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  #321  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2012, 9:47 PM
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^ I know the difference between brutalism and modernism, BUT One Chase Manhattan Plaza, brutalized the Lower Manhattan skyline. Not that it's a bad looking building, BUT the other part of this thread is called "in your region", and the building doesn't look bad, but it makes the region (Lower Manhattan) look bad. If the thread was just call Brutalist Building, then NO OCMP wouldn't be in this thread, along with OLP, and new Penn Station.

Last edited by THE BIG APPLE; Feb 16, 2012 at 10:29 PM.
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  #322  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2012, 9:51 PM
Nowhereman1280 Nowhereman1280 is offline
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Originally Posted by THE BIG APPLE View Post
How bout the building that destroyed the romantic Lower Manhattan skyline (One Chase Manhattan Plaza), or the building that replaced the Singer Building (One Liberty Plaza), or the complex that replaced (old) Penn Station. Just three examples, there are MANY more.
What Steely said, One Chase Manhattan Plaza isn't even close to being brutalist. There isn't even a single element of the design that utilizes exposed concrete. The building is about as purely modernist as they come.

THIS is a brutalist highrise:


chicagoarchitecture.info

THIS is a bruatlist highrise:


panoramio.com

THIS is a brutalist highrise:


Lee Bay


Now compare those with International Style Modernism:


chicagomag.com


flickr


Chicagoarchitecture.info



See the radical difference between the two styles?
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  #323  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2012, 10:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BIG APPLE View Post
^ I know the difference between brutalism and modernism,
i don't think you do.

otherwise you would not have brought up one liberty plaza or one chase manhattan plaza as examples of brutalist architecture. they are not in the brutalist style.





Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BIG APPLE View Post
BUT One Chase Manhattan Plaza, brutalized the Lower Manhattan skyline..... BUT the other [I]part/I] of this thread is called "in your region"....
the title of the thread is "Brutalist Buildings In Your Region". that is a very specific title asking about very specific buildings done in a very specific style (brutalist style). this thread is not some open free for all where people are supposed to post pics of any structure that they feel ruined a section of their city. brutalism has nothing to do with that. stay on topic or stop posting in this thread.
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  #324  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2012, 10:40 PM
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^ My bad, I thought this thread was for ANY building, that brutalizes the skyline. In that case a building built in the BRUTALISM style of construction in NYC would surely have to be the Metlife Building.

Another building called the "Zebra Building" in disgustingly brutal.



Another in NYC is the disgusting 450 W 33 Street



Another is the NYC police headquarters



Another is the William Beaver House



Another GREAT example is the Verizon Building



I'm not sure if the Westin Hotel on 42nd Street counts, I find it so/so, but not fitting NYC. That's up to the people to judge.

Last edited by THE BIG APPLE; Feb 18, 2012 at 3:59 AM.
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  #325  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 4:10 PM
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/davehil...m-appreciation

Interesting Video about the post war 'new brutalist' architectural movement in Britain. The video also points to a new appreciation of Brutalism.

Video Link

Last edited by Codex; Feb 17, 2012 at 4:46 PM.
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  #326  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 4:14 PM
Nowhereman1280 Nowhereman1280 is offline
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While I can see why you'd think that is the case, Beaver House and Verizon aren't quite Brutalist. Verizon is actually more along the lines of the International style. It has a similar look to the Aon Building in Chicago. Beaver house is more just a bad attempt at making something different looking than any particular style.
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  #327  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 4:30 PM
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Whilst architecture has moved beyond the 'new brutalist' post war period, you can still see brutalist influences in many modern buildings such as the new East London Line station at Shoreditch. I also found an interesting flickr set of photos relating to 'Chamberlin, Powell and Bon' Barbican & Leeds University Campus - http://www.flickr.com/photos/french-...th/6124524395/

http://www.archdaily.com/70676/brutalism-in-the-uk/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ist_structures




Last edited by Codex; Feb 17, 2012 at 5:41 PM.
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  #328  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 5:31 PM
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National Arts Centre, Ottawa, Canada:


http://www.listarchitecture.com/nati...ada/#more-4335


The Canal, Ottawa by Asif A. Ali, on Flickr
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  #329  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 5:36 PM
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Uh, Big Apple, not all of those buildings are Brutalist. Not by a long shot.

And 450 W. 33rd is one of the better looking Brutalist buildings in this thread.

Nowhereman--While the use of concrete as an aesthetic element is considered a defining feature of Brutalism, I do not think it is the defining feature. There are several examples of Brutalism that are faced in stone (particularly limestone), for example, and more rarely, aluminum. A variant is the brick-faced stuff often found in academic contexts.

