Portage and Main Proposals ideas

[cheswick]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Not just north-south but also east-west. Plan a route from Portage and Morray to say the Club Regent Casino without going through downtown.

You mean no reason other than any councilor voting to not put those barriers back up is signing their name on a dotted line to be promptly voted out of office.

Based on what? People were asked to vote on an issue and the majority voted against it. Doesn’t mean the majority were passionate about it one way or the other. I’d venture to say the vast majority or people who voted were pretty apathetic. Bowman was elected with part of his platform being opening it up. Goes to show you right there that the issue is far from the front burner for most people or he would never have been elected.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The voters spoke pretty clearly on this and to go against the public opinion in the referendum is career suicide for anyone on city council

Change happens.

The non-binding plebiscite, like all opinion sampling, reflected how people felt at one point in time. Public opinion can change, and with it the willingness of some city councillors to continue to oppose opening P & M.

I certainly can't speak for the inner thoughts of the "keep it closed" side but I SUSPECT many people who voted to keep P & M closed to pedestrian traffic did so under the assumption that doing so would mean NO money would end up being spent at the intersection and that automobile travel through the area would carry on unchanged.

Now that it seems lots of money needs to be spent and there will be disruptions to automobile traffic anyway, some drivers will probably try to find alternative routes and others will simply tough it out and endure the traffic delays.

Will the traffic delays due to construction be as long as they would have experienced with pedestrians crossing at P & M? Who can tell? I am guessing, however, that many drivers will adjust their expectations on the time they will need to get through the intersection. Some may even change their driving habits and start their journey 4 minutes early (though for many people that is just wishful thinking). For some of these people I suspect it will be less threatening to them to again suggest opening P & M to pedestrian crossing when they have already gotten used to the "delay". Add to this the now-extra cost of re-building the concrete barriers once they have been removed and voila!

I repeat: change happens.

[esquire]

Absolutely no one would get voted out over something as operationally trivial (yet symbolically important) as reopening Portage and Main to pedestrians. If it reopened, in typical Winnipeg style people would kvetch about it for a few months and predict traffic Armageddon, but then it would open, things would be pretty well the same as they were before, and everyone would forget about it. In other words, it would be exactly what happened when Bell MTS Place was built.

Unfortunately Bowman does not exactly have an abundance of fortitude, so he found a way to get out of delivering on his promise. The good news is that the next mayor can finish the job.

[CoryB]

The reason Portage and Main went to a plebiscite is that it was informally voted on by Council behind closed doors like everything else and was "defeated". Knowing it would not pass at Council, Bowman pushed the idea of the plebiscite forward likely with backing on the true council, EPC, willing to support a vote for opening.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The reason Portage and Main went to a plebiscite is that it was informally voted on by Council behind closed doors like everything else and was "defeated". Knowing it would not pass at Council, Bowman pushed the idea of the plebiscite forward likely with backing on the true council, EPC, willing to support a vote for opening.

A more capable politician would have found a way of getting a deal done. A mayor who backs down at the first sign of resistance, especially for something like this where other than maybe with Browaty who is a "special" kind of guy, resistance would not have been too entrenched, is probably not someone cut out for the job IMO.

[buzzg]

So my source was correct: the barricades are currently being torn down. About half is gone on the Main Street side of Richardson.

[cheswick]

Originally Posted by buzzg

So my source was correct: the barricades are currently being torn down. About half is gone on the Main Street side of Richardson.

To be replaced with what?

[bomberjet]

Why are they being torn down? For Richardson plaza work or for underground repairs?

Hopefully it blows up in the press / social media and the team closed people lose their minds hahahaha

[Wigglez]

Originally Posted by cheswick

To be replaced with what?

If were to believe the opponents - the piled up bodies of those who dare to cross their freeway on foot

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Why are they being torn down? For Richardson plaza work or for underground repairs?

The barriers are being torn down to make way for new pedestrian barriers made out of leftover "Team Open" signs.

[The Jabroni]

Eh, just nuke it already. Start fresh.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The barriers are being torn down to make way for new pedestrian barriers made out of leftover "Team Open" signs.

I have boxes of flyers. Can we use them instead?

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Why are they being torn down? For Richardson plaza work or for underground repairs?

Hopefully it blows up in the press / social media and the team closed people lose their minds hahahaha

To replace the roof membrane on the Richardson’s underground buildings. There are no barricades in the plan. Will be interesting to see what the city does.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by trueviking

I have boxes of flyers. Can we use them instead?

Sure. Just drop them off at the intersection when construction is completed. They can then be encased in the new permanent concrete pedestrian barriers.

Originally Posted by trueviking

There are no barricades in the plan. Will be interesting to see what the city does.

Nothing says important intersection in a major city like some nice precast jersey barriers.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Sure. Just drop them off at the intersection when construction is completed. They can then be encased in the new permanent concrete pedestrian barriers.



Nothing says important intersection in a major city like some nice precast jersey barriers.

Actually there are strategically-placed concrete blocks on the sidewalks in downtown Toronto now, ever since that crazy guy drove down the sidewalk in North York and killed all those people. So Portage and Main isn’t going to look quite as unusual, going forward, to your big-city visitors.

[plrh]

Originally Posted by trueviking

To replace the roof membrane on the Richardson’s underground buildings. There are no barricades in the plan. Will be interesting to see what the city does.

The tender probably says, "sidewalk repairs are incidental to the membrane work, at the discretion of the engineer"

Passing the buck to the field inspector (summer student) and the contractor.

[buzzg]

My money is on the big black planters that the city uses everywhere. Can easily be moved in the future.

[bomberjet]

We're talking about crossing the street man. Crossing the street.

[Andy6]

There are lots of places where you can’t cross a given street, man.

[bomberjet]

The whole argument is silly. Barricades are already coming down to repair the underground. So let's spend 10 million dollars replacing them. Or not. But then my drive will be 30 seconds longer. Okay, so? But transit will need to buy buses (apparently). So let transit spend the money on buses instead of concrete barriers if that's the case.

For context, the City let's you cross Kenaston Blvd Bishop Grandin, Lagirmodiere, etc on foot, which is 80km/h with 50k-60k vehicles per day. But we can't cross the street downtown at the heart of the City?