A comparison of NYC (the 4 densest boroughs) and a territory of the same land area in Paris, based on the results of the 2011 French census and postcensal US estimates. I've added 5-year growth figures.

http://i44.tinypic.com/jk7e39.png

Evolution of the population since 1860:

http://i42.tinypic.com/4slnow.png

The 634 km² of NYC reached their population peak in 1950, then declined, then grew again, and passed the 1950 peak in 2010. The 636 km² of Paris reached their peak in 1968, then declined, then grew again, and passed their 1968 peak in 2005.

Both territories are currently at their maximum population in history, although Manhattan (59 km²) only has 68.5% the population of its 1910 peak, and the City of Paris (87 km²) only has 77.4% the population of its 1921 peak.

France is a Northern European country, Northern European countries like UK, France and germany are richer, more developed, more liberal and cosmopolitan, this is one of the reasons why immigrants prefer to live in Northern Europe than southern europe

I think France's identity, as this nation still is for now is really complex in that matter. Neither "northern" nor "southern", or say maybe both. From Corsica to Nord-Pas-de-Calais, there's a whole little universe made of various things. Lol. And that's not even taking far and away overseas territories into account. It's just very western for sure.

I assume sooner or later, when people are ready for it, we'll end up merged with neighbors in a federal union anyway. Then the overall French territory could well be dismantled into several member regions of the federal union. I know that sounds crazy and definitely disturbing to many for now, but you never know what 50 years ahead will be like.

^^So if Lorraine is merged with Saarland and Rhineland-Palatinate, Dieudonné will become a German comedian? :shrug:

I've always thought of France as a Northern European country, it's culture and politics is Northern European, it's history and place in Europe has always been with Britain, Germany, the Netherlands etc, its empire like UK and Netherlands, it's army navy and airforce is very Northern European, paris is definitely northern and it's economical and political persuasion are Northern European...to me it is anyway, but you know your country better than me, I would say however, that France is more similar to UK, Germany and the Netherlands than Italy, Portugal or greece

There are still a big gap between Western and Eastern European countries.
Anyway could we back to topic.

First of all this was not my claim...

A fellow minister did not call Kyenge an orangutan, that was a Lega Nord senator (you are displaying your ignorance of Italian politics here proving your "opinion" is based on nothing more than the headlines and your own stereotypes to fill in the gaps). What about the fact that Italy even has a black immigrant minister?* The remarks were widely condemned, as are instances where bananas were thrown at black players (which didn't happen as often as you make it out to be). Balotelli gets crap because he is dumb and an asshole, if he just plays well and doesn't break into women's prisons or sets things on fire he's just another Italian football player scoring goals for his team or country.

Lastly, you have just as much prejudice towards Italians or Greeks judging by your posts as you suppose they have against "people of color" (a racist term in itself).



*(btw how many immigrant cabinet members in the USA? Thought so...)

Population growth in the Spanish provinces and the departments of Metropolitan France (the European part of France) in 2010, based on the results of the 2011 French and Spanish censuses. For comparison, I'm also adding a map showing population growth in 2007, the last year before the crisis, based on intercensal estimates.

http://i44.tinypic.com/2ed1rif.png

http://i43.tinypic.com/10z7ng1.png

OFF Topic: I have a question about the language.
"More than -0.5%" would not be more correct to "less than -0.5%" in this map?
Because for me, a minus of a negative is positive while a plus of a negative is negative
This would means that "less than -0.5%" means a lower decline than -0.5% while "more than -0.5%" means a higher decline than -0.5%. :shrug:

+ US states and Canadian provinces for comparison.

http://i41.tinypic.com/2ywxve1.png

http://i42.tinypic.com/2rmbmeo.png

No one here does these stats better than you do, Brisavoine... Uh, we're not so well, huh? :( How comes we're not all red like a tomato? Shame. In fact, Spain just pretty much came back down to our level and even below within a tiny couple of years, the time for real estate over there to completely collapse. And overall the US is doing just as good as usual, huh? I bet MI turns red sometime soon... Damn, we're not doing good enough. :brickwall:

^^France has very small net migration, that's why. Thanks to 30+ years of Socialism (big emigration) and Lepenism (small immigration).

