Winnipeg | True North Square | 86.9M | 77.8M | 25F | 17F | 22F | 17F | 19F | U/C - Page 63

Urban recluse · #**1241** Posted **Mar 7, 2016, 3:31 PM**

Yes. I often imagine such a scenario where a lot of that residential character was retained. A mixture of old homes (restored of course LOL) and some converted to shops and restaurants, etc mixed with newer developments which would have been added over the decades. The downtown would be a vibrant one. At this point, the city and province need to work their bags off to fill so many gaps.

I truly hope TNS acts as a catalyst for further development in the area.

TimeFadesAway · #**1242** Posted **Mar 7, 2016, 5:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

I guess in the postwar boom era the old turn of the century houses were falling apart and everyone figured that skyscrapers would replace them, so everything was flattened. As it turned out, very little of that space was actually needed and 60 years later we're still trying to fill all of the voids in that area.

The difficulty, as I see it, had two causes. The first was that the houses had deteriorated significantly, morphing from palatial single family homes to run down rooming houses. Secondly, as Winnipeg was becoming less of a banking centre and more of a financial and insurance centre in the '50s, there was a movement to create a 'new' financial centre, away from Main, on Broadway. Great West Life and, I believe, Investor's Group were the first to make this move. Unfortunately, that had the effect of creating an island between Portage and Broadway that was the last nail in the coffin for any hope of maintaining a residential neighbourhood there were dashed.

It's too bad. If you look at photos from the residential era, there was amazing potential. Although the cash required to renovate these house had they remained standing would have been substantial.

esquire · #**1243** Posted **Mar 7, 2016, 5:48 PM**

^ Yeah, it seemed as though Winnipeg was trying to emulate the style of Toronto's University Ave at the time. Could you imagine if that finance/insurance industry had focused on setting up in the then-existing CBD area? Even a cluster on an existing artery like South Main? It could have really been transformative.

Instead we ended up with kind of a half-assed "financial district" separated, as you point out, by a large gap between Portage and Broadway. We're still paying the price for that.

Urban recluse · #**1244** Posted **Mar 7, 2016, 6:02 PM**

Love supertall skyscrapers though I do, it makes sense to spread smaller developments over the downtown to fill in these gaps.

I would actually prefer to see SkyCity reduced to 20 stories, and a second project perhaps fill one of the other lots, say the one at York and Donald and/or Hargrave.

bomberjet · #**1245** Posted **Mar 7, 2016, 6:11 PM**

I'm kind of torn on that topic. Mega projects vs. smaller ones. There are only a few large empty lots downtown (I know there are tonnes of lots). So I'm okay with having SkyCity go ahead as a single large project. Then all the smaller projects can fill the gaps surrounding the larger projects. That's how it should go anyways IMO.

Bdog · #**1246** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 1:01 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

Looking back on things, downtown could have been a totally different place if the original residential character of the area south of St. Mary Ave. was left intact, so that the area between the river and St. Mary Ave. would have effectively been a big residential neighbourhood like Osborne Village, or if you want an out of town example, Regina's "transition area".

I guess in the postwar boom era the old turn of the century houses were falling apart and everyone figured that skyscrapers would replace them, so everything was flattened. As it turned out, very little of that space was actually needed and 60 years later we're still trying to fill all of the voids in that area.

Had the area remained residential, it probably would have concentrated more development into the Portage Avenue and Main Street corridor. It probably would have also kept a critical mass of activity in what is still the most forlorn part of downtown, basically the northernmost stretch above the Exchange District. It would have also resulted in a much more substantial downtown residential neighbourhood.

Expanding the CBD area to its current footprint was a big mistake that we're still paying for.

Conversely, things could have gone another way in that scenario. The dilapidated residential could have continued to deteriorate, and become an undesirable neighbourhood (somewhat like we see in rustbust US). At the same time, during that 60s boom, dealerships, surface lots, and mid/high rise office/apartments replace our beloved Exchange District instead of those houses. Fast forward to today, and the exchange is gone (covered by Broadway to Graham type development), while there's a mini North End south of Graham. Actually, it was probably replaced in the late 60s by Lord Selkirk Park style "urban renewal".

I'll take what we have today...

1ajs · #**1247** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 3:18 AM**

Urban recluse · #**1248** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 3:20 AM**

Rise, bitch, rise.

buzzg · #**1249** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 5:16 AM**

Has anything in Winnipeg EVER moved this quickly. Especially of this scale, and the fact they admitted no one really knew what they were gonna find under the parking lot.

The Unknown Poster · #**1250** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 2:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by buzzg

Has anything in Winnipeg EVER moved this quickly. Especially of this scale, and the fact they admitted no one really knew what they were gonna find under the parking lot.

That's interesting. What might they have found? Historically, what has been located there in the recent past (say 100 years or so) and distant past? Might there have been some historically significant discoveries?

bomberjet · #**1251** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 3:08 PM**

It's been discussed on previous pages, with photos. I think there was a bus station, a school and/or church, a parking lot. Prior to that housing, and then probably prairie.

Urban recluse · #**1252** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 4:53 PM**

First school, South Ward school (then named South Central, Carlton school) built in 1880. Prior to this, I believe the land was just that: land. It was owned by HBC if I am not mistaken, and it was donated for the school.

https://readreidread.files.wordpress...onschool-1.jpg

Second built in 1903.

https://readreidread.files.wordpress...-carlton-2.jpg

bomberjet · #**1253** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 5:00 PM**

Also, thanks for the photos 1AJS.

I'm curious as to what is under the orange hoarding on the left hand side of your picture, above the white office trailer. It's up out of the hole on the original sidewalk. Also looks like something going in the far bottom corner, possibly tower crane foundation.

Cyro · #**1254** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 5:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1ajs

Progress is moving at an incredible rate..We'll be above grade in no time..

bomberjet · #**1255** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 5:25 PM**

It's been cool to see the progress on a daily basis. They keep moving and replacing the ramp down into the hole. Which is quite the effort to be moving this ramp around almost daily.

buzzg · #**1256** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 8:20 PM**

UnkonwnPoster: The engineers were concerned that there could have been a lot of environmental damage under the old bus depot spot, and that costly and time consuming remediation may have been needed.

factis · #**1257** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 9:29 PM**

I walked by one day and there were several very large metal water tanks laying end to end with "Canadian dewatering" on them. I'm assuming they'll be for storage as they try and keep that hole dry. Anyone know if there are restrictions on pumping that water into the storm sewer?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Also, thanks for the photos 1AJS.

I'm curious as to what is under the orange hoarding on the left hand side of your picture, above the white office trailer. It's up out of the hole on the original sidewalk. Also looks like something going in the far bottom corner, possibly tower crane foundation.

cllew · #**1258** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 9:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by factis

I walked by one day and there were several very large metal water tanks laying end to end with "Canadian dewatering" on them. I'm assuming they'll be for storage as they try and keep that hole dry. Anyone know if there are restrictions on pumping that water into the storm sewer?

From what I saw from looking down from the office window at them before the cover went on, the tanks were compartmentalized with weirs in them. I think with 4 weirs in total between the two tanks (2 each tank) giving 6 compartments of settling space.

I would guess that by the time any water makes it to the last compartment most if not all of any mud should have settled out and the water may be clear enough to go into the sewer.

1ajs · #**1259** Posted **Mar 8, 2016, 11:33 PM**

could also be a cement plant of some sort pcl had a setup for one at the cmhr

cllew · #**1260** Posted **Mar 9, 2016, 12:57 AM**

the containers are from Canadian Watering. They specialize in pumping out and filtering the water from excavations like at the True North Square.