The Manitoba Provincial Politics Discussion

[Pinus]

Originally Posted by Ando

It's a good thing you "can't wait to leave!"

Seriously, our province needs less people like rrskylar and Riverman who continually crap all over us. I'm sick and tired of listening to them whinge about everything here.

Please, just let them move to their perceived utopias and be done with it already.

[Riverman]

Same shit as always from Penis and Dildo.

[Pinus]

So you can come here and dump all over my home but I'm not allowed to say a bloody thing in response to it. I'm just supposed to sit tight and keep quiet. As long as Riverman gets what he wants and can resort to petty name calling on anyone who challenges him. Okay gotcha.

Reminds me of another former poster here.

[The Jabroni]

This thread right now...

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Pinus

Seriously, our province needs less people like rrskylar and Riverman who continually crap all over us. I'm sick and tired of listening to them whinge about everything here.

Please, just let them move to their perceived utopias and be done with it already.

Oh you mean we need more people like you, the NDP and other lefties who have driven this province into the ground financially. The 8% PST, highest marginal payroll tax in Canada, only province in Canada to not a have "lower rate" corporate tax, highest income tax on the bottom tax brackets, ridiculous land transfer tax rate, ever increasing fee's on everything and just wait this is all just the start.

[Pinus]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

Oh you mean we need more people like you, the NDP and other lefties who have driven this province into the ground financially. The 8% PST, highest marginal payroll tax in Canada, only province in Canada to not a have "lower rate" corporate tax, highest income tax on the bottom tax brackets, ridiculous land transfer tax rate, ever increasing fee's on everything and just wait this is all just the start.

I'm neither an NDP supporter or a lefty..........by a LONG shot.

Nice try though

[Riverman]

Or, you are embarassed to say that you are. Most likely.

[Pinus]

Originally Posted by Riverman

Or, you are embarassed to say that you are. Most likely.

Once again, nope.

[optimusREIM]

Geez there's more ad hominem here than at a school yard argument.

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by drew

Why isn't it fair?

Rrskylar brought forward the statement "why would you stay here?".

So to ask rrskylar to perhaps qualify why he/she remains here is perfectly acceptable IMO.

Sorry, perhaps I read the sentence with a bit more of the undertone that usually goes with one phrased as such... ie "if you don't like it, why don't you just leave?"

Originally Posted by Ando

You have a proclivity for very black and white arguments, absolutes.

It's a post about staying or leaving. There are many reasons for either, but if we want to go into them all it would take more space than the entire skyscraper forum, so obviously, the arguments are simplified.

Reality is that Winnipeg, for all its potential, gets in its own way a lot.

I've spoken with a lot of successful people who left, and they've told me similar stories.

Originally Posted by Pinus

Seriously, our province needs less people like rrskylar and Riverman who continually crap all over us. I'm sick and tired of listening to them whinge about everything here.

Please, just let them move to their perceived utopias and be done with it already.

What kind of nonsense is that? And as we've already said, we all have reasons to be here, whether family, or work. Thos can be very good and happy reasons to stay, doesn't mean we cannot urge our city and province to improve!

The frustration comes with a clear avoidance, at particular times (for Ando), to taking basic steps in the right direction.

The problem is that sometimes this leads to uncomfortable conversation.

If we want our cute little town to stay a cute litte town, then that ship sailed about 500,000 residents ago.

Originally Posted by optimusREIM

Geez there's more ad hominem here than at a school yard argument.

[StNorberter]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

highest marginal payroll tax in Canada,

What the hell are you talking about?

Ontario's "Payroll Tax" ( do you mean Health & education Support Levy?) kicks in at $400K, Manitoba's kicks in at $1.25M

Originally Posted by rrskylar

only province in Canada to not a have "lower rate" corporate tax,

Manitoba has the LOWEST corporate tax rate on income under $500K ( the only province to have a $0 rate), and our rate on corporate income over $500K is lower than mos provinces.

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by StNorberter

What the hell are you talking about?

Ontario's "Payroll Tax" ( do you mean Health & education Support Levy?) kicks in at $400K, Manitoba's kicks in at $1.25M




Manitoba has the LOWEST corporate tax rate on income under $500K ( the only province to have a $0 rate), and our rate on corporate income over $500K is lower than mos provinces.

Before you try to spin that as praise for MB....

