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  #41  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2019, 9:28 PM
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ORD is a great connecting airport (go through there several times a year) but it's a fustercluck flying in and out of..
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  #42  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2019, 9:32 PM
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Providence is pretty big on its own. Manchester is more commonly used as a secondary airport to Logan. In fact, it's called Manchester-Boston Regional Airport. But I guess that depends on where in the Boston area you lived...
Boston-Manchester is a great option if the final destination is north of the Massachusetts line. It's totally hassle-free in my experience, and when that damnable wet concrete snow is bogging down operations at Logan, it's oftentimes still powdery and drifting off the runways on its own in Manchester. I haven't explored the terminals much at Manchester, but I did catch a decent meal with a good local brew in one of their eateries. Logan obviously has more and better amenities overall.
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  #43  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2019, 9:32 PM
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ORD is a great connecting airport (go through there several times a year) but it's a fustercluck flying in and out of..
as busy as ORD is, it's still a million times easier to use than first driving 90 miles up to MKE, that's why almost no one in chicagoland uses MKE, except for people like my sister who live in the far northern burbs.

and for those in the city itself, ORD is very accessible via the blue line.
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  #44  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2019, 9:57 PM
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^ The blue line makes ORD very convenient.

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I haven't explored the terminals much at Manchester, but I did catch a decent meal with a good local brew in one of their eateries. Logan obviously has more and better amenities overall.
It's pretty nice but small.
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  #45  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 12:58 AM
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Ann Arbor and Detroit! AA has access to a bigger city plus DTW in a way that Madison, WI cannot.
Ann Arbor is in Washtenaw County, which makes up the Ann Arbor micropolitan area which is a part of the Detroit CSA. Ann Arbor, though it has its own "feel", still depends too heavily on metro Detroit to be considered separate. Most metro Detroiters would consider Ann Arbor part of metro Detroit before they considered it its own metro area.

Windsor also depends heavily on the Detroit area, and Windsor never would have become what it is if Detroit was never successful. That comment might receive flak from Windsor forumers, but if the auto industry never took off in Detroit Windsor would still be a small town.

Toledo is a better example of a standalone metro that benefits from being close to a larger metro. Toledo has about 275000 residents and the metro is about 610000. It lacks a large airport, a lot of large corporations that bigger metros have, and plentiful attractions. Toledo also strongly benefits from Detroit's auto industry.
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  #46  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 3:02 AM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
To avoid O'Hare?
I'm from Boston. If I want to go home for the weekend of 12/6 - after the Thanksgiving thing.

For the cheapest tickets it will cost about double for a round trip ticket, I will need to get to Milwaukee - a few hours, there are 5 trains a day from Chicago to Milwaukee I believe, and the train schedules don't line up with the flights.

There are roughly 27+ non-stop flights from Chicago to Boston a day and 2+ from Milwaukee. It costs almost double from Milwaukee for the cheapest tickets - layovers or not, there is less schedules to choose from and I need to spend a few hours to get to Milwaukee and a few hours to get back assuming the train schedule lines up with with the flight - or I can take one subway line to O'Hare
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  #47  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 5:36 AM
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ORD is one of the best connected airports in the world.

Believe it or not there are flights from Milwaukee to ORD just to access the global hub that is O' Hare to access the entire globe.

I know people that fly from Milwaukee to Chicago to transfer to almost any point in the planet.

Its less than a 30 min flight but people in Milwaukee to do that. Trust me I know them.
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  #48  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 3:15 PM
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I almost want to think that the Milwaukee and Chicago relationship is similar to what Toronto and Hamilton have, but I think it's more of an Ottawa-Montreal thing.
That being, the distance is more similar (just over 1.5 hours vs 45 minutes), Milwaukee is still a classic medium sized metro (in the U.S context,) with it's own bigger city/major league stuff happening and ditto for Ottawa within it's role in Canada, yet both Ottawa and Milwaukee have the even larger city to take advantage of for flights, etc.As a sidebar, I wish Lavergne and Shirley had a Chicago based episode where Lenny and Squiggy got lost in Chicago or something..haha I know that it may be a stretch, but does Buffalo benefit from being close to Toronto?..I know that having the NFL in Buffalo makes it a close option for Torontonians..Kingston is also in a fairly good situation..a few hours to Montreal, Toronto, and 1.5 to Ottawa..Also close to the border for cheaper flights and other cross border amenities..Red Deere is also another city that comes to mind. Halfway to either Calgary or Edmonton..Imagine if there was more European style HSR connectivity to all cities mentioned in this thread?.It would be game changing.

