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  #41  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2020, 9:29 PM
ue ue is offline
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Originally Posted by pallo View Post
oh yeah i know all about the history of course, but one can't deny that many local people are uneasy about going inside a shop and start speaking English because they don't know what reaction they will get... then of course there is the recent issue of French school boards confiscating schools from English school boards so they can turn them into French schools....
I have been to Montreal many times and never felt like I would get attacked for speaking in English. I have tried doing some broken French, but I found that more useful in Quebec City and rural Quebec, as most Montrealers will pick up on this and just switch to English because, by and large, Montrealers are fluidly bilingual. If anything, I feel bad for not being able to speak French better, as it is the dominant language of the city and province. I think it's good when visitors at least try with the local language. Anglophones have an entitlement and a privilege so when any protections AGAINST this are formulated, it is viewed as an attack, which is comical to say the least.

Yes, there is an Anglo minority and it was historically very powerful, but I don't think it's had that hard of a go at things. The Anglo community of Montreal has way more robust institutions and services than any French, Indigenous, or other community in Toronto or Halifax or Calgary. There are still English bookstores, English schools, hell you can even see movies in English. The most prestigious university in Canada, which happens to be in Montreal, is also an English university.

The language protections are in place because of the pervasive influence of English and how, up until the 1970s, in Montreal, the powerful were all Anglophones and viewed Francophones as second-rate citizens in their own cities, hence the separatism and Quiet Revolution. Yes, at times they seem a bit extreme, and I don't always agree with individual new bills and policies, but on the whole, I get the rational behind it. Montreal would simply be New Orleans linguistically otherwise and a lot would be lost as a result. Quebec is merely protecting itself from an English hegemony.
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  #42  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2020, 9:42 PM
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Originally Posted by pallo View Post
oh yeah i know all about the history of course, but one can't deny that many local people are uneasy about going inside a shop and start speaking English because they don't know what reaction they will get...
Yes, one can very easily deny it.

For having worked in retail and customer service during my student years, I can affirm with 100% certainty that English-speaking Montrealers do not, in any way, hesitate to go right in a shop or restaurant and start speaking English : they just assume that the 12$/hour employee is fully bilingual - which is true most of the time, but not always.
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  #43  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 2:10 PM
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Originally Posted by begratto View Post
Yes, one can very easily deny it.

For having worked in retail and customer service during my student years, I can affirm with 100% certainty that English-speaking Montrealers do not, in any way, hesitate to go right in a shop or restaurant and start speaking English : they just assume that the 12$/hour employee is fully bilingual - which is true most of the time, but not always.
I'll second this. As an anglo-Montrealer for some 25 years, I've rarely if even encountered any rudeness or linguistic drama in a retail or service setting. I can personally attest to not feeling uneasy about going inside a shop and speaking English.

I prefer to speak French in these settings but my partner is an ROC'er (anglo Canadian from outside of Quebec) whose French is very limited. She has also encountered no issues.

Also, as "English" is not a race and Montreal is a multicultural city (anglo and franco populations alike), I don't think the claim that there is institutionalized linguistic racism towards the anglophone minority in Montreal is valid.
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  #44  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 5:30 PM
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Longtime Anglo-Montrealer here, since departed... bottom line? It would have become New Orleans. I've heard it all, have even sympathized. I've lived it. Pastagate, 101 ou 401, Richler in the New Yorker. The Auf der Mars and the Schnurmachers. Angles great and small.

Evacuating McGill lecture halls onto Sherbrooke in the rain.

Points were made.

But it would have become New Orleans.

And this is better. This is much more interesting. This is a happy ending.
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  #45  
Old Posted Aug 11, 2020, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by kool maudit View Post
Longtime Anglo-Montrealer here, since departed... bottom line? It would have become New Orleans. I've heard it all, have even sympathized. I've lived it. Pastagate, 101 ou 401, Richler in the New Yorker. The Auf der Mars and the Schnurmachers. Angles great and small.