The major defining features of Brutalism vis-à-vis Midcentury Modernism or glass-tube Modernism seem to be (a) reduced fenestration, (b) bulkier solid façade elements, (c) use of arcading, particularly to set off entrance elements at street level, and often (d) anti-urban posturing (blank walls along street faces, for example).

Other common features include (e) flaring at the top of the structure--particularly when high-rise--(f) pilotis, and (g) ornamentation styles derived from Futurism and the oeuvre of Le Corbusier. True Brutalism died out by the mid-1970s and was replaced by Postmodernism--however, the current architectural avant-garde shows Brutalist inspiration. Surprisingly, some of it is showing in Robert A.M. Stern's current projects at Drexel University (housing along the 3200 block of Chestnut, the new LeBow College of Business building).
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  #330  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 6:38 PM
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^^^ Yes, but they usually have at least SOME usage of concrete (or limestone, which are really the same general idea) in the design. Also, to me a huge defining characteristic of brutalism is a rejection of the box. Almost all brutalist structures find a way to break out of the international style mold, usually with rough hewn, bulky design elements, radical massing, or even just an intentionally jagged looking facade.

I don't think Verizon, for example, has any of those elements other than the fact that is has somewhat reduced fenestration. The formal, uniform, lines of Verizon's facade is about as international style as it gets without resorting to black anodized aluminum.
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  #331  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 9:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theKpa View Post
National Arts Centre, Ottawa, Canada:
That building reminds me a lot of Queen Elizabeth Hall in London.
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  #332  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 10:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nowhereman1280 View Post
While I can see why you'd think that is the case, Beaver House and Verizon aren't quite Brutalist. Verizon is actually more along the lines of the International style. It has a similar look to the Aon Building in Chicago. Beaver house is more just a bad attempt at making something different looking than any particular style.
The Verizon is SO International, that people have been dieing to see it reclad for YEARS now. Atleast a building constructed in the Brutal Style of Architecture the Metlife Building has its share of fans (even I like the Metlife). The Verizon is as brutal as they come!

Another building that I personally think is OK. But many people think this one is Brutal. I will agree that the Westin Hotel doesn't fit the NYC architectural mold.


Last edited by THE BIG APPLE; Feb 18, 2012 at 3:57 AM.
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  #333  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2012, 11:38 PM
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Um, Big Apple, "Brutalism" doesn't derive from the English word brutal--or anything in English at all, really.

It comes from the French béton brut, which means "rough-hewn concrete". So what is implied in Brutalism (other than the concrete) is a sense of roughness, unfinishedness. It is not a catchall term for any ugly* Modernist folly**. It is a specific style with specific features (those features being what Nowhereman and I are debating about).
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  #334  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 12:00 AM
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^ No, I know the difference, and don't have a problem with the Westin. Other people at various other websites (SSC etc) have called it a building built in the Brutalist style.

Heres another Brutalist Building, the At&T Long Lines Building.



BTW The Verizon Building IS in the Brutalist category. Most of it is a blank facade. I guess some of the streaming vertical lines (windows) could constitute it being part International Style.

Last edited by THE BIG APPLE; Feb 20, 2012 at 10:02 PM.
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  #335  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 2:54 AM
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^You need to source ALL of the images your posting or else they will be deleted.
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  #336  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 3:56 AM
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^ Ok, I did Kevin.

Last edited by THE BIG APPLE; Mar 5, 2018 at 8:19 AM.
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  #337  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 5:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BIG APPLE View Post
^ I know the difference between brutalism and modernism, BUT One Chase Manhattan Plaza, brutalized the Lower Manhattan skyline. Not that it's a bad looking building, BUT the other part of this thread is called "in your region", and the building doesn't look bad, but it makes the region (Lower Manhattan) look bad. If the thread was just call Brutalist Building, then NO OCMP wouldn't be in this thread, along with OLP, and new Penn Station.
This is an absolutely bizarre post.
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  #338  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 5:25 AM
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^ How's it bizarre. I originally thought that this thread was about buildings in my region (NYC) that Brutalized the skyline. Everyone has a misconception here and there. Then I realized that it was about Brutalism (the Architectural style).
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  #339  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 12:46 PM
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New York City does have some very good examples of brutalism such as the concrete brutalist estates on Roosevelt Island, which featured in the 2005 film Dark Water starring Jennifer Connelly .

http://www.interiordesign.net/blog/C..._Brutalism.php

If you go to page 6 of this thread there are pictures of some of this brutalist architecture.








Last edited by Codex; Feb 18, 2012 at 2:23 PM.
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  #340  
Old Posted Feb 18, 2012, 10:09 PM
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NYC is full of them, but three fourths are low-mid rises, some high rises.
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