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  #1221  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2008, 3:32 AM
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wich won?
there we go
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  #1222  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2008, 5:09 PM
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Finally! Thank you Bartley, thank you

With Friends like these, does Upper Fort Garry need enemies?
Campaign no gain
By: Bartley Kives

Updated: March 15, 2008 at 06:35 AM CDT

Whenever somebody issues an urgent plea to "save" some sort of precious thing, you had better think twice about that special something in question.

All around the globe, kind-hearted, caring people are being wooed by earnest websites to do everything from "save the children" to "save the rainforest" to "save the black-tailed prairie dog" -- all noble and worthy causes -- as well as join rather more dubious campaigns, which include the quirky, the sarcastic and even the outright ridiculous.

At savethedeli.com, you can help preserve "the cultural heritage and taste of Deli throughout the world, for future generations to enjoy and savour." True enough, a world without chopped liver or pickled herring is a world no child should ever experience.

Meanwhile, savethehumans.com advocates the precise opposite of its name. And at zapatopi.net, dim-witted conservationists are encouraged to "save the Pacific Northwest tree octopus," which of course does not exist.

Here in Winnipeg, nobody is urging you or anyone else to save a nonexistent species of arboreal mollusc, kill off the human race or preserve endangered delicatessens.

But you are being exhorted to "save Upper Fort Garry," an 19th-century trading post that was dismantled in stages in the 1880s. And this campaign is not a hoax, despite the fact the ability to travel back in time is currently beyond the technological means of anyone in this city -- including well-meaning fundraisers and wealthy philanthropists.

Make no mistake, what used to be Upper Fort Garry -- land currently sitting below a surplus city building at 100 Main St., the Grain Exchange Curling Club on Fort Street and a patch of asphalt on Main Street itself -- is arguably Winnipeg's most important historic site. The former fort is both the birthplace of this city and this province as a whole, given its role in the Red River Resistance led by Louis Riel.

But the fort itself can not be "saved" any more than Riel himself can be saved, seeing as the man swung from the gallows near Regina in 1885.

And I say this not because I have any problem with efforts to build a heritage park at 100 Main St. and connect the historic site to The Forks.

In fact, I wholeheartedly support this effort -- just not the ridiculous rhetoric that's enveloped the debate, thanks to an effective but disingenuous public-relations campaign waged by some of the park's supporters.

If you listen to the Friends of Upper Fort Garry, the volunteer group advocating the creation of a $12.5-million heritage park that would cover both 100 Main St. and a second parcel of surplus city land at the corner of Fort Street and Assiniboine Avenue, the evil powers that be at City Hall are trying to pave over paradise.

Ever since last spring, when city council's downtown development committee voted to sell that second parcel to an apartment building developer, the Friends have been crying foul, even though that very same original vote called for the city to enter into negotiations with the group to build a heritage park on the rest of the site.

So what was wrong with building a heritage park on Main Street, with an apartment building located to the immediate southwest?

The answer: The Friends had a plan to place an interpretive centre where the new residential building would be erected, and did not want to see that plan altered by the city's decision.

Of course, that decision was revisited in the fall, after an archeological survey found Upper Fort Garry's former footprint a little further to the west, encroaching on the land to be sold to Crystal Developers.

Faced with a vote to lower the sale price to Crystal, the downtown development committee changed tacks and voted to allow the Friends of Upper Fort Garry to develop the entire site -- provided they raise $10 million by April Fool's Day and purchase the Grain Exchange Curling Club.

At the time, the Friends said this would not be a problem. After all, some of Winnipeg's most prominent citizens -- well-meaning fundraisers and wealthy philanthropists included -- had agreed to place their names on a piece of paper endorsing the Friends' cause.

But there's a big difference between agreeing to see your name on some charity letterhead and actually ponying up a big pile of cash. This is what Winnipeg Mayor Sam Katz suspected when he signed on to the plan to give the Friends a few scant months to come up with the money.

Katz basically called the Friends on a bluff -- and now it looks as if the mayor has won.

With two weeks and two days to go before the deadline, the Friends of Upper Fort Garry have all but conceded they can't raise the cash. Hence the recent, more urgent campaign to "save Upper Fort Garry" -- even though nobody is proposing to build anything but a heritage park at the former fort's site.

