NEW JERSEY | Liberty World Trade Center -TTII| 1,515 FT / 462 M | 115 FLOORS | VISION - Page 6

TwinTowersForever · #**101** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 5:42 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGII

Okayyyy.....so it is actually a fake 1 WTC that has billions of dollars worth of investment behind and that I see is a hundred plus feet above the ground?

I have a question: are you crazy?

Yes I am. Im not an 100% expert but the Twin Towers II could take over whats been done and is also paid for with the money being put into the Freedumb Tower. We'll just have to see. The architect is holding summits with the politicians and builders and media and other important people to discuss it. Idk all the details but it will be in early sepember. Plus the Twin Towers Alliance is going to have something on the 12th that will show the crooked politicians what they've done to screw up the WTC.

TwinTowersForever · #**102** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 5:43 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGII

Okay, great. But we asked for specific, hard evidence to support your claims and that Today Show segment is insufficient in supplying any answers.

Here is his facebook account. Ask him yourself.

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/p...4261083&ref=ts

CGII · #**103** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 5:44 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGII

I have a question: are you crazy?

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwinTowersForever

Yes I am.

Thread over.

TwinTowersForever · #**104** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 5:48 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CGII

Thread over.

Hmm we'll see who's crazy in a month or so.

http://www.twintowersalliance.com/pe.../forward-march

TwinTowersForever · #**105** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 5:54 AM**

Also the retired fire chief can tell you how horrible the current memorial and situation is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0SVxCNFwHU

wisla_krakow · #**106** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 6:12 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by @KyleDavid13

If you know buildings/skyscrapers/architecture then you know that every building has its story. The Twin Towers had a great story that every New Yorker grabbed and added too. America grew to love these two towers and use them as an icon of the American economic system...then to an American icon. They transformed New York and made a new standard for skyscrapers all across. The Twin Towers II plan must be built. The Freedom Tower (I refuse to call it 1 World Trade Center) is nice but doesn't fit into Lower Manhattan. I would love to see the building be built somewhere else besides Ground Zero. (Uptown, Brooklyn, Queens) New York can expand their buildings..they have 5 boroughs and Manhattan does have limited room.

daquin13!!?!?!?!?!?!
omg, it's like it's 2008 all over again!

plinko · #**107** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 6:33 AM**

Remember when we had a whole sub-forum for this crap?

So a 70yr old architect who worked on the original towers was asked 'how could you rebuild the towers and add all kinds of safety features' and he comes up with a basic idea. This idea as a problem solving exercise was quite interesting, but did horrible injustices to the detailing, aesthetics, and spirit of the original design, not to mention the fact that it's just boring.

A few crazy conspiracy theorists decided this plan is the absolute and anything different would be bending over to terrorism. Ya know, this being 'Merica and such. They start a website and start circulating petitions. Lots of people sign up because MOST people don't really understand the logistics of building a house, let alone building twin 110 story towers over two subway lines, a myriad of infrastructure, all wrapped up in a bathtub foundation that holds back a large waterway.

Sure, lots of people wanted the towers back, lots of really smart people. But the majority of people who actually understand the logistics of such undertakings, and also have an appreciation for the art and engineering of architecture (not to mention economics which is a whole other discussion), recognized the opportunity to do something different.

Is it the best plan? Maybe
Is it a good plan? Absolutely
Is it economically sound? Moreso than a rebuild would be, otherwise rebuilding might have actually been considered by the peeps with the $$$
Is it taking too long? Anybody who honestly expected this to NOT be a political clusterfuck doesn't understand what it takes to get anything built, let alone a project under such a microscope.
Does it 'restore' the skyline? 4 supertalls? Uh, yeah...
Does it mean the terrorists will win? Win what? They kicked us square in the balls when we weren't looking. Get over it.

The thing that continually fascinates me about the TwinTowersAlliance and all these groups that think they have some say in the process is that they actually think they have a say. This is not a public project, regardless of the PA's involvement, not even addressing Silverstein's leases and rights to build. The only reason any politicians were involved had to do with PR value.

So here we are, 8 years later, and now the TTA is somehow going to enlighten us next month with what? The same re-hashed crap they've been spewing since 2002? Except now all of the infrastructure for the entire complex has been laid which conflicts with their precious re-build plan?

Sure, I can see the PA and Silverstein just having an epiphany on September 12th, trashing everything they've done so far ($billions in infrastructure improvements and foundations), and saying 'yeah we had it wrong, why didn't we do this in 2002?'

Why won't that happen?

Economic reality. Any reality. The TTA has no say, they never did. I'm an architect with a facebook page...hmmm, maybe I should submit a proposal by September 12th, I'm sure I can come up with a hack design for that site that completely disregards everything that's been completed over the last 8 years.

TwinTowersForever, it was over in 2002 when you were 8 years old, get over it...

