SAN ANTONIO │ Frost Bank Headquarters │ 386 FEET | 23 FLOORS │ Complete

[Restless 1]

Disappointed specifically with this:

"Still, don’t expect a radical departure. What works in Shanghai or New York won’t fit here."

Not that there's any merit to what he is saying, but more that there are still people who feel this way. We can have a nice mix of modern and historic. Rivard just sounds kind of "get off my lawn!!!!" here.

[kornbread]

Originally Posted by Restless 1

With Beneby gone, not sure what's going on with the CPS building. They might want to find a new CEO first, and then no telling what that person might think about it.

It's not just Beneby, they lost another top level management member as well as having a few changes on the board. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up going with the team that proposed upgrades to the old AT&T buildings off McCollough. Unless they need to be really close to city offices.

Having a major tenant in that building/campus would be a positive link between the River North area and downtown. Of course the same could be said about San Pedro creek and the near east side.

As for Rivard, I think that statement was more about the community than himself. There was a backlash over the main library over paint. But also I'm sure the design will take it's surroundings into consideration and be respectful and complimentary while at the same time nudging the city towards an aesthetic that coveys a sense that it's the beginning of a new era (whether or not that is actually true only time will tell).

[jaga185]

Weston Urban CEO Randy Smith told County Commissioners that the Weston Urban team was still collaborating on schematics with Frost, but that the groups would have finalized designs to share with the community in a couple weeks.

you guys, it's coming!

also...

The commissioners jokingly pleaded with Smith to avoid making the building tan or beige, like so many of the city’s existing structures.

http://therivardreport.com/weston-ur...ntive-package/

[ILUVSAT]

$142 million? That seems a bit low for a "signature" tower.

[AwesomeSAView]

Originally Posted by ILUVSAT

$142 million? That seems a bit low for a "signature" tower.

Chip in another $5 million then!

[Austinite101]

Originally Posted by ILUVSAT

$142 million? That seems a bit low for a "signature" tower.

Hmm. For comparison, the Frost Bank Tower here in Austin was about $140 Million at slightly over 1/2 million square feet of office space. BG Group Place in Houston was in the low $300 million range, if I'm remembering correctly, and is almost 1 Million square feet.

If the $142 Million figure is correct, the building will likely be somewhere in the mid 400ft/mid 500ft ballpark. Which is still a big deal.

[KevinFromTexas]

Originally Posted by ILUVSAT

$142 million? That seems a bit low for a "signature" tower.

There are two conflicting sources, but the price tag for the Frost Bank Tower in Austin (though, the bank wasn't affiliated with its development) - but anyway, one source says it cost $137 million while the other says $142 million. A high cost doesn't always equal it being a signature tower. There are hotels in Austin that cost more than twice what the Frost Bank Tower did, but I would never consider them to be a signature building in the way the Frost Bank Tower has been.

[GoldenBoot]

Please stop comparing the cost of Austin's Frost Tower to the new HQ being proposed for SA. It is NOT an apples-to-apples comparison. For one, construction costs are FAR higher today than they were 15 years ago!

$142 million is pretty low in 2016 terms.

I don't think the developer of the first major tower in downtown San Antonio in more than 25 years is going to go balls out...especially since half of the building's 400,000 SF of office is spec. And, because of the aforementioned, I don't think equity and construction loan facility partners are going to allow a developer to do that.

Guess time will tell...

[SAtown]

Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas

There are two conflicting sources, but the price tag for the Frost Bank Tower in Austin (though, the bank wasn't affiliated with its development) - but anyway, one source says it cost $137 million while the other says $142 million. A high cost doesn't always equal it being a signature tower. There are hotels in Austin that cost more than twice what the Frost Bank Tower did, but I would never consider them to be a signature building in the way the Frost Bank Tower has been.

Frost Tower won't be the tallest building Downtown. So I would prepare yourselves for that. A 400K SF tower would have to be extremely skinny to be that tall, and skinny buildings don't lease well. Look at Tower Life versus a Bank of America. Why take 5 floors at Tower Life when you can consolidate onto one in Bank of America. Hints dropped by Weston Urban and Rivard suggest that this will not be the tallest building. While Rivard article was an opinion piece, they do share a close relationship with the Weston Urban team.

