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  #28841  
Old Posted May 28, 2015, 10:05 PM
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GaylordWilshire GaylordWilshire is offline
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We may very well have seen this already, but if so, I missed it:

http://cityhubla.github.io/LA_Buildi...0267/-118.2621
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  #28842  
Old Posted May 28, 2015, 11:41 PM
Tetsu Tetsu is offline
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Originally Posted by CityBoyDoug View Post
What usually happens is that the City Council was someday going to ask these suits if they had seen the situation with ''their own eyes". I suppose they could have sent their secretaries or flunkies but they went themselves to see the situation. Its often a no win situation for both sides. Damned if they do and damned if they don't. That close to City Hall there seemed to be no hope of eventual gentrification of Bunker Hill. It was doomed.

Fortunately several of the elegant antique Bunker Hill homes were carefully moved to a new location by the Pasadena Freeway and are still standing today as a memory of a long ago time.

Heritage Square Museum is located at 3800 Homer Street in Los Angeles off the 110 Fwy, 10 minutes Northeast of Downtown.

http://heritagesquare.org/


google
Proximity to City Hall certainly had to have played a factor. The irony in the total destruction of Bunker Hill lies in looking at neighborhoods like Echo Park, Highland Park, and Boyle Heights and seeing the way that they are being gentrified now (for better or worse, I can understand both sides of the argument). What is happening with those neighborhoods certainly speaks to the way that many people of some means wish to live nowadays, i.e. not in the faraway suburbs. Had Bunker Hill not been completely annihilated, might it have become the first such gentrified neighborhood in LA?

And, I certainly do understand that, in any scenario, not everything could have been saved. Still, I look to nearby examples such as San Diego's downtown for reference - many older Victorian-era homes and commercial buildings are literally standing side by side with huge modern skyscrapers.

Not to nit pick - but none of the buildings at Heritage Square are actually from Bunker Hill, though they are certainly representative of the same era in LA.
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  #28843  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 3:52 AM
Mstimc Mstimc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityBoyDoug View Post
What usually happens is that the City Council was someday going to ask these suits if they had seen the situation with ''their own eyes". I suppose they could have sent their secretaries or flunkies but they went themselves to see the situation. Its often a no win situation for both sides. Damned if they do and damned if they don't. That close to City Hall there seemed to be no hope of eventual gentrification of Bunker Hill. It was doomed.
Our neighbors in the great city to the north are facing the same conundrum. I read an article on apartment building rehab in San Francisco's Chinatown. In a city where the rent on a doghouse tops 2 grand a month, one can rent a room over a store in Chinatown for as little as $250 a month. Nearly all the buildings don't meet code and exceed legal occupancy levels, but the neighborhood is cohesive and street crime nearly non-existent.

City Housing and non-profit assistance programs face a dilemma; if they force owners to bring the buildings up to code, they force people out and increase the rent; the displaced renters, many of whom are newly-arrived immigrants or the elderly, would literally have no place to go. So there's an unwritten agreement on all sides; the City looks the other way on occupancy limits, the non-profits help owners make minimal repairs to keep the buildings from falling (or burning) down, and the renters get to stay in their homes. It's certainly not ideal, but it beats the heck out throwing people into the street or dispersing them into housing projects all over town.
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  #28844  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 8:35 AM
CityBoyDoug CityBoyDoug is offline
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Originally Posted by Tetsu View Post
Proximity to City Hall certainly had to have played a factor. The irony in the total destruction of Bunker Hill lies in looking at neighborhoods like Echo Park, Highland Park, and Boyle Heights and seeing the way that they are being gentrified now (for better or worse, I can understand both sides of the argument). What is happening with those neighborhoods certainly speaks to the way that many people of some means wish to live nowadays, i.e. not in the faraway suburbs. Had Bunker Hill not been completely annihilated, might it have become the first such gentrified neighborhood in LA?

And, I certainly do understand that, in any scenario, not everything could have been saved. Still, I look to nearby examples such as San Diego's downtown for reference - many older Victorian-era homes and commercial buildings are literally standing side by side with huge modern skyscrapers.

