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  #301  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 6:43 PM
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In this globe and mail article:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle37536117/

It says:

"As of Jan. 1, 2018, China, which buys approximately two-thirds of North America's recyclables, requires that contamination levels – newspaper smeared with ketchup, plastics mixed with broken glass – can't exceed 0.5 per cent as part of its National Sword initiative."

Could a solution be just to apply some pre-sorting?
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  #302  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 6:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DizzyEdge View Post
In this globe and mail article:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle37536117/

It says:

"As of Jan. 1, 2018, China, which buys approximately two-thirds of North America's recyclables, requires that contamination levels – newspaper smeared with ketchup, plastics mixed with broken glass – can't exceed 0.5 per cent as part of its National Sword initiative."

Could a solution be just to apply some pre-sorting?
It might, but if it's not economical or environmentally friendly for the Chinese to do it, why would it make sense for us?

Essentially, we will still be able to recycle plastic, it will just cost a lot more now. The benefit is questionable.
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  #303  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 6:56 PM
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Originally Posted by milomilo View Post
It might, but if it's not economical or environmentally friendly for the Chinese to do it, why would it make sense for us?

Essentially, we will still be able to recycle plastic, it will just cost a lot more now. The benefit is questionable.
I figure for us if we just break even that would be sufficient. Of course maybe presorting wouldn't even give us that.
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  #304  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 8:30 PM
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So we only manufacture goods from raw materials? do you even know how recycling works? they take the plastic, melt it down, then make new stuff out of it. Same with metal, paper is broken down into pulp, then pressed back into sheets. The reason it goes to china is that's where most of the goods in the world are manufactured, they don't buy our recycling off us to fucking burn it there genius.
I didn't say the Chinese were burning the plastic, I was responding to your question about what WE could do with it. As Milo has stated most of the plastic is unusable for recycling into feedstock for other plastics because of the chemicals put into the plastic. So OUR choices are bury it or burn it.

We were recycling useful materials long before Blue Bins. Blue bins are full of additional wastes that are really poor recyclables. You need to educate yourself on how recycling really works, then you will see how limited our options are if China refuses to buy our recycled garbage and how inefficient blue bin collection is.

From the pickup point, most of Boston’s trash is sent to one of two incinerator operators, Wheelabrator Technologies in Saugus and Covanta, whose plants are in Haverhill and Rochester. Some of the waste travels by way of a transfer station in Lynn.

Once it reaches an incinerator, the waste is conveyed into a combustion chamber where it is burned at an extremely high temperature. The heat generated fires boilers whose steam drives power-generating turbines. The electricity they create feeds into the power grid to help light homes and offices.

The ash created by the combustion process is filtered to extract metal that can be recycled.
Some of the resulting material is used as cover material at conventional landfills, and some goes into landfills with other waste that can’t be burned.

http://newbostonpost.com/2016/03/23/...tons-trash-go/

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  #305  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 8:38 PM
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The news of China's decision to stop importing trash has had a significant impact on Edmonton's overall diversion rate, and some of the things they've been telling us about Edmonton's waste management. Many of us who depend on the diversion stats to drive any number of metrics related to waste and reclamation are really unimpressed that the city seemed to be "hiding" the true diversion rates, purported to be near the 88% mark, whereas the actual diversion rate is closer to 55%. That's not nearly as good as we were led to believe and this misinformation puts a real damper on our record and puts things like building certifications at risk of being downgraded.
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  #306  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 9:19 PM
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Originally Posted by jawagord View Post
I didn't say the Chinese were burning the plastic, I was responding to your question about what WE could do with it. As Milo has stated most of the plastic is unusable for recycling into feedstock for other plastics because of the chemicals put into the plastic. So OUR choices are bury it or burn it.

We were recycling useful materials long before Blue Bins. Blue bins are full of additional wastes that are really poor recyclables. You need to educate yourself on how recycling really works, then you will see how limited our options are if China refuses to buy our recycled garbage and how inefficient blue bin collection is.

From the pickup point, most of Boston’s trash is sent to one of two incinerator operators, Wheelabrator Technologies in Saugus and Covanta, whose plants are in Haverhill and Rochester. Some of the waste travels by way of a transfer station in Lynn.

Once it reaches an incinerator, the waste is conveyed into a combustion chamber where it is burned at an extremely high temperature. The heat generated fires boilers whose steam drives power-generating turbines. The electricity they create feeds into the power grid to help light homes and offices.

The ash created by the combustion process is filtered to extract metal that can be recycled.
Some of the resulting material is used as cover material at conventional landfills, and some goes into landfills with other waste that can’t be burned.

http://newbostonpost.com/2016/03/23/...tons-trash-go/

Sorry, the burning part should have quoted DoubleK's post above yours, as he was the one saying they burn it in China.

I get that low grade plastics are tough to recycle, that's why it all goes to China (it basically says exactly that in the article). We definitely should do something with it though, putting it in the landfill where it will basically exist forever isn't a good solution. Burning it to make electricity isn't a bad option as long as the smoke is filtered as it is in your example.
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  #307  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 9:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Calgarian View Post
Sorry, the burning part should have quoted DoubleK's post above yours, as he was the one saying they burn it in China.

