Atlantic Canada airport thread

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by sailor734

I agree that connecting through HFX would work.....providing that the additional cost over the HFX to where ever flight pricing didn't make jumping in the car for 3.5 hours or so a preferred choice

Also take into account the pay parking station if you're going for a longer period.
IF this comes together for YSJ->HFX I'll be using it as Halifax as direct connections to Iceland, England, Germany.
Always hate having to backtrack to Toronto just to fly over the Maritimes again lol.
Pre-covid I believe there was a YFC->HFX. I had a friend tell me they used that en route to England in 2019.

[sailor734]

Thinking about it the changes I'd like to see at YSJ.

Firstly would be AC going back to 3-4 flights per day to TO and at least 2 to Montreal with early departures and evening arrivals.

Second would be a return of Porter service to Toronto. Although it would almost certainly be a Q400 to Toronto Island so not the most convenient for anyone wanting to connect onwards with Porter's expanding service to the US and western Canada as those flights are mostly E195's operating out of Pearson.

Third (and very unlikely to happen) would be a morning flight to Boston on a US carrier that offers an extensive route network for onward connections (a true alternative to AC for travel throughout North America and overseas)

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Thinking about it the changes I'd like to see at YSJ.

Firstly would be AC going back to 3-4 flights per day to TO and at least 2 to Montreal with early departures and evening arrivals.

Second would be a return of Porter service to Toronto. Although it would almost certainly be a Q400 to Toronto Island so not the most convenient for anyone wanting to connect onwards with Porter's expanding service to the US and western Canada as those flights are mostly E195's operating out of Pearson.

Third (and very unlikely to happen) would be a morning flight to Boston on a US carrier that offers an extensive route network for onward connections (a true alternative to AC for travel throughout North America and overseas)

Perhaps once the new terminal at the Saint-Hubert Longueuil airport is operational we will see more Porter flights out of the Maritimes to that hub.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by OliverD

Perhaps once the new terminal at the Saint-Hubert Longueuil airport is operational we will see more Porter flights out of the Maritimes to that hub.

Interesting. I didn't even know this existed. Depending on the routes flown out of this facility it might make Porter a more viable option out of the Maritimes.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Interesting. I didn't even know this existed. Depending on the routes flown out of this facility it might make Porter a more viable option out of the Maritimes.

I guess it has been renamed to be the Montreal Metropolitan Airport. This will basically be a hub for Porter.

https://montrealgazette.com/business...g-new-terminal

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montr...ghts-1.6761363

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by bridgeoftea

Also take into account the pay parking station if you're going for a longer period.
IF this comes together for YSJ->HFX I'll be using it as Halifax as direct connections to Iceland, England, Germany.
Always hate having to backtrack to Toronto just to fly over the Maritimes again lol.
Pre-covid I believe there was a YFC->HFX. I had a friend tell me they used that en route to England in 2019.

Pre-covid, YSJ had 4x daily to YHZ, I believe that YFC had the same. It was quite convenient. Seeing that return for YSJ is going to be awesome.

[stephan.richard]

Well folks Lynx Air is stopping operations on Monday.

https://www.globenewswire.com/news-r...rotection.html


Lynx Air Files for and Obtains CCAA Creditor Protection
Calgary-based low-cost airline will cease operations effective February 26
February 22, 2024 20:00 ET
| Source: Lynx Air

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CALGARY, Alberta, Feb. 22, 2024 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) -- Lynx Air (Lynx), a low-cost airline with service to destinations throughout Canada, the U.S. and Mexico, today announced that it has sought and obtained an initial order for creditor protection from the Court of King’s Bench of Alberta under the Companies' Creditors Arrangement Act (“CCAA”).

Over the past year, Lynx Air, has faced a number of significant headwinds including rising operating costs, high fuel prices, exchange rates, increasing airport charges and a difficult economic and regulatory environment.

