Winnipeg - Conservative (Right) or Progressive (Left)?

[biguc]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

my problem with the current left, is that everyone must not only respect the new infinitely overcomplicated individual, it must now also be legally protected, funded, and society molded around it. "Everyone just be yourself and be nice" works for me, but we've created a new, untouchable individual with an unlimited spectrum provided it votes left. These same identity warriors can dictate punishment for wrongful use of pronouns by unknown, innocent people, yet see no overreaching when the law is rewritten, and conveniently, the same party they support starts taking more money from people they disagree with in the form of taxes.

They are untouchable...

I think you're ascribing them a power they just don't have. I agree with you that "everyone be yourself and be nice" is adequate. But I'm not seeing the left gain overwhelming legal power. There is a certain set of the left that gets heavy handed, manipulates the court of public opinion to sometimes devastating effect, and can make places like universities insufferable. Real life, though, is not like right wing memesters describe it, with Trudeau passing laws against using gendered pronouns.

The other side of this power equation is that there are still people who aren't nice to people who be themselves. Gay bashing still happens. Trans people regularly suffer brutal abuses. Real-life racists still exist. We don't live in a post-racial, post-gender happyland where all people can be themselves and be nice.

However, Black Block, 1930s style, violent antifascism is not the way towards achieving that kind of society. The shrill whining of millions of 20 year olds on social media who took their first gender studies course can also prove counter productive. The kind of politician who wants to enmesh us all in an impossibly intricate web of legal protection can't help. And those who determine moral culpability for saying or doing racist/sexist shit by party membership (cough NDP) are the worst kind of hypocrite.

But for all that, anyone can get tired of making the same arguments over and over again, and end up resorting to ugly behaviour that will only hurt their cause.

In the case of Alex Jones--or any politicized media--there's also a weird confluence of money and ideas that makes discourse impossible. Alex Jones (or Michael Moore) is never going to change his mind because he's a brand. He's selling being a guy who screams the same thing at his opponents, over and over. Nobody is paying him to have a conversation, so he won't. Once the avenue for a free exchange of ideas closes, coercion is all that's left.

[The Unknown Poster]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

I guess I have to be careful with this response...

If you take a left wing person and have them provoke, he'll get punched in the face, and the media backlash would label the aggressor a nazi. Because Nazi motivations had to be the root.

If a righty gets punched, then the aggressor is just an asshole or idiot. Perhaps some actually get reasonable and acknowledge the quick trigger violence of the new alt-left. There isn't an equally damaging political label to nazi that you can brandish the left aggressor with, so it's a losing battle for any right leaning person when one of their own idiots does something wrong.

Now as a conservative, I'm happy to denounce racism and of course, nazism... a no brainer. But I also am hesitant to accept identity based politics and to base each political thing around race, class, or identity, but rather the individual civilian regardless of identity etc... So to the new left, anyone who disagrees is a potential nazi and charlottseville sympathizer. They are HAPPY to jump to that conclusion.

Why, if there is any reason left, would ANYONE want to damage another person with such vile accusations? Why would anyone WANT that to be true?

Because if these accusation, however wrong, stick, that person's fucked, and they're down one person they disagree with. They lose their good job and any good public image.

A violent lefty gets no such permanent label, spends the night in jail and is back at Wendy's for their shift the next day.

I agree that politics are dangerous if your views outweigh racism, but that's also why many intelligent aggressive alt-lefties are so quick to cry it out... it shuts down the debate... and, as a bonus, might permanently damage the credibility of your political opposite.

None of this justifies Jones, however.

I disagree. Im a conservative so its not blinded by political ideology at all.

There isnt nuance to this.

Are there bad guys on both sides? Sure. Is a protest by KKK, Nazi's and White Nationalists the time to discuss the bad guys on the left? Not remotely.

Watching James Woods desperately search the internet for examples of bad behavior by counter protestors and leftists as if that somehow excuses people marching with Nazi flags is hilariously sad.

When the disagreement is reasonable, we can talk nuance. We can talk about reverse racism and things of that nature. When it's Nazi's, it isnt nuance. it isnt right vs left. Its right vs wrong. And there is only one side. Period.

The alt right are so scared of their position being overwhelmed by reasonable center-right people moving more center or *gasp* left, that they are trying to shout down the condemnation using noise and confusion.

