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  #13721  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2019, 5:55 PM
CityTech CityTech is offline
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We already exceed the TTC subway and Montreal metro for reliability. No train is going to work perfectly 100% of the time.
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  #13722  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2019, 6:50 PM
MalcolmTucker MalcolmTucker is offline
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Originally Posted by CityTech View Post
We already exceed the TTC subway and Montreal metro for reliability. No train is going to work perfectly 100% of the time.
What the system needs is resiliency: being able to more quickly recover from small incidents.
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  #13723  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2019, 7:14 PM
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Originally Posted by CityTech View Post
We already exceed the TTC subway and Montreal metro for reliability. No train is going to work perfectly 100% of the time.
True, but you also have to look at how preventable the breakdowns are. Older trains are going to be less reliable no mater how well maintained they are. When the issues are caused by poor design (computer bugs and flimsy doors) the issues need to be addressed and not just shoved under the rug with the excuse that all systems have reliability issues.

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Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker View Post
What the system needs is resiliency: being able to more quickly recover from small incidents.
Agreed. For one, when a train does need to go out of service, there should be a procedure for having it run empty back to the garage without having to slow down the entire line.
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  #13724  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2019, 2:50 PM
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Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post
True, but you also have to look at how preventable the breakdowns are. Older trains are going to be less reliable no mater how well maintained they are. When the issues are caused by poor design (computer bugs and flimsy doors) the issues need to be addressed and not just shoved under the rug with the excuse that all systems have reliability issues.



Agreed. For one, when a train does need to go out of service, there should be a procedure for having it run empty back to the garage without having to slow down the entire line.
That is not always possible.

This morning, there was a switch issue that shut down the C-Line between Blair and St. Laurent. There are still too many problems and they seem to most often arise during peak hours.
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  #13725  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2019, 3:18 PM
SidetrackedSue SidetrackedSue is offline
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post

This morning, there was a switch issue that shut down the C-Line between Blair and St. Laurent.
Again. It feels like that's the alert I receive most often. My guess is there's a problem switch there that isn't getting any better.

And speaking of alerts, there appears to be a problem sending to gmail accounts so I get them often hours after they were sent (but the time stamp is the current time.) Or I'll get an all-clear when I never got the R1 in service comment. Last night, it talked about a power outage at Blair so those with mobility issues were required to take a para Transpo bus around to their stop because there were no escalators or elevators (train was running fine.)

I checked on twitter and there was no tweet about that at all. Nor anything from Ottawa Hydro about an outage in the area. Which made me wonder if it was a test message that got sent by accident.

For now, I'm using OccasionalTransport, #OttawaLRT and the OCT tweets to know if things are running well. Communications are still not running well enough to be relied upon (nor is the 560 system which was down again for maintenance last week.)
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  #13726  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2019, 4:54 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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The issue this morning seemed to resolve fairly quickly. I arrived at St. Laurent just as a bunch of R1s from the east did. The platform clogged, then quickly unclogged as a train came back into service westbound.

Pro tip, people: when this happens, you can always wait for the second train back in service. Sheesh.
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  #13727  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 12:54 AM
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RTG outscored competitors to win Stage 1 LRT contract, but evaluators noted downfalls
While the city released the Stage 2 O-Train procurement scores earlier this year, it has never released the Stage 1 procurement scores.

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Updated: December 5, 2019


The Rideau Transit Group received the best technical and financial scores in the Stage 1 LRT contract competition, but newly released records show bid evaluators recorded flaws in the proposal on several fronts, including on construction, design and communications.

The Stage 1 procurement scoring documents, obtained by this newspaper through access to information, show RTG beat the two other shortlisted bidders for the $2.1-billion construction contract and long-term maintenance deal, with evaluators in 2012 ranking RTG the top bidder based on the consortium’s final procurement score. RTG met the minimum technical scoring thresholds for the massive project and the strength of its financial bid secured a win.

While the city released the Stage 2 O-Train procurement scores earlier this year, it has never released the Stage 1 procurement scores.