I get that low grade plastics are tough to recycle, that's why it all goes to China (it basically says exactly that in the article). We definitely should do something with it though, putting it in the landfill where it will basically exist forever isn't a good solution. Burning it to make electricity isn't a bad option as long as the smoke is filtered as it is in your example.
I'm not a fan of burying the problem either, but in the case of plastic it really might be the best solution. Our primary concern right now should be CO2 emissions, and AFAIK recycling plastic is very poor for this and it's usually more energy efficient just to create new plastic. Last I heard, and this information may be out of date, was that aluminum was the only product that actually takes less energy to recycle than to create new.
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  #308  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2018, 11:52 PM
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This may be unpopular, but maybe we should tax hard-to-recycle packing materials.
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  #309  
Old Posted Jan 13, 2018, 2:50 AM
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lol, you think they are buying it off us just to bury it! that's beyond idiotic, if that was the case, we would be paying them to take it, not the other way.
The City overpays a third party to recycle the materials who turns around and pays less for someone overseas to get rid of it in any manner.
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  #310  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2018, 4:05 PM
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Originally Posted by DizzyEdge View Post
This may be unpopular, but maybe we should tax hard-to-recycle packing materials.
More taxes. That's exactly what we need.
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  #311  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2018, 5:46 AM
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More taxes. That's exactly what we need.
To be honest, DizzyEdge is correct - the only way the world will resolve its refuse problems is through government intervention.
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  #312  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2018, 4:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Chinook Arch View Post
More taxes. That's exactly what we need.
Well, it's either that or just make certain packaging illegal with fines.
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  #313  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2018, 3:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DizzyEdge View Post
Well, it's either that or just make certain packaging illegal with fines.

Agree it needs to start at the source. Packaging has to change to become easier to recycle.
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  #314  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2018, 4:16 PM
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Agree it needs to start at the source. Packaging has to change to become easier to recycle.
Agreed but when it comes down to dollars and cents, cheaper packaging will almost always win out. Nothing will really change unless forced. Cornstarch peanuts can easily replace styrofoam peanuts but how often does one see cornstarch peanuts? Same goes for cardboard packaging versus styrofoam packaging - it all comes down to cost. Recycled plastic fencing (is there such a thing) versus wood fencing. The number of things that could be manufactured from recycled materials in considerable but cost is the largest negative factor.
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  #315  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2018, 9:41 PM
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Agreed but when it comes down to dollars and cents, cheaper packaging will almost always win out. Nothing will really change unless forced. Cornstarch peanuts can easily replace styrofoam peanuts but how often does one see cornstarch peanuts? Same goes for cardboard packaging versus styrofoam packaging - it all comes down to cost. Recycled plastic fencing (is there such a thing) versus wood fencing. The number of things that could be manufactured from recycled materials in considerable but cost is the largest negative factor.
There was a Calgary company making curb stops a few years ago out of recycled plastic, but I haven't heard if they are still in operation. I would assume that the plastic curb stops would be much cheaper than concrete ones.
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  #316  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2018, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Design-mind View Post
There was a Calgary company making curb stops a few years ago out of recycled plastic, but I haven't heard if they are still in operation. I would assume that the plastic curb stops would be much cheaper than concrete ones.
Is this company you're thinking of? They're based in Lethbridge but appear to make a lot of products out of recycled plastic and timber.

http://altplastic.com/
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  #317  
Old Posted Jan 22, 2018, 4:23 AM
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Is this company you're thinking of? They're based in Lethbridge but appear to make a lot of products out of recycled plastic and timber.

http://altplastic.com/
And their web site's suggested retail pricing reveals the problem - I can go down to Home Depot and pick up an 8 foot treated 4x4 for $11.30 while the suggested retail price for Alt Plastics's 8 foot 4x4 is at least $34.65. It will be very difficult to convince the general public to pay triple the price for a recycled plastic product when the treated wood product will easily last 10-15 years if not longer.
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  #318  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Corndogger View Post
Is this company you're thinking of? They're based in Lethbridge but appear to make a lot of products out of recycled plastic and timber.

http://altplastic.com/
This might be them, as it looks like the products they showed. It was quite a few years ago when one of the local news stations did a story on them.
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  #319  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2018, 11:09 PM
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Floating Bridges

Could our recycling be used to make floaters for floating bridges? Probably a dumb question but maybe we have an engineer here. I mean huge bridges by the way. I know they are using recycled plastic to make smaller non-floating bridges. Looking forward to the recycling future!!

Video Link
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  #320  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2018, 8:06 PM
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Not a dumb question per se, but if you’d read the article it says that newer plastic is much cheaper thsn recycled plastic, so the answer is yes it’s possible but realistically know it isn’t.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kw5150 View Post
Could our recycling be used to make floaters for floating bridges? Probably a dumb question but maybe we have an engineer here. I mean huge bridges by the way. I know they are using recycled plastic to make smaller non-floating bridges. Looking forward to the recycling future!!

Video Link
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