Not to nit pick - but none of the buildings at Heritage Square are actually from Bunker Hill, though they are certainly representative of the same era in LA.
I really think that one of the main factors that doomed the entire Bunker Hill area was the geological topography itself. The hills and the land were still very raw in 1955 and much of it was unusable.
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  #28845  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 8:39 AM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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Crescenta Valley

A small update on the Van Deusen Estate on Castle Road, which was so prominently noted on the 1934 flood map:


LAT

Mike Lawler of the Crescenta Valley Historical Society, who also writes a local history column for Crescenta Valley Weekly, "Treasures of the Valley" was kind enough to send along an undated aerial of the Van Deusen home:

mike lawler

And a directory listing:

mike lawler

The street number has changed, but it's still there:

google maps


gsv

Castle Road wasn't named after the Van Deusen home, it looks nothing like a castle. The road was named for Gould castle (1890) at the very top of the road:






The House Beautiful (undated) cut via mike lawler

There's two interesting (not long, but info packed) articles on Gould Castle, its rise and its fall, here and here. Well worth the read.

Stranger yet, Gould Castle wasn't the only castle built out that way. Some of them still exist. See here and here.

Lawler has also did three articles on Verdugo Lodge and the little neighborhood which exists in the ruins, Mountain Oaks. He explains more about those tiny plots one could buy here.

Lawler is a devotee of noir. Reading his articles, one learns a great deal about the things that would most horrify the Chamber of Commerce, the local real estate agents and others who work so hard to convince people that the Crescenta Valley is (and always was) "nice". He's co-authored a couple of books too:

amazon



amazon
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  #28846  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 9:11 AM
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HossC HossC is offline
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All of the Leonard Nadel pictures I've posted so far have been wide street scenes and aerials, but, after tovangar2's post about the men in suits, I had another look at the shots of more private areas. Just like the San Francisco residences described by Mstimc, I'm sure this place (listed on the envelope as 1st and Olive) wasn't up to code. There are boards falling off at the left, and the stairs don't look too safe, but the image is so evocative. I'm sure buildings like this would've been gradually replaced if they hadn't been wiped out in one go. It's just a shame that none of these old apartments and hotels exist anywhere on Bunker Hill these days.


getty.edu
"Bunker Hill Renewal Project, 1951-1956" > "Slums, stores, alleys, and street conditions, 1955 October 8-1955 October 10" > "BH2-120 (negative 15)"
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  #28847  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 4:53 PM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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For me, I regret the loss of nothing that was ever built on Bunker Hill as much as I miss the hills themselves. I wish they'd never been built on and that the hills were still here.
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  #28848  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 8:06 PM
CityBoyDoug CityBoyDoug is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tovangar2 View Post
For me, I regret the loss of nothing that was ever built on Bunker Hill as much as I miss the hills themselves. I wish they'd never been built on and that the hills were still here.
Too bad the City Fathers did not have the foresight to turn the Bunker Hills tract into a park back in 1850. The size being similar to Central Park, NY.
But Los Angeles politicians are notorious for having bad judgement and desiring to line their pockets with gold.

I suppose the reality was that those hundreds of Bunker Hill parcels were worth a fortune by 1955. Pershing Square, the one Central Park that Los Angeles does have was eventually paved over and turned into a parking lot. It was purposely made as unfriendly to people as possible.

Last edited by CityBoyDoug; May 29, 2015 at 8:23 PM.
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  #28849  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 9:28 PM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityBoyDoug View Post
Too bad the City Fathers did not have the foresight to turn the Bunker Hills tract into a park back in 1850. The size being similar to Central Park, NY.
But Los Angeles politicians are notorious for having bad judgement and desiring to line their pockets with gold.

I suppose the reality was that those hundreds of Bunker Hill parcels were worth a fortune by 1955. Pershing Square, the one Central Park that Los Angeles does have was eventually paved over and turned into a parking lot. It was purposely made as unfriendly to people as possible.