The Stage 1 contract scoring offered comments on each of the 19 technical categories, and RTG largely received positive comments from evaluators. “Strong team,” “strong approach with the use of sophisticated tools,” “very good overall strategies” and “solid understanding” of risks were some of the comments recorded by evaluators.

However, the five-member evaluation team noted several negative attributes of all the bids, including RTG’s bid.

On RTG’s risk management plan, evaluators observed that the bid “did not adequately describe the tunnel risks” and “did not describe management responsibilities.” Evaluators saw a “weak” environmental management plan and a tracking system for environmental incidents that was “lacking detail.”

When it came to RTG’s approach on utilities, evaluators noticed a “lack of detail on drawings,” and on geotechnical information, they noticed RTG’s plan was “lacking detail on impacts to adjacent structures.”

The design evaluation prompted evaluators to observe no discussion by RTG on public art and an urban design proposal that had a “narrative focused almost solely on NCC approvals.” Evaluators didn’t find good descriptions of station integrations not subject to approvals by the National Capital Commission.

While evaluators agreed RTG demonstrated a “good understanding” of specifications on the LRT guideway, they noted a “weak description of design considerations for snow clearing and storage.”

A review of RTG’s tunnel design prompted evaluators to write, “addresses understanding of project requirements however, results of analysis and proposed solutions represent project risks.” Evaluators, for example, saw that RTG didn’t believe mitigation measures for adjacent structures were required for anticipated ground settlement.

RTG received a higher score on its communications plan compared to the other two bidders, but evaluators saw a “poor approach to government relations” and that RTG had “little demonstrated experience for government and media relations.”

The city on Thursday was unable to respond by deadline on how it made sure to mitigate the negatives in RTG’s bid after the consortium won the contract.

RTG’s main partners are SNC-Lavalin, ACS Infrastructure Canada Inc. and EllisDon.

The other two shortlisted bidders were Ottawa Transit Partners (Vinci, Acciona, Aecon, Bombardier) and Rideau Transit Partners (Bouygues Travaux Publics, Brookfield Financial, Fiera Axium Infrastructure, Parsons, Colas Rail, Johnson Controls).

The request for proposals required minimum technical, design, construction and maintenance scores of 70 per cent. The financial plan required a minimum score of 60 per cent.

The consensus technical scores for the bidders were close. RTG did best at 79.83 per cent, followed by Ottawa Transit Partners at 78.98 per cent and Rideau Transit Partners at 78.28 per cent.

RTG easily walked away with the top-ranked spot with its financial score of 98.5 per cent.

As it turns out, the Stage 1 procurement wasn’t like the controversial Stage 2 procurement of the Trillium Line expansion where the winning bidder, SNC-Lavalin, won the contract by having a below-threshold technical score but a strong financial score, which carried the company to victory.

For the Stage 1 procurement, all three bidders achieved at least 70 per cent on almost all of the 19 technical sub-categories. The one sub-70 score was Rideau Transit Partners’ 68 for safety management and certification and regulatory matters.

RTG’s technical sub-category scores ranged from 72 per cent on the low end for its utilities submission to 85 per cent in areas of risk management and safety management.

Today, the heat is on RTG when it comes to its maintenance of the LRT system — for which the consortium is receiving more than $2 billion over a 30-year term for Stage 1, a sum that increases substantially when Stage 2 LRT maintenance is included — even though the consortium easily met, and exceeded, the minimum 70-per-cent score during Stage 1 procurement.

RTG scored 80 per cent on its maintenance and rehabilitation plan, and the other shortlisted bidders scored 80 per cent (Rideau Transit Partners) and 86 per cent (Ottawa Transit Partners).

Evaluators noted that they didn’t see a preliminary asset management plan or handover plan in RTG’s bid, and they described RTG’s approach to ensuring compliance with regulatory inspections and testing as “marginal,” but their overall comment was that RTG’s strength was having maintenance staff involved from the beginning of testing and startup activities.

