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  #1001  
Old Posted Sep 5, 2016, 4:38 PM
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You could make small changes to up the speed until after the bridge. No reason for that stretch to be 60 if the accesses are removed.
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  #1002  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 11:22 AM
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Imagine the improvements that could be made to the Perimeter and all roads around Winnipeg that serve the 900K living in the capital region if the speNDP hadn't foolishly/recklessly started an eastern MB roadway in the north for $3B to serve a measly 36 thousand people where close to zero economic activity will or ever take place!
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  #1003  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 3:06 PM
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BTW Gunn Rd is missing as a future interchange on the map for two reasons:

1. The map is of Perimeter intersections that currently have traffic signals. Gunn Rd has a stop sign at the Perimeter, not even a traffic light! That is a big part of why it is the most dangerous stretch of the Perimeter.

2. When the CPT east extension hits the Perimeter it will likely be near Gunn Rd but not at that exact location. CPT and the Perimeter would be a full interchange, similar in scope of CCW/Perimeter and what is being proposed for the St Nobert by-pass. It is also extremely likely would be the under route due to the nearby crossing of the floodway and on to Oak Bank.

--

If we could accomplish the following in would really get Winnipeg's roads moving in the right direction:

1. Replace the traffic lights and Gunn Rd on the Perimeter with grade separated interchanges, diamonds or better to make the Perimeter one continuous free flowing route.

2. Have a continuous grade separated four lane highway from Oak Bank to St Francis Xavier via the CPT/CCW/Headingley bypass.

3. Extend Bishop east to Fermor and west to the Perimeter. Then have that route be fully grade separated and free flowing. Likely diamonds except at St Marys and Lag.

4. Grade separate Lag with the possible exceptions being Regent and Dugald due to the complexities involved. Ideally include both those as well.

5. Extend William Clement south to Bishop and full grade separate, likely diamonds except at Portage Ave. Then figure out the north extension to CPT.

If we could get all that in place Winnipeg would start to have some decent road infrastructure to move traffic around. It doesn't solve anywhere near all the issues but would give a solid base to build from going forward.
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  #1004  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 3:34 PM
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^this is a great idea and one that echoes the sentiment of most posters here.
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  #1005  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 3:52 PM
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^^ I would add if it is not on that list it is simply not a priority and that would include Waverly Underpass, Arlington bridge replacement and Marion and Archibald.

Also missed in my original post that I would include the St Nobert by-pass on that list.

If Winnipeg had more "smart" road design used to efficiently move vehicles it would less in terms of additional lanes and new high speed routes. It's not the tree hugging banish all cars view but it has a lot more grounding in the reality of how the city operates and will continue to operate.
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  #1006  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 4:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Imagine the improvements that could be made to the Perimeter and all roads around Winnipeg that serve the 900K living in the capital region if the speNDP hadn't foolishly/recklessly started an eastern MB roadway in the north for $3B to serve a measly 36 thousand people where close to zero economic activity will or ever take place!

Amen to that - that money should have been paid by Ottawa. Almost no Manitoba taxpayers live there. Hopefully the PCs put the whole thing on hold once the current projects are complete.
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  #1007  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 4:10 PM
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Originally Posted by CoryB View Post

4. Grade separate Lag with the possible exceptions being Regent and Dugald due to the complexities involved. Ideally include both those as well.
The ironic part of this idea is that those are the only two intersections that are in the early planning stages to be replaced by grade separation.
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  #1008  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 4:13 PM
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Amen to that - that money should have been paid by Ottawa. Almost no Manitoba taxpayers live there. Hopefully the PCs put the whole thing on hold once the current projects are complete.
There is an all weather road serving isolated communities on the west side of the province that runs all the way to Flin Flon. Aside from Flin Flon how much economic activity takes place north of Swan River. Getting really tired of seeing govt. waste tax dollars when there is no economic net benefit!

Here are the tax dollars already wasted on the Eastern Road to nowhere; http://www.eastsideroadauthority.mb....n-tenders.html

