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  #1  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 12:46 AM
Bamelin Bamelin is offline
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Rent question (Surrey)

I live in downtown Toronto (Cityplace condo area). Just received a 6 month job offer covering a mat leave in Surrey. The office is located in Surrey across the road from Guildford Town Centre (104 and 152nd).

I know very little about Vancouver in general although I've been getting a little worried as ive been hearing Surrey is crime ridden? I was wondering if somebody who knows both Toronto and Vancouver neighborhoods could give me a toronto neighborhood comparison in terms of what Surrey compares to. Is it basically Vancouver's Scarborough?

My plan was to find the cheapest accommodations possible ... Maybe even just a furnished room or unfurnished bachelors. Will be putting nothing into furniture (if unfurnished just a futon) as I plan on flying back to Toronto once my contract is over.

Is 500 a month realistic or would that be "ghetto" living? I could stretch a little on that number but not by much. So far I'm seeing a lot of 500 - 600 dollar unfurnished basement units as well as 1brs and bachelors around 700/mth but I get the impression the apartments in this range are not the greatest (bug problems, crime, etc). I'm thinking basement apt, a roommate shared accommodation or a furnished room might be my solution. Hoping to rent within walking distance from work (104 and 152) so I don't have to get a transit pass.

Anyways was hoping for some advice. My budget is somewhat tight as my spouse is staying behind in Toronto so I'll be sending some money back each month. Realistically how much am I going to need on rent?
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  #2  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 8:52 PM
GMasterAres GMasterAres is offline
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Unfortunately I don't know anything about the Toronto area but in general, crime is higher in the West period not just in Surrey, that's just statistics. So even Vancouver, Edmonton, Calgary, Regina, etc., all have noticeably higher crime statistics compared to the Toronto area. Why? I don't know that's just how it is right now. So I can't comment as to comparing it to any area in the Toronto area unfortunately. I know Scarborough's reputation but those that have seen me post on these forums also know I try really hard not to jump to conclusions based on "reputation" alone. For all I know it could be a context thing and Scarborough could be "horrible" in the Toronto area but stacked against other regions in Canada, could be glowing.



As a native Surrey resident though, there are a few things with respect to avoiding crime in Surrey. First, don't join a gang. A large chunk of our crime in the violent category is directly gang related, and many of it is gangsters against gangsters so your average Joe is at little to no real risk.

The second is definitely pick the right area. Realistically you can't paint Surrey with a single brush (though some try). Crime rates in South Surrey for example are lower than most other neighborhoods in Greater Vancouver whereas crime rates in some other parts like Whalley and parts of Newton are higher.

It varies. Also the types of crime vary. If you aren't going to have a car and you have no furniture or really any possessions than you're really not at risk of auto theft (a big number in Surrey) or property crime (a big number in many parts of Metro Vancouver period). Context.

Guildford specifically I would personally avoid anything between 152nd and 140th East/West, and 104th and 110th North/South. Especially the area just North of Guildford Mall itself around 150th and 104th to 108th. That area is fairly low income so you're likelihood of brushing with criminal elements is higher.

It comes down to how far you are willing to commute. Your best bet is to try and find something in either the Fleetwood area or around Surrey Central/King George Station apartment (highrise) wise. Something newer. You will pay more than $500 though. You could also look at any area along 152nd basically from 104th South. Bus service is fine along that major road and income levels are generally middle to high along that stretch.

Another though again if you're ok with commuting is to look across the water into New Westminster or even towards Lougheed. You can take SkyTrain and then the B-Line to Guildford. If you definitely want to stay right in Guildford though then I'd look South or East or Guildford Mall as the developments there are a bit newer.

Or look towards Fraser Highway and 148th near Green Timbers. Places around there are olders but they are fairly established neighborhoods that have no less or more crime than any other neighborhood in the region.

Surrey has some hot spots but the majority of it isn't full of crime at every corner turn.

