Surrey Langley Skytrain - Expo Line Extension | Proposed

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[nname]

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

No, I totally agree with you Skytrain is a superior mode if we can get the money together in virtually all cases. What excites me is that I think the LRT will get more riders than what even a good bus would. There are lots of people I know that wouldn't ever ride a bus but, would be willing to ride a train. At the very least theres definitely a perceived view that electrified rail transit is nicer.

But then what about the existing riders who taking Bus and transfer to Surrey Central for SkyTrain? Would the LRT good enough to retain them when they are forced to do an extra transfer to LRT? Or, would the riders continue to force TransLink to send every bus to Surrey Central instead of trying to establish a grid-like system SoF?

As far as I know,
Bus ==> Bus -> SkyTrain appears to be good enough to people in South Delta and WR
Bus -> Bus -> SkyTrain ==> Bus -> LRT -> SkyTrain was rejects by most people from Coquitlam and beyond
Bus -> Bus -> SkyTrain ==> Bus -> SkyTrain is a huge improvement with Evergreen Extension
So what about Bus -> SkyTrain ==> Bus -> LRT -> SkyTrain for people beyond Newton/Guildford??

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[GlassCity]

Service brings more riders than vehicle technology.

Besides, do we want to make transit more useful for those that already use it, or are we going after people that are transit-averse already? There is plenty of demand for transit in Metro Vancouver for TransLink to address already, we don't need to push for more of it like some sunbelt city. Plenty of work to do just meeting the demand that exists already, and LRT will not do that.

[nname]

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

The buses still don't force a transfer now, but frankly most people on the 321 get off if they see a 96 bus waiting so obviously they don't mind a transfer to go faster. And the LRT will be faster than the 96 (not a BRT alternative but still faster than status quo) so I'm sure it will be fine.

In that case, they SEE the bus, they KNOW they will not spent much time waiting at the bus loop. Even if the bus isn't there, they always got the alternative of staying on the bus.

That is a huge difference compared to having to keep thinking "am I going to miss my connection?" "How long do I have to wait?" "How much earlier should I leave so I will arrive on time?" "Is there any alternative if I miss the connection?" "Would my bus even coming at all?"

Perhaps going the other direction is a better comparison...

[WaxItYourself]

Originally Posted by nname

So what about Bus -> SkyTrain ==> Bus -> LRT -> SkyTrain for people beyond Newton/Guildford??

The LRT is replacing the 321 and 96B line out to newton. The only people that would have to do as you say is the people that would need to transfer onto the bus from newton to white rock. I don't think many would have much a problem with that though as the LRT would be running rather frequently. All other bus routes would probably remain the same.

[Firebrand]

Originally Posted by WaxItYourself

I don't think many would have much a problem with that though as the LRT would be running rather frequently.

Until there’s a blockage on the train, and the line will shut down.

[Waders]

How frequent will the LRT train runs? Every 15 minutes? How many drivers would be required?

[nname]

Originally Posted by WaxItYourself

The LRT is replacing the 321 and 96B line out to newton. The only people that would have to do as you say is the people that would need to transfer onto the bus from newton to white rock. I don't think many would have much a problem with that though as the LRT would be running rather frequently. All other bus routes would probably remain the same.

337.501.509 will probably terminate at Guildford, as there is already 320 providing local service.

New or improved cross-town service on 72, 88, 96th Ave meaning people taking those route will need to trasfer at KGB and then again at Surrey Central.

All those infrequent service like 329 that goes to Surrey Central would probably replaced by more frequent grid-like service that does NOT taking long detours all over the places.

If all these bus route remain the same, then it really defeat the purpose of building rapid transit deeper into SoF... Instead of getting region-wide network improvement (as seen in the recent Canada Line and Evergreen integration), you're saying they spend a billion just to replace ONE bus route????

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Waders

How frequent will the LRT train runs? Every 15 minutes? How many drivers would be required?

I believe that Surrey's aiming for every five minutes, eventually going down to every three... so basically, a 99 B-Line level of service. Don't ask why they can't just improve the 96 until it gets the 99's frequencies, nobody knows.

Originally Posted by nname

If all these bus route remain the same, then it really defeat the purpose of building rapid transit deeper into SoF... Instead of getting region-wide network improvement (as seen in the recent Canada Line and Evergreen integration), you're saying they spend a billion just to replace ONE bus route????

SkyTrain For Surrey's way ahead of you.

Really, the choice should be between one big SkyTrain that majorly improves one part of Surrey, or several rapid bus lines that slightly improve all of Surrey... instead, they want to spend all the money on something that doesn't really accomplish either one?

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by nname

337.501.509 will probably terminate at Guildford, as there is already 320 providing local service.

New or improved cross-town service on 72, 88, 96th Ave meaning people taking those route will need to trasfer at KGB and then again at Surrey Central.

All those infrequent service like 329 that goes to Surrey Central would probably replaced by more frequent grid-like service that does NOT taking long detours all over the places.

If all these bus route remain the same, then it really defeat the purpose of building rapid transit deeper into SoF... Instead of getting region-wide network improvement (as seen in the recent Canada Line and Evergreen integration), you're saying they spend a billion just to replace ONE bus route????

I have this hobby of taking TransLinks maps and tracing out the routes in different colours - then rolling my eyes before doing another map where I've taken those routes apart and put them back together again in a way I think makes more sense. I had a fairly recent e-mail conversation with someone who works for Surrey (I think he might have also worked for TransLink at some point, or maybe he still does?) and City of Surrey certainly wants to move their bus routes to something more grid-like (which was what I drew).

[Firebrand]

Can you show me the map? I’m interest in looking at it.

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by Aroundtheworld

I'm not against LRT in principle. I think it has been done well in other cities. What doesn't work for me is the massive opportunity cost needed to build something that will be nice but not very efficient. I would've preferred if they had gone with a BRT solution for the L line.

I think what irks most people is the non-sensical proposal to make the line to Langley Light Rail. It appears that decision is being motivated by Surrey's selfish interests to the detriment of potential passengers and overall transportation goals.

You hit the nail on the head.

My feelings exactly.

Also the incredibly poor alignment proposed for the LRT is a major concern.

I can understand supporting LRT on the correct corridors, but not poorly designed LRTs.

And yes, Surrey trying to strong arm RRT to Langley as LRT is very selfish and makes no sense when you have Skytrain currently pointing in that exact direction extension ready.

[Firebrand]

God forbid they put LRT on Fraser Hwy.

There was a specific thread on r/vancouver where someone said that a Langley LRT will be better than the Langley extension (they kept repeating the same shit), but the thread is deleted, possibly because of downvotes. Ironically, that same person who said it is a trucker.

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[Reecemartin]

[Deleted]

[Firebrand]

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

Again you say that like it will be a daily occurrence, even with blockages on other systems they are still few and far between.

Its not like we are going to have cars stalling in LRT lanes.

Then why do I hear every news about accidents on the C-Train and the Edmonton LRT?

It doesn’t even have to be daily. Once a week will be enough to affect its reliability, and its ridership will also be affected. The whole thing becomes a Catch-22.

[Firebrand]

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

The alignment only has one questionable intersection and that can be fixed with a unique crossing gate arrangement.

I have a feeling that Surrey is going to leave that intersection as it is, because they are too cheap to bother.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by Reecemartin

And a LRT service every 5 minutes is excellent, sure to draw plenty of riders.

Except that with the money it'll cost to build an LRT and have it come every 5 minutes on the corridor, you could have more corridors served by express buses with the same frequency.