Perimeter Highway | Winnipeg

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by CoryB

My guess it the delay in closing local access to the north Perimeter involves negotiations with RMs and traffic studies. You could likely cross off a few of them by giving WSP a diamond at Pipeline.

From what I can tell Roser are a lot harder to negotiate with, especially when closing Perimeter access is going to make most the commercial property in their RM less desirable.

It seems silly to me that each RM has the ability to block this process. Can you imagine if that was the case when the US interstate highway system was built? Any highways receiving an upgrade to an Interstate were subject to long drawn out negotiations with every affected county? Pretty sure it didn't play out that way.

This is a provincial highway. The province is the boss here...they should be telling them what and when is happening and give them a time (maybe a year) to get their shit in order.

[esquire]

^ It's been a while since I looked into this, but I'm pretty sure the province has strict control over PTH rights of way and access. If there are in fact any consultations with RMs it's done purely as a courtesy and not because there is any actual obligation on the province's part.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by Reignman

Biff are you able to share the timetable for the south perimeter upgrade?

The RFP for Functional Design should be out hopefully before fall. The earliest we could see construction would be 2019 based on all of the land acquisition and design work required....it will likely be broken into 3 packages.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ It's been a while since I looked into this, but I'm pretty sure the province has strict control over PTH rights of way and access. If there are in fact any consultations with RMs it's done purely as a courtesy and not because there is any actual obligation on the province's part.

Yes, MIT determines what access a Hwy has. The RM's can petition for a change but ultimately have no power.

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Reignman

It seems silly to me that each RM has the ability to block this process. .

They don't, but ignoring them takes political courage.

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Biff

Yes, MIT determines what access a Hwy has. The RM's can petition for a change but ultimately have no power.

For context, the RMs can be dissolved and amalgamated at will by the province. They simply lack courage, no matter the party in power.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by Reignman

It seems silly to me that each RM has the ability to block this process.

[...]

This is a provincial highway. The province is the boss here...they should be telling them what and when is happening and give them a time (maybe a year) to get their shit in order.

It is done more as a courtesy than something heavy handed. It is similar to how expropriations work, you have the tool to use but it is something you try to avoid. The province doesn't want to be responsible for the maintenance and upkeep of access roads but you also can't strand property owners by cutting off access. That means you need to play nice to work out a deal with the RM.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by CoryB

It is done more as a courtesy than something heavy handed. It is similar to how expropriations work, you have the tool to use but it is something you try to avoid. The province doesn't want to be responsible for the maintenance and upkeep of access roads but you also can't strand property owners by cutting off access. That means you need to play nice to work out a deal with the RM.

I understand the desire to appease all parties involved and trying to keep the peace. But how long can you let that drag on (putting more and more people's lives at risk) before you finally say enough is enough and start closing them off?

One of the worst culprits has to be where Plessis connects with the south perimeter. When you have EB vehicles wanting to turn left, the second (or more) vehicles are left stopped dead in the passing lane on the curve of the highway. That's about as unsafe of a situation as you can get. I have myself seen so many close calls there and one accident...and I'm sure there have been many others.

[Bluenote]

Originally Posted by Reignman

I understand the desire to appease all parties involved and trying to keep the peace. But how long can you let that drag on (putting more and more people's lives at risk) before you finally say enough is enough and start closing them off?

One of the worst culprits has to be where Plessis connects with the south perimeter. When you have EB vehicles wanting to turn left, the second (or more) vehicles are left stopped dead in the passing lane on the curve of the highway. That's about as unsafe of a situation as you can get. I have myself seen so many close calls there and one accident...and I'm sure there have been many others.

I would say Brady takes top honours in the south.
Then Where Asnew has access to either side of east or west bound. Zero pull offs. And it's always busy with tandems crossing fully loaded. I've seen a few wrecks there in the last 2 years in person.

But then you look at the west. The idiots who are allowing the cement trucks to turn right tin front of 100kmh traffic. The idiot who allows them to stop in 100kmh traffic and on one of the busiest stretches at rush hour. I'm talking the Oakbluff clusterfck. And it's a simple fix. Make them use the lights.

[CoryB]

If there was a smart RM with access to the Perimeter currently they should be talking with MIT on closing that access and getting something in trade. Someone is going to get a deal and odds are the first one to move is going to have the most leverage.

Personally I think WSP has the most to gain (grade separation for Pipeline) and the least to lose (two access points already well served by access roads). The flipside is Springfield has the most the lose and the least to gain unless MIT is willing to build the HWY 15 relocation project...

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Reignman

That's great, thanks. According to the list they are also rebuilding highway 75 NB from the US border up to 243. I travel to the US quite often, and that will be a welcome improvement as the first km or so when you get back into Canada is brutal.

There is some additional work on Highway 75:

https://www.merx4.merx.com/public/so...07730/abstract

[bomberjet]

Description


The Work of this Bonded Tender No.:6779 is generally described below:

SECTION 1 PTH 75
The work involves the rehabilitation of concrete pavement (full depth repairs) on the southbound lanes of Provincial Trunk Highway 75 from 2.0km south of Provincial Road 305 to south town limits of the town of Morris and 1.0km south of St. Jean Baptiste to 19.0km south of St. Jean Baptiste in the Municipalities of Ritchot, Morris, and Montcalm.

SECTION 2 PTH 1E
The work involves the rehabilitation of concrete pavement (full depth repairs) on the eastbound lanes of Provincial Trunk Highway 1E (E/B) from 13.0km east of Provincial Road 207 to 1.0km west of Provincial Trunk Highway 12, in the Municipality of Tache.