Your best bet actually would be to find several areas you're looking at and maybe post them here in this thread so those of us familiar with Surrey can give you a native's perspective.
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  #3  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 9:03 PM
GMasterAres GMasterAres is offline
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Sorry to help take a look at this map. Area bounded by red is what I referred to as I'd look elsewhere. Green areas are ok generally. There are a lot of other areas but I didn't show areas beyond what I'd call reasonable range of Guildford.

If you find things in other area outside the red/green then you'd have to post specifically and we can let you know. They'll be a fair distance away though.

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  #4  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 9:05 PM
go_leafs_go02 go_leafs_go02 is offline
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The other neat thing you can consider is that the City of Surrey's mapping system has a Crime Incidents mapping layer covering the last 6 months.

http://cosmos.surrey.ca/external/

Once loaded, click on "City Map" then go to "Layers & Legend" on the left side, and open up the "Public Safety" folder to see Crime Incidents.

You may need to zoom in the map for the layer to properly work.
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  #5  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 10:09 PM
GMasterAres GMasterAres is offline
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Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02 View Post
The other neat thing you can consider is that the City of Surrey's mapping system has a Crime Incidents mapping layer covering the last 6 months.

http://cosmos.surrey.ca/external/

Once loaded, click on "City Map" then go to "Layers & Legend" on the left side, and open up the "Public Safety" folder to see Crime Incidents.

You may need to zoom in the map for the layer to properly work.
Yah it's a nice new feature. My only caution (as I've looked at it quite a bit) is that it isn't 100% accurate. It does incorrectly pinpoint locations from time to time. For example a crime report dot (1) on Whalley Boulevard by Park Place but you click on it and the address is 14400 78th AVE which is in Newton, nowhere near Surrey Central where the map shows it.

I still like statistics in a table from Police. The map definitely shows though that areas like Fleetwood are relatively "quiet" when it comes to Break and Enters though in general they happen everywhere.

Break and Enters are as much crimes of opportunity than they are specific areas in my experience. Much like auto thefts or theft from cars. It's just odds You could park your car on a street that has had 10 car thefts but yours isn't touched because of factors like the car make/model, having nothing visible in it, or an alarm being installed. Same with B&Es. Rarely are they some person kicking down a door with a gun and more often it is someone finding a house where they left the garage door open, or an easily accessible window unlocked, or they are visibly "out of town" so the thief knows they have extra time.

We had a string of crimes happen in our building when we first moved in and it was brand new. Mainly through just educating residents and instituting some best practices for people to follow including limitations to construction crews, people being made aware of what to watch out for and how to be careful with open gates, propping doors, and reporting suspicious activity, we've had virtually no criminal events in the past 6 months with the exception of one bike being stolen and that was again a crime of opportunity.

That's why I always advocate that even statistics when it comes to crime need to be tempered as there are a lot of factors that play into things and that's also a big reason why it isn't simple to "solve" crime by passing some laws or a politician throwing 200 more cops "on the beat."

That said don't want to fly off topic. Like I said in my post above, feel free to find some places/areas and post them on here and we can comment either way and if you're willing to commute a bit again you can look in areas like New West or Lougheed/Delta too. You should have no issue finding something reasonably priced in and around Guildford that isn't ghetto though imho and you may be able to lower your costs by getting a 2 bedroom apartment in Surrey Central with a room-mate for example. With 2 people, a 2 bedroom in some fairly new buildings (5 years or less) would probably put your share around $600-700 per month.