Those maps... :slob:
Imagine one using county level for North America (and including all of Europe). But I guess that would take a couple of days work to do? :(

A comparison of Berlin and a territory of the same land area in Paris, based on the results of the 2011 French and German censuses.

http://i39.tinypic.com/214w4ea.png

Evolution of the population since 1872. In 2011, Berlin had as many inhabitants as in 1906, whereas Paris was at its historical peak.

http://i42.tinypic.com/ih5cb8.png

A question for the forumers from Berlin: when you have to deal with the administration, renew some administrative papers, etc, do you have to go to the administrative HQ of one of the 12 Bezirke, or are there some administrative sub-offices at a more local level?

For example if you live in Prenzlauer Berg, which is in the Bezirk Pankow, do you have to go to the central Bezirksamt Pankow or is there a local office in Prenzlauer Berg?

If you live in that neighborhood, where do you go to:
- renew your ID card?
- renew your passport?
- declare a birth or death?
- get your voting papers?
- get your driving license?

Show me your papers ja

Go to your local post office

To everyone here, "Lepenism" == nationalism.

:hell: I tried to shut my mouth in the first place, but I eventually can't help saying how damn right you are, Brisavoine. Those 2 bolded and fugly have been feeding off one another, and they know it even better than we do. They are the very same, the hatred party feeding on scare and issues. We'll tear their ugly ass down. Don't worry too much about that.

You're free to correct us, of course, but I doubt you'll even bother.

And I'd love to hear your arguments that 1. Italy is among the more welcoming countries in Europe for immigrants and 2. that Italy isn't a country directly across the Mediterranean from immigration sources in North Africa.

1. That was not my claim.
2. Irrelevant since we are talking legal immigration and Italy currently takes in most legal immigrants by far. It also has an immigrant as a member of government, something unheard of even in the USA (Madeline Albright notwithstanding).



Now please quit your off topic trolling.

Obama has one immigrant cabinet member. Bush had three.

1. No, this was your claim. I wrote that Italy was one of the less welcoming countries in the EU, and you claimed this was not true.

2. Italy's geographic proximity to North Africa is irrelevant to a discussion of North African migration to Italy? So Finland should get the same number of migrants on boats as Italy?

It is entirely on topic. We are talking in-migration to the EU. You apparently have no constructive response to the topic.

:haha:

You truly are a piece of work. A woman with British parents who came to the US when she was 4. The Bush ones were also people brought to the US by their parents at a very young age. Likewise Madeline Albright. The fact that they are supposed "immigrants" is nothing more than a technicality. They didn't have their education in a foreign land, the decision to come to the US wasn't even their own.

Meanwhile you think you are justified to call Italy, a country that actually does have a immigrant cabinet member in the truest sense of the word (and doesn't pride itself as being some kind of immigrant utopia), one who did came here from a very different background and eduction by her own free will, unwelcoming to immigrants.

Yes, quit your trolling indeed...

And it isn't true. Still doesn't make my claim that Italy is one of the "most welcoming" (though it is depending on definition).


Now it's North African migration all of a sudden? Who said anything about that? Geesh you are thick headed... I'm going to spell it out for you one last time...
Italy currently admits (in absolute numbers) the most immigrants of any EU nation. Its location is utterly irrelevant because if Finland was in Italy's location it wouldn't be admitting that many. Italy admitting that many is a result of its policies not its geography. We are talking about legal immigration (also from other EU states) afterall.

Really? In my experience it is right wing parties that are nationalist and anti immigrant, and left wing 'socialist' parties are liberal and pro immigrant

Germany 2013 with highest net immigration since 1993:

2013 +400.000 (estimated)
2012 +368.945
2011 +279.330
2010 +127.677
.
.

1993 +462.096
1992 +782.071 (record since reunification)
1991 +602.523

Italy, like most European countries has many immigrants, and needs them because of the low birth rate, my original post was referring to illegal immigrants and the eu rules that state that illegal immigrants have to claim asylum in the first eu country they get to, which is usually Italy, Greece or Spain, but many of these immigrants travel straight through Southern Europe to get to Northern Europe. There was a famous immigrant camp on the French coast town of Calais, many of them travel through many countries to get to France, and from there into their final intended destination...Britain. Many immigrants make their way to France, but they are supposed to claim asylum in the first eu country they get to, but they want to be in northern europe, so go to france to get into Britain, so they set up these big tented camps on the coast of calais until they can smuggle themselves into Britain, this has been happening for years and years, it was only after lots of pressure from the British government that France eventually closed the camps. The same thing happens to France aswell, where immigrants want to live in France, so travel through the Mediterranean to get there. This obviously still happens today, when asylum seekers don't want to claim asylum in the first eu country that they get to, so travel to Northern Europe first, then claim asylum there

Then you still lack experience. Politics is sadly often horribly vicious, and that's obviously not the only thing you're clueless about. :D mm?