Evacuating McGill lecture halls onto Sherbrooke in the rain.

Points were made.

But it would have become New Orleans.

And this is better. This is much more interesting. This is a happy ending.
Or at least, it wouldn't have been as interesting given the other "non-New Orleans" cultural, geographic, political and environmental traits Montreal and its part of the world has, and what it would could logically have become as a result of those in the absence of a dominant francophone character.

New Orleans itself is, of course, a pretty interesting city.
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  #46  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2020, 11:52 AM
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^^^ good to hear people's different lived experiences
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  #47  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2020, 12:20 PM
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Stop 16 - Luxembourg City, Luxembourg
I took the train from Brussels to Luxembourg City (4 hours approx) The city is divided into old town and new town. The old town is quite pretty and it has a lot of nice architecture and this is where the local people live mostly. The new town is the area around the train station and unfortunately it is where my airbnb was. I say unfortunately because i never felt so unsafe walking around that area anywhere else in the world (not even Mexico or Colombia) - there were drug dealers on the street all day long doing their business openly and unashamedly, prostitutes, drunks, drug addicts, etc.
Interesting fact - 16% of people who live in Luxembourg are from Portugal or have Portuguese heritage.




Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Luxembourg City by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Last edited by pallo; Aug 12, 2020 at 1:11 PM.
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  #48  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2020, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pallo View Post
Stop 16 - Luxembourg City, Luxembourg
I took the train from Brussels to Luxembourg City (4 hours approx) The city is divided into old town and new town. The old town is quite pretty and it has a lot of nice architecture and this is where the local people live mostly. The new town is the area around the train station and unfortunately it is where my airbnb was. I say unfortunately because i never felt so unsafe walking around that area anywhere else in the world (not even Mexico or Colombia) - there were drug dealers on the street all day long doing their business openly and unashamedly, prostitutes, drunks, drug addicts, etc.
That's not an image anyone would intuitively have of Luxembourg. Not even the worst of the worst areas.
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  #49  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2020, 1:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
That's not an image anyone would intuitively have of Luxembourg. Not even the worst of the worst areas.
A reviewer on trip advisor commenting on the area where i stayed:
"The street is full of prostitutes, drug dealers and people that obviously dont want you there. Staring constantly as you walk down the street to the hotel it is not safe to carry much money or cameras / phones etc. It is truly terrifying"

and another one
"I did not know that Lux had such scary locations.Keep you phone in your pocket"

and one more
"Location is horrendous (prostitutes on nearby street corners, drug dealing on another corner, loud nightclubs on several sides, derelict building 2 down that has been used as a toilet)" Although window was closed you can hear the noise from the street in your room as if you were outside: cars, bar visitors, hookers and dealers were constantly yelling, fighting etc - till 4 am!
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  #50  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2020, 1:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pallo View Post
A reviewer on trip advisor commenting on the area where i stayed:
"The street is full of prostitutes, drug dealers and people that obviously dont want you there. Staring constantly as you walk down the street to the hotel it is not safe to carry much money or cameras / phones etc. It is truly terrifying"

and another one
"I did not know that Lux had such scary locations.Keep you phone in your pocket"

and one more
"Location is horrendous (prostitutes on nearby street corners, drug dealing on another corner, loud nightclubs on several sides, derelict building 2 down that has been used as a toilet)" Although window was closed you can hear the noise from the street in your room as if you were outside: cars, bar visitors, hookers and dealers were constantly yelling, fighting etc - till 4 am!
Oh, I believe you. It just doesn't correspond to the prim and proper stereotype of Luxembourg.
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  #51  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2020, 10:59 PM
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Oh, I believe you. It just doesn't correspond to the prim and proper stereotype of Luxembourg.
They do have the highest salaries in the world so it makes you wonder...
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  #52  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2020, 1:23 PM
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Stop 17 - Paris, France
Took the train from Luxembourg to Paris (2 hours approx). I have been to Paris many times, but one never really gets sick of this city especially since moving around is a breeze with their metro. Only downside is that Paris is an expensive city.