Allow me to repeat this: There is nobody in Winnipeg advocating anything other than the creation of a heritage park at 100 Main St. What the Friends and their supporters are quibbling over is the second parcel of land, at the corner of Fort Street and Assiniboine Avenue.

Both Katz and Manitoba Premier Gary Doer consider the Friends' plan to be too big and too expensive. But they're willing to go along with a smaller park at 100 Main St. -- and the same can be said about Crystal Developers.

The Friends know this, but they're still sticking with their original plan, even though a park could be created with much less cash and rancour if they would only compromise.

But they would rather sit back and watch Winnipeggers get spun into believing Upper Fort Garry is in danger, when in fact their all-or-nothing game is the only thing that truly imperils the park.

Unless we hear a little less jingoism and see a little more pragmatism from the Friends over the next two weeks, their cause is all but doomed.

In the mean time, long live Upper Fort Garry -- and long live the Canadian Prairie tree octopus.

bartley.kives@freepress.mb.ca
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  #1223  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2008, 7:23 PM
Greco Roman Greco Roman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theruler462 View Post
Faced with a vote to lower the sale price to Crystal, the downtown development committee changed tacks and voted to allow the Friends of Upper Fort Garry to develop the entire site -- provided they raise $10 million by April Fool's Day and purchase the Grain Exchange Curling Club.
How fitting, since this whole scenario is nothing but a big joke anyways
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  #1224  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 1:18 PM
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Finally the truth comes out in the main stream media. It was making me sick too see the wool pulled over Winnipeggers eyes regarding this issue with the so called "Friends" influence over the Free Press and CJOB.
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  #1225  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 6:52 PM
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excellent article by bartley.....finally.

my lingering concern is that the developer of the tower plans to build it for $80 per aquare foot.....i am worried that after this long fight he will construct a commie block a la henderson highway....that is less than half the cost of most construction these days.
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  #1226  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 7:35 PM
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i think you have bigger reasons for concern now...

Quote:
Feds Come Through For Fort
MAR 17 2008 01:50 PM

Vic Toews says the Upper Fort Garry Heritage Park Complex will receive a priority federal funding commitment of $1.5 million from Western Economic Diversification Canada.

The Feds say the commitment hinges on the initiative meeting "all applicable federal eligibility requirements," including the completion of a due diligence review.

The project is set to begin in the spring of 2008 and continue in phases for five years.

CJOB News
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  #1227  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 8:55 PM
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Originally Posted by j.online View Post
i think you have bigger reasons for concern now...


Feds Come Through For Fort
MAR 17 2008 01:50 PM

Vic Toews says the Upper Fort Garry Heritage Park Complex will receive a priority federal funding commitment of $1.5 million from Western Economic Diversification Canada.

The Feds say the commitment hinges on the initiative meeting "all applicable federal eligibility requirements," including the completion of a due diligence review.

The project is set to begin in the spring of 2008 and continue in phases for five years.

CJOB News
Yea...but i think the Friends needed $3.5 mil each from the Feds and the Province.

They estimated their "World Class" project in the $12 mil range. They have raised $3 mil or $4 mil, $1.5 mil from the Province and now $1.5 mil from the Feds. My admittedly rudimentary math puts that at about $6 mil to $7 mil. Still about $6 mil short.
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  #1228  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 9:20 PM
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phew! thx for the quick math lesson, Biff. I thought I read 10.5 million from the feds.
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  #1229  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 9:51 PM
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Something about Nothing

You know I used to work across from this site in The North West Company Building for 9 years wondering what would ever happen across the street at the old Fort. Well I couldn't be any more disappointed, I've seen the pages and pages dedicated to this from grand highrise condo plans to a world class heritage site.
It appears Winnipeg will be left with a glorified park and or at the square footage price quoted a shoe box stumpy condo at best.
Great!
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  #1230  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 10:49 PM
Lee_Haber8 Lee_Haber8 is offline
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Originally Posted by CB-MAN View Post
You know I used to work across from this site in The North West Company Building for 9 years wondering what would ever happen across the street at the old Fort. Well I couldn't be any more disappointed, I've seen the pages and pages dedicated to this from grand highrise condo plans to a world class heritage site.
It appears Winnipeg will be left with a glorified park and or at the square footage price quoted a shoe box stumpy condo at best.
Great!
That's Winnipeg for you! A constant disappointment.
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  #1231  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 10:56 PM
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That's Winnipeg for you! A constant disappointment.
witch is a shame wtf do we have to do to change that?
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  #1232  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 11:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CB-MAN View Post
You know I used to work across from this site in The North West Company Building for 9 years wondering what would ever happen across the street at the old Fort. Well I couldn't be any more disappointed, I've seen the pages and pages dedicated to this from grand highrise condo plans to a world class heritage site.
It appears Winnipeg will be left with a glorified park and or at the square footage price quoted a shoe box stumpy condo at best.
Great!
i work there now and always think the exact same thing.
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  #1233  
Old Posted Mar 18, 2008, 6:49 AM
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Winnipeg: Where disappointing dreams come true.