The city announced this week it’s hiring outside experts to make sure RTG is properly maintaining the rail system after more than two months of unreliable LRT service.

jwilling@postmedia.com
twitter.com/JonathanWilling

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...-bid-documents
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  #13728  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 3:10 AM
Gat-Train Gat-Train is offline
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post

This morning, there was a switch issue that shut down the C-Line between Blair and St. Laurent. There are still too many problems and they seem to most often arise during peak hours.
That station is cursed. Twice I have dropped my coffee mug in there.
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  #13729  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 3:32 AM
TransitZilla TransitZilla is offline
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Originally Posted by SidetrackedSue View Post
And speaking of alerts, there appears to be a problem sending to gmail accounts so I get them often hours after they were sent (but the time stamp is the current time.) Or I'll get an all-clear when I never got the R1 in service comment.
I get the same issue on Gmail. I'm not sure if it's specific to Gmail or all e-mail in general, but many of the alerts are delayed by hours. The text alerts come through right away.

Quote:
Last night, it talked about a power outage at Blair so those with mobility issues were required to take a para Transpo bus around to their stop because there were no escalators or elevators (train was running fine.)

I checked on twitter and there was no tweet about that at all. Nor anything from Ottawa Hydro about an outage in the area. Which made me wonder if it was a test message that got sent by accident.
Hydro Ottawa did tweet about a power outage in Beacon Hill-Cyrville on Wednesday Dec 4... the 1st tweet was at 12:14 pm and it was announced as resolved at 1:06 pm. That's about the same time as OC was announcing a power outage at Blair.

The good thing this shows is that a localized power outage has no impact on train service.
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  #13730  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2019, 7:39 PM
PHrenetic PHrenetic is offline
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Smelly Day.

Re: CBC article : LRT sewer snafu a real stinker, city says
Amanda Pfeffer · CBC · Posted: Dec 07, 2019 5:00 AM ET | Last Updated:......

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...tion-1.5387329

Quote:
Sewage has been seeping into the LRT tunnel since before its completion, according to rail construction program director Michael Morgan.

"During the construction of the tunnel, a municipal sewer in proximity to Parliament Station was punctured by a rock anchor," Morgan explained in an email to CBC.
The city discovered the puncture on Aug. 9 during a routine camera inspection of the sewer, he said.

The Confederation Line opened to the public more than a month later.
Rideau Transit Group (RTG) was tasked with developing a plan to deal with the issue and begin repairs on Nov. 4.
The work was supposed to wrap up by Nov. 28, but Morgan said the new target date is Dec. 13.
...ok...WHO knew WHAT, how much did they know, and WHEN did they know it ?

Poo!
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  #13731  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2019, 11:00 PM
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Jamaican-Phoenix Jamaican-Phoenix is offline
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Well, that explains the smell people were talking about. XD XD XD
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  #13732  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2019, 11:58 AM
IntoTheCore IntoTheCore is offline
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I walked into Parliament station with my two-year-old on Saturday. While I don't have the best sense of smell in the world, she immediately started saying over and over, "It smells not good!" until we were on the train.
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  #13733  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2019, 2:23 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
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Originally Posted by PHrenetic View Post
Smelly Day.

Re: CBC article : LRT sewer snafu a real stinker, city says
Amanda Pfeffer · CBC · Posted: Dec 07, 2019 5:00 AM ET | Last Updated:......

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...tion-1.5387329



...ok...WHO knew WHAT, how much did they know, and WHEN did they know it ?

Poo!
The course of events in this article is exactly as I described in this forum last month, lol
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  #13734  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2019, 7:01 PM
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Interesting article, though some information is off (station names, captions, figures, locations, etc.)