This thread is about demographics, and if we all want to maintain a healthy and growing population, then we need immigrants, this is true for every eu country, personally I think it has been a good influence on Europe, we now have a much richer and varied society, with many vibrant cultures, anyone who thinks immigration is a bad thing have no idea how western economies work, a stop of immigration would be disastrous

Ooh ouch, that hurt, in fact I'm so dimoralised, indeed if I was French I think I would have surrendered by now;)

No my dear, the anti immigrant politicians in France, like le pen, are RIGHT WING

This has exactely nothing to do with Italy having a net migration of + 311,658 in 2013.

Shiro, your comments get stranger and stranger.

The UK isn't the US. I guess it doesn't "count" as a foreign country, in your estimation, but to most of the world, it does.

And what are your excuses for all the other foreign-born cabinet members? Afghanistan, Belgium and the Czech Republic aren't "real" foreign countries in your esteemed judgment? :uhh:

That's a very healthy immigration number for Italy, it is most likely professional people who go to Italy for better job prospects and better quality of life, untrained illegal immigrants have different needs, the racist golden dawn party in Greece, a group of thugs that have somehow attained legitimate political power, in any Northern European country they would be in jail, shows there is real anti immigrant sentiment in southern europe

So Italy isn't a "less welcoming" country and it isn't a "more welcoming" country? No, like usual, you got caught with no argument.
Yeah, how crazy of me to mention North Africa in the context of Italian immigration. Obviously North Africa has absolutely nothing to do with Italian in-migration!
What an odd and obviously wrong point. Geography is obviously related to immigration trends.

You think it's random coincidence that U.S. has more Mexican immigrants than Turkish immigrants, or that the top three immigrant groups to Italy are from Romania, Albania, and Morocco?

A comparison of the City of Munich and a territory of the same land area in Lyon, based on the results of the 2011 French and German censuses.

http://i43.tinypic.com/52z34n.png

Evolution of the population since 1841. Until 1871, Lyon was nearly twice more populated than Munich, then after 1871 Munich grew tremendously and passed Lyon shortly before 1910. By 2011, the City of Munich was 16% more populated than the corresponding territory in Lyon.

http://i39.tinypic.com/2qxx8ad.png

The metropolitan area of Munich compared to a territory of the same size around Lyon:

http://i42.tinypic.com/mlm9a1.png

Evolution of the population since 1871:

http://i42.tinypic.com/t852qa.jpg

Lyon city core is much denser and more urban than that of Munich, though.

I imagine Munich to have a greater population in the same area because the urbanity extends outward much more than Lyon. Munich is a bigger city, and looks like it.

Both cities have roughly the same size. Lyon extends a lot outward too.

I posted those pictures of the suburbs of Lyon some months ago on another forum. They show the big suburban belt surrounding Lyon.

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/...f/25/25849.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/...f/24/24120.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/...f/23/23171.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/...f/17/17373.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/...f/17/17368.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/...f/17/17459.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/2/2828.jpg

Wealthy people live in the hilly Western suburban belt (where they have blocked for more than 30 years the construction of the Western motorway bypass of Lyon):
http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/2/2844.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/2/2664.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/1/1939.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/1/1875.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/1/1621.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/2/2987.jpg

Approaching Central Lyon:
http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/7/7791.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/7/7787.jpg

Central Lyon, larger than Central Munich (in 1800, Lyon had 114,000 inhabitants, whereas Munich had only 41,000 inhabitants):
http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/7/7789.jpg

http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/7/7786.jpg

Unlike Munich, the Medieval heart of Lyon was not bombed during WW2:
http://www.survoldefrance.fr/photos/highdef/2/2984.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/qqby8l.jpg

Here are the results of the Jan. 2011 French census released 2 weeks ago for the urban areas of overseas France (except Nouméa and Papeete which have separate censuses). The figures refer strictly to urban areas, not metropolitan areas.

I'm listing the 8 largest urban areas in overseas France, with their populations at the 2011 census, and their yearly population growth between the 2006 and 2011 censuses. As you can see, the situations are quite contrasted. Some urban areas are booming, while other urban areas are either stagnating or experiencing population decline.

Note that the maps are not at the same scale.

