Surrey Langley Skytrain - Expo Line Extension | Proposed

[ilikeredheads]

Originally Posted by Sheba

Here's an interesting e-mail (slightly edited) I got today.

says the city who has been adamantly pushing for a streetcar. The irony is delicious.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by ilikeredheads

says the city who has been adamantly pushing for a streetcar. The irony is delicious.

Surrey City Council has been pushing for on-ground rail of some variety (yeah I know, not much better). That e-mail sounds like they want to get the routes sorted out before deciding on the technology, which will likely change a lot over the next 50 years.

[officedweller]

Yeah, the technology and the route are married to each other,
but you then run into the issue of "growth-serving" or "growth-inducing" routes.

[Migrant_Coconut]

I'd suggest that any improved bus network come with an improved street grid. Cul-de-sacs and non-continuous roads make it harder for buses and riders to get to each other.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by ilikeredheads

says the city who has been adamantly pushing for a streetcar. The irony is delicious.

I find it interesting that they are linking the existing brick and mortar malls SS and GM under the assumption that people do most of their shopping at the mall. Personally, I might go to the mall once or twice a year. I mostly shop online. I just use 104th as a means to get to other places beyond both of the malls. Will 104th ave and KGB change much with the new LRT? Hard to say. That vacant building west of 144th st has never had tenants. It was supposed to be an asian centre in the 90's.

I will be pleasantly surprised if the LRT helps revitalizes the 104th stretch. Time will tell if this expensive bus on rails makes a difference.

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

I'd suggest that any improved bus network come with an improved street grid. Cul-de-sacs and non-continuous roads make it harder for buses and riders to get to each other.

An improved arterial grid. I don't have issues with cul-de-sacs on residential side streets but when main routes stop and start all over the place...

Originally Posted by Trainguy

I find it interesting that they are linking the existing brick and mortar malls SS and GM under the assumption that people do most of their shopping at the mall.

Burnaby has 4 town centres and 3 of them are anchored by a mall, and 2 of them are in the process of being rebuilt.


Considering the complaints I've seen on here about Surrey's crappy road network and the crappy bus routes on them, I would have hoped for a little more feedback.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by Sheba

An improved arterial grid. I don't have issues with cul-de-sacs on residential side streets but when main routes stop and start all over the place...




Burnaby has 4 town centres and 3 of them are anchored by a mall, and 2 of them are in the process of being rebuilt.


Considering the complaints I've seen on here about Surrey's crappy road network and the crappy bus routes on them, I would have hoped for a little more feedback.

Well, Metrotown Centre is scheduled to be torn down so the city can use the land to build a new city hall among other things.

"Plans unanimously approved by city council last month include tearing down the existing infrastructure and replacing it with more mixed use developments."

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Sheba

Considering the complaints I've seen on here about Surrey's crappy road network and the crappy bus routes on them, I would have hoped for a little more feedback.

Doodled this a few months ago when I was bored, if it's any help. Assumes LRT for Newton-Guildford and the interurban, and SkyTrain for Fraser Highway; the rest are B-Lines and express buses.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Doodled this a few months ago when I was bored, if it's any help. Assumes LRT for Newton-Guildford and the interurban, and SkyTrain for Fraser Highway; the rest are B-Lines and express buses.

I'm with you on Skytrain for Fraser Hwy. For the moment I'm sketching out ideas in two varieties of orange (just like TransLink uses to mark FTN routes) - one for north-south and the other for east-west. I'm trying to make it a grid like Vancouver has, only not as close together.

Interesting about continuing up 152nd and across the Port Mann. Trying to put anything on the interurban is a likely no-go as it's still being used for freight, and we've seen how well that's worked out with the West Coast Express train regularly being late.

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by Trainguy

Well, Metrotown Centre is scheduled to be torn down so the city can use the land to build a new city hall among other things.

"Plans unanimously approved by city council last month include tearing down the existing infrastructure and replacing it with more mixed use developments."

I'm sure that came as a surprise to the malls owner, Ivanhoe Cambridge.

All that changed is the Metrotown plan itself, and just shows you how deaf the Burnaby City council has become. The Metrotown area is the highest point on the peninsula other than SFU itself. Sure it can be the "downtown", because that's basically what it's always been since the mall was built. But destroy that mall, and there will be ZERO reason for people to come here to shop, thus it becomes just another condo jungle for foreigners to own and keep empty.

I live on the edge of Metrotown, every block of apartment buildings has been torn down and I'm in the last row, and everyone on this block started getting notices of redevelopment months ago, not eviction notices.

When I originally moved here, the third Metrotower and everything east of Nelson was not a tower, and that crappy Chancellor building/seniors 55 complex behind it had not yet started.

Surrey has a completely different problem from Burnaby. Burnaby approves basically everything that is luxury and nothing else. No (rental) apartments have been built in Burnaby the last decade, it's all been luxury shoeboxes.

Surrey has been letting -anything- be built, thus in they've been in a rush to destroy as much ALR that they can get away with. So all these crappy cul-de-sac's that used to be farmland that popped up and the consequence of not enough police or educational facilities for them. What drives down educational enrollment? High property prices.

