HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Discussion Forums > City Discussions


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #1  
Old Posted Nov 4, 2019, 9:55 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 473
Will the US see an uptick in European/Caucasian Immigration?

This was inspired by the tread "Will Asian American immigration (like Hispanics did in the 2000s) peak/slow soon?"


Europe was the main sources of immigration up until the mid 20th Century but has continued to decline since then.


Western Europe:

Overall has a much higher standing of living than the US. There is some right wing hysteria about Europe collapsing in the future but still the US is less of a desirable location to immigrate to except for a handful of wealthy people who want to avoid the higher taxes.

Eastern Europe/Russia:

The overall quality of life has increased in those places and immigration has declined since the modest wave after the fall of Communism.

Israel:

Israel has a fairly high quality of life but that region is unpredictable.


South Africa:

A lot of Whites are looking to leave but Australia seems to be the main destination of choice.

Canada:

Overall higher quality of life but Canada is actually one of the largest sources of White immigration to the US.

Latin America:

Mostly tied to political upheaval where the White elites leave after leftist uprisings. Was the case in Cuba after the Communist revolution. In the recent case with Venezuela a handful have gone to Miami but most have gone to other Latin American Countries such as Brazil and Chile.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2  
Old Posted Nov 4, 2019, 10:10 PM
Crawford Crawford is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NYC/Polanco, DF
Posts: 19,202
Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
Western Europe:
Overall has a much higher standing of living than the US.
Say what?

There won't be large numbers of whites immigrating to the U.S. anytime soon, for obvious reasons. Immigration is very difficult, so is generally attempted by those without domestic opportunities, and that isn't the case in Western Europe. But that doesn't mean Western Europe has economic parity with the U.S.

And most of Eastern Europe can move to Western Europe as easily as an American can move from Michigan to Ohio. So why would they come here?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3  
Old Posted Nov 4, 2019, 11:03 PM
bossabreezes bossabreezes is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: NYC/SP/RJ
Posts: 122
No, caucasian immigration isn't happening anytime soon in the US.

Also, like you mentioned, I have noticed lots more white Venezuelans in Brazil as of late, due to the crisis in Venezuela.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #4  
Old Posted Nov 4, 2019, 11:08 PM
yuriandrade's Avatar
yuriandrade yuriandrade is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 603
White population is decreasing in most countries and about to decrease in Americas and Oceania. There will be no immigration or it will be negligible.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #5  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 1:34 AM
ocman ocman is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Burlingame
Posts: 2,280
Large scale immigration has always been from poverty to opportunity. What nation of white people isn’t on the scale of the US in terms of wealth? Except maybe Russia, and we get a lot in Silicon Valley.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 10:41 AM
yuriandrade's Avatar
yuriandrade yuriandrade is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 603
The entire eastern Europe, the 160 million or so whites in Latin America are all way below the US in terms of wealth.

The thing is eastern Europeans can easily go to Western Europe while White Latin Americans live relatively good lives taking full advantage of extremely unequal societies, regressive taxes, cheap labour and low competitive environment. Moreover, they are about to decline and the bulk of them live in the southern portions of South America, far away from the US or Western Europe, so no mass immigration is likely.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #7  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 4:33 PM
MonkeyRonin's Avatar
MonkeyRonin MonkeyRonin is offline
¥ ¥ ¥
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 7,040
France and the UK are still top 10 immigrant sources in Canada (as is the US, for that matter). And while Canadian immigration policy obviously has no bearing on that of the US, it's clear that there also are still large numbers of Europeans interested in coming to North America. Moving "up" to from a developing country to a first world country isn't necessarily the only pattern of immigration - as evidenced by the millions of Canadian and American emigrants around the world.
__________________
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #8  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 6:25 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,764
Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
This was inspired by the tread "Will Asian American immigration (like Hispanics did in the 2000s) peak/slow soon?"


Europe was the main sources of immigration up until the mid 20th Century but has continued to decline since then.


Western Europe:

Overall has a much higher standing of living than the US. There is some right wing hysteria about Europe collapsing in the future but still the US is less of a desirable location to immigrate to except for a handful of wealthy people who want to avoid the higher taxes.

