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  #1  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2023, 10:27 AM
thenoflyzone thenoflyzone is offline
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Originally Posted by zahav View Post

GDL is actually a very major city in Mexico, and Vancouver has a big Mexican population many of whom are from that region, so it makes sense. Not for Flair though lol, it's an odd addition coming from them, it would be more something for AC or AM honestly.
Mexico recently regained CAT 1 status from the FAA, enabling once again Mexican airlines to start new US routes, and they are busy doing just that.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/231031-amfy2324us

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/231010-amjan24us

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/231006-vbns24us

It will be extremely unlikely - in the short to medium term - to see a Mexican carrier starting a new route to Canada, especially from anywhere other than MEX (or NLU).

I can confirm the interest was there from a certain Mexican carrier to launch service to YUL from an unserved destination, but this was all before the FAA gave back CAT 1 status to Mexico. Different priorities now for these airlines. They were unable to add service to a major market for more than 2 years. They need to catch up with that first.

Best bet for service to places like MTY or GDL in the short/medium term is a Canadian carrier. Once YVR starts getting AC A220s based there, there is potential for routes like these.

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Originally Posted by zahav View Post
AC seems to be snubbing YYZ in favour of YUL, it's insane the route growth they've had at YUL, and to all over (India, Africa, Europe of course).
Did you see their Q3 results. Seems the strategy is working !
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  #2  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2023, 4:48 PM
casper casper is offline
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Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
....
Best bet for service to places like MTY or GDL in the short/medium term is a Canadian carrier. Once YVR starts getting AC A220s based there, there is potential for routes like these.
Well, that is interesting. Any thoughts on when AC will start basing A220 in Vancouver.

Wikipedia claims AC has 33 on property and another 27 to be delivered over the next three years. They must be getting close to the point where YVR will start having its own A220?
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  #3  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2023, 7:52 PM
nname nname is offline
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Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
It will be extremely unlikely - in the short to medium term - to see a Mexican carrier starting a new route to Canada, especially from anywhere other than MEX (or NLU).
You know that AM flies 4x daily to YVR during peak winters, right? And they recently increase YVR to at least 3x daily through the rest of the winter season. This was after the FAA announcement.

Typically AM will have summer seasonal increase for YVR. Would they keep the 3x daily through the entire summer, or increase to 4x, or move the additional daily to another airport such as GDL?

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Originally Posted by casper View Post
Well, that is interesting. Any thoughts on when AC will start basing A220 in Vancouver.

Wikipedia claims AC has 33 on property and another 27 to be delivered over the next three years. They must be getting close to the point where YVR will start having its own A220?
Normally AC will have 1 or 2 A220 flights out of YVR for the winter season, but not this or the next winter though. In the current schedule, YVR seems to be getting quite a lot of A320 for W24...

Last edited by nname; Nov 5, 2023 at 8:07 PM.
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  #4  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2023, 8:04 PM
thenoflyzone thenoflyzone is offline
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Originally Posted by nname View Post
You know that AM flies 4x daily to YVR during peak winters, right?
Yes. I believe they announced it a few weeks after regaining CAT 1. Which means they were already planning it way before then. They've increased service to YVR, YUL and YYZ for the last couple of peak winters I believe. I wouldn't expect anything else to Canada besides that for a little bit.

Adding an extra rotation during a few weeks in Dec/Jan isn't the same as adding a whole new route, year round, especially from a secondary Mexican market.

Last edited by thenoflyzone; Nov 5, 2023 at 8:15 PM.
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  #5  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2023, 8:20 PM
nname nname is offline
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Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
Yes. They've increased service to YVR, YUL and YYZ for the last couple of peak winters I believe. I wouldn't expect anything else to Canada besides that for a little bit.

Adding an extra rotation during a few weeks in Dec/Jan isn't the same as adding a whole new route, year round, especially from a secondary Mexican market.
For YVR, it's more than a few weeks actually.

S22: 2x daily Apr, 3x daily May-Oct
W22: 2x daily Nov, 3x daily Dec-Jan, 2x daily Feb-Mar
S23: 3x daily Apr-Oct
W23: 2x daily Nov, 3->4x daily Dec-Jan, 3x daily Feb-Mar
S24: 3x daily Apr-

So compare to last winter, YVR will get an additional flight from Dec 1 to the end of the W23 season. The question is would YVR keep that additional flight for next summer, or if AM want to fly 4x daily on a route, or split it 3/1 to a different route.

But AM is probably mostly going for connecting traffic though, and it have monopoly of those traffic out of YVR for central and South America for everyone who don't wish to connect in US or go out of the way to connect at YYZ/YUL and possibly connect again in South America. Unlike YYZ/YUL, CM and DM are not an option at YVR. So not sure if secondary Mexican destination is any good for that, since their network there is quite limited.

Speaking of CM, looks like they are increasing YYZ/YUL to daily starting March(?) I believe...

