JERSEY CITY | PATH Train Ridership Growing Rapidly

[TowerDude]

Could PATH service be extended to the Meadowlands?

[mrnyc]

^ oh geez, lets get it to the airport first!

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by TowerDude

Could PATH service be extended to the Meadowlands?

1950s proposed path expansions

https://flic.kr/p/SdrxU4

This expansion would have likely saved a few more commuter rail lines

https://flic.kr/p/QYtdWF

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by TowerDude

Could PATH service be extended to the Meadowlands?

Yes, and it should have happened decades ago.

But it's much more likely that HBLR is eventually extended to the Meadowlands. At least this would provide good regional light rail connectivity.

[Busy Bee]

Much of HBLR should be PATH but that's a whole other issue.

[jbermingham123]

My dream (which will never, ever, ever happen) is the merger of NJT, LIRR, and PATH (which is true heavy rail like the others) into a single transit system with through-running at Penn station and the WTC station.

It should be possible to take a LIRR train through Atlantic terminal to the WTC station, and continue on to JC and Newark.

most of the infrastructure for this already exists. The east river tunnel is the only significant missing link, and could potentially be acquired by repurposing one of the 4 (!!!) existing subway tunnels from atlantic terminal which cross the east river

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by Busy Bee

Much of HBLR should be PATH but that's a whole other issue.

It overlaps in Downtown Jersey City but it follows the 1930s proposed route down to Bayonne and up to North Bergen.

[mrnyc]

what’s the status on plans to extend the lr up to englewood and beyond?

that seems to be the logical and easiest next steps.

[electricron]

Originally Posted by jbermingham123

My dream (which will never, ever, ever happen) is the merger of NJT, LIRR, and PATH (which is true heavy rail like the others) into a single transit system with through-running at Penn station and the WTC station.

It should be possible to take a LIRR train through Atlantic terminal to the WTC station, and continue on to JC and Newark.

most of the infrastructure for this already exists. The east river tunnel is the only significant missing link, and could potentially be acquired by repurposing one of the 4 (!!!) existing subway tunnels from atlantic terminal which cross the east river

Do all LIRR, NJT, Amtrak, MTA subways, and PATH rails at Penn Station have platforms on the same level vertically? It's difficult to trough run trains with tracks on different levels.
Additionally, I understand that Amtrak, LIRR, and NJT are regulated by the FRA while MTA subway and PATH are regulated by the FTA. Rarely are trains regulated by the FTA and FRA allowed to run on the same tracks, and never at the same time.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

what’s the status on plans to extend the lr up to englewood and beyond?

that seems to be the logical and easiest next steps.

Murphy's appointee screwed things up so badly the feds want a new review...its just one of the many projects hes screwed up...but none of the highway projects been affected..

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by electricron

Do all LIRR, NJT, Amtrak, MTA subways, and PATH rails at Penn Station have platforms on the same level vertically? It's difficult to trough run trains with tracks on different levels.
Additionally, I understand that Amtrak, LIRR, and NJT are regulated by the FRA while MTA subway and PATH are regulated by the FTA. Rarely are trains regulated by the FTA and FRA allowed to run on the same tracks, and never at the same time.

Yes , you can see this at Newark Penn. PATH is FRA due to legacy tracks interconnecting to the NEC.. The different electrification systems and the lack of high level platforms on the Morris & Essex are the biggest hurdles to merging and through running.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

^ so nice to see nexis back in action!

I'm back , I had to be sneaky with that platform shot as the PATH has a ban on photography..

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Yes, and it should have happened decades ago.

But it's much more likely that HBLR is eventually extended to the Meadowlands. At least this would provide good regional light rail connectivity.

Originally Posted by Busy Bee

Much of HBLR should be PATH but that's a whole other issue.

The PATH and HBLR systems are completely different in construction and use. The PATH is an actual railroad which is grade separated and has it's own reporting mark while the HBLR is a newly constructed system which is either at grade, below grade, or above grade depending on the location.

It's best to keep both systems separated anyways since PATH is owned by the PANYNJ, a bi-state agency, while HBLR is owned by NJT, which covers the entire state of NJ.

Originally Posted by jbermingham123

My dream (which will never, ever, ever happen) is the merger of NJT, LIRR, and PATH (which is true heavy rail like the others) into a single transit system with through-running at Penn station and the WTC station.

It should be possible to take a LIRR train through Atlantic terminal to the WTC station, and continue on to JC and Newark.

most of the infrastructure for this already exists. The east river tunnel is the only significant missing link, and could potentially be acquired by repurposing one of the 4 (!!!) existing subway tunnels from atlantic terminal which cross the east river

And that's what it is, nothing more than just a dream!!! It's a possibility of connecting Atlantic Terminal to the WTC station, which will cost a lot of money, but combining the three transit agencies is going to only create a lot of infighting between NY and NJ, plus the fare structures are so different in that PATH operates on a flat rate, while NJT and LIRR have their own fare zones.

It's just best to let each state do it's own thing and not mess with the current structures. Also, NYC is the main destination for a lot of modes of transport, which is why Grand Central is currently a terminus, and Penn Station is the busiest train station in the Americas, if not the world!

If a commuter who lives in LI has a job in either JC, Hoboken, or Newark, then he'd have to transfer either at Penn Station of WTC just to do so, and the reason why it's designed that way is because of the economic strength or Downtown and Midtown Manhattan.

[TowerDude]

I think I'd prefer to see Amtrak take over any Through running at Penn Station.

[Nexis4Jersey]

World Trade Center train at Newark

[C.]

March 2024 Ridership Numbers Just Released

March 2019
Avg. Weekday: 281,605
Saturday: 106,134
Sunday: 69,640

March 2024
Avg. Weekday: 177,646 (63% Recovered)
Saturday: 86,807 (81.8% Recovered)
Sunday: 72,350 (103.9% Recovered)

PATH should not be considered a commuter railroad! Weekend numbers are rising fast. PATH should have normal service instead of weekend service. Numbers would rise even higher.

On the plus side, NIMBYs have lost a credible claim about PATH overcrowding. Tens of thousands of units coming online and still not close to pre-pandemic ridership levels. Might as well keep adding until back up to 300,000 people a day and resume talks of expansion of service.

[C.]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

1950s proposed path expansions

https://flic.kr/p/SdrxU4

This expansion would have likely saved a few more commuter rail lines

https://flic.kr/p/QYtdWF

I know it hasn't been a serious proposal for 70 years, but a PATH extension to Elizabeth would be great. The density is 11,145/sq mi. That and a couple more stops in Newark (the airport and one in the surrounding community), would be such a boon to the region. If a really large parking garage is built underground, that would also help reduce the number of trips into Manhattan.

[Crawford]

PATH will be extended to Newark Airport. That's in the next Port Authority funding cycle. So I guess that leaves out hope PATH could be extended further?

The plan wasn't to extend PATH just to Elizabeth, but all the way to Plainfield. That would have been a regional game-changer.

[Busy Bee]

I'm a big believer in PATH expansion but with NJTransit I don't think extending past EWR makes much sense.

[Crawford]

I also hope that congestion pricing will boost PATH and NJT ridership. You'd think there would be a notable ridership boost for Manhattan-bound riders.