And some buildings like Wave right in Surrey Central are furnished and should be reasonably priced. You have the added benefit of being right next to SkyTrain and the B-Line which is a direct 10-15 minute bus ride directly to Guildford Mall.
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  #6  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 10:11 PM
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if you're not familiar with rental laws in BC I know one of the big differences when signing a rental contract in BC, is you are only required to put down a deposit which is a half months rent which is given back to you when you move out assuming the unit is in the same condition, many places will ask for a one year contract to start and than change it to month to month but i think if you explain your situation they can allow for a 6 month contract
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  #7  
Old Posted Sep 2, 2015, 10:29 PM
Tetsuo Tetsuo is offline
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I used to rent a nice cosy small basement suite in the large green area JDawg marked above for around $500 two years ago. No issues, easy driving, had a nice lawn and the landlord was smoke friendly.

No pests at all
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  #8  
Old Posted Sep 3, 2015, 6:35 AM
twoNeurons twoNeurons is offline
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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
if you're not familiar with rental laws in BC I know one of the big differences when signing a rental contract in BC, is you are only required to put down a deposit which is a half months rent which is given back to you when you move out assuming the unit is in the same condition, many places will ask for a one year contract to start and than change it to month to month but i think if you explain your situation they can allow for a 6 month contract
Although it's kind of a crappy thing to do, there's little recourse to breaking a 1-year lease in BC. Just saying... other than losing your damage deposit... that is, if the only thing you can find is for 1-year leases. Then again, rental places for $500 usually expect people to be moving around more often, I would think... so it's probably less of a problem. After 6 months you may end up wanting to stay here... it's happened before. Many times.
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Old Posted Sep 3, 2015, 11:04 AM
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I actually live in a basement suite in the red area in Guildford side. I can honestly say I haven't had much issue with this area. Not once have I felt unsafe in this area. Plus jolly mac pub is a nice place to have with in walking distance after a long day of work.
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Old Posted Sep 3, 2015, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by twoNeurons View Post
Although it's kind of a crappy thing to do, there's little recourse to breaking a 1-year lease in BC. Just saying... other than losing your damage deposit... that is, if the only thing you can find is for 1-year leases. Then again, rental places for $500 usually expect people to be moving around more often, I would think... so it's probably less of a problem. After 6 months you may end up wanting to stay here... it's happened before. Many times.
yes, i just mean in terms of whats expected, i know people who were told they needed first and last for a rental they looked at in BC which is against the rental laws. Its a half month rent as a deposit.
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Old Posted Sep 4, 2015, 5:47 AM
Bamelin Bamelin is offline
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Thanks for all the comments folks.

After thinking hard about it I decided the ideal situation for me is to find a "homestay" ... it appears that there are lots of these in Vancouver. With homestays you stay in the home of the host, they give you a furnished room, 3 meals a day and access to all the common areas. Homestays appear to cost around 700 - 900 a month. Usually it's international students looking at these options but in my case it makes a lot of sense since once I factor in the food included it brings the total cost to around what my budget is.

It's extremely likely I'll return to Toronto at the end of my contract ... my wife isn't coming to Vancouver with me due to her own job. So while it's possible I'd stay longer in the case of a contract extension or new job offer, I have obligations here in Toronto.

Multiple people on different forums and reddit have recommended looking at New Westminster or even Burnaby near the Skytrain line citing better neighborhoods and lower crime. I actually do have an offer for a place near Brentwood Skytrain/Brentwood Mall in Burnaby. It seems like a nice area although a bit of a commute to Guildford Town Centre in Surrey.
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Old Posted Sep 4, 2015, 6:14 AM
WugOverlord WugOverlord is offline
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Originally Posted by Bamelin View Post

Multiple people on different forums and reddit have recommended looking at New Westminster or even Burnaby near the Skytrain line citing better neighborhoods and lower crime. I actually do have an offer for a place near Brentwood Skytrain/Brentwood Mall in Burnaby. It seems like a nice area although a bit of a commute to Guildford Town Centre in Surrey.
I live in the Brentwood area, it's awesome. However, commutes for you would probably be 45 minutes to an hour by transit. Homestay sounds like the best option for your needs
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Old Posted Sep 5, 2015, 11:23 PM
Bamelin Bamelin is offline
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Originally Posted by WugOverlord View Post
I live in the Brentwood area, it's awesome. However, commutes for you would probably be 45 minutes to an hour by transit. Homestay sounds like the best option for your needs
45 min commutes in Toronto are fairly normal. Even somewhat "short" if commuting by transit. I do get the impression though talking to folks in Vancouver that a 45 min commute is "bad" by Vancouver standards.

