The Economist: Vancouver Mindnumbingly Boring

[Klazu]

Well, I will choose "sterile" Vancouver over "vibrant" Rome every time. Eternal city is showing its long life, alright.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Vancouver is still a very quiet, parochial, conservative {not socially but how people live their lives} minded city. Anyone coming to Canada for an urban experience would ever dream of coming to Canada, that's why god created Toronto and Montreal.

Parochial? Really? Narrow minded? I'd argue many people here have a far greater understanding and holistic view of the world than people from many other countries and cities.

Originally Posted by ssiguy

My 62 year old cousin is currently here from Rome and he, like everyone, thinks the city is very attractive with a wonderful geographic situation. He has also mentioned how bland, sterile, and how "nonurban" the city seems to be despite the density. He just came from Seattle and is quite astonished about how urban Seattle is and how quiet and sedate Vancouver seems to be.

Vancouver is a likeable place but anyone who thinks it is either exciting or even interesting desperately needs to get out more.

Vancouver is new. One of the newest cities on the planet. We've learned lessons from others and done many things "right". It's certainly not perfect (DTES), but we had very few legacy issues to deal with. It has its benefits and its flaws.

So many cities around the world are horribly dirty, polluted places. I love some of the older, worldly cities, like NYC, London, Rome, Istanbul. But sadly there's no way I could live there for a long time, unless I was being paid %0.01 level wages.

[memememe76]

I figure that if there are so many more exciting cities in the world, then why not move there? Apparently, so many other cities have exciting nightlife and gritty atmosphere? Why should Vancouver attempt to replicate that?

Vancouver being so "mindnumbingly boring" and not even "interesting" is something that the City should embrace.

Interesting that Seattle is used as an exemplar of urban excellence. I like Seattle too. But I don't quite understand how its downtown is so much better than Vancouver's. Seattle does a particularly awful job of using its waterfront. And places like Ballard have a a great nightlife. But who takes transit to Ballard?

Metro Vancouver probably does factor in "liveability" a bit too heavily. We have our nature to attract tourism. But I'm fine with it. I live in Guildford, for goodness sake. I live within very easy walking to distance to virtually all required amenities. But living next to malls, Walmarts and Tim Hortons isn't exciting or cool like living next to hipster coffeeshops, organic taco bars, and craft breweries. I like how practically all of our malls are near a Skytrain Station. I mean, why in the World did Seattle not build a light rail station next to Southcenter?!?

[Caliplanner1]

Originally Posted by memememe76

I figure that if there are so many more exciting cities in the world, then why not move there? Apparently, so many other cities have exciting nightlife and gritty atmosphere? Why should Vancouver attempt to replicate that?

Vancouver being so "mindnumbingly boring" and not even "interesting" is something that the City should embrace.

Interesting that Seattle is used as an exemplar of urban excellence. I like Seattle too. But I don't quite understand how its downtown is so much better than Vancouver's. Seattle does a particularly awful job of using its waterfront. And places like Ballard have a a great nightlife. But who takes transit to Ballard?

Metro Vancouver probably does factor in "liveability" a bit too heavily. We have our nature to attract tourism. But I'm fine with it. I live in Guildford, for goodness sake. I live within very easy walking to distance to virtually all required amenities. But living next to malls, Walmarts and Tim Hortons isn't exciting or cool like living next to hipster coffeeshops, organic taco bars, and craft breweries. I like how practically all of our malls are near a Skytrain Station. I mean, why in the World did Seattle not build a light rail station next to Southcenter?!?

It could be that to some critics the general cultural essence/disposition/"quality" of the immigrants and original residents of Vancouver lack a certain hard to describe entertainment energy/dynamic diversity/allure? Some folks feel that Vancouver could use a larger live theatre scene, live jazz and blues music scene, more opera and philharmonic orchestra presentations along with live dance music in a systematic way! At the end-of-the-day it's all subjective I suppose!

[Metro-One]

I have never understood why people associate vandalism, higher crime rates, and garbage on the ground as positives for an urban environment.