Its the "yeah but" argument. Are the nazi's and KKK bad? Yeah but...look at this black lefty punching a guy. Are white nationals disgraceful? Yeah but...look at this lefty saying cops should be killed.

That is exactly what Trump did. Actually Trump was even less nuanced because he's far stupider than most people. Its egregious.

Its hard to have an intelligent discussion with someone who equates removing a statue of Robert Lee with tearing down a statue of Washington. Is there a time and place for a nuanced discussion? Sure. is it when the Lee statue is surrounded by bigots waving Nazi flags? Um, no.

I try to avoid heavy politics because it never results in quality discussion.

But seriously. Im pretty Right Wing. This isnt right vs left. Not at all. Right vs Wrong. Period.

Too many "rights" holding onto the rope playing an unwinnable game of tug of war. As more and more people let go, the alt right holds on tigher trying to distract everyone else. Just give up. Stop trying to pull everyone into the muck. This crap isnt "right wing" at all. its not conservative values. Its gross. Its a mutation of right wing.

Anyway...

[biguc]

Well put, Unknown.

Originally Posted by WolselyMan

The only people I see racializing Muslims are social justice warriors who think that just because Islam is mostly practiced by brown people, that means anything you say about Islam you say about 'brown people' as well. Forget about the word race. Think ethnicity, and Muslims are NOT an ethnic group. Connecting Islam to race is nothing but a sneaky tactic that the left uses to shield the religion from any possible scrutiny. No idea is above criticism, and no person is below dignity. Do you understand the difference between these two sentences?

"Jets4Life Hates Muslims"
"Jets4Life Hates Islam"

People regularly conflate Muslimhood with being a middle eastern or even south Asian person. Adam Purinton did just that, when he murdered two Indian men believing them to be Iranian Muslims.

Religion has a deep influence on how we determine ethnicity. The history of the Balkans tells us as much.

If you want to debate the virtues of Islam, fine. Go talk to an Imam. Don't go on a message board and declare Muslim refugees to be dangerous and suggest we only accept those from "Christian Africa". That's not a comment against Islam, it's a comment against Muslims.

[JM5]

Originally Posted by biguc

Well put, Unknown.



People regularly conflate Muslimhood with being a middle eastern or even south Asian person. Adam Purinton did just that, when he murdered two Indian men believing them to be Iranian Muslims.

Religion has a deep influence on how we determine ethnicity. The history of the Balkans tells us as much.

If you want to debate the virtues of Islam, fine. Go talk to an Imam. Don't go on a message board and declare Muslim refugees to be dangerous and suggest we only accept those from "Christian Africa". That's not a comment against Islam, it's a comment against Muslims.

You're completely right if you view the world from a viewpoint of cultural relativism - and there's nothing necessarily wrong with that, just as there's nothing technically wrong with islam. Otoh, if you care about your own culture (not necessarily saying that it's moralistically or qualitatively BETTER than others) then you may care about the influx of people into your jurisdiction that don't share your values.

[OTA in Winnipeg]

Today we Muslims face a crisis like never before.

With Saudi Arabia and Qatar at each other’s throats, President Donald Trump making Islamic countries dance like puppets on a string, fanning a Sunni-Shia catastrophe, dictators flexing muscle in Egypt and Pakistan, all I can say to my fellow Muslims is to echo the cartoon character Pogo when he said, “We have met the enemy and he is us.”

Allow me to share with you a quote about the depth of the ossification that has rendered too many Muslim minds irrational, unreasonable and in need of anger management.

In 1974, the Cornell-educated Indian Islamic scholar Hashim Amir-Ali translated the Qur’an and published it in its chronological order, the way it was revealed, as against how it was collated many years after the death of Prophet Muhammad.

He wrote in the preamble:

“The Qur’an is read parrot-like in most Muslim homes. … The religion that passes for Islam today – the Islam of the masses and of the ruling classes in every Muslim country – is the Islam of the Middle Ages and not exactly the Islam of the Qur’an or the Prophet. … The lines of thought laid down a thousand years ago have vitiated the entire course of Muslim thought and history. It is this legacy of the past that has to be faced today.”

http://www.winnipegsun.com/2017/06/1...soul-searching

[Spocket]

Well, given that I myself am somewhere in the middle and consider myself a classical liberal (the kind that actually believes in the principles of liberalism) I think Alex Jones is both a nutcase and not particularly representative of conservatism anywhere.