1- Saint-Denis (Réunion): 175,309 inhabitants (in Jan. 2011)
(+0.75% per year since 2006)
http://i48.tinypic.com/2ryr975.png

2- Pointe-à-Pitre (Guadeloupe): 171,529 inhabitants (in Jan. 2011)
(+0.21% per year since 2006)
http://i50.tinypic.com/2hrcuv9.png

3- Fort-de-France (Martinique): 168,101 inhabitants (in Jan. 2011)
(-0.59% per year since 2006)
http://i50.tinypic.com/20st0ys.png

4- Nouméa (New Caledonia): 163,723 inhabitants (in Aug. 2009)
(+2.44% per year since 1996)
http://i47.tinypic.com/xfq6th.png

5- Saint-Pierre (Réunion): 155,354 inhabitants (in Jan. 2011)
(+1.48% per year since 2006)
http://i46.tinypic.com/2jdmmfm.png

6- Papeete (French Polynesia): 133,627 inhabitants (in Aug. 2012)
(+0.29% per year since 2007)
http://i48.tinypic.com/260zz1v.png

7- Cayenne (French Guiana): 106,358 inhabitants (in Jan. 2011)
(+1.18% per year since 2006)
http://i48.tinypic.com/nybvgj.png[/QUOTE]

8- Saint-Paul (Réunion): 103,916 inhabitants (in Jan. 2011)
(+0.91% per year since 2006)
http://i47.tinypic.com/4vics7.png

Ho hè, awesome job as always, Bris. For once I'm gonna kinda worship some guy... :worship:
Hahaha. :tup:

It's done! The Constitutional Council of France has just approved in its entirety the bill creating the Greater Paris Metropolis!! The bill should now be signed by the president in the coming days (perhaps before the end of the week) and become law.

The Greater Paris Metropolis (Métropole du Grand Paris in French) will officially come into existence on January 1, 2016. It will absorb at least 124 presently independent communes (which will remain in existence, but will be under the authority of the Greater Paris Metropolis), with a population of at least 6.7 million inhabitants. Some more communes can join before the autumn of 2014, so we will know the exact territory and population of the Greater Paris Metropolis only next autumn, but the figures I'm giving here are the minimum figures (if no other commune joined).

It's the greatest day in the administrative history of Paris since the act of 1859 which enlarged the city of Paris by absorbing the then suburbs of the city! :cheers:

This map shows the minimum extent possible of the Greater Paris Metropolis (more communes may join before the autumn of 2014), with its 124 communes. In green are parks, woods, and airports. In pale yellow are built-up and industrial areas.

http://i44.tinypic.com/ieklqw.png

Satellite view showing the north-western border of the Greater Paris Metropolis (minimum extent). As you can see, many dense suburbs are still lying beyond the borders of the future Greater Paris Metropolis:

http://i42.tinypic.com/f09ls5.png

What's the maximum extent Greater Paris can get to? and what would you guesstimate it will become?

According to the bill, the maximum extent is the extent I've shown on the map plus all the communes which share a border with this minimum perimeter (i.e. all the communes which border the red line on my map). If all these communes decided to joined, then the Greater Paris metropolis would be made up of 170 communes, and its population would be 7.7 millions inhabitants.

It is however probable that a majority of these communes will NOT join the Greater Paris Metropolis, for fear of becoming a small voice in a big assembly, and of losing too many powers. So probably only a few communes beyond the red line will join, but I do not know how many. Answer by the Autumn of next year!

In the future, however, the French government may redraw the borders of the Greater Paris Metropolis after realizing it's stupid to cut the suburbs in half. Even worse, they've cut CDG airport and Orly airport in half (half of each of these airports will be inside the Greater Paris Metropolis, and half outside of it). More and more voices are saying that the borders are stupid and should have been drawn much further out. So hopefully they will redraw them in the future.

What will be the size of it, in terms of sqkm ?
And is their really a political reorganization ?
A Greater Paris Parliament so to speak....?

Minimum size: 762 km²
Maximum size: 1,158 km²
Exact size will be known by the Autumn of next year.

There will be a metropolitan council (conseil de la métropole du Grand Paris) made up of representatives from the communes (each commune will have from 1 to 5 representatives in the council, depending on the size of their population, except the City of Paris which will have 90 councilors in the council; in total the metropolitan council will be made up of 337 councilors at its minimum extent, i.e. 124 communes).

Above the metropolitan council there will be the president of the Greater Paris metropolitan council (président du conseil de la métropole du Grand Paris). He will be a little bit what the Mayor of London is to Greater London. Unlike in London, he won't be elected by the citizens but instead he will be elected by the councilors in the metropolitan council, who themselves won't be elected but will be appointed by the municipal councils of the communes, who are elected by the citizens in the municipal elections.

