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  #61  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by toddguy
Well I had read that 3 square miles were cleared out starting in the 1950's for the la Defense area and that over 25,000 residents were displaced. I guess the source I had was wrong then. Certainly it does not appear that large in any images I have seen of it.
3 square miles, that's about three times larger than the municipality of Puteaux, where will be located that Thom Mayne's Tower. La Défense is about 0.7 square miles, or 2 km², and that tiny area already hosts about 40 towers above 100m/300ft.


Actually, municipalities in the Paris area are 10 times smaller than the average municipalities in the US. French municipalities nowadays haven't evolved since the royal parishes of the 18th century. That's the main reason why I think it's very sad that when we type "Paris" on SSP diagrams, no building of La Défense appears. Clearly, that French exception when it goes about municipalities isn't something which could be understood internationally.
     
     
  #62  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 11:35 AM
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honestly, the top just freaks me out.
     
     
  #63  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by toddguy
*edit* The French government officially launched its La Défense operation in 1958 by creating a Public Corporation for managing the project, the "Etablissement Public pour l'aménagement de la région de La Défense", or EPAD. 750 hectares of land were allocated from three different neighboring towns - Courbevoie, Puteaux, and Nanterre.
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/zo/?id=100065

^^ well 750 hectares is about 1800 acres...and with 640 acres to a square mile that is nearly 3 square miles is it not??
Emporis is wrong. 750 hectares, or 3 square miles, that's the combined area made by both Puteaux and Courbevoie, the two main areas on which are located La Défense. However, La Défense represents only a part of both municipalities (and also a minor part of Nanterre).

To understand that kind of things, you should understand that French municipalities are the same as the old parishes of the 18th century. It reflects no urban reality at all. Courbevoie and Puteaux are not La Défense, La Défense is located in the middle of both, but don't cover them fully. I'm sorry if that sounds complicate.
     
     
  #64  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 11:42 AM
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I'm afraid that the top is not the worst part of it.
     
     
  #65  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 12:08 PM
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Here is a google map showing where is located La Défense. The district is mainly located on Puteaux and Courbevoie, but also extends to Nanterre. As you can see there are various municipalities which are totally independent from the development of the business district. That's why Emporis and Skyscraperpage, in considering municipalities as the thing determining all, aren't adapted to the Parisian case.

The Société Générale twin towers are themselves located half on Puteaux and half on Nanterre...

     
     
  #66  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Metropolitan
Here is a google map showing where is located La Défense. The district is mainly located on Puteaux and Courbevoie, but also extends to Nanterre. As you can see there are various municipalities which are totally independent from the development of the business district. That's why Emporis and Skyscraperpage, in considering municipalities as the thing determining all, aren't adapted to the Parisian case.

The Société Générale twin towers are themselves located half on Puteaux and half on Nanterre...

Thanks for the info. That aerial does clear it up. Emporis obviously was talking about the whole area then and not just the part that really is La Defense.

Well anyway I hope this tower design gets tweaked some and turns out to be better than these initial renderings suggest.
     
     
  #67  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 1:24 PM
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"Some people are being a bit (as in a lot) reactionary. Don't be nimbys. Not every skyscraper has to utilize only straight lines. There is a lot of geometry in this tower."

Someone is full of epiphanies I'm not sure how I could be NIMBYish about this tower as I live a few thousand miles away from its planned site. And really? Not every tower has to have straight lines? The HELL you say! Next thing you know, you'll be telling me that they've invented electricity!?!

Am I correct in understanding that SSC is down? That would explain a lot of these posts lately.
     
     
  #68  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 5:23 PM
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I'm sure the more artistic of you can do a better job but this is my reaction to this design:

     
     
  #69  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 5:31 PM
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All the posts in this thread prove my point I made yesterday, that this is a potentially groundbreaking design.
     
     
  #70  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 5:44 PM
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A nice, slim and tall tower would be 10000x better than this piece of .. shmoo.

Une belle, grande mince serait bien mieux que cette tour qui fait de l'embompoint.

Qui sera le principal locataire/ promoteur de la tour?? ca en fait quand meme de l'espace a louer!!
     
     
  #71  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 6:05 PM
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I do like this building !!
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  #72  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 6:31 PM
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Most controversial and one of the most intriguing designs I've seen in a long time.
This is how you do it.

I love Paris.
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Last edited by staff; Nov 29, 2006 at 6:36 PM.
     
     
  #73  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 6:37 PM
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I'm sorry, but this is just flippin' rediculous.

Gherkins, Sea Cucumbers, Crumpled Trash, Shtockenblocken Lego Buildings...This stuff just doesn't do it for me. I think it may be better on a smaller scale (lets say museums or something of the sort) instead of using it on monstrous towers.

It looks like an eggplant skin held up by pick-up sticks w/ a stringy toupee.

^^ Speaking of how to "Do It" - I'd nominate Nashville (Sig Twr) for that.
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  #74  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 8:19 PM
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Originally Posted by BANKofMANHATTAN
^^ Speaking of how to "Do It" - I'd nominate Nashville (Sig Twr) for that.
A retro tower is virtually impossible in Paris. It'll be dull and squat (most of the time), or avant garde, but not retro.

Not tall either, apparently.
     
     
  #75  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 10:11 PM
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Eco-skyscraper planned to rival Eiffel tower

It is a city so protective of its romantic skyline that skyscrapers have been banned in the historic centre for more than 30 years.