So this crappy LRT that Surrey is pushing, somehow they believe this is going to lead to development like in Burnaby, but it will not, because people don't want to commute in Surrey already. All this will do is become a series of park-and-rides because nobody will use it because it's no faster than their car. The angle will instead be "save fuel"

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Kisai

I'm sure that came as a surprise to the malls owner, Ivanhoe Cambridge.

All that changed is the Metrotown plan itself, and just shows you how deaf the Burnaby City council has become. The Metrotown area is the highest point on the peninsula other than SFU itself. Sure it can be the "downtown", because that's basically what it's always been since the mall was built. But destroy that mall, and there will be ZERO reason for people to come here to shop, thus it becomes just another condo jungle for foreigners to own and keep empty.

Surrey has a completely different problem from Burnaby. Burnaby approves basically everything that is luxury and nothing else. No (rental) apartments have been built in Burnaby the last decade, it's all been luxury shoeboxes.

I wonder if all the 'demovictions' will cause Corrigan to be voted out this October. There a lot of people who are pissed off about that and the lack of rental properties. The 'lets destroy Metrotown mall' plan hasn't gone over well either.

Originally Posted by Kisai

So this crappy LRT that Surrey is pushing, somehow they believe this is going to lead to development like in Burnaby, but it will not, because people don't want to commute in Surrey already. All this will do is become a series of park-and-rides because nobody will use it because it's no faster than their car. The angle will instead be "save fuel"

If Surrey can come up with a good sane plan then transportation improvements stand a chance. That also means not value engineering it, which sadly is a habit they have and is why they don't have enough police officers, among other things. I don't mind councils being fiscally conservative - that doesn't mean always being cheap.

[cabotp]

Originally Posted by Kisai

I'm sure that came as a surprise to the malls owner, Ivanhoe Cambridge.

All that changed is the Metrotown plan itself, and just shows you how deaf the Burnaby City council has become. The Metrotown area is the highest point on the peninsula other than SFU itself. Sure it can be the "downtown", because that's basically what it's always been since the mall was built. But destroy that mall, and there will be ZERO reason for people to come here to shop, thus it becomes just another condo jungle for foreigners to own and keep empty.

I live on the edge of Metrotown, every block of apartment buildings has been torn down and I'm in the last row, and everyone on this block started getting notices of redevelopment months ago, not eviction notices.

When I originally moved here, the third Metrotower and everything east of Nelson was not a tower, and that crappy Chancellor building/seniors 55 complex behind it had not yet started.

Surrey has a completely different problem from Burnaby. Burnaby approves basically everything that is luxury and nothing else. No (rental) apartments have been built in Burnaby the last decade, it's all been luxury shoeboxes.

Surrey has been letting -anything- be built, thus in they've been in a rush to destroy as much ALR that they can get away with. So all these crappy cul-de-sac's that used to be farmland that popped up and the consequence of not enough police or educational facilities for them. What drives down educational enrollment? High property prices.

So this crappy LRT that Surrey is pushing, somehow they believe this is going to lead to development like in Burnaby, but it will not, because people don't want to commute in Surrey already. All this will do is become a series of park-and-rides because nobody will use it because it's no faster than their car. The angle will instead be "save fuel"

I get the feeling that while Metrotown mall maybe redeveloped. I highly doubt the mall will be gone completely. I'm more inclined to think that the mall will be redeveloped in a different form. My thoughts are that the mall will be redeveloped in a way to have towers on top of the mall. Like station square is right now.

[Colin4567]

Originally Posted by cabotp

I get the feeling that while Metrotown mall maybe redeveloped. I highly doubt the mall will be gone completely. I'm more inclined to think that the mall will be redeveloped in a different form. My thoughts are that the mall will be redeveloped in a way to have towers on top of the mall. Like station square is right now.

Or like the City of Lougheed plans?

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by cabotp

I get the feeling that while Metrotown mall maybe redeveloped. I highly doubt the mall will be gone completely. I'm more inclined to think that the mall will be redeveloped in a different form. My thoughts are that the mall will be redeveloped in a way to have towers on top of the mall. Like station square is right now.

Actually, the recently-approved plan literally IS to have the mall gone completely.

Granted, 2041 is a long way away, and plans can change.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Actually, the recently-approved plan literally IS to have the mall gone completely.

Granted, 2041 is a long way away, and plans can change.

I looked it up and Surrey has 5 town centres (plus Surrey Central as their downtown). Can anyone name the ones that aren't anchored by a mall.

[ilikeredheads]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Actually, the recently-approved plan literally IS to have the mall gone completely.

Granted, 2041 is a long way away, and plans can change.

wow burnaby city hall really do live in their own world.

[flipper316]

https://www.surreynowleader.com/news...rolls-forward/

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Sheba

I looked it up and Surrey has 5 town centres (plus Surrey Central as their downtown). Can anyone name the ones that aren't anchored by a mall.

Newton, South Surrey, Cloverdale. Do I win anything?

Originally Posted by ilikeredheads

wow burnaby city hall really do live in their own world.

Ivory Tower Syndrome is not a joke. Thousands of politicians suffer every year.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Newton, South Surrey, Cloverdale. Do I win anything?


Ivory Tower Syndrome is not a joke. Thousands of politicians suffer every year.

You missed the mall anchored Guildford - technically South Surrey is anchored by a mall too. If you want you can help yourself to a cookie.

Surrey's mayor lives in an Ivory Tower too, with an LRT plan that a lot of people are against.