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  #1  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2018, 4:02 PM
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PHILADELPHIA | 200 Race | 230 FT | 19 FLOORS



200 Race St
http://www.phila.gov/historical/meet..._IC-lowres.pdf
Title: 200 Race
Project: Apartments, hotel, ground floor retail
Architect: Adjmi Architecture
Developer: Revolution Development
Location: 200 Race Street, Philadelphia, PA
District: Old City
Floors: 19
Height: 230 FT

Last edited by summersm343; May 18, 2019 at 5:08 AM.
     
     
  #2  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2018, 4:52 PM
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Whoa!
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  #3  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2018, 5:07 PM
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Didn't see that coming. Isn't there something under construction near there (between there and Christ Church) already?
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  #4  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2018, 5:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64 View Post
Didn't see that coming. Isn't there something under construction near there (between there and Christ Church) already?
I think there's a project on the 400 block of Race, but I don't think it's nearly this tall. Someone on here compared it to a pile of tinder
     
     
  #5  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2018, 7:30 PM
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While i like the design, my big concern is the lack of space for loading and other back of house issues, especially trash removal. If loading is going to take place on 2nd Street, there won’t be room for passenger drop off/pick up when this is happening. I also find it to be a stretch that the trash for a hotel of this size will just be brought out to Race Street; more dedicated space is needed for the operations to be practical (not to mention for the commercial component ops).

I love the height, the high-end condos and the street life this will add, but this could be a really tough sell to the neighbors for the reasons mentioned above (as this will need a variance to get built).

Last edited by El Duderino; Jun 20, 2018 at 2:09 AM. Reason: Read the document more thoroughly
     
     
  #6  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2018, 7:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgrath618 View Post
I think there's a project on the 400 block of Race, but I don't think it's nearly this tall. Someone on here compared it to a pile of tinder
The project at 4th and Race is a 4 story apartment building that mimics row-homes. Renderings here: http://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phill...s-for-401-race

Also, the National consists of additional apartments that are going up on the east side of 2nd between Race and Arch; these along with 218 Arch street (another 150-or-so apartments) is really going to change the amount of foot traffic over here.
     
     
  #7  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2018, 12:19 PM
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I love this proposal and hope it gets built ASAP.

In addition to the 401 Race St development mentioned above, and The National --
don't forget PMC Property has nearly completed this one at 218 Arch:




https://pmcpropertygroup.com/properties/218-arch-street
     
     
  #8  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2018, 8:02 PM
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^Yep, I did mention that one above as well

It's really wild how many large developments are going up all over Old City. There are a few other smaller projects as well - 313 Race Street, 3rd between Market and Arch, Vine between 2nd and 3rd, an Astoban condo project immediately east of the Arch St. side of the National and row homes going up on Front and near the Ritz. Hopefully that damn billboard/surface parking lot on the opposite corner to this proposal will be the next lot to be developed, as I'd imagine this project would make that corner that much more appealing; the billboard lot is also in a special bridge approach overlay that is much more permissive from a zoning perspective, so that alone should increase the value of the land.
     
     
  #9  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2018, 9:11 PM
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A big part of it is that OCCA used to deny every single project that required community review, and then when they died -- because when you're a community group that says "No" to everything, you run into insurance issues; who knew? -- it suddenly opened up that part of Old City for a development gold rush.

As long as the Architectural Committee isn't populated by aesthetic cretins of the type you find in the main development thread, this thing should get approved largely as-is. It really is one of the handsomest and most aesthetically pleasing proposals we've seen on this board in quite a while, IMO, and I really love how it's bringing this Chelsea look to Old City.
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  #10  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2018, 6:35 PM
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I think this proposal would work (and be fantastic) IF the bottom portion was a genuine, historic industrial brick building with a modern overbuild. But the base is new construction and therein lies the problem. I get what they're going for, but I question if they can achieve that industrial/modern "Soho/Chelsea" look since the industrial aspect of it is contrived. Because the base is new construction, I don't know that they will achieve that jarring contrast you need for something like this to work (Pennovation is a good example of this style). Although, I'd love to eat my words b/c I really like the concept (again, if only the base was a true industrial building) and I think the contemporary part is really well designed.

Kudos to the developer/architect for thinking outside the box and putting forward a bold proposal. Sometimes it's good to shake things up with buildings that elicit strong love-it-or-hate-it opinions.

Last edited by McBane; Jun 21, 2018 at 6:50 PM.
     
     
  #11  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2018, 6:39 PM
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Definitely doing some cribbing off of the architecture of Lower Manhattan and architects like Tamarkin and Adjmi.
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  #12  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2018, 1:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vandelay View Post
Definitely doing some cribbing off of the architecture of Lower Manhattan and architects like Tamarkin and Adjmi.
It’s misstated in the first post, but this is indeed Adjmi
     
     
  #13  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2018, 5:45 AM
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Mark me down as someone who really likes this design.
     