The folks at RFD seem to think Surrey isn't that bad, especially compared to bad GTA areas so I should be looking in Surrey.

Edit: talked to landlord in Brentwood I'm thinking I'm going to go with it. 800 mth furnished room shared common areas and breakfast plus dinner. 10 min walk to Brentwood sky train.

Is the Skytrain like a subway or more like the Scarborough RT in Toronto?

Last edited by Bamelin; Sep 6, 2015 at 3:44 AM.
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  #14  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2015, 7:13 AM
red-paladin red-paladin is offline
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Sounds like a good plan. Definitely a well located and safe area to live.
The skytrain is the same technology as the Scarbough RT, and the oldest cars are nearly identical. However, The stations, the frequency and train capacity is much more extensive, and just about everyone considers it a 'real metro' system.

Here's a time lapse tour of the Expo Line, you may find it interesting:

Video Link
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  #15  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2015, 2:57 AM
Bamelin Bamelin is offline
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Originally Posted by red-paladin View Post
Sounds like a good plan. Definitely a well located and safe area to live.
The skytrain is the same technology as the Scarbough RT, and the oldest cars are nearly identical. However, The stations, the frequency and train capacity is much more extensive, and just about everyone considers it a 'real metro' system.

Here's a time lapse tour of the Expo Line, you may find it interesting:

Video Link
Amazing video. Wow the scenery is incredible.
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  #16  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2015, 4:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Whalleyboy View Post
I actually live in a basement suite in the red area in Guildford side. I can honestly say I haven't had much issue with this area. Not once have I felt unsafe in this area. Plus jolly mac pub is a nice place to have with in walking distance after a long day of work.
Just curious, how much do you pay for that?
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  #17  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2015, 4:31 AM
memememe76 memememe76 is offline
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As a Guildford resident, I do not know what Guildford lacks in comparison to Brentwood besides proximity to Skytrain. Our mall is better, there is a movie theatre, pubs, a T&T, library, red centre. Brentwood may end up be the panacea that some are predicting but for someone who is intending to stay for a short while, I can't recommend Brentwood over Guildford.
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Old Posted Sep 7, 2015, 5:44 AM
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Just curious, how much do you pay for that?
1050 that includes utilities minus cable. I have a shared washer dry area with 2 washers and 2 dryers. Even have my own back yard. its about 1400sq ft basement suite. Right by Guildford park secondary.
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Old Posted Sep 7, 2015, 6:36 AM
Bamelin Bamelin is offline
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Originally Posted by memememe76 View Post
As a Guildford resident, I do not know what Guildford lacks in comparison to Brentwood besides proximity to Skytrain. Our mall is better, there is a movie theatre, pubs, a T&T, library, red centre. Brentwood may end up be the panacea that some are predicting but for someone who is intending to stay for a short while, I can't recommend Brentwood over Guildford.
I agree that the area right by Guildford Town Centre doesn't seem too bad. One of the other issues I was having was actually finding a homestay in Surrey. September is the worst time to be looking (as majority of homestay seekers are students starting school). I put out over a dozen enquiries and most have been rented out.

I start work in 2 weeks so I'm under a time crunch. I figured the one I found in Brentwood looks decent in a nice neighborhood and it should be easy to get to work albeit a bit further than I'd hoped originally. I don't mind the commute really, I'll use the time to read or surf.
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  #20  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2015, 10:48 PM
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Given that you will be working near Guilford area, don't discount Surrey Central either. It's close to skytrain stations, so that means easy access to Downtown Vancouver on the weekends.
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