Hard to disagree with your observation of lacking foresight and missed opportunity regarding both Bunker Hill and Pershing Square. But the City Fathers of 1855 did not have a monopoly on myopic planning. Landscape architect F.L. Olmsted, who designed Central Park, had two sons that followed in their pop's footsteps.
Quote:
[They co-authored] a 1930 report for the LA Chamber of Commerce entitled "Parks, Playgrounds, and Beaches for the Los Angeles Region" encouraging the preservation of outdoor public space in southern California. The report was largely ignored by the city, but became an important urban planning reference.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olmsted_Brothers
Of course, to be fair, in the 1930s, the City's decision makers might have had quite a bit on their plates - at the beginning of the Depression. And, I suppose the lack of Bunker Hill-foresight warrants mention of the fortunate existence of Griffith Park, which I have occasionally heard referred to as "LA's Central Park."




Interesting 1948 pamphlet on the future of LA Light rail > http://libraryarchives.metro.net/DPG...ransit_now.pdf

1948
http://images.onset.freedom.com/ocre...il1dddfl.1.jpg


Is there an available on-line version of LA's 1940 Master Plan? In looking for it I recall seeing this planning which some may find interesting> https://laplanninghistory.wordpress.com/1913-1941/










1950

Last edited by Godzilla; May 29, 2015 at 10:57 PM.
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  #28850  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 9:40 PM
oldstuff oldstuff is offline
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Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
A. Bard Mohr Pretzels, 504 Molino Street, Los Angeles. (i can't quite read the smaller words after Mohr and above the S in Pretzels)


eBay


detail / buggy with the street address.

I've been trying to decide what is stacked at the side-door. (besides boxes of pretzel ) looks like small fans on top...but I know it's not.




the pretzel factory would have been along this stretch of Molino Street.

gsv

__
A 1904 directory has an ad for Mohr pretzels with a phone number: Home 2063. Mr Mohr, who was born in Pennsylvania in 1880, is listed individually in the same 1904 directory as manufacturer of steam pretzels. A. Bard Mohr is listed as a roomer in the 1910 census at age 50 and his occupation is listed as a farm worker, so maybe pretzels did not work out. By 1930 he is living in Redlands with his brother's family. His brother was running a resort. He reappears in Los Angeles in 1940, living at 120 S. Grand and is listed as being a hotel manager. The address there is that of the Annex to the Melrose Hotel. Jack of all trades, apparently
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  #28851  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 9:44 PM
oldstuff oldstuff is offline
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Originally Posted by Matt Maxwell View Post
Popping back in after a little time away. Still buried under research for SMOKETOWN and the day job and still trying to get through this thread, but wanted to share a couple pics:


L1070662.JPG by Matt Maxwell, on Flickr
Not technically Los Angeles, but the Valley. Still, beautiful neon and sixties design probably most famous now for use as a setting in TRUE ROMANCE.


L1070622.JPG by Matt Maxwell, on Flickr
Toluca Lake, CA, home of the original Bob's Big Boy, where I ate many times during my time as an animator (once saw Laura San Giacomo two tables away) though honestly I preferred Mo's, which was just up the street. But you can't argue with classic design.

More at the following photoset on Flickr, but it's not all LA. Some points further south, including the giant tombstone hangars of the Tustin air base:

SoCal 2013 photoset by me.

Should note that there's some photos in this set taken at a friend's studio space in the brewery building (which is now artists lofts and the like) that's been featured here. If it's of vinyl toys or motorcycle helmets, car parts or pinball machines, it's taken at his place.
Mo's isn't Mo's anymore. The name has changed. The building that housed it was the first IHOP. Bob's Big Boy is still the same
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  #28852  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 11:23 PM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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The Olmsted Bros Plan for LA

Thank you Godzilla for bring the Olmsted plan to my attention.

There's an excellent LAT article on it and the 2000 book ("Eden by Design: The 1930 Olmsted-Bartholomew Plan for the Los Angeles Region" by Hise and Deverell) about it here

The City Project page on it (with map links) is here

Quote:
"Implementing the Olmsted vision would have made Los Angeles one of the most beautiful and livable regions in the world. Civic leaders killed the Report because of politics, bureaucracy, and greed in a triumph of private power over public space and social democracy".