There is a false idea that being dirty and lawless = grit and excitement.

I would much rather follow a Japanese urban approach where you can have clean well maintained urban spaces that are still gritty at the same time due to night life activities and the variety of stores / bars / clubs available.

Also, honestly, for its population, metro Vancouver is not boring. Yes, it can improve in many areas (and i hope it does) but if you are bored in Vancouver, well, then I feel you must be a boring person.

Just from my anecdotal evidence, Vancouver is quite famous here in Japan, and I am surprised by the sheer number of Japanese who have been there (seriously, many of my Japanese co-workers have even done 1 year live work visas in Van) and they all think about Vancouver fondly and enjoyed their time in the city. Many of them want to go back and some actually have in the two years I have been there.

Vancouver has to stop caring about Eastern Canadian / Euro centric bullshit. We are a Pacific Rim city, time to reach out more to Asia, Oceania, and South America (where we seem to get far more positive reviews / attention from).

PS, if you want to see something that will really piss you off go look at the BC dump fest on the housing bubble thread on the Canadian section, it is quite annoyingly hilarious.

Seriously, with all the shit coming from many of the Ontario / Quebec forum members now, I really am starting to wish Cascadia was a nation....

[connect2source]

I'm doing the Grouse Grind before work today, certainly NOT boring and I ask where else in the world can I climb to 4000 ft then still put in a full days work!?

[s211]

Originally Posted by connect2source

I'm doing the Grouse Grind before work today, certainly NOT boring and I ask where else in the world can I climb to 4000 ft then still put in a full days work!?

Umm, the Himilayas, maybe?

[Jebby]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Guessing the gist of the article, I have to add that I both hated and loved living in exciting Berlin. The city is very, very interesting, but it is not because of all the grittiness and vandalism that I absolutely hated. It was all the history, culture and events going on in the city that made it interesting, not the dirtiness.

Even then I prefer Vancouver over Berlin thanks to its cleaniness and boundless outdoors. There is so much to do here that I am not bored at all after 3.5 years in here. But different people have different priorities and that is fine.

I feel the complete opposite. I lived in Vancouver for 15 years and Berlin for 5 (still have a house there).

I loved Berlin. It just has everything to appeal to every taste. Yes, there are parts of the city that are very gritty, but there are also fantastic, clean, calm, green neighborhoods that are excellent to raise a family.

Vancouver is a nice city, but it just doesn't have the cultural attractions and entertainment that many cities around the world have to offer. I mean, there's more nightlife in many small towns with a population of 20,000 in Germany....

[MolsonExport]

To me, Vienna is a better city than Rio.

Given its historical legacy and urban fabric, Vienna is one of the greatest places on the planet, quite frankly.

Rio has a gorgeous physical setting, but it is also extremely crime-ridden.

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by connect2source

I'm doing the Grouse Grind before work today, certainly NOT boring...

But what about people for whom mountain climbing, hiking, jogging, cycling and getting sweaty are not their ideas of urban excitement and culture? I personally love nature and outdoor activities but by definition those kinds of physical activities have nothing to do with the great benefits of urban civilization. They are activities that largely take place outside of the city or at least on its perimeter, and you can do them just as easily whether you live in Vancouver or in Campbell River. They are products of Vancouver's geography, not Vancouver itself.

Pointing out Vancouver's many outdoor activities does nothing to address the charge that Vancouver focuses far too much on its geography/natural beauty and not enough on creating a brand of urban arts, entertainment and culture that a truly dynamic city of Vancouver's size should be able to offer.

[subdude]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

but if you are bored in Vancouver, well, then I feel you must be a boring person.

That's always my answer. Also watch what people do, not what they say - young people from everywhere have Vancouver at the top of their list of places they want to visit.

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

PS, if you want to see something that will really piss you off go look at the BC dump fest on the housing bubble thread on the Canadian section, it is quite annoyingly hilarious.