SECTION 3 PTH 101
The work involves the rehabilitation of concrete pavement (full depth and partial depth repairs) on the eastbound and westbound lanes of Provincial Trunk Highway 101 (EB and WB) from Provincial Trunk Highway 1E to 4.0km east of Provincial Trunk Highway 59N, in the Municipality of Springfield.

SECTION 4 PTH 9
The work involves the rehabilitation of concrete pavement (full depth repairs) on the northbound lanes of Provincial Trunk Highway 9N (N/B), 0.1km north of Provincial Trunk Highway 27, in the Municipality of St. Andrews.

[jmt18325]

Thanks - that's hard to do from my phone. There's also perimeter work, making it completely relevant to this thread.

The small budget decreases have not really changed the pace of work, which is good.

Edit: Some of this could also be federal cost share - remember that it was use it or lose it.

[bomberjet]

No problem. It was a small link to the right side of page.

Lots of rehab for the major routes. I assume the #1E work will begin at the east limit of the rebuilds from a few years back. The roadway is still terrible around the #12 interchange.

[jmt18325]

More significant repair work coming for the perimeter:


SECTION I

Location 1 PTH 100
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the northbound travel lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 100, 0.6km north of Provincial Road 241 to 1.6km north of Provincial Road 241, for an approximate total construction distance of 1.0km in the Municipality of Headingly.

Location 2 PTH 100
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the southbound travel lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 100, 0.3km south of Provincial Trunk Highway 1E to 1.1km east of Provincial Trunk Highway 1E, for an approximate total construction distance of 0.8km in the Municipality of Headingley.

Location 3 PTH 100
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the southbound travel lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 100, 1.2km south of Provincial Road 241 to 1.9km south of Provincial Road 241, for an approximate total construction distance of 0.7km in the Municipality of Headingly.

Location 4 PTH 100
Construction of bituminous pavement bridge approach fillets on the Provincial Trunk Highway 1E/PTH 100 interchange south east exit ramp at the Canadian National Railway Sprague Subdivision Bridge, for a total construction distance of 0.04km.


SECTION II

Location 1 – PTH 101
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the westbound exit lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 101 and Provincial Trunk Highway 8, starting at the east end of exit lane taper for an approximate total construction distance of 0.3km in the Municipality of West St Paul.

Location 2 – PTH 101
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the southeast leg (exit ramp) of Provincial Trunk Highway 101 and Provincial Trunk Highway 8, for an approximate total construction distance of 0.3km in the Municipality of West St Paul.

Location 3 – PTH 101
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the eastbound travel lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 101, 3.1km east of Provincial Trunk Highway 7 to 4.0km east of Provincial Trunk Highway 7, for an approximate total construction distance of 0.9km in the Municipality of West St Paul.

Location 4 – PTH 101
Construction of bituminous pavement bridge approach fillets on Provincial Trunk Highway 101 at PTH 190 southbound and northbound lanes, for a total construction distance of 0.120km in the Municipality of Headingley.

SECTION III

Location 1 PTH 100
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the northbound travel lane, passing land and collector distributor lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 100, starting at Provincial Road 241 to 0.45km north of Provincial Road 241, for an approximate total construction distance of 0.45km in the Municipality of Headingly.

Location 2 PTH 100
Construction of a bituminous pavement overlay, including milling of the existing bituminous pavement on the southbound travel lane, passing land and collector distributor lane of Provincial Trunk Highway 100, starting 0.43km north of Provincial Road 241 to Provincial Road 241, for an approximate total construction distance of 0.43km in the Municipality of Headingly.

SECTION IV

Construction of bituminous pavement bridge approach fillets on Provincial Trunk Highway 1E at the Floodway Bridge west bridge approaches eastbound and westbound lanes and the Floodway Bridge east bridge approach westbound lane for a total construction distance of 0.06km.

https://www.merx4.merx.com/public/so...54552/abstract

[CoryB]

Can anyone interrupt those locations?

Trying to guess it sounds like sections of the Perimeter from McPhillips through to Wilkes however that seems too large.

[MG922]

I'm assuming you meant interpret? not interrupt?

Looks like short sections of specific lanes in and around the Roblin / West perimeter bridge, the McPhillips / North perimeter bridge, as well as Brookside / North Perimeter and the CNR overpass on the East perimeter.

Definitely not the whole distance from Mcphillips to Roblin, just little sections.

[LilZebra]

Hwy 59 / Perim. Hwy. Interchange Project looking good

It has 3 overpasses.

[buzzg]

St. Mary's should not an intersection with the perimeter. RIRO on both sides, no crossing. Use St. Anne's or Pembina if you need to make a left turn or go into the city from south of the perimeter. And eventually make St. Anne's an interchange. It's a horribly dangerous intersection, especially with the entrance to Maple Grove right at it. And it doesn't really need to have full access, it's not overly busy.

I know some people would freak out that god forbid they add 3 minutes to their drive, but it's perfectly normal in every other city that sometimes you have to go past your destination a bit on freeways and use an interchange to turn around and go where you want to go.

[CoryB]

^^ Actually looked into this and if you use the standard of 2 KM (aka one mile in the USA) both St Annes and St Marry's are sufficiently far apart to warrant maintaining them. That said Gunn Rd is sufficiently far from another cross as is Pipeline. Further, Pipeline to Route 90/HWY 6 is 4 KM and the extension underway to Keewaitin would fall within the middle of Route 90 and Pipeline.

If you want to apply the rules one way on the Perimeter it is going to apply all the way around so best be careful what set of rules you want enforced.