Perimeter Highway | Winnipeg - Page 121

WildCake · #**2401** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Ps: Where’s the island in Île des Chênes?

Chênes is oak in french. Must've been a bunch of oak trees back in the day and they called the town island-of-oaks.

rrskylar · #**2402** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

^ Makes me glad I shut down my Facebook account nearly a decade ago!

Yeah but how do you see the stuff your friends dogs did or the great vacation pics that friends of friends took?

bomberjet · #**2403** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by WildCake

Chênes is oak in french. Must've been a bunch of oak trees back in the day and they called the town island-of-oaks.

Or in English, Oak Island. Shit, that's where all the treasure is buried!!

Jeff · #**2404** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 6:13 PM**

my favourite recent perimeter criticism is still the vet clinic opposed to his clients soon having to use an access road to get to his business... imagine one business thinking they're important enough to alter the safety and functionality of nationally significant piece of infrastructure LOL

esquire · #**2405** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 6:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff

my favourite recent perimeter criticism is still the vet clinic opposed to his clients soon having to use an access road to get to his business... imagine one business thinking they're important enough to alter the safety and functionality of nationally significant piece of infrastructure LOL

The problem is that complaints like that have been indulged far too often in the past, which has led to a sense of entitlement.

WildCake · #**2406** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 7:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

The problem is that complaints like that have been indulged far too often in the past, which has led to a sense of entitlement.

Do they really get indulged in as an isolated complaint? I feel like it's these people that pull on the heart strings of others living in the area and get them riled up, which leads to a wave of complaints against a given project. Like I could see "small local vet" getting people of oak bluff on their side and then spamming the government with complaints.

That said, it seems there is finally enough global support for a limited access freeway that MI can take their stand rather than caving for localized opposition of people losing their private access to Perimeter.

The media definitely loves to get one contrarian opinion every time there's a government proposal out so its no surprise St Mary's deer guy made it to CTV news.

Dengler Avenue · #**2407** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 7:41 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by WildCake

Do they really get indulged in as an isolated complaint? I feel like it's these people that pull on the heart strings of others living in the area and get them riled up, which leads to a wave of complaints against a given project. Like I could see "small local vet" getting people of oak bluff on their side and then spamming the government with complaints.

You see? This is what I've been concerned about. Maybe I still have to remind you guys to make it to the information session today (if you didn't make the one yesterday). It's from 5 to 8 pm at 666 Silverstone Avenue. The one tomorrow (December 12) takes place from 4:30 to 7:30 pm at 101-123 McDonald Road, Oak Bluff.

Ps: Alright. I saw the name Oak Bluff and immediately got the urge to tell everyone to storm the one tomorrow instead.

Quote:

That said, it seems there is finally enough global support for a limited access freeway that MI can take their stand rather than caving for localized opposition of people losing their private access to Perimeter.

Let's keep the political will strong!

Quote:

The media definitely loves to get one contrarian opinion every time there's a government proposal out so its no surprise St Mary's deer guy made it to CTV news.

Like I said, move to Île des Chêne and hug trees.

Corndogger · #**2408** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 7:57 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff

my favourite recent perimeter criticism is still the vet clinic opposed to his clients soon having to use an access road to get to his business... imagine one business thinking they're important enough to alter the safety and functionality of nationally significant piece of infrastructure LOL

I would have thought there would be huge support for the use of access roads.

bomberjet · #**2409** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 8:13 PM**

If it takes someone 1 minute longer. nope zero support. They'd rather jut out across the roadway in high speed traffic.

The vet will actually have the road 8E interchange just a half mile away. So they'll have pretty good access from the west. They'll have nothing to the east as the get blocked in by the railway. Would need to head south and connect to PR 330. Not sure what time frame the 8E interchange would be though. Seems like it would be quite low on the priority list. However it would be one of the cheaper interchanges.

Dengler Avenue · #**2410** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 8:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

If it takes someone 1 minute longer. nope zero support. They'd rather jut out across the roadway in high speed traffic.

Am I just paranoid, or is it a legitimate concern that the final session, which takes place in Oak Bluff, aka the main source of contention, will make or break this grand project?

bomberjet · #**2411** Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 8:28 PM**

IMO this is too big to be shut down by some local people. Even if they get organized Seems like there have been extensive consultations done already with many options to choose from.

Specific to Oak Bluff, I think they've dealt with that area fairly well. Pushed the highway away from the town, minimizing noise, etc. The new interchange cleans up the road network very well.

mcpish · #**2412** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 4:06 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

What about a giant 3-lane roundabout interchange for those 2 locations? British style.