Eastern Europe/Russia:

The overall quality of life has increased in those places and immigration has declined since the modest wave after the fall of Communism.

Israel:

Israel has a fairly high quality of life but that region is unpredictable.


South Africa:

A lot of Whites are looking to leave but Australia seems to be the main destination of choice.

Canada:

Overall higher quality of life but Canada is actually one of the largest sources of White immigration to the US.

Latin America:

Mostly tied to political upheaval where the White elites leave after leftist uprisings. Was the case in Cuba after the Communist revolution. In the recent case with Venezuela a handful have gone to Miami but most have gone to other Latin American Countries such as Brazil and Chile.
I would say it depends on how the EU comes apart or does not come apart in coming years and that impact especially on places like Balkans, Italy and Spain.

Historically Europe is overdue for blowing itself up again.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #9  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 6:35 PM
Buckman821's Avatar
Buckman821 Buckman821 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 484
Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
Western Europe:

Overall has a much higher standing of living than the US.
Ummm Good luck actually justifying such a statement with facts and data.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #10  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 6:54 PM
yuriandrade's Avatar
yuriandrade yuriandrade is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin View Post
France and the UK are still top 10 immigrant sources in Canada (as is the US, for that matter). And while Canadian immigration policy obviously has no bearing on that of the US, it's clear that there also are still large numbers of Europeans interested in coming to North America. Moving "up" to from a developing country to a first world country isn't necessarily the only pattern of immigration - as evidenced by the millions of Canadian and American emigrants around the world.
6,000 from France, 5,000 from Britain in 2017. That makes only 4% of immigrants in Canada. Those are hardly large numbers.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #11  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 7:09 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckman821 View Post
Ummm Good luck actually justifying such a statement with facts and data.
Yeah it seems to me that a lot of Europeans score high on squishy things like "happiness rankings" They'll quantify quality of life in terms of cost of higher education, time spent in traffic, "access" to healthcare etc.

but the US has almost every cold economic number in the bag by quite a bit.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #12  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 8:43 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckman821 View Post
Ummm Good luck actually justifying such a statement with facts and data.
Not based on per-capita income but the proportion that is middle class is much larger.

https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2...und-in-places/



There's little incentive for a middle class person to want to come to the US. However there might be a handful of wealthy people who would want to come here for lower taxes or to start businesses.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #13  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 8:45 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuriandrade View Post
The entire eastern Europe, the 160 million or so whites in Latin America are all way below the US in terms of wealth.

The thing is eastern Europeans can easily go to Western Europe while White Latin Americans live relatively good lives taking full advantage of extremely unequal societies, regressive taxes, cheap labour and low competitive environment. Moreover, they are about to decline and the bulk of them live in the southern portions of South America, far away from the US or Western Europe, so no mass immigration is likely.
That's true. A lot of people in the Ukraine are desperate to leave but why go with the trouble to get to the US when the EU is right next door. Not just Western Europe but also tons of immigrants from the former USSR in Poland and the Czech Republic.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #14  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 8:49 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuriandrade View Post
6,000 from France, 5,000 from Britain in 2017. That makes only 4% of immigrants in Canada. Those are hardly large numbers.
Australia, which like Canada, has a merit based system is the one country that seems to attract a decent number of White immigrants, primarily from the UK but also from South Africa and Southern Europe.

Source: Australian Bureau of Statistics (2018)[2]
Place of birth Estimated resident population[A]
Total Australian-born 17,650,000
Total foreign-born 7,341,910
England England[B] 992,000
Mainland China Mainland China[C] 651,000
India India 592,000
New Zealand New Zealand 568,000
Philippines Philippines 278,000
Vietnam Vietnam 256,000
South Africa South Africa 189,000
Italy Italy 187,000
Malaysia Malaysia 174,000
Scotland Scotland[D] 135,000
Sri Lanka Sri Lanka 134,500
South Korea South Korea 116,120
Germany Germany 114,580
Greece Greece 108,830
United States United States 108,610
Hong Kong Hong Kong SAR[E] 100,620

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreig...n_of_Australia
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #15  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 8:52 PM
Crawford Crawford is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NYC/Polanco, DF
Posts: 19,202
Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
Not based on per-capita income but the proportion that is middle class is much larger.
Middle Class European households have much lower incomes than middle class U.S. households. Yes, it's more equal, but not as wealthy.

