Arlington Bridge

[wags_in_the_peg]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

If we can find a few billion to relocate the rail yard, I'm all for it.

how many billion in budget to replace every bridge and build new over/under pass in coming 20+ years?

[bomberjet]

I get it. I said I'm all for it! haha

Relocating out of the City would be nice. But it won't eliminate grade seps and issues with the new rail yards. Rail yard itself is billions (we don't actually know as the studies never get that far). But I do this specific thing for a living and it's very expensive.

And the tone of the relocations is that the yards move but the main tracks stay where they are. Still requiring grade seps if you want it.

Regina had minor success in CP closing their small yard. Main track still there. Saskatoon failed at relocating the main track outside of the City. Regina is currently exploring relocation of the CN and CPKC main tracks that cross ring road. Simply moving a couple tracks will cost north of $200 million.

If Winnipeg chose to pursue a multi billion dollar project (other than NEWPCC), LRT/subway would be my choice. Better value there for the City than relocating a rail yard.

[Ozabald]

[QUOTE=thurmas;10085650]https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manit...tely-1.7035382

City of Winnipeg closes Arlington Bridge indefinitely due to poor condition
Immediate closure announced Tuesday after city says yearly safety repairs no longer viable

The City of Winnipeg has decided to close the Arlington Bridge, effective immediately, until further notice due to its condition.

The closure was announced Tuesday afternoon via a news release.

Commuters, including pedestrians and cyclists, will need detour across the rail yards via either the McPhillips Street underpass or Slaw Rebchuk Bridge on Salter Street, the news release says.

The decision was made after an assessment of the 121-year-old bridge found that the steel corrosion has accelerated in recent years and has gotten to the point where annual safety repairs are no longer viable, the news release says.

The city is still looking into whether a long-term rehabilitation of the bridge is possible, the release says.

Arlington Bridge will remain closed until that study is complete, the city said.[/Q

Due to lack of proper maintenance and/or deferred maintenance?

There are older bridges in Canada which seem to be holding up quite well such as the Victoria Bridge in Montreal (1859); Whirlpool Rapids Bridge in Niagara Falls (1897) and Alexandra (Interprovincial) Bridge in Ottawa (1901).

[bomberjet]

Lack of maintenance. The City flat out said (years ago) they are not doing any major repairs to the bridge because it's expensive and the money is better spent on a replacement. The City does yearly inspection and maintenance on the bridge. Which usually requires a closure. They'll do expansion joints maintenance and other stuff.

I believe during the recent closure, they identified structural items they could no longer pass as acceptable. These issues have likely known for a long time now.

Let's be honest, this isn't an architectural masterpiece and is functionally obsolete. The approach ramps mostly.

Is this the blue nile bridge that was shipped from overseas?

[1ajs]

ok who made this actualy would make a good housing project
to bad its satire
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid...05096838534853

[borkborkbork]

Originally Posted by 1ajs

ok who made this actualy would make a good housing project
to bad its satire
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid...05096838534853

satire is indistinguishable from 546 architecture proposals

[The Jabroni]

Arlington Bridge should have been replaced a decade ago. Hell, it should have been replaced in 1992 when it undergone a full rehab instead of full replacement. Instead, they extended the life of it for another 20-30 years, and look where we are now.

This is a safety and traffic concern now. Safety concern where not only they had to close down the bridge, but also because there will be desperate people out there who doesn't want to take a detour to Salter or McPhillips to cross the CPKC yards, but rather cut through it.

Traffic concern for obvious reasons.

[trueviking]

It blows my mind that provincial and civic elections were held in the last year and both made a 3/4 billion widening of Kenaston and replacement/expansion of the St. James Bridge campaign issues.....and almost immediacy a bridge in the north part of the city is shut down.

what could be the difference I wonder....

[Biff]

...approximately 30,000 more cars per day maybe.

[Sasquatch]

When infrastructure like this is built, funds ought to be set aside and invested to eventually offset replacement costs, but voters typically don't care and politicians are quite happy to grab tomorrow's funds to buy today's votes.

When the Arlington Bridge was built, the role of government was a fraction of the size it is today. Nowadays, the competition for borrowed capital is exponentially more intense as the definition of infrastructure has also expanded exponentially.

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by trueviking

It blows my mind that provincial and civic elections were held in the last year and both made a 3/4 billion widening of Kenaston and replacement/expansion of the St. James Bridge campaign issues.....and almost immediacy a bridge in the north part of the city is shut down.

what could be the difference I wonder....

