Marion - Dugald Street Re-alignment

[alittle1]

As stated previously in the Dugald - Plessis interchange thread, it is my opinion that the City let dead dogs lie and find another route to move traffic in the East/West direction in the eastern part of the City.

One such way would be to abandon the Marion extension to Dugald Rd. and go to a more southern route that would branch the roadway at Dawson Rd, and Marion would flow South to the southside of Maple Leaf, just North of the Symington underpass, Cross Lagimodiere and the CN spur to Symington yards with an overpass, run along St. Boniface Industrial Park and join up with St. Boniface Road, travel eastward joining at the perimeter or swing North at the water-ski park to Dugald and Ravenhurst.

Dugald Road from Dawson to Plessis should just be left as a feeder route to the industrial area. Dugald Road from Plessis to the perimeter should be left to service South Transcona residential and the industrial property along the CN mainline.

The off-shoots of the southerly route for Marion - Dugald is, extending Maginot and Dawson Rd. intersection over the tracks to the new roadway. And if they ever get around to it, Maginot west to Archibald along the north end of the golf course to Youville and Carriere to St.Mary's Road would remove some of the burden on Marion Street.

[Biff]

If somebody has talent the schematic boards for this project are up on the City website.

http://www.winnipeg.ca/publicworks/M...ng/default.asp

I was there, there are some interesting configurations. In my mind:

- Option 1 - should be out - it doesn't address the issue of Lag between Marion and Dugald (clusterfuck).
- Option 2 - good
- Option 3 - good
- Option 4 - interesting, not sure about the one way sections, might be an issue to business
- Option 5 - likely most difficult because of the disruption to the existing neighborhood west of the Seine River

Note - all options require a grade separation of Archibald and the rail line. If anyone really likes Teasers you may want to check it out over the next 5 years because if this project gets traction (and funding) there are no scenarios where it stays.

[bomberjet]

I can get the boards posted here over lunch hour. On option 5, there is an at grade rail crossing of the NB Archibald to WB Marion. Seems kind of silly. But overall it looks pretty sweet.

And yeah, that whole neighbourhood will be changing significantly, especially the loss of Teasers!

[esquire]

Option 3 seems to make the most sense to me... direct, cuts out the Lagimodiere multiplexing problem, and takes a route that avoids going into the middle of the industrial area and might allow for higher speeds.

It is comical to some degree that these scenarios all involve a big new interchange. Bishop Grandin can't get a new one to save its life, but meanwhile Archibald of all streets gets a major balls-out interchange as though it were the 401.

[bomberjet]

I agree, option 3 seems to be the best approach. In terms of not demolishing the residential neighbourhood. Option 5 is the best overall option in my eyes, but destroys all the homes, etc. there. Minus the at grade rail crossing for the ramp.

I wonder how all the businesses in the area feel. The Great Canadian Oil Change is only a couple years old. Tims Hortons, Co-op etc. will need to go for most of the options. Of course the Chalet would be gone. So option 5 would limit the demolition of some of those businesses, but increase the residential demolition numbers.

Edit: I've changed my mind and think option 3 is best.

[bomberjet]

[bomberjet]

Looks like option 3 is the preferred option as well. It shows that option as the proposed design in the open house, but doesn't really say. Only part I don't like about it is the underpass. Should be an overpass, especially with Dugald drain. Likely need some kind of pumping station just for the drain, nevermind the underpass. Not sure what utilities are in there either. Look at the mess going on at Plessis right now..

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by esquire

Option 3 seems to make the most sense to me... direct, cuts out the Lagimodiere multiplexing problem, and takes a route that avoids going into the middle of the industrial area and might allow for higher speeds.

It is comical to some degree that these scenarios all involve a big new interchange. Bishop Grandin can't get a new one to save its life, but meanwhile Archibald of all streets gets a major balls-out interchange as though it were the 401.

Ya no kidding. Is Marion/Archibald really the city's worst choke point? So many intersections along Lag and Bishop that should take priority. Don't get me wrong though..I am happy to see the city is actually mentioning an interchange anywhere..gives me some hope for the future.