My entire life I have been witness to the left go from being actually progressive to definitely regressive. The people on university and college campuses shouting in the name of left-wing politics are anything but liberal. They shout down anybody who disagrees with them, try to censor their speech and muzzle all who dissent. I absolutely do not like them and refuse to identify with them. I want them as far as away as possible due partially to their radical views and partially thanks to those radical views being so detrimental to a functioning society. Have we not seen the recent surge of people who actually think that communism is a great idea? Of course they're young and, well, stupid but they must have got their glowing view of it from somebody who really should know better. These guys are morons and they're also rather belligerent. On the other hand, we just saw what may well be the last gasp of the racist right in Charlottesville. I say last gasp but perhaps that's rather premature. It's not premature because those idiots won't do something again. No, rather I think it's premature because the radical left is giving those kinds of people every reason in the world to view the radical right with favor. Alex Jones and his ilk are exactly the kind of idiots they need because he has a platform from which to point down to the radical left and say "See!? I told you so!"

So I certainly wouldn't welcome Alex Jones or anybody who thinks he actually has anything worthwhile to say, I do believe that he has every right to say it. As such, no, I would do absolutely nothing to stop him and I would oppose anybody who tried to stop him.

Incidentally, Winnipeg is a racist city? Fuck off. Yeah, not particularly thought-provoking but I experienced far more racism in the ostensibly "progressive" cities of the east than I ever did in Winnipeg.

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by The Unknown Poster

I disagree. Im a conservative so its not blinded by political ideology at all.

There isnt nuance to this.

Are there bad guys on both sides? Sure. Is a protest by KKK, Nazi's and White Nationalists the time to discuss the bad guys on the left? Not remotely.

Watching James Woods desperately search the internet for examples of bad behavior by counter protestors and leftists as if that somehow excuses people marching with Nazi flags is hilariously sad.

When the disagreement is reasonable, we can talk nuance. We can talk about reverse racism and things of that nature. When it's Nazi's, it isnt nuance. it isnt right vs left. Its right vs wrong. And there is only one side. Period.

The alt right are so scared of their position being overwhelmed by reasonable center-right people moving more center or *gasp* left, that they are trying to shout down the condemnation using noise and confusion.

Its the "yeah but" argument. Are the nazi's and KKK bad? Yeah but...look at this black lefty punching a guy. Are white nationals disgraceful? Yeah but...look at this lefty saying cops should be killed.

That is exactly what Trump did. Actually Trump was even less nuanced because he's far stupider than most people. Its egregious.

Its hard to have an intelligent discussion with someone who equates removing a statue of Robert Lee with tearing down a statue of Washington. Is there a time and place for a nuanced discussion? Sure. is it when the Lee statue is surrounded by bigots waving Nazi flags? Um, no.

I try to avoid heavy politics because it never results in quality discussion.

But seriously. Im pretty Right Wing. This isnt right vs left. Not at all. Right vs Wrong. Period.

Too many "rights" holding onto the rope playing an unwinnable game of tug of war. As more and more people let go, the alt right holds on tigher trying to distract everyone else. Just give up. Stop trying to pull everyone into the muck. This crap isnt "right wing" at all. its not conservative values. Its gross. Its a mutation of right wing.

Anyway...

I'm not sure I disagree with any of this, nor that it directly addressed what I was saying... it's decently removed from what I was saying.

Except that it is nuanced, because although it is right vs wrong, everyone is so quick to throw labels around that a lot of the right wing get lumped in with the "wrong" extremists wrapping themselves in confederate flags and taking racist action. I was simply saying there is a straw man series of consequences that could be worse for someone on the right wing. I'm thinking beyond right and wrong, to of the underlying social/political current here, and how it shapes how everyone behaves or perceives the opposites "wings" going forward... that's my concern as someone right of centre.

It is not a "yeah but" for me, especially with Nazis... a "but" can come off as justification, and that's something I tried to be careful about in my post. Hence, nuance. You may be speaking towards more, but atleast for my post it wasn't supposed to be a "but". I have to strongly distance myself from that.

It's a "yes and". Maybe I could have said it better.

I'm no fan of the alt-right, which, like others, I initially assumed to be more of an unapologetic, uncensored right, before the real ugly core started showing more clearly. Like you, I agree that it is a mutation of right wing that morons have gotten a hold of.