I don't think many people would define higher living standards as being poorer as long as long as others are poorer too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
There's little incentive for a middle class person to want to come to the US. However there might be a handful of wealthy people who would want to come here for lower taxes or to start businesses.
There's plenty of incentive, but it's too difficult, so not worth it.

And the wealthy, all things equal, are probably better off in Europe. There are many tax shelters (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Monaco, Lichtenstein, even the UK to an extent), but if you're American you would have renounce citizenship, probably a deal-breaker to most. If you're trying to protect intergenerational wealth Europe is probably a better bet, especially if you're not American (which is why third world despots and Arab playboys tend to domicile in London, Monaco or Zurich instead of NY or LA).
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #16  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 8:54 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 2,718
Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
Australia, which like Canada, has a merit based system is the one country that seems to attract a decent number of White immigrants, primarily from the UK but also from South Africa and Southern Europe.

Source: Australian Bureau of Statistics (2018)[2]
Place of birth Estimated resident population[A]
Total Australian-born 17,650,000
Total foreign-born 7,341,910
England England[B] 992,000
Mainland China Mainland China[C] 651,000
India India 592,000
New Zealand New Zealand 568,000
Philippines Philippines 278,000
Vietnam Vietnam 256,000
South Africa South Africa 189,000
Italy Italy 187,000
Malaysia Malaysia 174,000
Scotland Scotland[D] 135,000
Sri Lanka Sri Lanka 134,500
South Korea South Korea 116,120
Germany Germany 114,580
Greece Greece 108,830
United States United States 108,610
Hong Kong Hong Kong SAR[E] 100,620

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreig...n_of_Australia
Those are older British-born Aussies. If you look back at the previous estimates, the percentage of population born in the UK has started to decrease. It does look like there might be a lot of whites migrating to Australia from New Zealand, which makes sense considering geography.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #17  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 8:56 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,764
Quote:
Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
Not based on per-capita income but the proportion that is middle class is much larger.

https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2...und-in-places/



There's little incentive for a middle class person to want to come to the US. However there might be a handful of wealthy people who would want to come here for lower taxes or to start businesses.
The US has little to no cultural desire for homogeneity especially when it comes to wealth. Europeans have active policies to proactively bring the lower classes to the middle and hinder the higher classes back to a middle class amount of wealth.

I would also say that many European countries have a heavy social and cultural pressure to not over-exceed which the USA largely does not have and in fact we tend to attract people with wildly unlikely desires for wealth and personal success.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #18  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 10:05 PM
yuriandrade's Avatar
yuriandrade yuriandrade is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by Obadno View Post
Yeah it seems to me that a lot of Europeans score high on squishy things like "happiness rankings" They'll quantify quality of life in terms of cost of higher education, time spent in traffic, "access" to healthcare etc.

but the US has almost every cold economic number in the bag by quite a bit.
What’s the point of making US$ 10,000/year more, live 6 years less and work longer hours? I’m the Western European way of life all the way.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #19  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 10:16 PM
Handro Handro is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 422
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuriandrade View Post
What’s the point of making US$ 10,000/year more, live 6 years less and work longer hours? I’m the Western European way of life all the way.
Plus one medical emergency away from bankruptcy, prohibitive education costs, etc.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #20  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2019, 10:55 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,764
Quote:
Originally Posted by yuriandrade View Post
What’s the point of making US$ 10,000/year more, live 6 years less and work longer hours? I’m the Western European way of life all the way.
Well for me I have insurance and given my families health history I will outlive the American average by a decade at minimum. Also the primary reason american life expectancy is lower is A) obesity (which I am not) and B) smoking which I dont do and C) Suicide, which I'd never consider

So I am not that worried and considering I was able to find a very basic job in my early 20's for 35 hours a week that provided adequate healthcare I have a very hard time feeling sympathy for those who dont.

Que "yeah but what about these other people" what do you expect me to do about that? If we enact universal healthcare I'll still pay for a supplemental above that (as most Europeans with means to also do) so it does nothing but increase my and my friends/families healthcare costs.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Discussion Forums > City Discussions
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 7:10 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.