The book itself may be previewed here


amazon

Quote:
“This fate [the lack of implementation of the plan] was not due to some intrinsic flaw in the plan, nor was it due to a lack of public will, and it certainly was not happenstance. No, what happened in this case was more deliberate, more planned. The Chamber of Commerce and its allies effectively limited circulation of the report and discouraged public discourse.”

Last edited by tovangar2; May 30, 2015 at 7:22 AM. Reason: add quote
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  #28853  
Old Posted May 29, 2015, 11:42 PM
Matt Maxwell Matt Maxwell is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldstuff View Post
Mo's isn't Mo's anymore. The name has changed. The building that housed it was the first IHOP. Bob's Big Boy is still the same
Aw, man. I'm gonna miss the Nelly burger. I was at the Bob's in 2013 and figure it'll be there until the Big One drops California into the Pacific...
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  #28854  
Old Posted May 30, 2015, 8:55 PM
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GaylordWilshire GaylordWilshire is offline
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African American Historical Photo Archive


I ran across this and tracked the address to Wall Street--it's no longer there, but I came up with a little history:

Andrew J. Roberts was a Virginia-born expressman living at 1331 Prospect Street, according to the 1888-90 voter rolls; he was still there as late as 1899--and beyond. It appears that Prospect became Wall Street by 1900; records from that year indicate the family's address as 1331 Wall Street. A news item tells of son Fred, 21, listed at 1331 Wall, having his bike stolen in Feb 1901; curious is that the Robertses appear to have built a new house on the lot in 1904--per the Times, July 24, 1904: "A. J. Roberts has let to C. Weisner the contract to erect a five-room frame cottage at No. 1331 Wall street. The house is to be modern, to be finished about September 24, and to be occupied by Mr. Robertsas a home." (In an Oct 16 item, the completion date has changed to Dec 1.) This appears to be the 1904 house.


More here
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  #28855  
Old Posted May 31, 2015, 3:12 AM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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Mrs AJ Roberts, nee Ellen Hemings (pictured with her husband above), was the daughter of Madison Hemings, one of the six (or 14, depending on who's counting) children Thomas Jefferson had by slaves. Madison and his five full siblings, being 7/8th White, were legally White at birth, according to the law at that time. He was the only one of Sally Hemings' children who chose to live in the Black community.

AJ and Ellen's son, Frederick Madison Roberts, 1879-1952, (who had his bike stolen as you note) went to USC and Colorado College. After graduation he joined, and later took over, his father's business, bought The New Age weekly newspaper in 1912, which he edited until 1948 (except for about a year in 1915-1916) and was elected to the California State Assembly, an historic first, for the 62nd District in 1918, where he remained for 16 years.

BTW, the New Age offices were at 829 S San Pedro St. The building was replaced in 1971.

Frederick Madison Roberts:

monticello.org

Last edited by tovangar2; May 31, 2015 at 6:45 AM. Reason: additions/corrections
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  #28856  
Old Posted May 31, 2015, 4:03 PM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
I cropped the White Log Coffee Shop [1061 S. Hill] photograph in my previous post. [http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...postcount=7388 ] Here is the complete photo from 1939. [The '39CD lists an office for White Log Coffee shopS at 1036 W Sixth Street.]




http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/search...=1334724496666



Seeming similarities - but different locations.

Coffee shop image is looking westerly on Eleventh Street. Below image is nearby, but looking north on Hill Street.



Circa 1939. Facing north on South Hill. (A.S.Aloe Co. at 932 S. Hill)



http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/si...d/22190/rec/17





A









B







It took a second look to determine that the small wall framing the lot was not a remnant of earlier construction.
C
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  #28857  
Old Posted May 31, 2015, 4:53 PM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Lincoln Heights revisited. Close to Abe Lincoln High and Gates Street Elementary School. Wonder if any notable Lincoln High alums (Robert Young, Robert Preston and John Huston) were familiar with the neighborhood depicted below.


Sidewalks and curbs seem long standing, but road pavement seems neglected or nonexistent.