Last edited by nname; Nov 5, 2023 at 9:39 PM.
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  #6  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2023, 8:12 PM
thewave46 thewave46 is offline
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I am curious how Pratt and Whitney's PW1100/1500 problems are affecting Air Canada's A220s and Air Transat's A320neos.

Every time I see an article, it just seems to get worse. The geared turbofan seems like a conceptual winner, but the real-world implementation has been just woeful. Ironically, the geared portion of the engine seems to be fairly reliable; the rest of the engine has just been a headache.
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  #7  
Old Posted Nov 6, 2023, 12:28 AM
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Alexcaban Alexcaban is offline
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Originally Posted by zahav View Post
It looks like AC has isn't operating YOW-EWR at all until Jan. 8th? Is this due to the CRJ exit mentioned a few posts back?

GDL is actually a very major city in Mexico, and Vancouver has a big Mexican population many of whom are from that region, so it makes sense. Not for Flair though lol, it's an odd addition coming from them, it would be more something for AC or AM honestly. It isn't like a Phoenix or one of Flair's other sun spots, it is much more an actual city akin to Mexico City, not a resort spot at all. We tend to think of Mexico as having one major "real" city, and then a bunch of beach cities that may be large and have their own residents, but for Canadians they are very much sun getaways. I am very glad to see this add, I know many Mexican residents here will be pleased as well (and with the lower price!). But moreso, I kind of hope AC will see this and announces their own service to GDL, maybe 3 or 4 weekly (they aren't big on 2 or less frequency for non-beach destinations). Airlines tend to get competitive when someone else gets into a big market; if no one is operating it, sometimes airlines will leave it unserved thinking they aren't losing out. But all of a sudden someone else is doing it, big airlines like AC might try and edge them out. AC just started YYZ-MTY 3-4 times a week, so they obviously have secondary non-resort destinations on their radar. Who knows, I prefer AC and don't trust Flair to keep and nurture routes like this, but glad to gave it for now.

OK I know I am going to sound like a broken record, since I mentioned this on the old thread quite a bit. I am still surprised what Air Canada is doing out east. YUL had always been very popular for Francophone routes to Europe (in France, Geneva, etc.). But AC seemed very clear that YYZ was its global hub, and that's where they were going to build up. Post-covid, or maybe even before, AC seems to be snubbing YYZ in favour of YUL, it's insane the route growth they've had at YUL, and to all over (India, Africa, Europe of course). YYZ was the undisputed king for European routes other than Francophone. Now it seems they are dividing things up almost 50/50! Barcelona, Madrid, Milan, Bogota, Delhi, Sao Paulo, Buenos Aires, Cairo, Copenhagen, Stockholm, and Venice are all routes I would have thought AC would keep exclusively at YYZ, and grow as demand warranted. Yet here we are. And YYZ might be busy, but it is not THAT overcrowded that AC couldn't increase capacity there if it wanted to keep the "global hub" idea. They are not Heathrow or Schipol, if AC wanted to have all those routes at YYZ and increase frequencies, the airport could handle it. AC is levelling the international field between the two in a big way, I didn't see that coming, I thought they were really thinking to make YYZ a behemoth, but that hasn't been the case. Good for YUL, it isn't easy being a smaller airport located not far from another larger airport in the same country, the larger airport tends to reap the prize routes. But somehow AC is letting YUL take a much bigger share, I wonder if someone at YYZ pissed them off lol!

I see AC still has YVR-YQB (5x weekly) and YYC-YQB (3x weekly) scheduled for next summer on Rouge. I am surprised by this, and not sure if they will update it, but I was thinking AC would keep YVR at least on mainline like they are doing in winter. It's not like it uses a hot commodity like a 787 that would be needed for long-haul international, it's a 737 in winter. I know 5x weekly Rouge is a decent capacity boost over 3x 737, but still, using Rouge seems unnatural at YVR now lol, they went from a big presence at YVR years ago to nothing now, at all. It is this random YQB flight and that's it. Even weirder is AC keeping YYC-YQB, at 3 days at that. I cannot see any rationale for them keeping this, no inbound really on either end, and after their last cut, they went down to bare bones. It's weird to just hand over all those other major routes like LAX and FRA to others, but then keep a weird Rouge flight to Quebec.

Sorry for the long post, I went for a couple months away from the forum (not because of the forum, just personal unrelated things) and so I feel like there's a lot to say
Such heavy demand for Europe has worked in favour of YUL, 6th freedom passengers are in high demand from both YYZ/YUL, and AC is making good money.

This in turn enables AC to open complimentary routes to Europe from YUL. (In the case of ARN, YYZ service compliments YYZ ) They can double the pax they can attract in the US with good connections from YUL and a mix of strong O&D to Europe from Montreal.

Win Win

I fully expect the list of European destinations from YUL to expand even further once AC's 321XLR arrive. Which will in turn free up widebody airplanes for YVR-Europe.
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  #8  
Old Posted Nov 6, 2023, 1:13 AM
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Sounds like WS requested slots for YYZ/YHZ-Europe in S24, with DUB / EDI being specifically named.

