try to use the fact that i dont live in saskatchewan as an argument to support your ridiculous claims, but until at least one of the things you have said over the past year comes true, your credibility is no better than mine....you claim you have the inside scoop but so far that has been meaningless....5 more weeks until we find out if this is yet another deadline that will come and go.

The majority of things that I have said are the same things that key stakeholders have said in the media. Its not my problem you can't distinquish between the two.

ever think your 'sources' are telling you what you want to hear?

Ever think my sources could be telling me the truth? I guess that is the difference between Manitoba and Sk, most of us choose to look at the glass as half full and take people for their word.

if the province announced that they indeed have most of the funding in place it would put much more public pressure on the feds to be included

Like I said, have you been living under a rock? For months the province has been stating that they are simply waiting on the feds and that all other stakeholders are fully commited. You whine about the delays (when its stated over and over that the delays are b/c of the feds, and then you say we aren't putting pressure on the feds when they have done so every time they've talked to the media on this subject. ((scratching my head))

That said, now if any of those stakeholders aren't commited, don't you think they'd be speaking up? 4 of the 5 stakeholders are on board, give me an example of Hopson, Fiacco, Chevy saying they weren't commited? As far as the private funding, that is still to be revealed. You do realize that it is illegal to apply for federal funding with misinformation? Don't know, maybe you aren't aware of that.

saying that they are not commited to this project.....if they actually had 25% of the funding as a private gift, they should announce it to pressure them into publicly justifying why they are not involved.....if all your claims are true but are for some reason being kept a secret then the province needs a lesson in public pressure.

Who said that the 25% of private funding was a gift? Can you possibly pull any more arguments out of thin air than you already have?

i didnt ask what cities built downtown stadiums...i asked which has been a successful urban development catalyst.....you cant provide one.

yes...pittsburgh and seattle are wonderful examples.....jane jacobs would be proud of this urban character in pittsburgh.....seattle looks the same....and these facilities are used way way more than the regina one will be....any other examples?

The football stadiums in Seattle and Pittsburgh are going to be used more than the one in Regina? Are you sure about that? I guess its only you who are allowed to pass your opinion off as fact, silly stuff tv.

And as far as parking is concerned, look in the pdf from Office for Urbanism. There is plenty of parking available as is and no new parking facilities will be required for the stadium.

[Migs]

Originally Posted by Bdog

Surely Migs, you must be joking about downtown stadiums. You saw the picture of Pittsburgh, now here is Seattle's:

What is your point? Both of those stadiums are beside those cities downtown area, the difference with ours is that we won't need any new parking facilities. Should we list the MANY other cities that have built arenas and stadiums near the downtown cores? Check the OfU pdf and they give many examples of what the plan for parking at the new facilitiy will look like.

But what do we know, we're just simple folk from Manitoba with no understanding of stadiums (sorry, multi-purpose facilities),

You said it, couldn't agree more.

fiscal realities, or the Regina context (where aparently bidding wars in the tens of millions are taking place between potash companies for naming rights, and the ever-lucrative public opinion).

For the millionth time, the Province has stated that we have 25% of private funding in place, where that money is coming from is tba. If you question any of these figures, please feel free to contact Mr Cheveldayoff, Mr Wall, and Mr Flaherty (who yesterday spoke very highly of the private commitment of this project)

Interestingly enough, it's not just Manitobans who have expressed their conerns here, but many from your own province as well.

Other than the Candian taxpayers Federation, please list me some of the organizations or groups in Saskatchewan who are against this project.

Migs has now resorted to a new tactic:

1. Someone asks legitimate questions about the stadium, or the bold claims he has made.
2. Migs responds by saying "I'm only repeating what has been said many times by the key figures" (even though at the time he made the claims, he says it was off the record, secret informant type stuff)
3. Migs ends with "Well, I guess you're calling [insert name here] a liar", whether it's Cheveldayoff, Harper, Office for Urbanism, Scheer, Flaherty, etc.

