Historical Winnipeg discussion

[esquire]

Originally Posted by trueviking

^^ No way!

what was the smokestack, i wonder.

Winnipeg Hydro had a site there that was cleared around 1995 to make way for the ill-fated Spirit of Manitoba arena proposal. It ended up being used for the ballpark instead after the arena fell through.

You can see the smokestack in this old photo:

[trueviking]

amazing....that is an incredible photo

[trueviking]

since we are here....i came across this tid bit that I didn't know about....there used to be three churches between fort and garry on Portage avenue....the original Knox, then a seconf knox and the origonal got moved over, then the original all saints, then it got demolished for the original holy trinity

[wardlow]

Such an interesting area of the city, east of Main and south of Portage. Before the railway came it was where most of Winnipeg's few industries were located. As was the immigrant sheds and a number of brothels.

In the mid-'50s my great-uncle lived in the white house with aqua blue trim above. Wish I could have met him and ask him about it... I think by that time the area was all pretty down-market.

[wardlow]

Originally Posted by trueviking

since we are here....i came across this tid bit that I didn't know about....there used to be two churches between fort and garry on Portage avenue....the original Knox (actually second) and original holy trinity

Wow. I had no idea Knox built such a substantial building at that spot... I assumed it was just the first wooden structure there before they moved further to the edge of town (ie, Donald and Ellice).

Holy Trinity Anglican built their current building at Donald and Graham in 1884, but the older church on Portage stood for another 20 years or so, rather sacrilegiously housing an auction near the end.

[drew]

^ good thing that was a church - that spire was only being held up by a prayer!

[esquire]

Just thinking out loud here, but it's interesting that no churches went up downtown along Portage Avenue back in Portage's heyday. Elim Chapel (formerly St. Stephen's Presbyterian) at Portage and Spence is the closest thing to one that I can think of, and that's clearly outside what would have been considered downtown back in the old days.

It's easy to imagine a prosperous congregation somewhere in that 1900-1930 era building an impressive house of worship somewhere on Portage between Hargrave and Memorial, but for some reason it never happened. They're all off on side streets instead of the main drag.

[pacman]

Originally Posted by esquire

Winnipeg Hydro had a site there that was cleared around 1995 to make way for the ill-fated Spirit of Manitoba arena proposal. It ended up being used for the ballpark instead after the arena fell through.

You can see the smokestack in this old photo:

Amazing to see the old railyards and lines where the Forks and Waterfront Drive stand now.

With all the discussion now about moving the current railyards out of town and people instantly saying it is next to impossible because of cost/environmental/no reason to do it for the railways etc..., does anyone have some context as to why these particular yards at the Forks were "easily" removed? I know CN was inclined to get out of there but was it really a big production back then? At the risk of "derailing" this thread (thank you) it seems to me that railyard relocation/removal is more about motivation than it is about actual hurdles. That whole area Forks/Waterfront Drive area was transformed in such a massive way, and it all stemmed from one actual decision, to remove the railyard, it really is amazing.

[esquire]

^ It was like that right up until the mid 80s when the tracks were removed.

As I understand it, the CN East Yards became expendable following a decline in passenger rail and associated activities (mail and express service) and newer facilities for freight, namely Symington Yards. After Symington Yards opened up the East Yards became functionally obsolete, and CN gradually closed them down.

CN attempted to launch a major redevelopment scheme for the East Yards (someone posted some information about that here within the last year or two), like major stuff with offices, hotels, an arena, etc., but Winnipeg was kind of in the doldrums in those years of the late 70s. So I suppose one thing led to another, and the focus became a park-type development instead which is what it is now, i.e. The Forks.

One of the big differences between The Forks and rail line relocation in general is that the East Yard was a relatively small chunk of land in a desirable area, right between downtown and where the rivers meet. By contrast, other rail yards like the CP Winnipeg Yards and Weston Shops are in relatively undesirable areas from a development standpoint.

And of course the major difference is that CN shut down the East Yards. It no longer had a use for that facility. The layers of government didn't have to pry those yards away from the railway the same way that it would all of the other operating CN and CP infrastructure in town.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by wardlow

Holy Trinity Anglican built their current building at Donald and Graham in 1884, but the older church on Portage stood for another 20 years or so, rather sacrilegiously housing an auction near the end.

holy crap....how did people even walk by that?!

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by wardlow

Wow. I had no idea Knox built such a substantial building at that spot... I assumed it was just the first wooden structure there before they moved further to the edge of town (ie, Donald and Ellice).

i revised what i wrote....the first knox was just a little wooden box built in 1868. When they built the bigger one they just moved the little one over. All saints' built their church at the corner of garry and portage. Both were demolished for holy trinity....its all pretty cool....seems like this all happened pretty quickly.

[trueviking]

and then of course it all became the post office.

[drew]

^ now there was a facade worthy of saving.

[trueviking]

The little all saints on portage became a new all saints on broadway in 1883. It had to be moved over when they built osborne street....in 1926 they built the current one.

second all saints'

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by drew

^ now there was a facade worthy of saving.

top five biggest losses in my opinion.

[drew]

I'd love to know the rationale for tearing down the old Post Office building and replacing it with what is currently there. You gotta assume that Post Office was of sturdy and similar construction to other major early 1900 buildings that survive.

[trueviking]

i have always enjoyed that the modernist buildings that replaced the post office have the same massing as what was there before.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by drew

I'd love to know the rationale for tearing down the old Post Office building and replacing it with what is currently there. You gotta assume that Post Office was of sturdy and similar construction to other major early 1900 buildings that survive.

same reason we have torn anything down....

Parking!!!!!

[esquire]

^ Ha.

I guess once the new Post Office on Graham was built in the 50s, the old one became expendable. Had it lasted a little while longer it's possible that it may have been adaptively reused. By the 70s Winnipeg was starting to get into proper heritage preservation. It's easy to imagine it functioning as a hotel or office building now.

Speaking of adaptively reusing old Post Offices, I'd sure love to see the one on Graham get that treatment.

PS - It really is uncanny how the existing buildings match the massing of the previous ones.

[trueviking]

the original knox on the far left in 1870