It's not just Beneby, they lost another top level management member as well as having a few changes on the board. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up going with the team that proposed upgrades to the old AT&T buildings off McCollough.

This.

[RyanfromTexas]

Originally Posted by SAtown

Frost Tower won't be the tallest building Downtown. So I would prepare yourselves for that. A 400K SF tower would have to be extremely skinny to be that tall, and skinny buildings don't lease well. Look at Tower Life versus a Bank of America. Why take 5 floors at Tower Life when you can consolidate onto one in Bank of America. Hints dropped by Weston Urban and Rivard suggest that this will not be the tallest building. While Rivard article was an opinion piece, they do share a close relationship with the Weston Urban team.



This.

You may be right, and this would absolutely "keep SA LAME". But why go with a star architect team like Pelli to put something so non-tranformative together?

[sirkingwilliam]

All there is on this page is wild speculation. None of which is even remotely close to the reality of the situation. I think people are reading too deeply into things.

It's similar to how people try and find meaning to I am the Walrus by the Beatles.

Any how, let's keep this discussion on the project itself.

[Keep-SA-Lame]

Originally Posted by RyanfromTexas

You may be right, and this would absolutely "keep SA LAME". But why go with a star architect team like Pelli to put something so non-tranformative together?

Transformative buildings don't need to be the tallest.

[RyanfromTexas]

Originally Posted by Keep-SA-Lame

Transformative buildings don't need to be the tallest.

we have the shortest skyline of any of the top 20 US metros. to "transform" we need to grow up.

[texboy]

Originally Posted by GoldenBoot

Please stop comparing the cost of Austin's Frost Tower to the new HQ being proposed for SA. It is NOT an apples-to-apples comparison. For one, construction costs are FAR higher today than they were 15 years ago!

$142 million is pretty low in 2016 terms.

I don't think the developer of the first major tower in downtown San Antonio in more than 25 years is going to go balls out...especially since half of the building's 400,000 SF of office is spec. And, because of the aforementioned, I don't think equity and construction loan facility partners are going to allow a developer to do that.

Guess time will tell...

Far higher? Not necessarily. Inflation has been fairly stagnant since the Great Recession when prices slumped. The Austonian's cost was roughly $160mil and it is the tallest in Austin. How do I know this? I worked on the project for the GC. And why can't they go "balls out"? This sounds like wishful thinking from an "ATX" forumer.

[sirkingwilliam]

Please return to the topic of this thread.

[Fireoutofclay]

Originally Posted by Keep-SA-Lame

Transformative buildings don't need to be the tallest.

[STLtoSA]

Originally Posted by RyanfromTexas

we have the shortest skyline of any of the top 20 US metros. to "transform" we need to grow up.

Well, SA is not a top 20 metro, so I'm not sure what the relationship is there.

This building, regardless of height, is going to be a great addition to the skyline; and there is a good chance that it may be the tallest in the city....

...which is not saying much.

If it gets close to 500' it will easily be the new tallest building in SA, but it really only needs to get around 480'.

[jaga185]

Originally Posted by STLtoSA

If it gets close to 500' it will easily be the new tallest building in SA, but it really only needs to get around 480'.

Agreed! Austin's Frost Tower is 516', I'd be happy with that. There's always time for something taller.

[wwmiv]

Originally Posted by RyanfromTexas

we have the shortest skyline of any of the top 20 US metros. to "transform" we need to grow up.

San Antonio is not even in the top 20 largest U.S. Metros.

Edit: already been stated.

[RyanfromTexas]

Originally Posted by wwmiv

San Antonio is not even in the top 20 largest U.S. Metros.

Edit: already been stated.

Fine top 25 metros with a simple google search, top 10 city by population. Anyways "let's get back to the topic at hand" which is speculating how this building will look. It seems as if the bar has been set really low regarding expectations. The city leadership is asking "please don't make it brown" as if to say anything else is fine just not beige or brown.

These same leaders and architects read these pages to get an idea of the ground swell of support or lack there of. We need to be happy with good/great. Not "meh". Another Weston center will be catastrophic. Austin's forum has shown influence by lampooning poor designs and have altered developments. Let's hope SKW is right that this building will be taller than expected and demand a game changing Frost in the same vein that Austin received.