Operating as an ultra low-cost carrier, Lynx launched its inaugural flight in April 2022, growing its fleet and number of destinations while doubling its volume of passengers over the past two years. However, despite substantial growth in the business, ongoing operational improvements, cost reductions and efforts to explore a sale or merger, the challenges facing the company's business have become too significant to overcome.

In connection with the commencement of proceedings, Lynx Air has made the decision to cease operations effective 12:01 a.m. MT on Monday, February 26, 2024, with flights continuing to operate until that time.

Every effort is being made to assist passengers at this time. Passengers with existing bookings are advised to contact their credit card company to secure refunds for pre-booked travel. Additional information for Lynx customers is available at this Frequently Asked Questions page (https://www.flylynx.com/en/faq-lynx).

Lynx would like to extend sincere gratitude to its loyal customers, dedicated employees and business partners for their commitment and dedication to the company.

Osler, Hoskin & Harcourt LLP are acting as legal advisors to Lynx Air. FTI Consulting Canada Inc. was appointed as the CCAA Monitor (“the Monitor”). Additional information related to the CCAA proceedings will be available on the Monitor's case website at: http://cfcanada.fticonsulting.com/lynxair.



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[MonctonRad]

Lynx destinations in Atlantic Canada included Halifax, fredericton and St. John's.

Potentially good new for their ULCC competitor Flair, but Flair is also in a very precarious situation.

[DyAm00394]

I’ve seen an article from 2 days ago saying there are rumours that Flair will be taking over Lynx Air. Apparently there are merger talks. This is interesting.

[Bishop2047]

Originally Posted by DyAm00394

I’ve seen an article from 2 days ago saying there are rumours that Flair will be taking over Lynx Air. Apparently there are merger talks. This is interesting.

I wonder if this was the referenced merger?

"However, despite substantial growth in the business, ongoing operational improvements, cost reductions and efforts to explore a sale or merger, the challenges facing the company's business have become too significant to overcome."

[sailor734]

More details in a CBC article here...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...nada-1.7123247

Booking on a discount carrier in Canada is risky business. You can never be sure they will still be in business when it's time to fly (or time to come home)

While this may help Flair's load factor I'm not sure it will be enough to pull them out of the deep hole they also appear to be in. I wouldn't be particularly shocked to see them gone as well in the next year.

One interesting point in the CBC story is regarding airport fees in Canada being among the highest in the world. Combined with high fuel taxes this makes it very difficult for ULCC's to succeed. I believe I read recently that Canada is one of the few major countries where the government actually takes more money out of air travel than they spend.

This also impacts fares on mainline carriers and contributes to our extremely high airfares. I mentioned here before about comparing short notice fares from SJ -Vancouver vs flying Portland Maine to Vancouver. One way was $1106 CAD from SJ..... $368 CAD from Maine.

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by sailor734

More details in a CBC article here...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...nada-1.7123247

Booking on a discount carrier in Canada is risky business. You can never be sure they will still be in business when it's time to fly (or time to come home)

While this may help Flair's load factor I'm not sure it will be enough to pull them out of the deep hole they also appear to be in. I wouldn't be particularly shocked to see them gone as well in the next year.

One interesting point in the CBC story is regarding airport fees in Canada being among the highest in the world. Combined with high fuel taxes this makes it very difficult for ULCC's to succeed. I believe I read recently that Canada is one of the few major countries where the government actually takes more money out of air travel than they spend.

This also impacts fares on mainline carriers and contributes to our extremely high airfares. I mentioned here before about comparing short notice fares from SJ -Vancouver vs flying Portland Maine to Vancouver. One way was $1106 CAD from SJ..... $368 CAD from Maine.

Right now it's cheaper to go to Moncton and use WestJet to fly to Vancouver.
I know as I booked flights for June 1st.
$494 round trip to Vancouver.
Using Flair from YSJ->YYZ->YVR was actually closer to $560.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by bridgeoftea

Right now it's cheaper to go to Moncton and use WestJet to fly to Vancouver.
I know as I booked flights for June 1st.
$494 round trip to Vancouver.
Using Flair from YSJ->YYZ->YVR was actually closer to $560.