Quote:
High Capacity Light Rail

Written by William C. Vantuono, Editor-in-Chief
December 9, 2019
Railway Age




[IMG]RAILWAY AGE, DECEMBER 2019 ISSUE: If legendary New York Yankees catcher Yogi Berra were to ride Ottawa’s new Confederation Line, he would say—provided he was familiar with the old North Shore’s Electroliners or Philadelphia Suburban Transportation Co.’s Liberty Liners—“It’s déjà vu all over again.”[/IMG]

Berra’s famous malapropisms aside, OC Transpo may have come to a fork in the road and taken it in selecting what is best described as hybrid rail transit technology for the Confederation Line. In the traditional sense, it’s not light rail. Nor is it rapid transit. It’s High Capacity Light Rail, or HCLR, to coin a new acronym. But because a portion, in Ottawa’s Central Business District, is underground, some at OC Transpo call it High Capacity Light Subway (HCLS).

Suffice to say, the Confederation Line—with up to 180,000 weekday riders, the busiest single-line LRT in North America—combines characteristics of both:
  • Four-section-articulated, 100% low-floor, 49-meter (160.8 feet)-long, 600-person-capacity Alstom Citadis Spirit vehicles, operated in pairs totaling 98 meters (321.6 feet). Eventually, they will be extended to 118 meters (387 feet) by adding a fifth section to one of the cars in each trainset. The vehicles have an on-demand door-opening mode, activated by the driver, for use in extreme cold to assist in maintaining the vehicle’s internal temperature. Passengers can activate the doors when the vehicle is stopped in a station. OC Transpo’s vehicles have been compared to the Electroliners, as they are similar in size and configuration.
  • Continuous ATC (Automatic Train Control) and ATO (Automatic Train Operation) with driverless capability through an RF (radio frequency)-based Thales SelTrac™ moving-block CBTC (Communications-Based Train Control) system. RF antennas are located at both ends of the trainset; transponders determine vehicle position. Speed sensors and accelerometers determine fine positioning. Wayside RF antennas are spaced 200 meters (656 feet) apart, with overlap redundancy to ensure continuous signal propagation. It is the latest iteration of SelTrac™.




  • Headways of approximately 4 minutes, 7 seconds with the current 13-trainset fleet. Four additional trainsets, bringing the Citadis Spirit fleet to 17 (34 cars), will reduce headways to approximately 3 minutes, 20 seconds. A full complement of 19 trainsets will offer even tighter headways (the CBTC system is capable of supporting 1 minute, 45 seconds).
  • Maximum operating speed of 80 kph (50 mph). No highway-rail grade crossings.
  • 8,000 PPHPD (people per hour, per direction) capacity, increasing to 11,000 once all vehicles are in service.


Station information display with receptacles for waste and various types of recyclables—a sustainable standard in Canada. U.S. transit systems should do the same.

The Confederation Line (Line 1) opened to revenue passengers on Sept. 14, 2019. The name reflected the original hope of starting service in 2017, the 150th anniversary of Canada becoming a nation. The project cost an estimated C$2.1 billion, making it the largest infrastructure project in Ottawa’s history. The bulk of the cost was for construction, as most of the property needed was publicly owned.


A wetsbound train pulls into underground Rideau Centre Station in Ottawa’s Central Business District.

Ottawa signed a 30-year DBFM (Design-Build-Finance-Maintain) agreement with the Rideau Transit Group (SNC-Lavalin, ACS Infrastructure Canada Inc. and EllisDon). OC Transpo operates the system with its own employees. Ottawa City Council approved the Confederation Line in December 2012, with construction beginning the following year. This followed many years of study and debate, including the awarding, then cancellation, of a contract for a completely different route to south Ottawa.



OC Transpo Operations Control Center Manager Joel Lemieux explains the Confederation Line dispatching display. The Center controls all OC Transpo rail, bus and paratransit services.

The argument frequently arose as to whether or not Ottawa had the population to warrant a rail transit system. However, steady growth—population has doubled, from 500,000 30 years ago to 1 million today—coupled with the lack of a comprehensive urban expressway system, ultimately green-lighted the project.