But on Monday Paris unveiled plans for a vast glass-enveloped office block that will become its tallest commercial building and loftiest construction since the Eiffel tower was inaugurated in 1889.

The "Phare," or lighthouse, is designed by Californian architect Thom Mayne.

Echoing London's famous "Gherkin," it is a gently sloping eco-friendly glass construction complete with wind-turbines on its roof, that will be the centrepiece of an ambitious overhaul of the La Defense area on the city's western outskirts.

Mayne's design was selected from proposals from10 famous architects including Norman Foster and Rem Koolhaas.

Once described as Paris's "mini-Manhattan," La Defense is one of Europe's biggest purpose-built business districts, built by Franois Mitterrand in 1989 to mark the bicentenary of the revolution.

Other projects built as part of Mitterrand's "Grands Travaux" developments included the Louvre's glass pyramid and the National Library.

But recently, the somewhat bleak La Defense has begun planning a new generation of high-rises to compete with new urban business quarters in Moscow, Madrid and Amsterdam. Around a fifth of the area's buildings are expected to be redeveloped.

The overhaul reflects worries that Paris has been losing business to rival cities including London and Milan and offers a chance to create a tower to match developments like Foster's glass Swiss Re building in the City of London, nicknamed the "Gherkin".

At 300 metres high, the "Phare" will be the first building to approach Gustav Eiffel's tower, which was originally 300 metres tall, but now soars a further 24 metres with its aerial.

A human element

"It's about an icon, and one of the major buildings in Paris," Mayne told reporters.

"There's a fluidity, a sensuousness, a softness to the form as it reaches to the sky," he said, adding he wanted the building to have a human element and describing its asymmetric twist which swells out over an elevated lobby in the lower portion before tapering off to a thicket of wind turbines.

Mayne said he wanted the Phare to be "a prototype for a green building," with the wind farm generating energy for the tower's heating and cooling for five months of the year and a movable "double skin" cutting the heat from direct sunlight through the windows.

At a cost of 900 million euros (US$1.2 billion), the building, which will offer 130,000 square metres of office space, is due to be completed in 2012.

Builder Unibail's Chief Executive Guillaume Poitrinal said the project showed private sector developers were just as capable as the public sector of creating landmark buildings, even if the Phare is dwarfed in height by mega developments in Asia.

"It's a real symbol of modernity but it's not a record tower, we're not trying to go to 800 metres. The idea is to have something which is modern and iconic rather than just high," he said.

But just as the Eiffel tower was initially described by the author Guy de Maupassant as "an odious tower of extreme bad taste", the French capital is braced for a backlash.

The newspaper Le Monde warned yesterday that a "hatred for concrete" and fear of high buildings was still common among Parisians traumatised by the 210 metre-tall 1970s monstrosity, Tour Montparnasse.

Source: China Daily
     
     
  #76  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 10:30 PM
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"
Once described as Paris's "mini-Manhattan," La Defense is one of Europe's biggest purpose-built business districts, built by Franois Mitterrand in 1989 to mark the bicentenary of the revolution.
"
they got their facts messed up

Ever since a kid I have always loved the tour montparnasse, and many more people like it than people think. Of course, there are plenty of retired people just waiting to move down to the cote d'azur, who skew the polls, otherwise, TM, as long as it is cleaned up, is great.
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  #77  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 10:41 PM
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Eww.

First the big "ding-dong" 30 St Mary Axe in London
Then the hidious deformed skinny Chicago Spire
And now, umm, this! I really cant describe this hidious building.

Seriosuly, it looks like the top collapsed off and the building just melted itself. Imagine two arms and a face and you'll see a guy with spikey hair and a huge ass!

I love the La Defence Skyline, so sleek and modern. So far the new towers are a great addition to the skyline, until this one.

Hopefully there is a redesign. Why not a nice postmodern tower?
     
     
  #78  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2006, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick
Eww.

First the big "ding-dong" 30 St Mary Axe in London
Then the hidious deformed skinny Chicago Spire
And now, umm, this! I really cant describe this hidious building.

Seriosuly, it looks like the top collapsed off and the building just melted itself. Imagine two arms and a face and you'll see a guy with spikey hair and a huge ass!

I love the La Defence Skyline, so sleek and modern. So far the new towers are a great addition to the skyline, until this one.

Hopefully there is a redesign. Why not a nice postmodern tower?
well postmodern is falling out of fashion, the 21st century most groundbreaking buildings include the 3 you listed above.

Tell me, what types of skyscrapers do you favor, and what you want to see in the La Défense skyline?
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  #79  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2006, 1:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Patrick
Eww.

First the big "ding-dong" 30 St Mary Axe in London
Then the hidious deformed skinny Chicago Spire
And now, umm, this! I really cant describe this hidious building.
Leave the first two buildings out of this. They are design masterpieces.
     
     
  #80  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2006, 1:52 AM
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Originally Posted by StatenIslander237
well postmodern is falling out of fashion, the 21st century most groundbreaking buildings include the 3 you listed above.

Tell me, what types of skyscrapers do you favor, and what you want to see in the La Défense skyline?
I like all types, except this whole new "natural" style. Some new buildings look cool like some of Frank Ghery's towers in NYC or the amazing Turning Turso. But some take it too far, like this one.

I'd love to see this tower resdigned into buildings like the New WTC or the Shanghi Financial Center. Paris already has some good towers in the works like the Generali Tower or even better, the Tour AXA redesign.
     
     
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