Glad to see someone else mentioned it. I was just going to mention this too.
When I was over in the UK driving around I really liked the design of the interchanges on the UK motorways like the M1 where they have a separate big roundabout above/below grade-separated from the main motorway. So you end up having 2 bridges crossing the motorway as the big roundabout handles the traffic for through-traffic on the non-major road only and any entering/exiting traffic from the main motorway. This leaves the main motorway free-flowing through the entire thing either above or below.
It's too bad I've never seen this kind of design here. Takes only slightly more space than a diamond yet it works at least as well as a parclo without taking up nearly as much land.

This is pretty much the most common type of interchange you'll see throughout the UK yet I've never seen them in North America.

Example:

buzzg · #**2413** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 4:11 AM**

The people that would complain with the vet (and the vet) are the same people complaining about all the accidents and deaths around there. Too stupid to realize the former is how you solve the latter.

Dengler Avenue · #**2414** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 4:14 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by buzzg

The people that would complain with the vet (and the vet) are the same people complaining about all the accidents and deaths around there. Too stupid to realize the former is how you solve the latter.

Some people simply aren’t used to proper freeways... What do you expect...

Dengler Avenue · #**2415** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 1:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcpish

Glad to see someone else mentioned it. I was just going to mention this too.
When I was over in the UK driving around I really liked the design of the interchanges on the UK motorways like the M1 where they have a separate big roundabout above/below grade-separated from the main motorway. So you end up having 2 bridges crossing the motorway as the big roundabout handles the traffic for through-traffic on the non-major road only and any entering/exiting traffic from the main motorway. This leaves the main motorway free-flowing through the entire thing either above or below.
It's too bad I've never seen this kind of design here. Takes only slightly more space than a diamond yet it works at least as well as a parclo without taking up nearly as much land.

This is pretty much the most common type of interchange you'll see throughout the UK yet I've never seen them in North America.

Example:

We technically do have them in Canada. Examples include Dorval Circle between A20 and A520 in Montréal, and a handful of interchanges of A40 (Metropolitan Expressway). The traffic on the cross roads is so high, though, that every single one of those circles has traffic lights for the cross roads.

Andy6 · #**2416** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 1:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

The problem is that complaints like that have been indulged far too often in the past, which has led to a sense of entitlement.

People are perfectly entitled to raise concerns about the effect of government policies and plans on their personal interests. The government can then try to find a way to accommodate them. I don’t think the evil vet is suggesting that the entire project should be abandoned to accommodate his/her desire to stay in business.

esquire · #**2417** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 2:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy6

People are perfectly entitled to raise concerns about the effect of government policies and plans on their personal interests. The government can then try to find a way to accommodate them. I don’t think the evil vet is suggesting that the entire project should be abandoned to accommodate his/her desire to stay in business.

Who ever said they weren't entitled to raise complaints or concerns?

The problem is when the interests of the thousands of daily highway drivers are overlooked because one resident or business owner along the way kicks up a fuss over the prospect of having to drive an extra kilometre or whatever, and then the local MLA intervenes and gets the highways department to change its plans as has happened in the past. The end result is you have dangerous access points left open, contrary to the principles of good expressway design.

So really, the issue here isn't when concerns are raised so much as it is what happens when those concerns are acted upon.

wardlow · #**2418** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 4:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

The problem is when the interests of the thousands of daily highway drivers are overlooked because one resident or business owner along the way kicks up a fuss over the prospect of having to drive an extra kilometre or whatever, and then the local MLA intervenes and gets the highways department to change its plans as has happened in the past. The end result is you have dangerous access points left open, contrary to the principles of good expressway design.

This is exactly how we get the kind of poorly-performing and dangerous highways Manitoba has. It's a vital trade corridor... but it's also an access road for every farmer or ex-urban commuter with land near it. Someone asks for an exception, says they weren't consulted, and that's that. The long-term problems/costs this will cause are for someone else to worry about.

Of course public consultation, notification, hearings, appeals, etc. should be part of the process. But in Manitoba it seems the loudest cry of "but I wasn't consulted!" often trumps vision, policy, and design.

bomberjet · #**2419** Posted **Dec 12, 2019, 8:19 PM**

Any words on this from the premier at today's lunch?

YWG-RO · #**2420** Posted **Dec 14, 2019, 3:34 PM**

RCMP member killed yesterday at 1630 in head on collision near 101 and 7. Tragic