VIA Rail

[Dengler Avenue]

https://globalnews.ca/news/6248373/v...hless-service/

No-cash policy for purchases on Via coaches upsets some people.

My take: bring your own food and drinks

[milomilo]

Can you use debit cards? I'm all for getting rid of cash (it's 2019), but forcing people to use credit cards is shitty.

[Dengler Avenue]

Debit? Was that ever a thing? (Honest question here.)
The one time I took Via was almost 6 years ago. I remembered not purchasing anything, but I wasn’t sure whether that was due to inability to use debit or ridiculous price.

[milomilo]

As in your regular bank card. It used to be you could only use it at places that used Interac, but now they (at least mine does), can be paid by Visa. But to VIA, they specifically might need a credit card as they don't have an internet connection all the time and can't confirm the funds are on the card.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by milomilo

As in your regular bank card.

That I know. I have one too. If anything, I only reserve credit for special occasions (i.e. using tolled roads in Ontario).

It used to be you could only use it at places that used Interac, but now they (at least mine does), can be paid by Visa. But to VIA, they specifically might need a credit card as they don't have an internet connection all the time and can't confirm the funds are on the card.

Fair enough. From the receiver's end, credits are much less risky.

[milomilo]

I use credit pretty much exclusively now, but I know there was a time not too long ago where I only had a debit card and it only had Interac. It was super annoying not being able to pay for things in most places, and while I fully sympathise getting rid of cash, forcing people to take on expensive debt is poor form. Especially by a Crown corporation that is supposed to be the "for the people" option. It's 2019, surely there must be a way?

[rbt]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

https://globalnews.ca/news/6248373/v...hless-service/

No-cash policy for purchases on Via coaches upsets some people.

I kinda understand it. They don't take debit due to transactions being offline and a number of VIA passengers are students under 18 years of age (where they cannot get a credit card).

Gift cards purchased at stations only, not online, is quite annoying.


They could add the option for a $10 onboard credit at ticket purchase time and most would be happy, particularly if the balance carried over to their next trip. Food credits would be pre-loaded at the same time they pre-load the tickets prior to departure.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

A huge VIA system like some of you are proposing would kill it financially. It would effectly eave the country with a large rail service that serves everyone very poorly and the travelling public would be MUCH worse off.

Ok, I'll bite. Please explain why it would be a detriment?

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Ok, I'll bite. Please explain why it would be a detriment?

You'd rather a system that was practically useless, serving no one adequately and was so heavily subsidized that it would go bankrupt, over a more limited scope system that could serve some areas well?

[ssiguy]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Ok, I'll bite. Please explain why it would be a detriment?

Easy...…….there is a set amount of funds for any government funded program and therefore priorities must be set. Just because every out post in the country wants a hospital, school, or sports arena doesn't mean they should get one. By trying to do so making sure everyone has that service means those services have to be cut back in areas that really need them to make up the financial costs.

To bring it to a transportation analogy, imagine a transit system where service to the hinterlands is provided for political expediency but runs practically empty. Those subsidies needed to keep that service afloat means those subsidies can't be used elsewhere resulting in a cut back in service on the transit routes that are already running over capacity.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Debit? Was that ever a thing? (Honest question here.)
The one time I took Via was almost 6 years ago. I remembered not purchasing anything, but I wasn’t sure whether that was due to inability to use debit or ridiculous price.

Prior to this you could use either cash or credit card with an antiquated manual carbon copy imprinting system. Debit was never an option onboard.

I assume you can't use debit on the new system for the same reasons you can't on a plane, as there are areas on VIA routes lacking cell reception so the system is offline. Not sure why they can't go through wifi but there's probably a technical reason. Also not sure if Visa Debit and the like works, but I know it doesn't on Air Canada, and generally doesn't overseas (sometimes it randomly does, though).

While flying I'd say I end up getting free drinks about 1/4 of the time simply because flight attendants can't be bothered with the payment system. This goes up to well over half the time when flying domestically in the US, for whatever reason. Given that VIA employees would spend 5 minutes doing the carbon copy thing holding up service, I'm guessing we won't see the same on trains...

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

https://globalnews.ca/news/6248373/v...hless-service/

No-cash policy for purchases on Via coaches upsets some people.

My take: bring your own food and drinks

There's a few issues at play here:

- Not every has, or wants a credit card. Such individuals could include young people who are too young for a credit card, recent immigrants with no Canadian credit history, people with credit problems, or people who for one reason or another refuse to get a credit card (I have a cousin like that, does not believe in debt whatsoever and got rid of her credit card several years ago).

- Visitors to Canada. Foreign credit cards sometimes are a problem, from my observations; I've seen people have their credit cards declined because they were not compatible with Canada's system.