As you can see, it's a very undemocratic organization for a structure that will manage the urban issues of 7 million people. The deputies in the National Assembly voted in favor of having half of the metropolitan councilors elected directly by the citizens in 2020 (there will be municipal elections in 2014 and 2020), but the Senators rejected it. After a complicated back and forth, I see that the latest version of the bill which should be signed by the president in the coming days says that the government must present a report to the parliament regarding the direct election of the metropolitan councilors by 2015, and a law organizing the direct election of the metropolitan councilors must be passed in parliament before Jan. 1, 2017.

At this point it is unclear how many of the metropolitan councilors will be directly elected by the citizens from 2020 onwards (half of them? all of them?). It will probably be a matter of debate until the end of 2016. What's certain is from Jan. 1, 2016 to the municipal elections in March 2020, the metropolitan council of Greater Paris will be made up of unelected councilors appointed by the municipal councils of the communes making up the Greater Paris Metropolis, with the City of Paris sending 90 councilors to the metropolitan council (all of them from the majority party I suppose, so if the Socialist-Green-Communist coalition wins the municipal elections of the City of Paris in March 2014 by 50.01%, the 90 representatives of the City of Paris from Jan. 1, 2016 to March 2020 will nonetheless be 100% Socialist-Green-Communist).

To make things even worse, it is unclear at this point whether the Mayor of Paris could also be President of the Greater Paris metropolitan council. The recently passed law banning politicians from holding 2 executive offices at the same time seems to indicate that he/she couldn't. So we would end up with 3 different persons representing Paris: the Mayor of Paris (probably Socialist Anne Hidalgo), the President of the Greater Paris metropolitan council (either Socialist Jean-Marie Le Guen or Socialist Claude Bartolone, as things are shaping up), and the President of the Paris Region (Île-de-France), currently Socialist Jean-Paul Huchon, but perhaps center-right Valérie Pécresse after the regional elections in 2015. Valérie Pécresse, by the way, the center-right opposition leader in the regional council, is opposed to the Greater Paris Metropolis. She says it's the Paris Region that should be the metropolitan structure for Paris.

French politics. :D

It's surprising to hear that a socialist will probably win the paris election, after the damage they've caused to the French economy, I thought a conservative might be elected, that's what Paris and France needs right now

Based on the recently published results of the 2011 French and German censuses, here is a comparison of the age structure in the largest French and German metropolitan areas.

For France, the results of the metro areas will be published only in July. What we have now is only the results of the departments. Here I've used the departments which correspond the best to the largest French metro areas. Note that this may lead to some statistical bias in a few cases (for example the metro area of Bordeaux would have relatively more young people than the department of Gironde, because Gironde includes some coastal resorts full of retirees, like Arcachon, which are not part of the Bordeaux metro area; likewise, the Lyon metro area has probably relatively more children than the Rhône department, because many family-oriented suburbs of Lyon are located in the neighboring Ain department). For Germany, I'm using the metro areas that we've defined on SSC.

http://i44.tinypic.com/2zhijig.png

Population from age 0 to 14:
- Nord (Lille): 20.2% (i.e. 20.2% of the population in the Nord department were between the ages of 0 and 14 at the 2011 census)
- Paris Region (Île-de-France): 19.7%
- Rhône (Lyon): 19.0%
- Bouches-du-Rhône (Marseille): 17.9%
- Haute-Garonne (Toulouse): 17.6%
- Gironde (Bordeaux): 17.4%
- Alpes-Maritimes (Nice): 16.0%
- Stuttgart: 14.3%
- Rhine-Main: 14.0%
- Hamburg: 13.8%
- Munich: 13.8%
- Rhine-Ruhr: 13.3%
- Berlin: 12.7% (Berlin the city without children!)