It is funny how it started from me (intentionally) being proud of how well Vancouver does waterfront planning. Our Seawall is the only world-famous Canadian waterfront, but some Torontonians were hurt by me calling it the best and Toronto clearly taking some cues from us. Just so hilarious seriously some of those users take such...

Originally Posted by Jebby

I feel the complete opposite. I lived in Vancouver for 15 years and Berlin for 5 (still have a house there).

Ah, I forgot that we have another Berliner in here.

It's indeed a wonderful city and so exciting. Nightlife in Berlin is world-class, especially for underground stuff. I love both, but for me Vancouver is a better city to live in and offers me more things to do. I am not in my 20s anymore, so clubbing is not very high on my list of important things.

I hope you are making good profit on that house you have in Berlin. Prices in that city have been going up very fast thanks to all the gentrification in the last 10 years. It has been a good deal to buy a property in Berlin before 2005, around which time Berlin "got noticed".

Originally Posted by Klazu

Well, I will choose "sterile" Vancouver over "vibrant" Rome every time. Eternal city is showing its long life, alright.

Just to add to this, I absolutely love Italy and especialy Rome (been there twice), but I hate how dirty the city is. I could also never live in there because of how dysfunctional the Italian society is. Their ineffiency would drive me nuts!

I much more prefer the German menthality and plan on moving back to a German-speaking country once our Canadian adventure is over. Vienna or Munich are high on my list as final destination cities for me. Vancouver could certainly be such because of the qualities, but remoteness from family is the only downside to living here.

[st7860]

Originally Posted by Pinion

If you enjoy a wide variety of outdoorsy stuff I get why you would move to Vancouver. Unfortunately I was dragged here kicking and screaming from Sydney by my parents.

For Japanese and Koreans they typically chose Australia for one of two reasons: the hot weather or the rather loose visa requirements for 2 year workers there

[st7860]

Originally Posted by Jebby

I feel the complete opposite. I lived in Vancouver for 15 years and Berlin for 5 (still have a house there).

I loved Berlin. It just has everything to appeal to every taste. Yes, there are parts of the city that are very gritty, but there are also fantastic, clean, calm, green neighborhoods that are excellent to raise a family.

Vancouver is a nice city, but it just doesn't have the cultural attractions and entertainment that many cities around the world have to offer. I mean, there's more nightlife in many small towns with a population of 20,000 in Germany....

In Germany its considered socially acceptable to have an exceptional career and yet continue to rent for your whole life, that's what I heard.

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by st7860

In Germany its considered socially acceptable to have an exceptional career and yet continue to rent for your whole life, that's what I heard.

Yep, most people in Germany rent. It is completely "acceptable" and why wouldn't it be? You cannot take your house to your grave with you...

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by st7860

For Japanese and Koreans they typically chose Australia for one of two reasons: the hot weather or the rather loose visa requirements for 2 year workers there

Also it's one if the few places that is top notch weather and culture wise (Sydney and a few other coastal cities anyway) with a strong functional government.

[st7860]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Also it's one if the few places that is top notch weather and culture wise (Sydney and a few other coastal cities anyway) with a strong functional government.

G'day mate! No worries mate! Yes the outback etc is famous.

What I meant was Australia is the easiest big name country to get a 2 year work visa(or even a 1 year) from, so the Japanese and Koreans gravitate there.

Something that isn't well known is that twice a year, there is a mad dash(similar to how concert tickets can sell out in seconds) for Koreans to apply for IEC Canada.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Yep, most people in Germany rent. It is completely "acceptable" and why wouldn't it be? You cannot take your house to your grave with you...

Good attitude, IMO. I wish more people in Canada thought along those lines ...

[Wooster]

Reminds be of the beginning of this bit by Chris Rock.

NSFW (swearing)

• Video Link

[vanman]

Originally Posted by connect2source

I'm doing the Grouse Grind before work today, certainly NOT boring and I ask where else in the world can I climb to 4000 ft then still put in a full days work!?

I wonder if we've ever passed each other haha. I do the Grind before work 1-2 times a week. I really find the "I climbed up a fookin mountain today" thought in the back of my mind helps me get through a long boring day.