The Confederation Line’s western half is built in a converted BRT (bus rapid transit) right-of-way. During the 1970s and 1980s, Ottawa had built an extensive BRT system, dubbed the Transitway. The western section of this was built on an abandoned Canadian Pacific line. Clearances, stations and bridges were designed for ultimate conversion to LRT, although after construction began, numerous rebuildings proved necessary. Part of the eastern section of the LRT is in the right-of-way of Highway 417.

The original plan was to lay tracks on streets through downtown Ottawa. However, strong objections from local merchants resulted in a 1.5-mile tunnel under Queen Street through this area. There are three underground stations, with 390-foot platforms. Surface stations are 300 feet long, with provision for future extension. The above-ground stations are quite elaborate, somewhat similar to Calgary’s LRT.

The 34-car Citadis Spirit fleet represents Alstom’s first North American LRV order. The carbodies were constructed at Alstom’s Hornell, N.Y., plant; final assembly occurred at OC Transpo’s Belfast Yard shop, in Ottawa. The facility is near the line’s approximate halfway point. The vehicles draw traction power from 1,500 VDC overhead catenary. The low-floor design and overhead power collection permit future on-street alignments.

The Confederation Line interfaces with the existing north-south OC Transpo Trillium Line (Line 2) DMU operation at Bayshore Station. However, the two operations are at different levels. Tremblay Station, just east of downtown, serves VIA Rail intercity trains.

An unusual feature of the Confederation Line is the use of a “guard” at stations, even with ATO. Before the driver pushes the start button to get under way after a station stop, the guard, positioned at the front of the train on the platform, checks to make sure the platform is clear. If the train is good to go, the guard blows a pocket whistle, giving the driver the all-clear. This is useful, because even though the trains are equipped with CCTV and external cameras, they’re very long (more than the length of a football field), and it’s sometimes difficult for the driver to monitor the entire platform. Ottawa transit users, used to short buses, are still adapting to frequent, fast rail service. So, use of a whistle-blowing platform guard is an effective, albeit quaint, safety practice.

BUILDOUT TO 2025

It was always intended to extend the Confederation Line eastward and westward after the initial section was open. Ottawa City Council approval has been given, contracts awarded, and work has begun.

An eastward 13-km (8-mile) extension will take service to Trim Road, in Ottawa’s far eastern suburbs. It will be a surface alignment, in the median of Highway 174, and includes five new stations. Opening is scheduled for 2024.

A westward 15.5-km (9.5-mile) extension will add 11 stations. This line will split at Lincoln Fields Station. One branch, terminating at Baseline Road, will serve Algonquin College. The other, terminating at Moodie Drive Station, will serve western Ottawa. The latter will connect with the Southwest and West Transitways. A yard and light maintenance facility is planned near the Moodie terminal. Part of the route will be built in an existing Transitway, while other sections are to be tunneled. Opening is planned for 2025.

Maximum operating speed on the extensions will be 100 kph (62 mph).

The Trillium Line will be also be extended from its current terminus at Greenborough. Just south of there, at South Keys, it will split. One segment will go directly into Ottawa International Airport; the other will terminate at Limebank. Stations will be doubled in length to 80 meters (262 feet) to accommodate on-order Stadler FLIRT DMUs or two existing Alstom Coradia LINT DMUs, which will operate in pairs.

An additional 38 Alstom Citadis Spirit LRVs have been ordered for Phase Two. The first 13 are being assembled at the 16-acre Belfast Road shop, with the balance to be finished at Alstom’s new plant in Brampton, Ontario. This will allow Belfast Road to focus on day-to-day maintenance of the operational fleet.

A BIT OF HISTORY



The Electroliners were a pair of streamlined, four-unit-articulated EMU (electric multiple-unit) interurban trainsets operated by the Chicago North Shore & Milwaukee Railroad between Chicago and Milwaukee. St. Louis Car Company built them in 1941. The Electroliners operated at speeds up to 90 mph. When the North Shore shut down in 1963, Philadelphia Suburban Transportation Co., known as the Red Arrow Lines, purchased and renamed them Liberty Liners. The trolley poles and steps were removed, new doors were added in the center coach sections, and third-rail contact shoes were installed for operation on the Philadelphia & Western (today’s Norristown High Speed Line), where they ran until 1978, when SEPTA retired them.