However, the word "right" is in alt-right, and a careless game of word association can suddenly make a reasonable right winger look much worse, because of

1) radical racists
2) unracist but provocateur alt-righters
3) opportunistic radical leftists

People with agendas are happy to take anyone down this path until they arrive at "Nazi", or even skip straight to it. We've all seen an instance or two where a conservative may have shown concern to Trudeau's initial 20,000+ refugee welcome program suring the election only to be instantly declared xenophobic or worse.

If it swings the other way, someone could be called communist but instead of the horrors of Stalin, China, or old East Germany, an arts student waves a Che Gueverra flag to a crowd of cheers.

The other consideration is the audience. James Woods? Do Canadians take him seriously? Milo is HUGE down south, but aside from a few yahoos, up here? While there absolutely are right wing moron counterparts to those on the left, they are further removed from the status quo, in my opinion.

In my opinion, the status quo leans socialist, and towards identity, with little regard to freedom of expression or belief... something that ultimately, still gets strong support from crazy groups like Antifa. So I don't see nearly as much emphasis on their wrongdoing in mainstream media as that of some of the right wingers, because the right has been shouted down as racist before anyone could determine if that was true.

So what we end up with us violence, and the majority, without thinking or recognizing the hypocrisy, says "they had it coming". Not that they're wrong, either...

So yeah, I tried to make some sense beyond the obvious (and clear) right/wrong matters; those are clear. I was speaking to wear Canada leans and how that shapes perceptions based on people's tendencies and the nonsense going on around us these days.

Again, not including Charlottsville in my points. Because that's clearer than day how wrong that is.

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by Spocket

Well, given that I myself am somewhere in the middle and consider myself a classical liberal (the kind that actually believes in the principles of liberalism) I think Alex Jones is both a nutcase and not particularly representative of conservatism anywhere.

My entire life I have been witness to the left go from being actually progressive to definitely regressive. The people on university and college campuses shouting in the name of left-wing politics are anything but liberal. They shout down anybody who disagrees with them, try to censor their speech and muzzle all who dissent. I absolutely do not like them and refuse to identify with them. I want them as far as away as possible due partially to their radical views and partially thanks to those radical views being so detrimental to a functioning society. Have we not seen the recent surge of people who actually think that communism is a great idea? Of course they're young and, well, stupid but they must have got their glowing view of it from somebody who really should know better. These guys are morons and they're also rather belligerent. On the other hand, we just saw what may well be the last gasp of the racist right in Charlottesville. I say last gasp but perhaps that's rather premature. It's not premature because those idiots won't do something again. No, rather I think it's premature because the radical left is giving those kinds of people every reason in the world to view the radical right with favor. Alex Jones and his ilk are exactly the kind of idiots they need because he has a platform from which to point down to the radical left and say "See!? I told you so!"

So I certainly wouldn't welcome Alex Jones or anybody who thinks he actually has anything worthwhile to say, I do believe that he has every right to say it. As such, no, I would do absolutely nothing to stop him and I would oppose anybody who tried to stop him.

Incidentally, Winnipeg is a racist city? Fuck off. Yeah, not particularly thought-provoking but I experienced far more racism in the ostensibly "progressive" cities of the east than I ever did in Winnipeg.

I think that these people are useful, and that violence has to be curtailed.

For whatever reason, a lot of people think that they must pay, or must learn, or must be stopped... they already have their army of morons and aggressive opposition fuels them.

Let Alex or Milo have their speeches, hear what they say, and BAM! That crowd, all those morons? Now you atleast know where people stand, and who you have to watch out for. And because non-violence is normal, some people might actually have dialogue.

Because although A LOT (and this goes unmentioned) of people had many reasonable reasons to vote Trump (or not Hillary), many crazy people shocked the world on election day. They came out of hiding. And this is why the alt-right gained traction... before it became clear how crazy they were, a lot of reasonable conservatives also were in hiding. Little about the Obama Administration inspired people with something to lose professionally/politically to be openly conservative (Texas doesn't count).

If we're not violent, then atleast they're not in hiding and nobody is surprised on election day. Then the world can pursue a reasonable dialogue based on actual circumstances.

[Spocket]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

I think that these people are useful, and that violence has to be curtailed.

For whatever reason, a lot of people think that they must pay, or must learn, or must be stopped... they already have their army of morons and aggressive opposition fuels them.