Having Westjet still in Moncton obviously helps hold fares down.
My daughter is looking at a return from Vancouver in June.

Return fares on the specific dates she is looking at.......
Westjet to YQM 458
AC to YQM 653
AC to YSJ 1255

There's nothing like a little competition to hold down prices.........or a lack of competition to let them soar!

[Pugsley]

Let me go and put on my surprised face.

https://www.reuters.com/business/aer...port%20charges.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Return fares on the specific dates she is looking at.......
Westjet to YQM 458
AC to YQM 653
AC to YSJ 1255

There's nothing like a little competition to hold down prices.........or a lack of competition to let them soar!

Holy crap! There's no excuse for that!

Obvious price gouging at YSJ by AC.

WestJet is bringing back daily Toronto service between YQM and YYZ (at least for the extended summer season). I hope they make this permanent. I gather load factors on the Calgary service this winter have remained decent. Edmonton is coming back this summer too.

GREATER MONCTON, NB, February 7, 2024 – The Greater Moncton Roméo LeBlanc International Airport (YQM) is very pleased to announce the resumption of the Toronto route by WestJet for the summer of 2024.

Starting on May 17, the airline will fly from Greater Moncton (YQM) to Toronto Pearson (YYZ) twice weekly, on Mondays and Fridays, increasing to three times weekly in June and to five times weekly during the summer peak.

“It is great news for the region to have WestJet resume the YQM to YYZ route for this upcoming summer,” said the Greater Moncton International Airport Authority’s President and CEO, Courtney Burns. “In 2023, YQM welcomed 600,121 passengers, representing 89% of our 2019 passenger count. Our recovery is going well and the addition of new routes by our airline partners is a contributing factor helping us reach our pre-COVID passenger levels.”

This WestJet flight contributes to YQM’s comprehensive array of flights to Ontario and Alberta during the peak tourism season including:

Air Canada to Toronto Pearson (YYZ) – twice daily
Porter Airlines to Ottawa (YOW) – once daily (going up to twice daily starting in April 2024)
Porter Airlines to Billy Bishop Toronto Island (YTZ) – once daily
WestJet to Calgary and Edmonton as many times as 7 days per week. We anticipate that the airline’s peak summer schedule with direct non-stop flights to Edmonton and Calgary will be released soon.

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Having Westjet still in Moncton obviously helps hold fares down.
My daughter is looking at a return from Vancouver in June.

Return fares on the specific dates she is looking at.......
Westjet to YQM 458
AC to YQM 653
AC to YSJ 1255

There's nothing like a little competition to hold down prices.........or a lack of competition to let them soar!

I would absolutely love to not have to drive all over the Maritimes and pay for parking, but when you include parking the flight is still $400-600 cheaper, it's worth it.

[sailor734]

Twitter post from Duncan Dee (former AC COO) concerning the LYNX shutdown and air travel in Canada in general.....some interesting points.



"A very sad day for Canada's airline community & the communities (like Fredericton/YFC) that Lynx & its employees served.

Unlike many countries on earth, Canada, sadly, is inhospitable territory for new entrants, especially ultra low cost carriers.

Where many other markets allow for ULCCs to aggressively stimulate air travel with bargain basement fares, the stimulative effect ULCCs can have on the Canadian market is unheard of with our ultra high anciliary fees which make it impossible for ULCCs do what they do successfully in virtually every advanced (and some not so advanced) economy on earth: Stimulate travel. Open new markets. Bake a larger pie vs fighting for their piece of an existing pie.

When a base $20 or $50 air fare quickly becomes $200+ when all the taxes, fees & charges are included, there's not much stimulation any ULCC can do which is why US LCCs have largely avoided entering Canada in the first place (For example, Southwest & Spirit have largely avoided entering the Canada-US transborder market like the plague even as they expand to Mexico, Latin America & the Caribbean).