- The gift card method doesn't work for passengers getting on at many stations; while stations like Union Station in Toronto or some smaller stations like London or Kingston have staff or vending machines that can sell them, some stations are nothing more than an unstaffed shelter - I believe Sarnia and Woodstock are among them. Some flag stops outside the Corridor don't even have a station or shelter.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by milomilo

You'd rather a system that was practically useless, serving no one adequately and was so heavily subsidized that it would go bankrupt, over a more limited scope system that could serve some areas well?

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Easy...…….there is a set amount of funds for any government funded program and therefore priorities must be set. Just because every out post in the country wants a hospital, school, or sports arena doesn't mean they should get one. By trying to do so making sure everyone has that service means those services have to be cut back in areas that really need them to make up the financial costs.

To bring it to a transportation analogy, imagine a transit system where service to the hinterlands is provided for political expediency but runs practically empty. Those subsidies needed to keep that service afloat means those subsidies can't be used elsewhere resulting in a cut back in service on the transit routes that are already running over capacity.

So, any rail to the 4th largest city is a bad idea? Seriously, that is what you both are saying. So, let's hear an argument for not putting regular passenger service to the fourth largest city in Canada.

On an island? Nope.
No rail infrastructure? Nope.
No spot for a station? Nope.

Seriously, come up with one good answer and I will let it lie.

[Dengler Avenue]

I think the rail tracks are still there on Vancouver Island. Let's see how well-used the Victoria - Duncan bus line will be down the road. If it has any signs of becoming crush loads, then we start thinking about how to revive that line and how to put a rail station in Victoria. It will be the Island version of WCE.

(I'm assuming that widening Island Highway through Goldstream and through Malahat is a lost cause.)

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

I think the rail tracks are still there on Vancouver Island. Let's see how well-used the Victoria - Duncan bus line will be down the road. If it has any signs of becoming crush loads, then we start thinking about how to revive that line and how to put a rail station in Victoria. It will be the Island version of WCE.

(I'm assuming that widening Island Highway through Goldstream and through Malahat is a lost cause.)

The tracks are still there. The line may be revived sooner than we think. Sometime in 2020 is possible.

Widening is not going to happen.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

The tracks are still there. The line may be revived sooner than we think. Sometime in 2020 is possible.

You see? In B.C., we can favour better transit over highway widening, even when that highway is the backbone of the region. Here in Ontario, we just can't pull that off.

Widening is not going to happen.

I think the best course of action for Island Highway through that gongshow is to imitate what U.S. did with I-93 through Franconia North State Park in New Hampshire: super-2 with median divider - if 80 km/h is too high, it should be brought down to 75 km/h. Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_93.

Anyway I digress, but yes, I can see the Victoria - Nanaimo rail link restored for passenger service.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

So, any rail to the 4th largest city is a bad idea? Seriously, that is what you both are saying. So, let's hear an argument for not putting regular passenger service to the fourth largest city in Canada.

On an island? Nope.
No rail infrastructure? Nope.
No spot for a station? Nope.

Seriously, come up with one good answer and I will let it lie.

It's so isolated it's even worse than if it were on an island. (Not even exaggerating - London on its island is better connected to peers like Paris than Calgary could ever be to Toronto/Montreal.)

Burden of proof is on you I'd say - what would pissing money on a Calgary-Regina milk run service accomplish? Come up with one good answer and we'll agree with you.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

So, any rail to the 4th largest city is a bad idea? Seriously, that is what you both are saying. So, let's hear an argument for not putting regular passenger service to the fourth largest city in Canada.

On an island? Nope.
No rail infrastructure? Nope.
No spot for a station? Nope.

Seriously, come up with one good answer and I will let it lie.

I've given you an explanation many times and you've ignored it.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

You see? In B.C., we can favour better transit over highway widening, even when that highway is the backbone of the region. Here in Ontario, we just can't pull that off.

I think the best course of action for Island Highway through that gongshow is to imitate what U.S. did with I-93 through Franconia North State Park in New Hampshire: super-2 with median divider - if 80 km/h is too high, it should be brought down to 75 km/h. Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_93.

Anyway I digress, but yes, I can see the Victoria - Nanaimo rail link restored for passenger service.

The reason it won't be widened is they would need to blast away the mountain. I have driven it many times and you have shear cliffs on either side that are over 100m high. What they really should do is stack the highway. Have 2-3 lanes per direction and have one direction on an elevated section as needed. The costs would be much more than upgrading the entire E&N line.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by lio45

It's so isolated it's even worse than if it were on an island. (Not even exaggerating - London on its island is better connected to peers like Paris than Calgary could ever be to Toronto/Montreal.)

Burden of proof is on you I'd say - what would pissing money on a Calgary-Regina milk run service accomplish? Come up with one good answer and we'll agree with you.

I didn't say a milk run to Regina. I have agreed a run between Edmonton and another between Winnipeg(Toronto, along the CP tracks) and Vancouver would be something that should be done.

Originally Posted by milomilo

I've given you an explanation many times and you've ignored it.

I have not ignored anything. I have refuted it.