Biff shared data in the construction thread. St James bridge have 69k vehicles using the bridges vs 13k using the Arlington Bridge. Kenaston Widening aside, replacing them will impact about 4x more people and the price tags are in the same ballpark (300-500 mil)

[Authentic_City]

Originally Posted by Biff

...approximately 30,000 more cars per day maybe.

No doubt this is true. But I do wonder about pedestrian and cyclist numbers. I would bet that many more pedestrians rely on the Arlington Bridge than the St. James Bridge. Could a less expensive, AT bridge replace Arlington? Could be a potential compromise?

[cllew]

Originally Posted by wags_in_the_peg

relocate the railyard will solve the problem of requiring all these bridges replaced in next decade

I always wonder when I hear move the rail yards out of Winnipeg do the RM's to the east or west of Winnipeg want to have them?

If they are stunting growth in Winnipeg what will they do the future development in the RM's of Rosser, Springfield, East and West St. Paul,Macdonald, and Tache just off of the top of my head depending on how the mainlines get moved.

When the rail yards were first put in Winnipeg it was all empty land and the city grew around them. The same is going to happen around the relocated yards in the future.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by Authentic_City

No doubt this is true. But I do wonder about pedestrian and cyclist numbers. I would bet that many more pedestrians rely on the Arlington Bridge than the St. James Bridge. Could a less expensive, AT bridge replace Arlington? Could be a potential compromise?

I suggested this exact thing. Build a pedestrian bridge to replace the Arlington bridge using the existing piers....aka the old Disraeli Bridge

[thebasketballgeek]

I would love if Arlington became a AT bridge because Arlington is supposed to be the primary N-S bike corridor for inner city and North End residents according to the cycling and pedestrian strategies (besides Main St ofc).

It would also make it easier to justify a road diet and adding protected bike lanes on Arlington. Especially since there are 10 schools within a block of Arlington and 3 community centres it would be allow the kids to travel more independently and much safer. It could be a major commuting route for active transportation users.

[drew]

I have driven on the Arlington bridge in varying amounts of frequency over the past few decades, and to be honest - spotting a pedestrian on that bridge is not a very common occurrence.

Maybe that's just because of how narrow it is with cars etc. and that would improve with a dedicated car-free corridor - but I doubt it's a bridge that someone would feel very secure on under a lot of circumstances.

[cllew]

Originally Posted by drew

I have driven on the Arlington bridge in varying amounts of frequency over the past few decades, and to be honest - spotting a pedestrian on that bridge is not a very common occurrence.

Maybe that's just because of how narrow it is with cars etc. and that would improve with a dedicated car-free corridor - but I doubt it's a bridge that someone would feel very secure on under a lot of circumstances.

Any time during the day that I have been driving on the Arlington bridge I have only seen a few rail fans on the sidewalk with a camera taking pictures of the rail yard.

Another bridge with next to no people using it, is the Disraeli pedestrian / cycle bridge.

I do encounter bikes on the car bridge fighting the up grade on both ends as if they are not aware there is a flatter bridge for them just to the east.

[OTA in Winnipeg]

Originally Posted by drew

I have driven on the Arlington bridge in varying amounts of frequency over the past few decades, and to be honest - spotting a pedestrian on that bridge is not a very common occurrence.

Maybe that's just because of how narrow it is with cars etc. and that would improve with a dedicated car-free corridor - but I doubt it's a bridge that someone would feel very secure on under a lot of circumstances.

I was walking on that bridge once and a late model white sedan stopped and the people inside it definitely had a plan. Someone got out then got back in the car. Then they left. The very next day I was walking on either Dufferin or Jarvis and the same car went by. At the next corner a guy got out and the car continued. I was walking my (very large) dog at the time. I called him and he was at my side. That guy was definitely going to attempt a mugging. As he walked past me and got to the next block the same car picked him up and I heard him say "he's got a dog".

So I got thinking about the bridge and thought they must have noticed the dog then too. Anyways, bad spot to possibly get mugged when there's not a lot of traffic. If they want to do AT there it better have a lot of lighting and maybe a few cameras.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by Biff

...approximately 30,000 more cars per day maybe.

ha ha.....or......


St. James Bridge is only 60 years old....if we are to believe that 60-year-old bridges need to be replaced, we are screwed.

[bomberjet]

Bridges are typically designed for 75 year life span. That is the sweet spot for cost/benefit. If you want the bridge to last longer, spend more money on it up front.

The St. James bridges are similar to the original Disraeli bridges. The girders fell apart when they were dismantling. St. James bridge is in a similar condition.