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  #101  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2013, 8:58 PM
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Hmmm politics...I may going out on a limb here here but imo "Drastic Change " is needed in this province, provincially and in winnipeg at the civiic level. I mean I am at the point where even several years of new provincial PC gov't, for example (I'm not argueing for or against any party just to be clear, I did say PC but thier not many choices) but is worth a try. Even if it may be difficult for some time, and drastic change takes years to come to fruition. Things are not going so well. And I am a person that tries to build up and promote this province and city whenever I can. /rant over/ ...I guess just vote ..that's it.
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  #102  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2013, 9:23 PM
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we need a third party that is either center right or center left with environmental policies in as well.

Since many in this province and city are not happy with the parties and mayoral candidates why is it nobody has the will power to step forward with a clear vision and concrete policies instead of doing nothing by letting the con artist take our money and make money for their business buddies. I guess we just like sitting around and bitch and wait until next year for the same incompetent bullshit.
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  #103  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2013, 9:38 PM
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Originally Posted by viperred88 View Post
we need a third party that is either center right or center left with environmental policies in as well.

Since nobody in this province and city are not happy with the parties and mayoral candidates why is it nobody has the will power to step forward with a clear vision and concrete policies instead of doing nothing by letting the con artist take our money and make money for their business buddies. I guess we just like sitting around and bitch and wait until next year for the same incompetent bullshit.
There are a lot of people with the will power. There just aren't people with the fiscal power to step up. I myself would love to run for office, however I am very aware of my own lack of knowledge and education.
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  #104  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2013, 2:31 PM
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I am very aware of my own lack of knowledge and education.
That doesn't stop most people who run for city council. Worth case scenario, you share your opinions with people and make them think.

One of my across-the-street neighbours ran for council here in 2010, on a platform that was extremely pro-urban. Did he win? Not even close. But did he get people talking about what he had to say? He sure did.

And remember that at any point, if someone says "but he isn't educated!", they're just saying that to discredit you because they can't win with what they have otherwise.
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  #105  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 3:45 PM
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There are a lot of people with the will power. There just aren't people with the fiscal power to step up. I myself would love to run for office, however I am very aware of my own lack of knowledge and education.
It's kinda a chicken/egg issue with the fiscal power... How do you get contributers if you don't get out there, but how do you get out there without the fiscal power.

I think that a lot of this will change with the growth of online politics -- this is also the reason that the old crowd at City Hall and the Province won't allow online voting. They say it's for security issues, but it's actually because they think they will lose their base if they allow it.

Sammy has all the old conservitives and is lacking the young urbanites (who don't actually get out to vote) and the NDP have all the lower wage earners in the inner city, some of whom don't have home internet access. Neither group has a motive to allow online voting.
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  #106  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 3:56 PM
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While I hate the political jocking for position with Wyatt, I think he's on a good path putting the conversation out there.

The City could do well with some austerity measures put in place... A rather crazy idea I've been stumbling around and eventually want to write about is the idea of "doing nothing". Not to go too far into it, but if the forecasts for the city's population are correct, what would happen to our density if no "new" infrastructure was built? The current infrastructure deficit that gets touted by City Hall is "7.4 billion by 2018," but only $3.8 billion of it is existing infrastructure, the rest is unfunded new projects.

What would happen if the city disallowed new greenfield development and forced more density?
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  #107  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 4:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisallard5454 View Post
There are a lot of people with the will power. There just aren't people with the fiscal power to step up. I myself would love to run for office, however I am very aware of my own lack of knowledge and education.
I would think it's quite the opposite.

If you're successful at what you do, why would you trade in the job security, privacy, and benefits to field phone calls at 5 am because the garbage wasn't picked up? Or have the big brains at CJOB or the Sun ridicule your every move?

There's lots of bright people in our province / city but you'll never catch them running for office because the job / pay sucks.
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  #108  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 5:08 PM
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I would think it's quite the opposite.

If you're successful at what you do, why would you trade in the job security, privacy, and benefits to field phone calls at 5 am because the garbage wasn't picked up? Or have the big brains at CJOB or the Sun ridicule your every move?

There's lots of bright people in our province / city but you'll never catch them running for office because the job / pay sucks.
As of two years ago the lowest a councillor made was in the high Fifties. The average was between 60-80 000, whilst the mayor makes 125 000-150 000. That is pay rate that many would love to have. Considering the average citizen in this city makes 47 000 dollars, I would say that most people would agree with me. That doesn't include the 114 000 that is included on top for spending.
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  #109  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 6:03 PM
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Originally Posted by chrisallard5454 View Post
As of two years ago the lowest a councillor made was in the high Fifties. The average was between 60-80 000, whilst the mayor makes 125 000-150 000. That is pay rate that many would love to have. Considering the average citizen in this city makes 47 000 dollars, I would say that most people would agree with me. That doesn't include the 114 000 that is included on top for spending.
Someone making under $47,000 probably isn't smart enough to be an effective leader in City Hall.