Doesn’t mean it’ll happen (they also requested those slots for S23 as well) but it’s good to see the interest is still there.
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  #9  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 6:48 PM
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WS adding 4 new Transborder routes for S24:

Effective June 20:
WS1030 YEG 11:30 - 13:32 SFO 737 13467
WS1031 SFO 14:25 - 18:25 YEG 737 13467

Effective May 2:
WS1420 YEG 09:35 - 14:24 BNA 737 47
WS1421 BNA 15:15 - 18:29 YEG 737 47

Effective April 29:
WS1902 YEG 00:45 - 07:06 ATL 737 D
WS1029 ATL 09:05 - 11:50 YEG 737 D

Effective April 28:
WS1582 YVR 23:35 - 07:01+1 DTW 737 D
WS1583 DTW 09:00 - 1055 YVR 737 D

YEG-ATL is year-round, well the others are summer seasonal. With the latest round of red-eyes, being curious if they go after a red-eye bound for JFK too at some point.

WS has really built up its presence in ATL, going from a single daily to upwards of 5 in S24.
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  #10  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 6:58 PM
nname nname is offline
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Looks like airlines love the extended transborder hours from YVR.

Now YVR have red-eye flights departing after 2100 to JFK, BOS, ORD, IAH, DFW, ATL, MSP, CLT, DTW, plus late night departures to LAX, SFO.
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  #11  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 7:24 PM
Ozabald Ozabald is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nname View Post
Looks like airlines love the extended transborder hours from YVR.

Now YVR have red-eye flights departing after 2100 to JFK, BOS, ORD, IAH, DFW, ATL, MSP, CLT, DTW, plus late night departures to LAX, SFO.
Given the number of late US bound flights, wonder if pre-clearance hours will be extended?
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  #12  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 7:45 PM
nname nname is offline
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Given the number of late US bound flights, wonder if pre-clearance hours will be extended?
Pre-clearance already run till 23:30 starting this summer, and the last US-bound flight departs 23:55. No need to extend it further.
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  #13  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 8:04 PM
Ozabald Ozabald is online now
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Originally Posted by nname View Post
Pre-clearance already run till 23:30 starting this summer, and the last US-bound flight departs 23:55. No need to extend it further.
Didn't realize pre-clearance has been extended for S24. Appreciate the update.
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  #14  
Old Posted Nov 7, 2023, 8:05 PM
thenoflyzone thenoflyzone is offline
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Originally Posted by nname View Post
Pre-clearance already run till 23:30 starting this summer, and the last US-bound flight departs 23:55. No need to extend it further.
USCBP website says preclearance at YVR runs from 4:30AM til 12:00AM, but I wouldn’t be surprised if airlines tell passengers to make sure they pass through by 11pm.

https://www.cbp.gov/travel/preclearance
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  #15  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 1:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hollywoodcory View Post
WS adding 4 new Transborder routes for S24:

Effective June 20:
WS1030 YEG 11:30 - 13:32 SFO 737 13467
WS1031 SFO 14:25 - 18:25 YEG 737 13467

Effective May 2:
WS1420 YEG 09:35 - 14:24 BNA 737 47
WS1421 BNA 15:15 - 18:29 YEG 737 47

Effective April 29:
WS1902 YEG 00:45 - 07:06 ATL 737 D
WS1029 ATL 09:05 - 11:50 YEG 737 D

Effective April 28:
WS1582 YVR 23:35 - 07:01+1 DTW 737 D
WS1583 DTW 09:00 - 1055 YVR 737 D

YEG-ATL is year-round, well the others are summer seasonal. With the latest round of red-eyes, being curious if they go after a red-eye bound for JFK too at some point.

WS has really built up its presence in ATL, going from a single daily to upwards of 5 in S24.
Three solid destinations and two incredible hubs for YEG on WJ. Nice
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  #16  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 1:05 PM
YYCguys YYCguys is offline
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Originally Posted by Coldrsx View Post
Three solid destinations and two incredible hubs for YEG on WJ. Nice
I hope these flights don’t get Swooped! 🫣
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  #17  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 2:59 PM
Dominion301 Dominion301 is offline
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I hope these flights don’t get Swooped! 🫣
Well given that Swoop no longer exists...
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  #18  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 3:30 PM
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Well given that Swoop no longer exists...
But will someone with a bit more flair just push them out. We will see.
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  #19  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2023, 6:38 PM
YYCguys YYCguys is offline
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Originally Posted by Dominion301 View Post
Well given that Swoop no longer exists...
I meant that since the Swoop aircraft were just transferred over and haven’t yet gotten new paint/livery/cabin reconfigurations yet, unsuspecting customers may be transported on a former Swoop aircraft.
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  #20  
Old Posted Nov 9, 2023, 3:04 AM
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