     
  #14  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2018, 2:29 PM
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I like this design as well. I think it would look great at street level and when looking at the building from a distance.

My only concern is with the west elevation, I hope the metal panels look good.

Hopefully the logistics as mentioned by El Duderino can be worked out.
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Philadelphia transportation thread: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=164129
     
     
  #15  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 5:40 PM
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edit: I’m dumb
     
     
  #16  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 6:15 PM
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Architecture Committee notes from the preliminary project review (starts on page 23): http://www.phila.gov/historical/meet...18%20draft.pdf

Synopsis of discussion: not a bad looking building, but doesn't fit character of neighborhood and is out of scale, most feedback from neighbors was negative, some recommended they go even more modern throughout

This is non-binding feedback, but it wouldn't surprise me if there we some adjustments made based on the decreased likelihood of passing muster by the higher authority of the Historical Committee. Hopefully it will evolve slightly but still retain most of the height and overall look.

This intersection (2nd and Race) would be a fantastic location for 3 modern towers that would be a grand entrance/exit for Old City (the third location being where the surface lot/billboard are...Mr. Barstool shouldn't go anywhere). The buildings this would replace provide little architecture value, are in disrepair, and do little to add to the overall character of the area, despite what the vocal meeting attendees claim.
     
     
  #17  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2018, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Duderino View Post
Architecture Committee notes from the preliminary project review (starts on page 23): http://www.phila.gov/historical/meet...18%20draft.pdf

Synopsis of discussion: not a bad looking building, but doesn't fit character of neighborhood and is out of scale, most feedback from neighbors was negative, some recommended they go even more modern throughout

This is non-binding feedback, but it wouldn't surprise me if there we some adjustments made based on the decreased likelihood of passing muster by the higher authority of the Historical Committee. Hopefully it will evolve slightly but still retain most of the height and overall look.

This intersection (2nd and Race) would be a fantastic location for 3 modern towers that would be a grand entrance/exit for Old City (the third location being where the surface lot/billboard are...Mr. Barstool shouldn't go anywhere). The buildings this would replace provide little architecture value, are in disrepair, and do little to add to the overall character of the area, despite what the vocal meeting attendees claim.
We have some friends in the the Bridge and they say the entire building HATES this idea.

They are pissed about the south view being obscured and the amount of traffic this would add to that corner.

I would expect a pretty good amount of push back on this.

I made a total idiot out of myself at the Bridge at a 4th of july party there when this came up. I was like "oh you saw that?! Yeah that looks aweso.....oh you hate it? Oh yeah, me too, me too...."

Anyway, I hope they can figure this out. The buildings currently on this site are terrible. This would really open up things there.
     
     
  #18  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2018, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Redddog View Post
We have some friends in the the Bridge and they say the entire building HATES this idea.

They are pissed about the south view being obscured and the amount of traffic this would add to that corner.

I would expect a pretty good amount of push back on this.

I made a total idiot out of myself at the Bridge at a 4th of july party there when this came up. I was like "oh you saw that?! Yeah that looks aweso.....oh you hate it? Oh yeah, me too, me too...."

Anyway, I hope they can figure this out. The buildings currently on this site are terrible. This would really open up things there.
Totally get why you heard this pushback (though nice save on your part haha), but my guess is that the fact that a quarter or so of the units in a rental building will have semi-obscured views won’t be a deal breaker. Per the meeting notes I posted above, the vast majority of those against it were long-entrenched neighbors...who probably railed against the Bridge. Also, it’s pretty amusing that those who live there complain about the traffic, given the huge spike in the number of drop-offs on the north side of Race (the Bridge side), though in fairness not all of those drops are for people who live there.

Basically, this is the ultimate pot calling the kettle black...and I say that as someone who lives in this immediate vicinity and will be just as impacted by the project (for the record, i want this to happen for sure).
     
     
  #19  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2018, 1:30 PM
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Originally Posted by El Duderino View Post
Basically, this is the ultimate pot calling the kettle black...
It's the standard "Got mine, bitches!" argument that virtually every new project in a residential area faces.
     
     
  #20  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2018, 1:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redddog View Post
We have some friends in the the Bridge and they say the entire building HATES this idea.

They are pissed about the south view being obscured and the amount of traffic this would add to that corner.

I would expect a pretty good amount of push back on this.

I made a total idiot out of myself at the Bridge at a 4th of july party there when this came up. I was like "oh you saw that?! Yeah that looks aweso.....oh you hate it? Oh yeah, me too, me too...."

Anyway, I hope they can figure this out. The buildings currently on this site are terrible. This would really open up things there.
Nimbys are bad enough. RENTER Nimbys are even worse. Those people can let their little lease rubber out and find a building that gives them the views they want. This is the perfect lot for a nice redevelopment like this.
     
     
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