Paris by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Montmartre by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Paris by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Paris by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Paris by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Paris by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Paris street scene by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Montmartre by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Montmartre by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Montmartre by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Paris street scene by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Trocadero by Piero Damiani, on Flickr
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  #53  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2020, 7:49 PM
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Originally Posted by ue View Post
I have been to Montreal many times and never felt like I would get attacked for speaking in English. I have tried doing some broken French, but I found that more useful in Quebec City and rural Quebec, as most Montrealers will pick up on this and just switch to English because, by and large, Montrealers are fluidly bilingual. If anything, I feel bad for not being able to speak French better, as it is the dominant language of the city and province. I think it's good when visitors at least try with the local language. Anglophones have an entitlement and a privilege so when any protections AGAINST this are formulated, it is viewed as an attack, which is comical to say the least.

Yes, there is an Anglo minority and it was historically very powerful, but I don't think it's had that hard of a go at things. The Anglo community of Montreal has way more robust institutions and services than any French, Indigenous, or other community in Toronto or Halifax or Calgary. There are still English bookstores, English schools, hell you can even see movies in English. The most prestigious university in Canada, which happens to be in Montreal, is also an English university.

The language protections are in place because of the pervasive influence of English and how, up until the 1970s, in Montreal, the powerful were all Anglophones and viewed Francophones as second-rate citizens in their own cities, hence the separatism and Quiet Revolution. Yes, at times they seem a bit extreme, and I don't always agree with individual new bills and policies, but on the whole, I get the rational behind it. Montreal would simply be New Orleans linguistically otherwise and a lot would be lost as a result. Quebec is merely protecting itself from an English hegemony.

i have an aunt from montreal, this is my own limited montreal experience, and well i just wanted to say bravo this is extremely well put.
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  #54  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2020, 7:58 PM
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i wondered about luxembourg. i mean old town looks nice, but is there anything to do? or worth the detour as they used to say in the old michelin guides?

i see a shopping street. and you mention drugs and hookers, so ...

thanks for showing it to us pallo.
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  #55  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2020, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
i wondered about luxembourg. i mean old town looks nice, but is there anything to do? or worth the detour as they used to say in the old michelin guides?

i see a shopping street. and you mention drugs and hookers, so ...

thanks for showing it to us pallo.
Not sure of the OP's motivations but Luxembourg is on a lot of people's checklist for the "fairy tale Europe" experience, given that it's a small monarchy.

It does fit the bill in my experience, provided you don't venture off into the wrong area.
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  #56  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2020, 3:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
i wondered about luxembourg. i mean old town looks nice, but is there anything to do? or worth the detour as they used to say in the old michelin guides?

i see a shopping street. and you mention drugs and hookers, so ...

thanks for showing it to us pallo.
Country where I met a waitress who just moved there from Montréal. She was interesting lol.
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  #57  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2020, 6:39 PM
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well hmm, thx boys. i'm more of an andorra or monaco type, but maybe a visit to lux is in order.
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  #58  
Old Posted Aug 15, 2020, 10:21 AM
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Stop 18 - Strasbourg, France
I took the train from Paris to Strasbourg (3.5 hours) and stayed there 3 nights. Luckily i go to Strasbourg 2 days after the police killed the Christmas Market terrorist so things were a bit more relaxed once i got there even though there was still a large police presence around the city. The Christmas market in Strasbourg has been rated the best in Europe for several years in a row.



Petite France by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg street scene by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr

Strasbourg by Piero Damiani, on Flickr
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  #59  
Old Posted Aug 22, 2020, 8:45 AM
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Ah Strasbourg, a German city in France. It is what most of Germany would have looked like had the cities survived the war.
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  #60  
Old Posted Aug 22, 2020, 11:15 PM
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^^^ yep that's for sure
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