Imagine if that money had been used for the 900K in the capital region to upgrade the Perimeter.
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  #1009  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 4:27 PM
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The ironic part of this idea is that those are the only two intersections that are in the early planning stages to be replaced by grade separation.
Well thank goodness. I'm going to assume/hope/pray this has something to do with either one of the coming inner ring road study or the Marion Widening plan being re-jigged. Transcona West Area structure plan also showed the Regent intersection as a grade separated. Don't think I've ever seen Reenders be grade separated in any docs.
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  #1010  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 4:33 PM
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Don't think I've ever seen Reenders be grade separated in any docs.
I thought there was a concept somewhere showing a raise Lag running past Renders with it having diamond access. In reality it could be changed into a right in, right out, no cross traffic and have minimal impact if Regent is a full interchange.
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  #1011  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 4:51 PM
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I thought there was a concept somewhere showing a raise Lag running past Renders with it having diamond access. In reality it could be changed into a right in, right out, no cross traffic and have minimal impact if Regent is a full interchange.
Yeah I'm not sure. There will need to be some thought into how that all goes together. The Credit Union really is in a dumb place. Can't be having a bunch of right in/outs all over the place. Ideally they'd get the service road to connect with Reenders. Reenders is used quite a bit as access to Lag. So it would be nice if that was kept. Regent is ridiculous a lot of times. So I couldn't imagine using it solely as the access point.
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  #1012  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 5:08 PM
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Originally Posted by CoryB View Post

3. Extend Bishop east to Fermor and west to the Perimeter. Then have that route be fully grade separated and free flowing. Likely diamonds except at St Marys and Lag.
I always though that the east expansion of Bishop G. was to be included as part of the future build out of Sage Creek. With Qualico putting a stop on Sage Creek development (according to today's Free Press) pending the resolution of the city building charge, it will later rather than sooner.
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  #1013  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 6:31 PM
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Originally Posted by bomberjet View Post
Well thank goodness. I'm going to assume/hope/pray this has something to do with either one of the coming inner ring road study or the Marion Widening plan being re-jigged. Transcona West Area structure plan also showed the Regent intersection as a grade separated. Don't think I've ever seen Reenders be grade separated in any docs.
The potential Dugald grade separation is part of the Marion Widening study and the Regent separation has been on the City's radar for a while as it is a very contested high speed intersection. The problem with Regent/59 is the complexities with construction and detours...virtually no room and high traffic numbers.

I have been told it should resemble the interchanges around the Chinook Centre in Calgary (Glenmore and McLeod)

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  #1014  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 7:29 PM
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That's about what I was thinking. Compact interchange. Kind of funny. One of the original schemes was to have a cloverleaf a this intersection. Now it's super tight. I think I pilfered a plan of that from somewhere. I'll see if I can find it.
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  #1015  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 7:50 PM
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^^^What is with this Province/City thinking every grade separation needs to be a cloverleaf. Has anyone noticed the 50s/60s were over 50 years ago. Not many jurisdictions build cloverleafs anymore, to much land use, not suitable for high speeds, looks like my grandpa....
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  #1016  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 7:56 PM
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In fairness, there hasn't been a pure cloverleaf built new in Manitoba since the 101/7 interchange sometime in the mid/late 80s. Although I suppose the one at 101/190 will one day become one based on how it's shaping up?
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  #1017  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 8:16 PM
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haha the plan I speak of was 50's/60's era. It was the same plan the Disraeli was born from. Disraeli was the only piece ever built out. Don't think it was WATS, but something else.
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  #1018  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 8:31 PM
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In fairness, there hasn't been a pure cloverleaf built new in Manitoba since the 101/7 interchange sometime in the mid/late 80s. Although I suppose the one at 101/190 will one day become one based on how it's shaping up?
Pretty sure 101/190 is what the kids call a parclo. A true coverleaf has traffic entering the flow and exiting the flow share a lane. This is especially dangerous as you have acceleration and deceleration occurring in the same physical space. The parclo mostly moves them to their own spaces although south bound 101 has west traffic entering and south traffic exiting sharing a space.
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  #1019  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 8:39 PM
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Pretty sure 101/190 is what the kids call a parclo. A true coverleaf has traffic entering the flow and exiting the flow share a lane. This is especially dangerous as you have acceleration and deceleration occurring in the same physical space. The parclo mostly moves them to their own spaces although south bound 101 has west traffic entering and south traffic exiting sharing a space.
I'm no engineer, but I didn't think having a separate lane to access the ramps and weaving lanes disqualified an interchange from being a cloverleaf. I thought a parclo was a cloverleaf that had some of the elements (like loop ramps) missing... Pembina/Bishop Grandin being a good example.

If you look at an aerial view of 101/190, it's clear that most of the elements of a cloverleaf are there... the SB to WB and EB to SB ramps are graded in. The only thing that's missing are the NB to WB and EB to NB loop ramps, although there is clearly enough room for them to be added.
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  #1020  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2016, 10:12 PM
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101/190 ought to be parclo with two high speed flyovers. Heck even WB T/C to South perimeter should have a high speed flyover. That one is really dangerous. As is Portage and perimeter and lagimodiere and south perimeter. Altough if they ever get around to building the headingley bypass then we would't have to worry about portage and we could just stick a flyover from NB 101 to WB 190
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