Let Alex or Milo have their speeches, hear what they say, and BAM! That crowd, all those morons? Now you atleast know where people stand, and who you have to watch out for. And because non-violence is normal, some people might actually have dialogue.

Because although A LOT (and this goes unmentioned) of people had many reasonable reasons to vote Trump (or not Hillary), many crazy people shocked the world on election day. They came out of hiding. And this is why the alt-right gained traction... before it became clear how crazy they were, a lot of reasonable conservatives also were in hiding. Little about the Obama Administration inspired people with something to lose professionally/politically to be openly conservative (Texas doesn't count).

If we're not violent, then atleast they're not in hiding and nobody is surprised on election day. Then the world can pursue a reasonable dialogue based on actual circumstances.

See, and this is exactly where I part ways with the Left. I happen to completely agree with virtually everything Milo says. Mostly because he's saying what I've known for years. It's not a matter of opinion really, it's just uncomfortable facts for people who feel they must ideologically oppose them. He's no worse in his delivery of the truth than anybody else I can name and he's a whole lot more reasonable than a lot.

To be honest, when people cite Milo Yiannopoulis as a source of hate speech and violent rhetoric, I can definitely say that they've never actually listened to what he has to say. Mind you, I shouldn't say that I agree with everything he says because he has, oddly enough, a rather perverse view of homosexuals which I don't agree with at all.

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by Spocket

See, and this is exactly where I part ways with the Left. I happen to completely agree with virtually everything Milo says. Mostly because he's saying what I've known for years. It's not a matter of opinion really, it's just uncomfortable facts for people who feel they must ideologically oppose them. He's no worse in his delivery of the truth than anybody else I can name and he's a whole lot more reasonable than a lot.

To be honest, when people cite Milo Yiannopoulis as a source of hate speech and violent rhetoric, I can definitely say that they've never actually listened to what he has to say. Mind you, I shouldn't say that I agree with everything he says because he has, oddly enough, a rather perverse view of homosexuals which I don't agree with at all.

Well, I definitely support his right to say things, and don't disagree with a lot of it (but definitely disagree with some strongly) but rather how he says it, and why, which is just as much to start a fight as it is to make money or spread the message. Maybe I'm getting soft.

I have no idea about his perverse views of gay people, but isn't he gay?

It does turn out that a larger than expected number of conservative "personalities", whether merely outside the mainstream down to shit-disturbers, are actually gay.

[Jets4Life]

Originally Posted by biguc

If you want to debate the virtues of Islam, fine. Go talk to an Imam. Don't go on a message board and declare Muslim refugees to be dangerous and suggest we only accept those from "Christian Africa". That's not a comment against Islam, it's a comment against Muslims.

I'm sure you have experienced tons of intolerant individuals behaving like this online.

[Roger Strong]

Originally Posted by Jets4Life

I'm sure you have experienced tons of intolerant individuals behaving like this online.

I have. There's no to it, or what you implied in your original edit.

My last interaction with biguc was an ugly disagreement, and I stand by what I wrote. But in this thread I agree with everything he's written so far.

Edit: I agree with everything that's visible. I've been informed that some posts have been removed.

[Jets4Life]

Originally Posted by Spocket

Incidentally, Winnipeg is a racist city? Fuck off. Yeah, not particularly thought-provoking but I experienced far more racism in the ostensibly "progressive" cities of the east than I ever did in Winnipeg.

I've lived in several Canadian cities, and Winnipeg is not the most racist city in Canada. It's a shame Macleans had to stoop so low, without any factual evidence. If anyone does have the impression that Winnipeg is racist, it could stem from the fact that Canada does have a problem with our First Nations people, due to how we treated them in the past, but the only reason it is more pronounced here, is that Winnipeg has, by far, the highest concentration of Native people in a big city, and it is not even close.

I hope some day that things will drastically improve. My suggestion was to build more community centres, recreational facilities, and give the youth of the impoverished areas where there are high concentrations of Native people more extracurricular activities to engage in. This can curtail youth from joining gangs, and substance abuse. Winnipeg has a lot of potential for positive change, with the rapid growth of the city in the last decade.

