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  #281  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2020, 7:31 PM
k1052 k1052 is offline
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Originally Posted by jc5680 View Post

I am open to hearing some sort of case to be made, but you've just dismissively offered SSP platitudes.

What materially was improved here by having the parking underground? More office space? Does that make the external design better, did it even change? Hell, does having some of the office space in the podium mean the office tower is actually shorter than it could have been?

What exactly is the benefit of 'active uses' in a podium above ground level if the pedestrian experience and architectural design is still good?
For me height alone isn't the end all of what makes a good building. I'd certainly take a shorter better designed and used structure with active uses over more floor count.

I don't agree at all that they create a good pedestrian experience. They deaden the streetscape. I'm entirely confident that Related is going to VE the design to a significant degree but if the program is improved like this the city comes out ahead IMO.
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  #282  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2020, 7:42 PM
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Sure, and in principle I entirely agree with you.

It's just weird to me that podiums get so reviled here when there is often a more nuanced way to evaluate them. 1 S Halsted is seemingly universally hated for its podium, meanwhile its wide arcaded sidewalk is kind of nice if you are a pedestrian.

Last edited by jc5680; Jan 10, 2020 at 8:02 PM.
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  #283  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2020, 9:32 PM
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Originally Posted by jc5680 View Post
What exactly is the benefit of 'active uses' in a podium above ground level if the pedestrian experience and architectural design is still good?
It's mostly asthetics. Where podiums have parking garages, you either see the cars and the harsh garage lighting, or there are fake windows that are just static.

Whereas with active use, the building is more dynamic. Lights are turned on and off, not every window is the same. You see people moving about, the lighting is better.

I guess it's that a parking garage feels dead, whereas inhabited space feels alive.
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  #284  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2020, 10:24 PM
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^ I've heard versions of this as well, but does it bear out if you look at it more critically? Particularly at a scale that warrants the usual podium hand wringing that happens ritually?

There are a lot of contradictory examples out there
  • Commercial buildings, still, regularly have large blocks of floors often uniformly lit. Like many parking floors in podiums you only notice this at night and they aren't especially lively outside of business hours either.
  • If you look at say, 465 N Park, the active use units haven't turned out to be all that particularly livening. Their design is kind of a homogenous blob that doesn't differentiate from the tower in a way that makes the scale on the street any more pleasant. Never mind that the building completely ignores New St as if it's an alley. It's an OK but not particularly good urban design that seems to have gotten a pass just because it checked the 'active uses in the podium' box

I get the aesthetic argument, and generally agree for instances where, for lack of a better description, the podium looks like a parking garage. But for a lot of the more recent developments I think they have been somewhere between decent and interesting and occasionally even good. Generally, architects seem to have gotten better a dealing with podiums but a lot of folks here don't seem to have moved past previously acquired notions that may no longer be as regularly true.

--

Sorry, I have probably steered this wildly off topic. Yes there is still a podium here. It is fine and probably would be just as fine if it was for the parking this development required.

Last edited by jc5680; Jan 11, 2020 at 1:57 AM.
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  #285  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2020, 12:58 AM
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This is slightly different...the podium fronts the highway....canyonaro that....there is no pedestrian experience to worry about...at least it is being used and not just parking with steel grate exhausts...and they are saving the nice building at the corner with halsted...which is around the same height of the podium...so hopefully blends in a bit
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  #286  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 8:04 PM
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Updated project approved by the chicago plan commission on 02.21.20


541'-6" Tower

231'-2" Office
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  #287  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 8:10 PM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
Updated project approved by the chicago plan commission on 02.21.20


541'-6" Tower

231'-2" Office
Nice, start date?
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  #288  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 8:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Zapatan View Post
Nice, start date?
I didn't have time to ask a Related representative, but I believe they want to begin both this and 900 W. Randolph St. sometime this summer.
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  #289  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 8:22 PM
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I didn't have time to ask a Related representative, but I believe they want to begin both this and 900 W. Randolph St. sometime this summer.
That would be amazing. I can't wait to see the impact this will have.
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  #290  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 8:44 PM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
I didn't have time to ask a Related representative, but I believe they want to begin both this and 900 W. Randolph St. sometime this summer.
900 W. Randolph likely isn't happening this summer unless they decide to back out of the proposed 80/20 deal- as they have yet to received state approval and financing from government sources for the 20% part.
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  #291  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by ChiPlanner View Post
900 W. Randolph likely isn't happening this summer unless they decide to back out of the proposed 80/20 deal- as they have yet to received state approval and financing from government sources for the 20% part.
That financing wouldn't be for the tower itself and because it's rental, I don't see how that would hold things up as those negotiations are separate.
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  #292  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2020, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Handro View Post
That would be amazing. I can't wait to see the impact this will have.
Very good news but still a bummer that this will only be close to 50 feet taller than 1 Halsted. Original height would have been a gem. Beggars cant be choosers., hope the canyon continues.
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  #293  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2020, 9:47 AM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
That financing wouldn't be for the tower itself and because it's rental, I don't see how that would hold things up as those negotiations are separate.
Um yes, yes it is. They're asking for a lot of financing for the tower because they're going for the 80/20 deal and can ask for financing.
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  #294  
Old Posted Jun 6, 2020, 2:48 PM
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I wonder what the chances are for this one now?
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  #295  
Old Posted Jun 6, 2020, 4:33 PM
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I hope so, the new design looks great, not really overly ambitious either.
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  #296  
Old Posted Jun 6, 2020, 6:03 PM
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Where did you find those renders?
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  #297  
Old Posted Jun 6, 2020, 9:32 PM
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Originally Posted by spyguy View Post

I wonder what the chances are for this one now?
I am not sure about the likelihood but, what is even going on with these renderings?

We should all be pretty used to the quasi absurd creative license taken with perspective adjustments in renderings but these are just weird.

This… huh?

Last edited by jc5680; Jun 6, 2020 at 9:42 PM.
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  #298  
Old Posted Jun 7, 2020, 3:38 AM
bhawk66 bhawk66 is offline
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^ That's accurate. Just looks funny.

The viewpoint is on the exact axis of the angled side of the building
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  #299  
Old Posted Jun 7, 2020, 4:47 AM
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Originally Posted by bhawk66 View Post
^ That's accurate. Just looks funny.

The viewpoint is on the exact axis of the angled side of the building
Go look at how distorted the surrounding buildings are in the other renderings with similarly sharp perspective. Everything is dramatically over-foreshortened.

While nothing looks 'technically' wrong if you track receding lines to their vanishing points, it does very much look like how photoshop used to unfortunately bloat landscapes when doing perspective/lens corrections. Its an odd set of choices given the early renderings had a heavy bias for showing the building from that northeast angle that used the off grid alignment of the tower to make it look quite thin.

Last edited by jc5680; Jun 7, 2020 at 2:40 PM.
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  #300  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2020, 3:05 AM
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Ugh bland architecture getting blander with the "inverted bay" windows removed from the base.

Still, these renderings make clear that this complex has NO parking podium, all parking is underground so that should be commended.
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