Oh the irony!

...and great article by Bartley! I too was getting sick and tired of being invited to such a joke group on facebook.
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  #1234  
Old Posted Mar 18, 2008, 7:09 PM
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A Winnipeg city councillor is making a last desperate plea in his effort to preserve the site of the city's birth.

St. Boniface Coun. Dan Vandal issued a statement this morning expressing concern that his bid to save the Upper Fort Garry site in downtown Winnipeg could fail.

Vandal tabled a motion last month urging the city to extend the deadline for a non-profit group that wants to convert the Upper Fort Garry site into an interpretive centre.

Two city hall committees have since debated Vandal's motion and all city councillors vote on the issue tomorrow.

If the motion fails and the city upholds the March 31 deadline, the Friends of Upper Fort Garry will have until the end of the month to raise $10 million and meet other conditions set by the city's Downtown Development committee last December.

Despite recent contributions from some high-profile Winnipeggers and a commitment from the provincial government, that might not be easy.

If the group does not meet the city's conditions, the city will sell part of the Upper Fort Garry land to a developer for the building of a highrise apartment.

"I defy anyone to tell Winnipeggers that this is an appropriate way to treat the birthplace of Manitoba," Vandal said, in an e-mail. "If my motion is defeated and the condominium tower is constructed 27 inches from the (former) west wall of the fort -- there is a serious lack of leadership in this city."

City council meets for a scheduled meeting Wednesday at 9:30 a.m.

joe.parakevas@freepress.mb.ca
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  #1235  
Old Posted Mar 19, 2008, 3:08 AM
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^Oh is Vandal's grandstanding irritating. Interesting that somebody else had to clarify on his behalf that there is no fort wall there right now.
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  #1236  
Old Posted Mar 19, 2008, 3:40 AM
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Not sure why Vandal said 27 inches or Condos. It's a metre setback from the old Fort foundation (a Provincial requirement) and it is Apartments.

Come by City Hall at 9:30 Wednesday morning to see the fireworks ... I'll be there!
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  #1237  
Old Posted Mar 19, 2008, 4:08 AM
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Not sure why Vandal said 27 inches or Condos. It's a metre setback from the old Fort foundation (a Provincial requirement) and it is Apartments.

Come by City Hall at 9:30 Wednesday morning to see the fireworks ... I'll be there!
9:30 eh i shall be there
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  #1238  
Old Posted Mar 19, 2008, 4:39 PM
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Any news??????
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  #1239  
Old Posted Mar 19, 2008, 9:02 PM
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No extension.

Quote:
Vote Goes Against Fort Fundraising Deadline Extension
CJOB's Colleen Bready reporting
3/19/2008

Friends of the Fort lost a key vote at city hall Wednesday that would have extended its fundraising deadline.

The vote was 9 to 6 supporting the existing plan to allow a developer to proceed with a proposal to construct a 20 storey condo complex near the site after March 31st. However the Friends of the Fort still has until the end of the month to come up with the money it needs.

Many of the councillors voting against the deadline extension placed the blame squarely on the shoulders of the Doer government complaining it didn't come through with the level of contribution that was expected. They suggested the Federal government would have matched the Provincial funds which fell far short of what was required.

Wednesday morning, Premier Doer surprised many by suggesting a multi-million dollar interpretive centre at the site was too expensive. He suggested on CJOB, the site would be better served by knocking down a nearby Petro Canada gas station, and a civic building next door, which could both be replaced by green space.
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  #1240  
Old Posted Mar 19, 2008, 9:02 PM
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I just heard the Friends lost their bid for extension by a 9 to 6 vote.

Excellent news!

Hopefully someone who was there can elaborate.
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