If someone is smart enough to be a good city counselor they are probably making well over $100k/year already and would rather not want the public scrutiny about every pothole and water main break.
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  #110  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 9:53 PM
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Someone making under $47,000 probably isn't smart enough to be an effective leader in City Hall.

If someone is smart enough to be a good city counselor they are probably making well over $100k/year already and would rather not want the public scrutiny about every pothole and water main break.
Why do you assume that because someone isn't making 100 000 dollars a year that they aren't smart? You are making the assumption that someone has to choose a career solely based on a high income to be smart, and that is blatantly prejudice.

I completely disagree with your assertion, and would in fact suggest that there are people more qualified for the position based on their honesty and integrity, as well as their work ethic rather than their previous pay grades.
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  #111  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 10:48 PM
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I think what hotwired is saying is that if someone is capable of making $100K they probably will. Why wouldn't someone gravitate to the maximum income they are capable of? And at that income level, who the heck would want to be a councillor and put up with all the crap the position brings?

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  #112  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 11:31 PM
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A lot of city councillors have other jobs. Most of Thunder Bay's city councillors are consultants who award consulting contracts to themselves for mundane shit like "What would happen if there was a tsunami in Thunder Bay", or "should be built a monorail to North Haverbrook?" The base salary for a city councillor in Thunder Bay is smaller than my base salary after two years of working for a small business, and I don't have the time or patience to deal with what they put up with. Our city council gets death threats and constant negative letters from a small group of people who vehemently oppose them; I don't think I'd be able to deal with that.

That said there are two kinds of city councillors: the quiet ones who work behind the scenes, affecting positive change, and the loud ones, who work behind the scenes, getting deals for their friends.
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  #113  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2013, 11:36 PM
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I think what hotwired is saying is that if someone is capable of making $100K they probably will. Why wouldn't someone gravitate to the maximum income they are capable of? And at that income level, who the heck would want to be a councillor and put up with all the crap the position brings?
That is true, however he is assuming that someone who makes more money would automatically befit the position of city councillor or mayor over someone with an average salary. Personally I would gravitate towards a career that makes me happy over something that pays more. I know many people who feel the same.

Also he is not accounting for the thousands out there who have not yet had an opportunity to make 100 000 a year. There are many individuals who are capable of running a city who don't hold executive positions. And the truth is that the mayor makes 125 000 a year. The chief of police, and the deputy fire chiefs make that salary. And that is after 20 + years of service for each. To suggest that making anything less as being insufficient for the position is evidently false. That is not even including the gold plated pension, or 114 000 in spending (may we assume that even a small percentage is used personally) that comes with the position either.

Also the idea that a candidate would face criticism should be obvious to anyone who runs, and that being said there isn't a public servant position that you could find where daily criticism was not a fact of life. Ask your "everyday bus driver" about the criticism that they receive.
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  #114  
Old Posted Apr 30, 2013, 12:51 AM
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Bus drivers often receive the worst of it because they're front line and dealing with frustrated people. Our city councillors probably wouldn't be able to handle it.
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  #115  
Old Posted Apr 30, 2013, 1:10 AM
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Personally I would gravitate towards a career that makes me happy over something that pays more.
Why not both?

Seriously, the fact remains that we can't get good people to run for council because it doesn't pay enough. Sure the mayor makes 125K or whatever his salary is but he is not there for the money - he made his money years ago - he is there because he wants to be mayor. Being a councillor is not seen in such high regard so it is unlikely an idealist would work so much for so little.

Heck, firemen, cops, nurses make 100K or close to it these days.
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  #116  
Old Posted Apr 30, 2013, 1:16 AM
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I'm sure everyone would love to have a job that they love and pays well, but there aren't very many of those around. You often have to chose one or the other.
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  #117  
Old Posted May 1, 2013, 8:49 PM
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Municipal politics is the one level that literally anybody can get into. Its when you get into provincial and federal that education and resources are massive factors. The only major resource it would take to run for councillor is time, work, and maybe a small amount of cash for. The most effective tool in generating support is direct face to face communication with your constituents. In civic elections where the wards are so small this can literally be done by an individual walking door to door in the afternoon and night for a couple weeks. In terms of education being a limited factor, it has been proven to be way less of a factor in civic elections then say provincial or federal. I even considered it although i would be running against Pagtakhan who i feel would be a touch incumbent to knock off in that area. Maybe after im done grad school....
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  #118  
Old Posted May 2, 2013, 1:43 PM
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In civic elections where the wards are so small
Provincial electoral divisions within the City of Winnipeg are actually much smaller than the Civic wards.

http://www.electionsmanitoba.ca/en/M...swinnipeg.html
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  #119  
Old Posted May 2, 2013, 2:32 PM
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they are talking about population not physical size
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  #120  
Old Posted May 3, 2013, 12:40 AM
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Either way they're smaller... Running in a municipal election is easier though. The voter turn out is lower, so if you target the right people your chances are much higher, and there is no competition from well organized and well funded political parties, unless they happen to be indirectly contributing to a municipal campaign somehow.
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