SelTrac™ was originally developed in the 1970s by Standard Elektrik Lorenz of Germany for the Krauss-Maffei Transurban, an automated guideway transit system proposed for the GO-Urban network in Ontario, Canada’s Greater Toronto Area. Although the GO-Urban project was never built, the Transurban technology was acquired by an Ontario consortium led by the Urban Transportation Development Corporation (UTDC), and adapted to become its Intermediate Capacity Transit System (ICTS). This technology was first used on the SkyTrain network in Vancouver, B.C., and the Scarborough Rapid Transit in Toronto. SelTrac™ was primarily supplied and developed by Alcatel, through a Toronto-based subsidiary. It is now supplied by Thales, after the company purchased many of Alcatel’s non-telecommunications assets. New versions have been developed for different markets, and today SelTrac™ is used for train control systems around the world. The original SelTrac™ system was based on inductive loops that provided a communications channel as well as positioning information. In the newest, modular version, the control signal is transmitted at 2.4 GHz.

Canadian Contributing Editor John Thompson contributed to this story.
https://www.railwayage.com/passenger...ty-light-rail/
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  #13735  
Old Posted Dec 13, 2019, 1:17 AM
Brannwagon Brannwagon is offline
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I'm accepting full responsibility if I jinx it but...

Has anyone else noticed that delays have seemed to be few and far between lately? Haven't experienced a delay myself in over two weeks (although I rarely ride at peak hours).

Checking Occasional Transport, it appears the most recent delays were over 2 days ago (two separate instances), and prior to that, over a week ago (albeit it appears there were 3 separate delays that day).

Still, to me it feels like this is a far-cry from the almost daily and sometimes multiple times per day instances of being bombarded with photos of massive crowds during delays.

I'm hopeful that that things continue trending in this direction. I also can't remember the source, but I remember reading that we may have 15 trains in action sometime in Q1 2020 (may have been from the most recent FEDCO).
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  #13736  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2019, 5:06 PM
scryer scryer is offline
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Originally Posted by Brannwagon View Post
I'm accepting full responsibility if I jinx it but...

Has anyone else noticed that delays have seemed to be few and far between lately? Haven't experienced a delay myself in over two weeks (although I rarely ride at peak hours).
I am hoping that I don't jinx it for you guys out East either, but I just wanted to ask if there are anymore delays or service interruptions? I'm hoping that the growing pains are over for you guys since this thread has been quieter the last few days.
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  #13737  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2019, 8:15 PM
PHrenetic PHrenetic is offline
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Originally Posted by scryer View Post
I am hoping that I don't jinx it for you guys out East either, but I just wanted to ask if there are anymore delays or service interruptions? I'm hoping that the growing pains are over for you guys since this thread has been quieter the last few days.
Good Day.

Well, I don't know if it's a jinx or not, but OccasioalTransport (http://occasionaltransport.ca/) has Blair with TWO dead trains 28 hrs ago (noonish Friday).

?????
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  #13738  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2019, 11:15 PM
RationalPhi RationalPhi is offline
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Reason: Too many dead trains.

Occasionaltransport.ca is legit the most reliable source for LRT status updates. That guy is on top of it.
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  #13739  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2019, 5:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gat-Train View Post
That station is cursed. Twice I have dropped my coffee mug in there.
There's an unwritten rule that you don't take your coffee on the train. Go to any major city and you won't see a coffee on a train.
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  #13740  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2019, 3:17 PM
sseguin sseguin is offline
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As usual, O-Train Fans will be sharing the Transit Commission meeting materials, audio and presentation as it becomes available on the following page:

https://www.otrainfans.ca/news/speci...cember-18-2019

Presentation Slideshow and Audio are now available.

Last edited by sseguin; Dec 18, 2019 at 7:26 PM.
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