Fact of the matter is this, the majority of my arguments on these forums are the same words that come from the key stakeholders. You need to ask yourself a simple question, why am I asking Migs these questions when all I have to do is google the email addresses of the key stakeholders and ask them yourself. Maybe its a little easier to question a guy like me when those other guys will likely tell you something you don't wanna hear, doesn't make you a bad person however.

So, when you said it was a "done deal" last year, who was telling you that? Was it Chevy? Harper himself? Darian Durant?

If I told you who my sources were, they wouldn't be sources much longer. Heck even Rod Pedersen was saying alot of the same things I have said about it being a "done deal", perhaps he has the same sources that I do. We live in Canada and you are allowed to believe whatever you wanna believe, c'est la vie.

[Rottie]

Originally Posted by SHOFEAR

two things:

The irony of TV pointing out the foolishness of migs's "inside scoop" when he has a history of doing the same re the return of the nhl to Winnipeg.

and

TV (and others) pointing out the massive flaws with everything surrounding this project is not much different from what numerous people do re the return of the nhl to winnipeg... except RTD isn't taking it personally and throwing a hissy fit. See RTD, it's nothing personal against any region, just an attempt by somebody who isn't wearing blinders and rose colored glasses to educate and *gasp* present an opposing viewpoint.

carry on...

oh, and for what it's worth just to reiterate something i said many many pages ago, yes, football stadiums in urban areas are a bad idea.

Well said. The hypocrasy on these threads is palpable. There is nobody on this forum more passionate or interested in this project than Migs and I believe he's done alot of digging and nosing around for info about it and would tend to believe he knows more than anybody what's going on behind the scenes. Whether it comes to pass is another story but give it time to materialize.

This "debate" as I see it continues to go full circle and it seems as though Migs is just being needled with the same comments. Some folk want proof but this is like a witch hunt. I wonder if it has anything to do with the underwhelming stadium project in Winnipeg for example compared to the overwhelming concept proposed for little old Regina.

[thefourthtower]

Originally Posted by Rottie

Well said. The hypocrasy on these threads is palpable. There is nobody on this forum more passionate or interested in this project than Migs and I believe he's done alot of digging and nosing around for info about it and would tend to believe he knows more than anybody what's going on behind the scenes. Whether it comes to pass is another story but give it time to materialize.

This "debate" as I see it continues to go full circle and it seems as though Migs is just being needled with the same comments. Some folk want proof but this is like a witch hunt. I wonder if it has anything to do with the underwhelming stadium project in Winnipeg for example compared to the overwhelming concept proposed for little old Regina.

i could not said it better , migs puts them in there place every time ,i bet we wont here a peep out of the tr ------ once this is announced they ,just stir the whiches brew for the sake of doing it , never once do you see regina folks trash the winnepeg boards , unless the one posting here is a rider fan hater

[Dalreg]

Originally Posted by thefourthtower

i could not said it better , migs puts them in there place every time ,i bet we wont here a peep out of the tr ------ once this is announced they ,just stir the whiches brew for the sake of doing it , never once do you see regina folks trash the winnepeg boards , unless the one posting here is a rider fan hater

Not even close to putting anyone in their place.... With what hear say and opinions?

I will keep saying it until it happens, put up or shut up. Supposed facts and figures from all types of "officials" Yet not ONE bit of OFFICIAL news in how many months?

If nothing else this thread is good for a laugh or three, watching the spin doctor spin his half truths and opinions

[thefourthtower]

what kind of a person would even say say anything like this , monitor please step in this has become a thread of hate

[cutterp]

Please lock this thread. What a joke.

[thefourthtower]

Originally Posted by Dalreg

Not even close to putting anyone in their place.... With what hear say and opinions?

I will keep saying it until it happens, put up or shut up. Supposed facts and figures from all types of "officials" Yet not ONE bit of OFFICIAL news in how many months?

If nothing else this thread is good for a laugh or three, watching the spin doctor spin his half truths and opinions

this is very much uncalled for i agree close the thread