Last edited by Razor; Nov 19, 2019 at 3:34 PM.
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  #49  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 3:31 PM
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I almost want to think that the Milwaukee and Chicago relationship is similar to what Toronto and Hamilton have, but I think it's more of an Ottawa-Montreal thing.
for sure.

chicago and milwaukee are nowhere near as tied together as toronto and hamilton.

a big part of that is simply the much greater geographical distance between them.

another big part is the fact that chicago and milwaukee are located in completely different states, unlike toronto and hamilton.

and the 3rd pillar of separation is major league sports. chicago and milwaukee DO NOT cheer for each other's teams, with the minor exception of the blackhawks because milwaukee does not have an NHL team.



city hall to city hall distances, as the crow flies:

montreal to ottawa: 103.7 miles

chicago to milwaukee: 81.2 miles

toronto to hamilton: 36.9 miles



if you're looking for a city pair in the US like toronto/hamilton, look at dallas/ft. worth, DC/baltimore, or san francisco/san jose.

all of those pairs listed above are far more intertwined with each other like toronto/hamilton than chicago and milwaukee are.
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Nov 19, 2019 at 4:21 PM.
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  #50  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 3:33 PM
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  #51  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 3:45 PM
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Originally Posted by M II A II R II K View Post
St. Paul, MN
st. paul really doesn't have much in the way of "independence" from minneapolis. MUCH more than a toronto/hamilton or dallas/ft. worth scenario, the twin cities really do function much more as a single city entity that just happens to have two different municipal governments and two downtowns. it's a somewhat unusual arrangement in the US.

the city hall to city hall distance is only 9 miles (connected by a light rail line, not commuter or regional rail), and the two cities share a 6 mile long border with each other, quite different from the other city pairs being mentioned here.
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Nov 19, 2019 at 3:57 PM.
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  #52  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 3:54 PM
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Originally Posted by pip View Post
I'm from Boston. If I want to go home for the weekend of 12/6 - after the Thanksgiving thing.

For the cheapest tickets it will cost about double for a round trip ticket, I will need to get to Milwaukee - a few hours, there are 5 trains a day from Chicago to Milwaukee I believe, and the train schedules don't line up with the flights.

There are roughly 27+ non-stop flights from Chicago to Boston a day and 2+ from Milwaukee. It costs almost double from Milwaukee for the cheapest tickets - layovers or not, there is less schedules to choose from and I need to spend a few hours to get to Milwaukee and a few hours to get back assuming the train schedule lines up with with the flight - or I can take one subway line to O'Hare
Obviously if you live ridiculously close to O'Hare then there is nothing to gain by going to Milwaukee. You could also go to Midway to avoid O'Hare. But, as was discussed upthread, there are people who live in Chicagoland that have more equitable factors under consideration when deciding between ORD and MKE.
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  #53  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 4:44 PM
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My husband is from Wilmington, Delaware and it's the first place that came to mind. It's definitely close to and in the orbit of Philadelphia but is a largish city on its own with a sizable skyline, important history, and sense of place independent from Philadelphia.
Yep. It has its own metropolitan division (which is kinda like an MSA within an MSA but only for certain MSAs of at least 2.5M that meet the criteria) of around 725K and pretty much anchors the whole state of Delaware.
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  #54  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 5:21 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
Obviously if you live ridiculously close to O'Hare then there is nothing to gain by going to Milwaukee. You could also go to Midway to avoid O'Hare. But, as was discussed upthread, there are people who live in Chicagoland that have more equitable factors under consideration when deciding between ORD and MKE.
it's not just those living "ridiculously close to O'Hare", it's really the VAST majority of chicagoland.

the only subset of chicagoland that it would make much sense for to use MKE as an alternate to ORD or MDW is kenosha county and the northern half of lake county, so you're talking about roughly 500,000 people out of a CSA of nearly 10M people (~5%).
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Nov 19, 2019 at 5:55 PM.
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  #55  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 6:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Razor View Post
.As a sidebar, I wish Lavergne and Shirley had a Chicago based episode where Lenny and Squiggy got lost in Chicago or something.
LOL!

https://www.google.com/maps/place/La...!4d-75.6641749

That's totally a typo that I could have made myself!
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  #56  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 6:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
it's not just those living "ridiculously close to O'Hare", it's really the VAST majority of chicagoland.

the only subset of chicagoland that it would make much sense for to use MKE as an alternate to ORD or MDW is kenosha county and the northern half of lake county, so you're talking about roughly 500,000 people out of a CSA of nearly 10M people (~5%).
I get that, but even 500K would be a lot, right? That's like a third of Milwaukee's MSA.
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  #57  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 6:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
LOL!

https://www.google.com/maps/place/La...!4d-75.6641749

That's totally a typo that I could have made myself!
You are right. "Laverne". heh ..I don't remember if they did, because it's too far back, but they should of had more
Chicago references in that series non the less..Anyways, OT.

Last edited by Razor; Nov 19, 2019 at 6:42 PM.
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  #58  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 7:31 PM
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You are right. "Laverne". heh ..I don't remember if they did, because it's too far back, but they should of had more
Chicago references in that series non the less..Anyways, OT.
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  #59  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 8:19 PM
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I get that, but even 500K would be a lot, right? That's like a third of Milwaukee's MSA.
yeah, it's definitely not an insignificant number of potential customers, but MKE struggles with service, thanks in large part to the presence of ORD and MDW, as mentioned earlier in the thread.

the lack of direct flights and schedule options is a serious problem for MKE in attracting more potential passengers from lake county.



MKE's current passenger service:

united and american only offer service to a handful of their resepctive hubs.

along with the obligatory flights to its hubs, delta offers seasonal service to a couple of vacation destinations like orlando and cancun.

alaska flies to seattle. air canada flies to toronto.

that leaves only LCC's southwest and frontier. frontier used to run a hub operation through MKE years ago, but that has been massively scaled back. and after seeing some decent growth there since entering the airport in 2009, even southwest now appears to be scaling back a bit at MKE, recently cutting service to laguardia and boston next year.
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  #60  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2019, 10:13 PM
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..another MKE denizen.
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