So, in Canada, ULCCs like Lynx are forced to mainly do battle with the large incumbents with their established sales networks, much deeper pockets & addictive frequent flier programs.

Add to that Canada's highly restrictive foreign ownership & control policies and ULCCs/new entrants emerge with one if not both hands tied behind their backs.

Unless & until Canada has a serious look at its treatment of air travelers, airlines & airports as cash cows, this situation will never change.

When politicians like Canada's Transport Min, expect other airlines to now step in to accommodate those from airlines that cease operations, the question must be asked: "who pays?" because if it isn't the Gov, the carrier ceasing operations or the travelers who bought tickets on the airline that ceased operations, the ones who are paying are the travelers who bought their tickets on the airlines that continue to operate."

[MonctonRad]

A damning commentary. His comments about American airline companies avoiding Canada are particularly interesting. This probably explains why the constant pleas by NB airports for direct service to Boston or NYC fall on deaf ears.

I think our current system needs to be reformed.

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Twitter post from Duncan Dee (former AC COO) concerning the LYNX shutdown and air travel in Canada in general.....some interesting points.



"A very sad day for Canada's airline community & the communities (like Fredericton/YFC) that Lynx & its employees served.

Unlike many countries on earth, Canada, sadly, is inhospitable territory for new entrants, especially ultra low cost carriers.

Where many other markets allow for ULCCs to aggressively stimulate air travel with bargain basement fares, the stimulative effect ULCCs can have on the Canadian market is unheard of with our ultra high anciliary fees which make it impossible for ULCCs do what they do successfully in virtually every advanced (and some not so advanced) economy on earth: Stimulate travel. Open new markets. Bake a larger pie vs fighting for their piece of an existing pie.

When a base $20 or $50 air fare quickly becomes $200+ when all the taxes, fees & charges are included, there's not much stimulation any ULCC can do which is why US LCCs have largely avoided entering Canada in the first place (For example, Southwest & Spirit have largely avoided entering the Canada-US transborder market like the plague even as they expand to Mexico, Latin America & the Caribbean).

So, in Canada, ULCCs like Lynx are forced to mainly do battle with the large incumbents with their established sales networks, much deeper pockets & addictive frequent flier programs.

Add to that Canada's highly restrictive foreign ownership & control policies and ULCCs/new entrants emerge with one if not both hands tied behind their backs.

Unless & until Canada has a serious look at its treatment of air travelers, airlines & airports as cash cows, this situation will never change.

When politicians like Canada's Transport Min, expect other airlines to now step in to accommodate those from airlines that cease operations, the question must be asked: "who pays?" because if it isn't the Gov, the carrier ceasing operations or the travelers who bought tickets on the airline that ceased operations, the ones who are paying are the travelers who bought their tickets on the airlines that continue to operate."

The frequent flyer bit is interesting to me. I would love to only fly with Air Canada to gain a status with them. But unless you have the status, I don't see the appeal in paying sometimes 300-800 dollars more for the same flight.

Especially hate the Aeroplan where you need to book via aircanada.com to gain half of your status.

I definitely understand the issues with low cost carriers in what the 2nd biggest country by land mass. When it takes the same amount of time to fly direct from Halifax to Vancouver as London to Baku.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by bridgeoftea

The frequent flyer bit is interesting to me. I would love to only fly with Air Canada to gain a status with them. But unless you have the status, I don't see the appeal in paying sometimes 300-800 dollars more for the same flight.

Especially hate the Aeroplan where you need to book via aircanada.com to gain half of your status.

I definitely understand the issues with low cost carriers in what the 2nd biggest country by land mass. When it takes the same amount of time to fly direct from Halifax to Vancouver as London to Baku.

No doubt our size and sparse population density make low cost air travel challenging but I also thing government policy (fees, taxes, airports required to be self sustaining etc) contributes a lot too. Used to be government spent public money on transportation infrastructure and supporting services for the public good.....now it seems like it's on a cost recovery basis for everything.