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  #2621  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2019, 11:01 PM
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I can't think of anything scarier than a German style autobahn with Californians and other American thrill seeking opportunists behind the wheels.
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  #2622  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2019, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
Thousands of people drive or take a cab to and from the SF and LA airports every day. Those same people wouldn't drive or take a cab to a train station?
There are folks that frequently make that claim even right here on this forum. It's maddening.
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  #2623  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
The opponent also brought up the nonsense about city density. Thousands of people drive or take a cab to and from the SF and LA airports every day. Those same people wouldn't drive or take a cab to a train station?
As already mentioned in this thread there isn't sufficient parking around either station and they're both downtown which means bad traffic. LA Union Station isn't in too dense of an area so building more parking is possible, but it would be really hard to build at the Transbay Terminal (assuming it ever reopens) due to the surrounding density.
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  #2624  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 12:22 AM
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Whay would anyone drive and leave their car at Transbay Terminal? The entire premise is misguided.
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  #2625  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 12:47 AM
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Whay would anyone drive and leave their car at Transbay Terminal? The entire premise is misguided.
Dude, you literally just said it in your last post..
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  #2626  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
Whay would anyone drive and leave their car at Transbay Terminal? The entire premise is misguided.
Very true. Most TBT/LAUS users will use public transit, whereas drivers would gravitate towards stations like Millbrae and Burbank. See St. Pancras vs Ebbsfleet for a real world example.
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  #2627  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 1:25 AM
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When I said that I was not thinking along the lines of parking and storing your car in the densest busiest core of the city. Driving to the train station was interpreted by me to mean having a family memberor friend drop you off at the train station in lieu of Uber or public transportation. Of course it's ridiculous to be building 10,000 spot parking decks to "allow" someone to drive to the main downtown train station.
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  #2628  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 1:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
When I said that I was not thinking along the lines of parking and storing your car in the densest busiest core of the city. Driving to the train station was interpreted by me to mean having a family memberor friend drop you off at the train station in lieu of Uber or public transportation. Of course it's ridiculous to be building 10,000 spot parking decks to "allow" someone to drive to the main downtown train station.
I think LA Union would definitely need a large parking garage added. Maybe in San Francisco you could get away with having all the parking at a different station though given how much small the actual city is that LA.
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  #2629  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 2:40 AM
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There's already a giant parking lot next to LAUS: https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0538...7i13312!8i6656
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  #2630  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 3:12 AM
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Contrary to belief the Autobahn does not have "no speed limit". Yes, there are portions with no posted limits, but you can be pulled over for driving too fast or reckless driving. And the fines are pretty punitive, possibly including automatic driving ban.
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  #2631  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 3:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
When I said that I was not thinking along the lines of parking and storing your car in the densest busiest core of the city. Driving to the train station was interpreted by me to mean having a family memberor friend drop you off at the train station in lieu of Uber or public transportation. Of course it's ridiculous to be building 10,000 spot parking decks to "allow" someone to drive to the main downtown train station.
This gets to the whole point that HSR is doomed unless well integrated with heavily used transit. If you're trying to accomodate drivers you've already failed.
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  #2632  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 5:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
This gets to the whole point that HSR is doomed unless well integrated with heavily used transit. If you're trying to accomodate drivers you've already failed.

Yeah, nobody has ever driven to a park-and-ride. They've all taken transit.

Last edited by jmecklenborg; Feb 22, 2019 at 5:13 AM.
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  #2633  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 5:43 AM
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New videos from CAHSR.

First is the blended service from San Francisco to San Jose:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7YHNpOj7sQ

Second is San Jose to Gilroy to the Pacheco Pass Tunnel to the Wye...lots of interesting stuff here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Wn3ynHNZ5A
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  #2634  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 1:59 PM
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Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
Yeah, nobody has ever driven to a park-and-ride. They've all taken transit.
Is there an example, anywhere on the planet, of a successful auto-oriented HSR line? Because that's the CA plan.
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  #2635  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 5:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Is there an example, anywhere on the planet, of a successful auto-oriented HSR line? Because that's the CA plan.
Is there an example, anywhere on the planet, of a successful transit-only airport?

Can't drive to the airport. No taxi stand, no parking garage, no rental cars.
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  #2636  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 5:59 PM
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Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
Is there an example, anywhere on the planet, of a successful transit-only airport?

Can't drive to the airport. No taxi stand, no parking garage, no rental cars.
What is the point of this silly question?

Pointing out that rail doesn't work unless you have existing public transit passengers has nothing to do with whether or not people will fly in planes based on the availability of airport parking.
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  #2637  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 6:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
Is there an example, anywhere on the planet, of a successful transit-only airport?

Can't drive to the airport. No taxi stand, no parking garage, no rental cars.
Billy Bishop?
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  #2638  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 6:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
Is there an example, anywhere on the planet, of a successful transit-only airport?

Can't drive to the airport. No taxi stand, no parking garage, no rental cars.
You keep bringing this same argument up and its already been debunked multiple times. The whole advantage of HSR transit is being able to go downtown to downtown without having to drive to the outskirts of the city and back. If CAHSR doesn't have that and most riders have to drive to a commuter station then it loses its whole advantage.
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  #2639  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 7:14 PM
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  #2640  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2019, 9:33 PM
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Originally Posted by BrownTown View Post
You keep bringing this same argument up and its already been debunked multiple times. The whole advantage of HSR transit is being able to go downtown to downtown without having to drive to the outskirts of the city and back. If CAHSR doesn't have that and most riders have to drive to a commuter station then it loses its whole advantage.
Yeah, they should have built a train station underneath Transbay when they rebuilt it. And if only LA's transit network centered around LA Union Station instead of Disneyland.
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