Yes, Ontario, the province that has the most money and runs the country, has a payroll tax that kicks in sooner than Manitoba's. Except it caps at 1.95% at $400,000+ annually. Manitoba, meanwhile, "only starts" at $1.25M annually, but at 4.3%... so more than double. It teeters off again at $2.5M annually, but to 2.15%, still noticeably higher than Ontario.

Again, this is a province that fails to launch. It takes care of the small, but neglects the reality that businesses want to grow, and it punishes you when they do. Plus, our "medium" is small elsewhere.

As far as corporate taxation goes, Manitoba has the tied highest rates among relevant provinces (if we can call ourselves that. Only Nova Scotia, PEI, Newfoundland and Yukon are higher.


HOWEVER...


These dumpy podunk cities (St. John's, Fredericton, Moncton, Charlottown) all were in the top 7 of the Total Tax Index (TTI) measuring tax competitiveness. Actually, Charlottown was 7th and the others took the top 3! Meanwhile, Winnipeg ranked 14th out of 17, trailed only by Gatineau, Quebec City, and Montreal.

So competitively speaking, we have the worst tax situation in non-french Canada. It must be noted that even Montreal is well regarded INTERNATIONALLY on the TTI, so overall Canada is a great business destination thanks to..... Stephen Harper.

But the problem is that Winnipeg is the lowest among the non-major cities... we are outranked by smaller and larger cities alike. We're not competitive with small or large markets in our own country.

[StNorberter]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

Before you try to spin that as praise for MB....

Yes, Ontario, the province that has the most money and runs the country, has a payroll tax that kicks in sooner than Manitoba's. Except it caps at 1.95% at $400,000+ annually. Manitoba, meanwhile, "only starts" at $1.25M annually, but at 4.3%... so more than double. It teeters off again at $2.5M annually, but to 2.15%, still noticeably higher than Ontario.

It starts at $1.25M, but at 4.3% on the amount ABOVE $1.25M. So at $2M, you pay $32,250, in Ontario you pay $39K. Oops. And if you're under $1.25M in MB you don't pay anything, but you start paying at $1 of payroll in ON.

Originally Posted by Wolf13

As far as corporate taxation goes, Manitoba has the tied highest rates among relevant provinces (if we can call ourselves that. Only Nova Scotia, PEI, Newfoundland and Yukon are higher.

OH NO!!! Except that many provinces have the same 12% rate as MB (AB,SK,NU), virtually the same rate (QC 11.9%), or marginally less ( ON, NT 11.5%, BC 11%)

We're A lot closer to the lower rates than we are to the higher rates ( NB - 14%, NL,YK - 15%, PEI - 16%)

Debating if we should have lower tax rates or payroll taxes is a different discussion, but don't post blatant bullshit that's too easy to call out.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

So competitively speaking, we have the worst tax situation in non-french Canada. It must be noted that even Montreal is well regarded INTERNATIONALLY on the TTI, so overall Canada is a great business destination thanks to..... Stephen Harper.

Because he cut the GST? It was the Liberals who cut the federal corporate tax rate.

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by biguc

Because he cut the GST? It was the Liberals who cut the federal corporate tax rate.

To be technical, both the Liberals and Harper cut the corporate tax rate - they both deserve credit for keeping us competitive.

[StNorberter]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

To be technical, both the Liberals and Harper cut the corporate tax rate - they both deserve credit for keeping us competitive.

Are you saying that because you heard someone say that Canada's corporate tax rates are uncompetitive?

Or do you actually know how Canada's corporate tax rate compares to other countries ( specifically the US)?

[Riverman]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Why would I move to Vancouver or Toronto, to make only a small fraction more money, if anything at all?

Moving to ON vs. MB, based on a taxable retirement income of $45K, you save $2200 a year in taxes per person. So two people, on a 25 year retirement, save close to $110,000.

That's real money in my books.

[drew]

That's a decent chunk of money.

What about other costs though? Moving costs money. Selling your house costs money. Trips back and forth to Winnipeg cost money (assuming you have family here to visit).

Are insurance and utilities the similar - or will you be paying more/less in Ontario? Even costs like cell phone plans can easily add up to several hundred dollars a year.

[Riverman]

Electricity is more there of course, but you can easily control how much you use. Home insurance appears less than here, I am paying about the same in both provinces but have a commercial policy in Ontario because the house is rented. I was told car insurance was very reaonable as long as I wasn't commuting to the city.

[Riverman]

Of course heating costs are far lower because of the climate.