[windypeg]

Originally Posted by Jets4Life

I've lived in several Canadian cities, and Winnipeg is not the most racist city in Canada. It's a shame Macleans had to stoop so low, without any factual evidence. If anyone does have the impression that Winnipeg is racist, it could stem from the fact that Canada does have a problem with our First Nations people, due to how we treated them in the past, but the only reason it is more pronounced here, is that Winnipeg has, by far, the highest concentration of Native people in a big city, and it is not even close.

I hope some day that things will drastically improve. My suggestion was to build more community centres, recreational facilities, and give the youth of the impoverished areas where there are high concentrations of Native people more extracurricular activities to engage in. This can curtail youth from joining gangs, and substance abuse. Winnipeg has a lot of potential for positive change, with the rapid growth of the city in the last decade.

Maclean's is a rag. They do this with every cover story - the author writes a decent, balanced article, then the editors get their hands on it and slap some outrageous headline that isn't even really related to the article just to sell some magazines. If you read that article without seeing the headline you never would have gotten the impression that the author was arguing Winnipeg is more racist than other places. The article was really about how Winnipeg is the epicentre of a national first nations crisis. I mean, it didnt even discuss other races. How can you definitively declare which city is the most racist if you haven't looked into racism toward black people, muslims, or any group other than indigenous people? Unfortunately it's the catchy headline that sticks. Kind of like how people nationwide still consider us the "murder capital" even when we don't make the top 3 anymore.

[thurmas]

Originally Posted by LilZebra

• Video Link

Alex Jones of Infowars.com just flew (or drove) to leftist city Seattle, Washington.

A young adult spilled what Alex allegedly says was HOT COFFEE on him. Another young adult male called Alex a 'racist'.

Wondering, if AJ were to visit our fair city, how would we treat him?

Is metro Winnipeg as a whole more Left-leaning or is it more Right-leaning?

My guesstimate is that we are a Left-leaning racist city and someone would do the same to AJ as was done in Seattle, Washington.

Alex Jones does not represent most Canadian Conservatives. To paint mainstream Conservatives in the Alex Jones brush is ridiculous, insulting and misinformed.

[Roger Strong]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Alex Jones does not represent most Canadian Conservatives.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by thurmas

To paint mainstream Conservatives in the Alex Jones brush is ridiculous, insulting and misinformed.

In the US it's a different matter. Right now Trump - including his "Alex Jones and Breitbart are the real news" shtick - is by definition mainstream conservatism.

The Republican Party as a whole determined that he best represented them and the country. It wasn't even close. Distant second place Ted Cruz was hardly better, and the others were mostly worse. The religious right supported Trump, and still do. Republicans in Congress make the occasional annoyed sounds, but still support him.

Nor can conservatives claim to have been misled. Absolutely nothing Trump has done since his nomination and election has been out of character with how he acted before.

[Spocket]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

Well, I definitely support his right to say things, and don't disagree with a lot of it (but definitely disagree with some strongly) but rather how he says it, and why, which is just as much to start a fight as it is to make money or spread the message. Maybe I'm getting soft.

I have no idea about his perverse views of gay people, but isn't he gay?

It does turn out that a larger than expected number of conservative "personalities", whether merely outside the mainstream down to shit-disturbers, are actually gay.

But that's the problem with today's left: I can name plenty of people on the left who say a lot worse and do it in a far worse manner but they get a pass for some reason. Hell, I can walk into any university and learn all about how I have to die because I'm white or male or heterosexual but the moment somebody says "Hey...you know, I don't think your statistics are true and frankly, I think you make them up so as to get more attention. You're an asshole." then that's the demon.

As to Milo's stance on homosexuality, well, for one thing, he thinks it's a choice that people engage in just to piss off their parents and to get a thrill. Utter nonsense. And yes, he is homosexual, which is why I find his position on the matter puzzling.

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Spocket

But that's the problem with today's left: I can name plenty of people on the left who say a lot worse and do it in a far worse manner but they get a pass for some reason. Hell, I can walk into any university and learn all about how I have to die because I'm white or male or heterosexual

[RLS_rls]

Winnipeg is fiercely centrist. Winnipegers are conservative people in that they are quite literally conservative with their language, behaviour, consumption etc. There is an aversion to being divisive here I think, and a strong desire for harmony and using (the lowest) common denominators to achieve that harmony. Instead of one group having lots and the other having little let's move things around a bit so everyone gets something they didn't want, that kind of thing. Where does dedication to mediocrity sit on the spectrum?

