HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Southwest


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #21341  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2024, 3:00 PM
ASUSunDevil ASUSunDevil is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 922
Quote:
Originally Posted by gymratmanaz View Post
I see the huge blocks south of McDowell and west of 56th ST fenced off with skirting, but I can't tell what is going to be built. Are they tearing down the existing buildings? The skirting almost looks like something involving entertainment.
https://www.axios.com/local/phoenix/...-52nd-mcdowell
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21342  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2024, 3:40 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,615
Looks like the lot at Cental and Adams (Edith??) HAs some activity, has it broken ground or is it site prepping for construction?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21343  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2024, 3:47 PM
dillsquad dillsquad is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by Obadno View Post
Looks like the lot at Cental and Adams (Edith??) HAs some activity, has it broken ground or is it site prepping for construction?
Interesting, does anyone have a mock-up on the Edith? Curious as to how much ground floor retail there is. Need more activation on Central, badly.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21344  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2024, 3:47 PM
gymratmanaz gymratmanaz is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,916
The article states - Chicago-based Baker Development Corp. says it hopes data centers, manufacturing, warehouses and distribution-type companies will take up residence. -

The wrapping sure doesn't seem to reflect data centers. I couldn't read it all as I was driving by, but the pictures all seem entertainment and social in nature.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21345  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2024, 6:34 PM
combusean's Avatar
combusean combusean is offline
Skyriser
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Newark, California
Posts: 7,202
The developer exclusively works in industrial per the article, and according to the zoning narrative they don't have a site plan or potential uses, just they are consolidating the site zoning to allow for "data center, manufacturing, warehouse, and distribution-type uses."

https://www.phoenix.gov/pddsite/Docu...0Narrative.pdf
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21346  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 4:29 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,615
Can somebody post the text: https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/...-concerns.html

Also, can somebody int he news industry outlaw the phrase "some experts say"

I am going to assume the conclusion and say NO we are not at risk of overbuilding, apartments downtown are too expensive for the local market, the decrease in rents due to oversupply is good.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21347  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 5:07 PM
combusean's Avatar
combusean combusean is offline
Skyriser
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Newark, California
Posts: 7,202
Downtown is absolutely overbuilt, for now at least.

And while I'm making calls like that, here are my predictions for the future.

The winners for the next phase are going to be old and cautious investors making plays in established low risk areas like Biltmore or North Scottsdale.

The losers have gambled on extra-risky areas like 12th St/Washington or further north on Central that only were hot because they were adjacent to overheated markets. Most of that area is still probably going to be a dump for the next few years which is really shameful.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21348  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 6:02 PM
muertecaza muertecaza is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,235
Quote:
Originally Posted by Obadno View Post
Can somebody post the text: https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/...-concerns.html

Also, can somebody int he news industry outlaw the phrase "some experts say"

I am going to assume the conclusion and say NO we are not at risk of overbuilding, apartments downtown are too expensive for the local market, the decrease in rents due to oversupply is good.
Here:

Quote:
About 2,400 apartment units are under construction in downtown Phoenix, putting the submarket in danger of being overbuilt.

Developers have been ramping up apartment construction throughout Phoenix for the past several years, which is causing real estate experts such as Peter O'Neil, research director for Northmarq, to expect a peak in new rental construction in 2024.

"As far as the potential for overbuilding is concerned, I think that is a valid concern in downtown, just like it's a legitimate concern in nearly all of the submarkets in the Phoenix area at least in the near term," O'Neil said.

Northmarq is forecasting 20,000 units to come online in 2024 across the region, with downtown Phoenix accounting for about 1,200 units, he said. However, O'Neil is forecasting a sharp decline in multifamily permitting and construction starts in 2024.

"So we'll overbuild in the short term and then demand should catch up with supply in the next few years as we slow the pace of new construction," he said.

Christine Mackay, economic development director for the city of Phoenix, counts nine cranes outside her office window in downtown Phoenix. That's a far cry from the 20 cranes she saw in November 2020 during the height of the global pandemic, which was up from 14 cranes in January 2020.