[bomberjet]

I totally agree there are more pressing location for a road/road interchange. The problem here is with the railway grade separation. So instead of doing it stupidly like Plessis, they're doing it properly with the interchange.

This is actually a bad spot during the rush hour. CP is constantly switching through the crossing. And a lot of people use this route to get downtown or crosstown. My boss lives out Highway 15. So instead of taking Lag to Bishop, he'll go through downtown. Which takes him right through the area. He is one of many many people doing the same. Also going the other way. There's basically two exits from St. B. One is Provencher. This is the other. So IMO the interchange is warranted.

Again, obviously Lag, Bishop, Chief need some of these too!

[roccerfeller]

I'm pleasantly surprised with the proposals, makes it more likely that grade separation can occur elsewhere for Wpg in the future.

My impression whenever on that road was always that it needed an overhaul, especially at the somewhat dangerous rue Archibald and rue Marion intersection, and the rail way crossing.

Option 3 looks to address many bottlenecks there.

Regarding the businesses, could they not theoretically just relocate somewhere further down Archibald in that area? I imagine opening up a new Tim hortons would still work out in the end

[Cyro]

Options 1-5, make your selection, whether based on the expropriation/relocation of residential property or commercial and it's potential effect on the surrounding area.

This(below) is the most important aspect of the plan.

All 5 alignment options:
Include a Marion Street underpass at the CPR Emerson rail crossing, which eliminates delays and improves safety

I'm ecstatic. Now, get it done.

[bomberjet]

The more I think about it, the more I change my mind. All options are 6 lanes by the way, which shouldn't be overlooked.



In options 1-4 they have Archibald as the major, Dugald as the minor. As shown on that image. Seems it should be the other way, as Dugald would have more potential for higher speeds. Looks like it could fit there.

But at the same time, there's lights on Dugald anyways. No lights on Archibald anywhere close, so it's good in that sense. Archibald actually has potential from Fermor, only two lights.

Then again, put the interchange at Lag as an overpass. Normal diamond or whatever. That would be amazing. It would clear up that whole stretch of Lag. Build the underpass at CPR Emerson with Archibald and Dugald as an intersection, like it basically is now. Improves that area quite a bit. Almost the best of both worlds.

Interesting in option 5, there is no residential demolition east of the river. I always thought they would be completely gone in that scenario. I also like how option 5 is an overpass. So if I had to choose, it'd be option 3 still since it's completely separated from the rail. Option 5 has that stupid ramp at grade, otherwise I'd pick 5.

[Danny D Oh]

Archibald north of Marion is basically undrivable. I've driven on former wagon trails which haven't been tended in 150 years that are smoother. Just some basic care for that road would be nice.

I often drive through that intersection during at least one rush hour per day, and it's not even the worst intersection on my commute. I don't believe it needs any extreme changes other than basic road maintenance, maybe restricting left turns off Marion, make people use Lag/Dawson to access whatever the neighbourhood between Windsor Park and St B is called. I wait a few minutes for a train maybe once a month. It's really not that bad.

I'd prefer these type of improvements to Regent/Lag, Lag/Grassie, Lag/Reenders. They just built a throughway in the CPT, and couldn't put together something like this for the intersections with Lag or Henderson, but they are going to potentially build an interchange at Archibald/Marion? Very odd.

I'm guessing they haven't figured out how to pay for this yet, so in the end it will likely be something completely different.

[kent_eh]

I was looking around this area in Google Map, and I spotted this at the north end of Nicholas.

Is it just me, or is this a figure-8 dirt trace track?

[steveosnyder]

Originally Posted by kent_eh

I was looking around this area in Google Map, and I spotted this at the north end of Nicholas.

Is it just me, or is this a figure-8 dirt trace track?

I think that is the land owned by Speedway International -- where the big racing fuel explosion happened a few years (maybe a year and a half) ago. It wouldn't surprise me if they had a track on the land.

[Riverman]

Originally Posted by kent_eh

I was looking around this area in Google Map, and I spotted this at the north end of Nicholas.

Is it just me, or is this a figure-8 dirt trace track?

Yes, probably a little private MX track.