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  #4741  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2019, 4:37 PM
DoubleK DoubleK is offline
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Originally Posted by Deepstar View Post
Overruns happen, but in the case of Seattle that's an anomaly. It's not often an arena goes over budget that high. $575 Million is plenty enough to build a great arena.
Aren't they also retroing an old building? There are lots of 'hidden' costs in an endeavour like that.
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  #4742  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2019, 6:34 PM
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They are, and yes, that sort of complicates things imo. Easier to do a rip and tear and then start from scratch.

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Aren't they also retroing an old building? There are lots of 'hidden' costs in an endeavour like that.
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  #4743  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2019, 6:36 PM
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Me too. There has been a two year consultation period, at this point there's nothing to gain by hashing it over. All sides have had a reset period, and the new deal looks palatable, time to move on and get it done.

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Originally Posted by milomilo View Post
If CSEC representatives had spent the last few months threatening to leave and calling Calgarians stupid if they didn't take a one sided deal like they did last time, my opinion would be different and I'm sure so would many others. Doing it all behind closed doors and coming out with a balanced deal was much more likely to be successful.

I'm glad there is virtually no consultation period either. It's pointless, all that needs to be said has been said and opening up a debate will just lead to needless heat.
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  #4744  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2019, 11:51 PM
suburbia suburbia is offline
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Majority of public feedback on Calgary's arena deal was negative: analysis
https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...ative-analysis
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“The fact that the Flames made the timeline so tight that it disallowed for meaningful public consultation shows an utter disdain for democratic norms and should have been an absolute non-starter,” read one submission from July 25.

“Do not let (Calgary Sport and Entertainment Corp.) bully you into spending money that could desperately be used elsewhere,” wrote one respondent on July 24.
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  #4745  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2019, 1:07 AM
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Majority of public feedback is negative: analysis
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  #4746  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2019, 4:08 AM
dg66 dg66 is offline
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Originally Posted by suburbia View Post
Majority of public feedback on Calgary's arena deal was negative: analysis
https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...ative-analysis
Chalk this up in the useless new column. 55% negative feedback on public spending is a non story, if there's a story here, it's that it's lower than expected. People who are against something are more likely to complain, so a paltry 55% does not show well, it instead reinforces that the city made the right decision.
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  #4747  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2019, 5:31 AM
Corndogger Corndogger is offline
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Originally Posted by dg66 View Post
Chalk this up in the useless new column. 55% negative feedback on public spending is a non story, if there's a story here, it's that it's lower than expected. People who are against something are more likely to complain, so a paltry 55% does not show well, it instead reinforces that the city made the right decision.
The city is getting a nice injection of funding from CSEC. $275 million plus all of the development that will result from the arena being the core focus of the entertainment district. What other city in Canada has had this much money invested into a sports facility by the private sector?
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  #4748  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2019, 8:13 PM
milomilo milomilo is offline
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Originally Posted by dg66 View Post
Chalk this up in the useless new column. 55% negative feedback on public spending is a non story, if there's a story here, it's that it's lower than expected. People who are against something are more likely to complain, so a paltry 55% does not show well, it instead reinforces that the city made the right decision.
Yeah, how does this compare to any other project? Do people turn up to say how much they love the new condo tower going up next to them?
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  #4749  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 12:55 AM
CrossedTheTracks CrossedTheTracks is offline
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Originally Posted by Corndogger View Post
What other city in Canada has had this much money invested into a sports facility by the private sector?
Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver? (ok, Vancouver may not be quite as much as $275 million in 2019 dollars, but it's awfully close)

(I'm not arguing that Calgary is "the same" as these 3 cities in a way that is relevant to this discussion, but you asked "what other city in Canada"....)
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  #4750  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 1:00 AM
CrossedTheTracks CrossedTheTracks is offline
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Originally Posted by dg66 View Post
55% negative feedback on public spending is a non story, if there's a story here, it's that it's lower than expected.
I'd have to agree, certainly with the bolded part.

I'm far more concerned with the "7 days or else" part of the deal than the deal itself. I'm not convinced everyone on city council fully understood what they voted on, which is ridiculous for an investment of this magnitude.

Seems like many of the 55% are in the same boat, according to the article. Maybe if the decision-making period was longer, a good chunk of the opposition would fizzle away. Or maybe increased scrutiny would have revealed details that deserved honest concern. Guess we'll never find out.
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  #4751  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 1:12 AM
Corndogger Corndogger is offline
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Originally Posted by CrossedTheTracks View Post
Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver? (ok, Vancouver may not be quite as much as $275 million in 2019 dollars, but it's awfully close)

(I'm not arguing that Calgary is "the same" as these 3 cities in a way that is relevant to this discussion, but you asked "what other city in Canada"....)
What happened 20+ years ago isn't necessarily relevant to today. I don't see any ownership group in Canada spending ~$600 million to build a new arena when they know they can get governments to help them.
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  #4752  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 4:07 PM
MalcolmTucker MalcolmTucker is offline
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Originally Posted by CrossedTheTracks View Post
Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver? (ok, Vancouver may not be quite as much as $275 million in 2019 dollars, but it's awfully close)

(I'm not arguing that Calgary is "the same" as these 3 cities in a way that is relevant to this discussion, but you asked "what other city in Canada"....)
Toronto was the only success. The others sold their teams and stadiums at a loss within a few years due to precarious finances. Vancouver couldn't succeed even with it being busy with both NBA and NHL tenants.
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  #4753  
Old Posted Sep 3, 2019, 9:48 PM
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Originally Posted by CrossedTheTracks View Post
Or maybe increased scrutiny would have revealed details that deserved honest concern. Guess we'll never find out.
Well that part we will find out eventually..
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