I don't think Winnipeg is the most racist city in the country. As someone else said that article was really in regards to Winnipeg's aboriginal population. That could have been said about any place in Western Canada because of demographics. Until the federal government changes the way it views and interacts with First Nations I am not sure how much more positive change can be eked out of the current arrangement. I have all sorts of things to say about this but I am too tired to put them in to words and also not that interested at the moment.

I think a lot of people are getting the alt-right all-wrong. Maybe I'm still associating alt-right with creeping 4chan back in the day, where I saw the earliest stages of what would soon become this weird, hideous movement. I'll try to put it in to words. I think it started out as a (mostly male, quite often white, likely middle class) bunch of arrogant, foul mouthed, ill-tempered, generally socially progressive but weak minded and impatient shitheads who mistook vulgar provocations as The Real Truth That Normies Couldn't See. The alt-right used to be a bunch of nerds who thought they knew how things worked and never doubted their superior intellect, as nerds are wont to. A lot of it started ironically I bet, and then turned in to sincerity as it is also wont to.

Today alt-right means something entirely different, but until fairly recently it more resembled (to me) that early stage than whatever the fuck it is now. I feel like there's a dirty secret that a lot of people aren't acknowledging about the alt-right but I'm not sure how to put it in words. To explain what I mean I will say that in the last half dozen years I can think of a handful of moments that, if I had made a different decision that was available to me at the time, I would be just like one of those tiki torch guys from Charlottesville. I believe there are people all over the spectrum who followed the same trajectory as me, and that despite their ideologies are all cut from the same cloth. I think a lot of people just reacted poorly to changes going on in the world and information that was around them and went down this alt-right path. Of course that only explains the origin...after a while it doesn't so much matter how you got there, just that you're doing the wrong thing. I am seeing protests and campaigns and the like from the far right (I say that with hesitation, nothing about this right comes across as conservative) that are so incredibly wicked and hateful, so insane and so incredibly stupid, it leaves me speechless. And I see awful things on the left (" ") as well, but of a different sort. Like everyone is just really stubborn and they've picked the spot on the spectrum where they're digging their heels in. More ego than ideology. I have all sorts of things to say about the other side as well, and tbh I feel more free to talk about it since Trump got in, but that's another post.

Anyway I'm conservative, a member of the CPC even. I did not vote for Scheer and I don't think much of him. I don't think much of conservative discourse in Canada, I am uninspired by it. I'm much more interested in imagining how conservatism might adapt to an entirely different future than our present instead of the usual "spending bad, tax bad, JT bad" approach. This whole Rebel nonsense is embarassing. Conservative views are underrepresented in the media but to give such a shitty, unprofessional network the benefit of the doubt? Yikes, I wrote them off the first time I heard of them.

Big shout out to Biguc and Unknown Poster for their :100 emoji: input, you two are nuanced and insightful and likely easier to understand than whatever I just wrote. Time for bed!

[Spocket]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

Oh really? Would you like to see some pretty standard quotes ?There's more than enough and they're certainly not difficult to find. It's hardly a secret but then, I guess if you agreed with all of it, yeah, of course you'd find no problem with it. Did you get a second helping of the Kool-Aid? Come to think of it, it's a fact that as far as the social sciences and liberal arts are concerned, it's a matter of pride that they're dominated by very much left-leaning professors. Are you seriously denying that? If you're not then obviously you haven't listened to anything they've said. Either way, what is it that you think the feminists, Antifa, and BLM people are out saying and doing? Why don't you read what they've written. You think Antifa is out there with a plan to restructure the world economy and leave peoples' accumulated wealth intact? You think those radical feminists don't really mean all men when they say that all men should die? You think BLM just hate white cops? These movements aren't based in reality or statistical analysis. They're based on how the people who run them perceive their world and how they think it should change to be more agreeable to them.

Don't roll your eyes at me, kid. You could just as easily be rolling your eyes at the people who took one look at the Nazis in '33 and said "These guys are trouble." It's all about the times you live in and in this time, the radicals are gaining ground again. If you're rolling your eyes when people point that out then maybe it's because you're one of the radicals.

Here's a sample from Canada's own Dalhousie University:
http://downtrend.com/robertgehl/coll...an-hating-fits

And here's the standard "All white people are racists" crap:
http://www.intellihub.com/liberal-pr...ist-no-matter/

There's plenty more. In fact, there's a mountain of it.