Answers on X Phoenix's stalled downtown project

The Phoenix area has one of the most aggressive new construction pipelines in 10 to 15 years, said Bruce Hanley, vice president of Commercial Properties Inc. in Tempe.

Within a three-mile radius of the 85004 ZIP Code in downtown Phoenix, Hanley counts 32 properties either under construction or proposed.

"Everybody now wants to get in on the action in downtown and around Phoenix," he said. "But you also have some construction projects that are faltering, that they've ceased construction on."

One apartment project that spans an entire city block downtown came to a screeching halt last fall, causing a flurry of mechanics liens against the project.

The second phase of X Phoenix, a 29-story luxury residential tower with 592 beds at Third Avenue and Van Buren Street, has racked up nearly $50 million in mechanics liens since October 2023, including $35 million from general contractor Clayco Inc.

Chicago-based X Cos. secured a Government Property Lease Excise Tax, or GPLET, through the city of Phoenix, to abate property taxes while the project is under construction. That means the city currently owns both phases of X Phoenix, Mackay said.

"They're working diligently right now on some new funding," she said. "I believe it will be back under construction by summer. The market got a little goofy on financing, and this is a project that got caught up in financing. It will be back by summer."

X Cos. could not immediately be reached for comment on this story.

Mackay said she doesn't expect to see 20 cranes in the air again within the next few years.

"That's what the market is supposed to do," she said. "Pause, take a breath, let's catch up. Sometimes, when we force the market is when we start to have problems."

'Weird market': Rent growth is now flat, and transactions are down
While year-over-year rent growth between 2020 and 2022 was 20%, rent growth is now flat, Hanley said. Plus, multifamily sales/transaction volume was down 72% from 2022 to 2023.

"This is a weird market right now," Hanley said. "Are we overbuilt right now? Probably. It's called absorption, where demand keeps up with supply. Right now that's kind of off."

These changes to the multifamily market come at a time when the state's second largest publicly traded company plans to vacate eight stories of its downtown Phoenix tower. Freeport-McMoRan Inc. (NYSE: FCX) is preparing to sublease its 250,000-square-foot global headquarters office in the 26-story Freeport-McMoRan Center at 333 N. Central Ave. in downtown Phoenix.

Mackay said she's glad the company will still have offices at the Cotton Center in Phoenix.

"But that's eight floors of new and modern office space, which is easier to bring tenants," she said, adding that she's also seeing activity and interest in the former Chase tower across the street.

Freeport McMoRan accounts for a small percentage of the overall workforce in downtown Phoenix, somewhere between 1% and 2%, O'Neil said.

"Typically, I don't think one move in particular is going to result in a significant impact on submarket vacancy or performance, especially in a dense area like downtown Phoenix," O'Neil said. "Not all of the people who work in Freeport's office rent. And even if they do rent, it doesn't mean they rent in downtown Phoenix. I imagine the company employs a mix of homeowners and renters, and that the employees are located in downtown and the Phoenix suburbs."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21349  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 6:08 PM
phxjack phxjack is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2023
Posts: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by muertecaza View Post
Here:
Good news to hear X Phase 2 will restart construction by Summer
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21350  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 7:18 PM
MMDelon MMDelon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 233
I did not know we were over building downtown. That concerns me that other projects will be pushed back or not happen at all.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21351  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 8:43 PM
ASU Diablo ASU Diablo is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,287
I guess we wait and see what happens with Astra...
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21352  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 9:07 PM
dillsquad dillsquad is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASU Diablo View Post
I guess we wait and see what happens with Astra...
What’s the latest on this ? this project has been talked about for years….
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21353  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2024, 9:35 PM
CrestedSaguaro's Avatar
CrestedSaguaro CrestedSaguaro is offline
Modulator
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 4,404
Quote:
Originally Posted by dillsquad View Post
What’s the latest on this ? this project has been talked about for years….
Nada
__________________
Ronnie Garrett
https://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?memberID=205
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21354  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2024, 4:37 AM
Sepstein Sepstein is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 89
Astra