1931 - Where Eastlake and Manitou Avenues intersect.


http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/co.../19389/rec/324









1931 - Eastlake and Manitou








1931 - Eastlake and Manitou





1931 - Eastlake and Manitou








1931 - Eastlake and Manitou







1931 - Eastlake and Manitou






1931 - Eastlake and Manitou







1931 - Eastlake and Manitou





1931 - Eastlake and Manitou








1931 - Eastlake and Manitou






1931 - Eastlake and Manitou






http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/newr...reply&t=170279
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  #28858  
Old Posted May 31, 2015, 6:02 PM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
Great photos of Mr. Eltinge's house, Gaylord. "Bohemian Los Angeles" is another book I've had for a while but I still haven't read it all the way through, I've just skimmed through it in parts; it is of course a very interesting book.

I like those photos of downtown LA, ethereal. I was just there today. Yesterday, in my search for old photos of the Engstrum Hotel, I stumbled upon other photos that made me stare at them all night last night... I'm now fascinated by the area around the Los Angeles Central Library. Apparently that area used to be a lot more hilly than it is now.

I know that LA's Central Library was built on the site that once was the southern branch of the California State Normal School (which evolved into what became UCLA). But I didn't really have it in my mind how that school building was situated on that site and how much it had been altered after its demolition and the subsequent building of the Central Library.

Here's a 1910 photo, looking west on 5th Street from Hill Street; 5th Street dead ends at the Normal School.

USC Archive

Now this is where it got interesting for me. Here's an undated photo; but this is looking west from where 5th Street USED to dead end at Grand Avenue, but here you can see that it was cut through the hill to extend the street. On the left is where the Central Library will be built; on the right is the Engstrum Hotel, with a narrow street in front of it that slopes down and intersects with Grand Ave.

USC Archive

Here's an aerial shot of the nearly completed Central Library, I assume this was taken while the finishing touches were still being put on the Library. You can see the Engstrum Hotel across the 5th Street from it, on the edge of the rise of Bunker Hill. The Edison Building/One Bunker Hill Building to the right of the Engstrum wasn't even built yet, nor was the Sunkist Building, which would rise to its left. Where 5th Street meets the hill looks unfinished, and you can see the narrow street that slopes down to meet Grand Avenue.

LAPL

The Sunkist Building, retaining wall and sloping street are of course gone, and in their place are the Citigroup Building, the Bunker Hill Steps and the US Bank Tower. The arches along the wall next to the Bunker Hill Steps curiously remind me of the arches in the retaining wall, if you look at the Sunkist Building photo.

Photo by me

Here's another shot of the Sunkist Building from the 1940s:

USC Archive

This is what's there today:

Photo by me




Sunkist Building, aka California Fruitgrowers Exchange had humble beginnings before its 1935 construction at Fifth and Hope. http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/co.../42616/rec/319




1934 - Sunkist Building Site.


























La Tosca Hotel






(1935 - Figueroa. La Tosca is at the far right)

https://urbandiachrony.files.wordpre...ueroa5thn4.jpg



















Yes, there was even "Sunkist" silverware.
https://queenofsienna.files.wordpres...2degrees-2.jpg


https://queenofsienna.files.wordpres...2014/04/16.jpg
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  #28859  
Old Posted May 31, 2015, 6:12 PM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Esther's Beauty Salon and Baths. 1769 N. Cahuenga Blvd.




http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/co.../66220/rec/306


Sulforall Baths - What's that smell?







Esther! (?)

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  #28860  
Old Posted May 31, 2015, 6:38 PM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Sears at Western and Santa Monica Blvd. Cemetery and Sears "adjacent" is The Green Court Hotel.




http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4150/...2e1f754b_b.jpg



Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckaluck View Post
Sears (formerly at Western and Santa Monica) getting a remodel or spruce up? Don't recall seeing the scaffolding before. Before or after awnings?


No text - no date - no explanation for "X"
http://jpg2.lapl.org/pics23/00046286.jpg



Apropos the vintage Sears.



1926 - 5620 Santa Monica Blvd.


http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/co.../31255/rec/292




1926 - The Green Court Hotel




















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