JDRCRASH · #**108** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 6:45 AM**

Even though it's too late, I admit, I would have loved this:

M II A II R II K · #**109** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 12:04 PM**

We saw that in the movie "Click"

Dac150 · #**110** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 1:52 PM**

So do all of you Twin Tower Alliance folk meet in one of those underwater swamp headquarter things like the League of Villains did in that old show the Super Friends?

BStyles · #**111** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CudaAhBuda_NYC

What are youuuuu talking about. I didnt say nothin about diggin up, I don't know why you assumed that

all I said was continue from were they left off w/ the Freedom Tower foundation and build WTC 5. That's what I meant when I say convert into WTC 5.

Exactly. the foundations are over 100 feet above street level, and are still rising, even though you keep saying there will be change. There's no way you can convert that into an office building without digging something up, and you can't re-use concrete.

Before you guys post any more ''changes'' take into consideration what I said a few times before. The PA, the owner of the site, not the builders, and the leaseholder, Larry Silverstein, are NOT turning back, and rebuilding the twin towers. Is that clear enough? I told you, that these engineers have to run these plans by them before anything gets built, and I haven't herd you guys mention that yet.

Here's a site plan that I whipped up, just in case some of you need reference of the problems to this plan.

1 WTC sits directly on top of the PATH, which isn't very smart, structurally-wise and transportation-wise. the site has been dug up, and those materials can't be regained, and tower 4 is still rising, about to catch up to the Freedom Tower.

You guys are running out of time. The superstructure begins to rise by this fall on both towers, and you can't demolish that, especially at the WTC.

Lecom · #**112** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:45 PM**

^Good site plan. As it rightfully indicates, the site of Gardner's 1WTC sits over active PATH tracks while the site of Gardner's 2WTC is presently occupied by 150 Greenwich St, also known as 4WTC, Greenwich Street and the subway line beneath, and a southeastern portion of the memorial; all three abovementioned projects are already at street level. The only things that coincide in the current plan and Gardner's proposal are the "proposed streets" as indicated above.

M II A II R II K · #**113** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:51 PM**

And there's a slogan

Quote:

“We Cannot Fix the Big Apple With a Lemon.”

And it is claimed that the current plan is unworthy, but by the looks of this picture it sure looks okay to me, including several supertalls.

Lecom · #**114** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:55 PM**

Aww, this thread is just like '06

source: me

theWatusi · #**115** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:55 PM**

who's that strapping fellow in the Mets hat?

Lecom · #**116** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by theWatusi

who's that strapping fellow in the Mets hat?

Hint: not TalA (who grew a beard and is posing on the left)

Dac150 · #**117** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 2:59 PM**

Wow.

wong21fr · #**118** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 3:33 PM**

I love how a guy who isn't even a liscensed architect is trying to run with this. Maybe he should actually build up his qualifications instead of bulding additional models.

God, I hope when the time comes to design the memorial for the two events that proceeded 9/11, also known as OEF and OIF, there isn't so much whiny bullshit from people who have no qualification to voice an opinion. Anyone who actually saw the remains of the WTC right afet 9/11 knows that a memorial shouldn't try to replicate what was there. And why the hell should a memorial have a VIP suite for the families?

TwinTowersForever · #**119** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 3:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wong21fr

I love how a guy who isn't even a liscensed architect is trying to run with this. Maybe he should actually build up his qualifications instead of bulding additional models.

God, I hope when the time comes to design the memorial for the two events that proceeded 9/11, also known as OEF and OIF, there isn't so much whiny bullshit from people who have no qualification to voice an opinion. Anyone who actually saw the remains of the WTC right afet 9/11 knows that a memorial shouldn't try to replicate what was there. And why the hell should a memorial have a VIP suite for the families?

He's not some random huy off the street. This excerpt from the wtc2011 site explains his qualifications

"Kenneth L. Gardner, a graduate of Rutgers College of Engineering specializing in structural design, worked on various design projects with the late Herbert Belton, A.I.A. For more than 20 years, Mr. Gardner has built design and marketing models of some of the most prominent construction projects in New York and New Jersey, including The Trump Organization, The Related Companies, and The Macklowe Organization. "

CGII · #**120** Posted **Aug 20, 2009, 3:51 PM**

from curbed:

Port Authority Finally Finishing Up

The Port Authority has completed site prep and infrastructure work for all three of the towers that will rise from the East Bathtub at the World Trade Center site—that's Towers 2, 3, and 4, for those that like things to be numbered—and they'll finally turn over full site control to developer Larry Silverstein "in the next few days." Glad tidings! And a mere eight months since the Authority had to start shelling out $300k a day to Silverstein in penalties—a total that comes to, in our very rough estimate, $67.5 million. Though of course, none of this resolve the slapfight between the PA and Silverstein, who also wants the Authority to help finance construction on the towers. The Architects Newspaper has a nice behind-the-scenes take on the current insanity.

Meantime, the memorial portion of the site is moving along, and officials vow to have portions of it—the waterfall memorials and 75% of the of the white oak trees—ready for the 10th anniversary in 2011. Says a Port Authority exec, cryptically, "With all the progress that is taking place on the site, it's not even Ground Zero anymore."