Population from age 15 to 24:
- Rhône (Lyon): 14.8%
- Haute-Garonne (Toulouse): 14.6%
- Nord (Lille): 14.2%
- Gironde (Bordeaux): 13.2%
- Paris Region (Île-de-France): 13.2%
- Bouches-du-Rhône (Marseille): 12.9%
- Stuttgart: 11.4%
- Alpes-Maritimes (Nice): 11.3%
- Rhine-Ruhr: 11.1%
- Rhine-Main: 10.7%
- Munich: 10.7%
- Hamburg: 10.6%
- Berlin: 10.1%

Population from age 25 to 49:
- Munich: 39.1%
- Berlin: 37.2%
- Hamburg: 36.9%
- Paris Region (Île-de-France): 36.6%
- Rhine-Main: 36.6%
- Stuttgart: 35.8%
- Haute-Garonne (Toulouse): 35.5%
- Rhine-Ruhr: 34.5%
- Rhône (Lyon): 34.2%
- Gironde (Bordeaux): 33.4%
- Nord (Nord): 33.2%
- Bouches-du-Rhône (Marseille): 32.6%
- Alpes-Maritimes (Nice): 31.8%

Population from age 50 to 64:
- Rhine-Ruhr: 20.2%
- Berlin: 20.1%
- Rhine-Main: 19.7%
- Gironde (Bordeaux): 19.5%
- Alpes-Maritimes (Nice): 19.2%
- Bouches-du-Rhône (Marseille): 19.1%
- Stuttgart: 19.0%
- Hamburg: 18.9%
- Nord (Lille): 18.5%
- Munich: 18.1%
- Haute-Garonne (Toulouse): 17.7%
- Paris Region (Île-de-France): 17.7%
- Rhône (Lyon): 16.9%

Population 65 y/o and older:
- Alpes-Maritimes (Nice): 21.8%
- Rhine-Ruhr: 20.8%
- Berlin: 20.0%
- Hamburg: 19.9%
- Stuttgart: 19.5%
- Rhine-Main: 19.0%
- Munich: 18.4%
- Bouches-du-Rhône (Marseille): 17.6%
- Gironde (Bordeaux): 16.5%
- Rhône (Lyon): 15.1%
- Haute-Garonne (Toulouse): 14.6%
- Nord (Lille): 13.8%
- Paris Region (Île-de-France): 12.8% (Paris the city without old people!)

Comparison of Paris (the Paris Region: 12,012 km²) and Berlin (the Berlin metro area: 17,389 km²) in absolute values (2011 French and German censuses).

Population all ages:
- Berlin metro area: 4,861,570
- Paris Region: 11,852,851 (2.44 times Berlin)

Population 65 y/o and older:
- Berlin metro area: 972,410
- Paris Region: 1,514,718 (1.56 times Berlin)

Population 50 to 64:
- Berlin metro area: 975,380
- Paris Region: 2,096,976 (2.15 times Berlin)

Population 25 to 49:
- Berlin metro area: 1,808,870
- Paris Region: 4,342,766 (2.40 times Berlin)

Population 15 to 24:
- Berlin metro area: 488,950
- Paris Region: 1,562,212 (3.20 times Berlin)

Population 0 to 14:
- Berlin metro area: 615,960
- Paris Region: 2,336,179 (3.79 times Berlin)

The French statistical office INSEE has published the population growth of the French departments in the year 2012. Looking at the departments which grew the most in 2012, it struck me that there appear 6 neatly defined corridors of high population growth in Metropolitan France (the European part of France).

Here on the map I have indicated those 6 corridors of high population growth in Metropolitan France, plus the 2 overseas departments which boomed in 2012 (the 3 other overseas departments had much slower growth, or even negative growth for Martinique). I've also added the population growth of the Paris Region (Île-de-France) in 2012 for comparison.

The 5 corridors in continental France are all centered on big regional metropolitan areas (Lyon, Toulouse, Bordeaux, Nantes, Rennes, Montpellier), plus Geneva whose high growth spills into French territory (note that the Canton of Geneva's population growth is NOT included in the figures for the Lyon-Geneva corridor). Some big French metro areas missing are Marseille, Lille, and Strasbourg, whose growth is slow, and Nice, which experienced negative population growth in 2012 (lots of retirees live in the Nice metro area, so high death rate there).

http://i60.tinypic.com/34hcroi.png

Year after year, it looks like the Lyon-Geneva-Savoy area is placing itself as the most dynamic area of France, almost unaffected by the 2008 global crisis. Lyon is in fact building new skyscrapers in its central business district (see the LYON | Incity | 170 m / 560 ft (roof) | 37 floors thread for example).

The Tour Incity will stand to the left of the chimney with the fume, taller than any skyscraper in this picture:
http://www.lighting.philips.fr/pwc_l..._2-960-450.jpg
By aiisser, on SSC.

Thanks a lot Bris.

Concerning the Grand Paris, you said that communes should say if they wanted to integrate the Metropolis before automn 2014, but it wouldn't be possible after that moment ? Do you thinks that another enlargement would be possible thanks to politics saying that Grand Paris should be IDF in not too long?