Astra always felt like a pipe dream!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21355  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2024, 5:00 AM
combusean's Avatar
combusean combusean is offline
Skyriser
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Newark, California
Posts: 7,202
New tallests are often signs of irrational exhuberism. SF built theres and is absolutely creamed right now.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21356  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2024, 3:10 PM
phxjack phxjack is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2023
Posts: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMDelon View Post
I did not know we were over building downtown. That concerns me that other projects will be pushed back or not happen at all.
One thing that has not been talked about enough is how we still have not hit critical mass of density in downtown to justify more urban shopping. The more people that move downtown the more businesses will follow. There's still a high percentage of downtown students that leave for summers. Until we have enough year round residents to support downtown shops - we will have to wait.

Other cities have downtown targets, whole foods, aldis, and upscale boutiques. We have not hit this tier yet but hopeful the next round of apartments will level supply and demand and encourage more residents to live downtown.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21357  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2024, 5:35 PM
MMDelon MMDelon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 233
I’m hopeful that Astra will still happen but if we are over building and waiting for demand to catch up then I don’t see the demand for a project like Astra at the moment.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21358  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2024, 6:25 PM
MMDelon MMDelon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 233
It just sounds like things are evening out at the moment. Instead of seeing 3 to 4 projects going up like we have been seeing, we may see one or two so that demand catches up. We have Central Station (two towers), Sol Modern, X Roosevelt, Saiya, Vela, and X Phoenix Phase 2 when it starts back up under construction. This doesn’t include AVE Phoenix and Skye, and Palm Tower that are finishing up. I am still optimistic about Astra but no way it breaks ground the second quarter of 2024 as planned.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21359  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2024, 9:45 PM
ASU Diablo ASU Diablo is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,287
Phoenix wants to hire national consulting firm to work on DT entertainment district

https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/...-advisors.html

Quote:
The city of Phoenix wants to hire a national consulting firm to help establish a new entertainment district in its downtown.

Phoenix City Council will consider a one-year contract worth $529,000 with HR&A Advisors Inc. for a proposed district at its March 20 meeting.

HR&A has offices in several major markets such as New York and Los Angeles and has worked on entertainment districts in Cincinnati, Detroit, Philadelphia and Toronto, Canada.

It focuses on real estate, economic development and public infrastructure projects and has worked with universities, private owners and investors, hospitals and government.

In the Valley, HR&A has worked on major projects including the design concept for Mesa City Center and the master plan for Margaret T. Hance Park in Phoenix.

The scope of the city of Phoenix agreement, which has two one-year renewal options, includes project management, studies, public participation, feasibility reports, growth analysis, boundary maps and recommendations.

HR&A will be partnering on the project with architecture firm Multistudio, which has a Phoenix office and has worked on a number of projects in the Valley such as Central Station.

Phoenix has been looking for ways to bolster its downtown area and compete with other major markets with more hotels and the establishment of an entertainment district around the Phoenix Convention Center. This would create an area for visitors and residents to walk in a vibrant and safe pedestrian area with amenities such as restaurants, bars, attractions, street performers, art, lighting and transportation options, according to the city.

In September, the city of Phoenix posted a request for proposals for consulting services and subsequently received five proposals, one of which was from HR&A Advisors. A panel evaluated the proposals and selected the winning bidder in December.

The city's economic development and housing subcommittee recommended approval for the contract at its Feb. 14. meeting.

Following a City Council vote, the project will begin in the spring with community outreach and analysis scheduled for the summer. The city expects a draft plan to be delivered by the fall and for the final plan to be completed near the end of 2024.

Phoenix is also in the process of a major expansion of its central business district boundaries in the downtown area, which could help create more development opportunities in the area. City Council is expected to vote on the central business district boundary at its April 17 meeting.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #21360  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2024, 11:03 PM
combusean's Avatar
combusean combusean is offline
Skyriser
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Newark, California
Posts: 7,202
Waste of money. Get the convention center activated and redeveloped with a well capitalized and willing partner like Hines and stop f'n around with pointless studies.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Southwest
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 4:37 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.