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-   -   PHILADELPHIA | Schuylkill Yards Future Phases | 1,095 - 375 FT | 70 - 28 FLOORS (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=221324)

Gonzo the Great Jun 16, 2017 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1487 (Post 7836512)
No. Nothing is close to finalized at this point. The renders are basically representations of future product. I would not presume what gets built will look anything like what we've seen so far.



Yikes .... :help:

Nova08 Jun 16, 2017 5:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gonzo the Great (Post 7836585)
Yikes .... :help:

There's something like 700k+ sq of office space just with this project. I don't think the buildings with a commercial component will get off the ground until a few businesses commit to a considerable lease. Something like a Spark taking ~150k sq. Which we haven't heard much about their "move" recently.

There is also a sizeable residential component. I think they will want to see how Philadelphia truly absorbs all of the residential space built over the past 3-5 years and within the next 2-4 years.

City Wide Jun 17, 2017 1:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nova08 (Post 7836971)
There's something like 700k+ sq of office space just with this project. I don't think the buildings with a commercial component will get off the ground until a few businesses commit to a considerable lease. Something like a Spark taking ~150k sq. Which we haven't heard much about their "move" recently.

There is also a sizeable residential component. I think they will want to see how Philadelphia truly absorbs all of the residential space built over the past 3-5 years and within the next 2-4 years.


My take on all this is, as you speculated, there won't be any new construction unless there is very significant lease commitments in hand. I'm alittle surprised by that since space is said to be tight and very much in demand in the UC area. But I also assume that simple office space, such as FMC, is a different animal and easier to market then labs and research type space.

If this is in fact true then design wouldn't even start until the space is somewhat spoken for. Which probably means that any new construction is a year or more away. I hope I'm wrong-----

I also wonder how the development of this area fits in with, or maybe even competes with the fairly new and very ambitious plans that the Science Center has for the UC High School site. Since Drexel is suppose to be one of the big players behind the SC it seems like they might be fighting themselves to find new tenants.

In terms of apartments----when one considers the number of commuters via train to points north and south, I've often wondered if an apartment building very close to the station wouldn't have a built in base of people who would be interested just based on the location

Boku Jun 27, 2017 1:35 PM

This says work on the park and the Bulletin building could start in "late summer."

http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...-20170627.html

summersm343 Jun 27, 2017 3:13 PM

Schuylkill Yards is the latest Philly project with workforce-diversity aims

Read more here:
http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...-20170627.html

summersm343 Jun 27, 2017 3:14 PM

Schuylkill Yards developer commits $5M to West Philly neighborhood initiative

Read more here:
https://philly.curbed.com/2017/6/27/...od-development

jsbrook Jun 28, 2017 4:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343 (Post 7847119)
Schuylkill Yards is the latest Philly project with workforce-diversity aims

Read more here:
http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...-20170627.html

.1% penalty for failing to satisfy diversity standards is a complete joke. How about a 2% penalty? I do think the contractors should be able to avoid a larger penalty, that should be implemented, by making a showing that they attempted to meet the standards and qualified, minority applicants did not exist. And if that's the case, it demonstrates a failing on the part of the city and community groups with respect to job training and programs to facilitate skilled labor.

summersm343 Jun 29, 2017 2:56 AM

Community leaders hopeful as Brandywine and Penn Medicine commit to local and minority hiring for upcoming projects

Read more here:
http://planphilly.com/articles/2017/...oming-projects

eixample Jun 29, 2017 9:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsbrook (Post 7848017)
I do think the contractors should be able to avoid a larger penalty, that should be implemented, by making a showing that they attempted to meet the standards and qualified, minority applicants did not exist. And if that's the case, it demonstrates a failing on the part of the city and community groups with respect to job training and programs to facilitate skilled labor.

I agree the penalty is too small but I find it interesting that you would pin the blame on the city and community groups for failing to find qualified minority groups and not the building trade unions (who have been excluding minority groups for centuries). It's not like the city and community groups are doing a lot for the white kids with family connections who find their way into the union system.

jsbrook Jun 29, 2017 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eixample (Post 7849442)
I agree the penalty is too small but I find it interesting that you would pin the blame on the city and community groups for failing to find qualified minority groups and not the building trade unions (who have been excluding minority groups for centuries). It's not like the city and community groups are doing a lot for the white kids with family connections who find their way into the union system.

I didn't pin the blame on the city and community groups. I said IF there aren't qualified diversity applicants, that's something the city and community groups should work to fix. It doesn't just apply to minorities exclusively, though. We need to do more to facilitate skilled trades and job training. Take a page out of Germany's book. Not everyone is meant to go to University. It shouldn't be the only path to financial success or socially acceptable choice, but it's viewed that way in many circles. Here, Brandywine has actually pledged some of this money for job training and hiring of local residents, which is nice to see. This is discussed in Summers other link and other articles.

Elevator1 Jun 29, 2017 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eixample (Post 7849442)
I agree the penalty is too small but I find it interesting that you would pin the blame on the city and community groups for failing to find qualified minority groups and not the building trade unions (who have been excluding minority groups for centuries). It's not like the city and community groups are doing a lot for the white kids with family connections who find their way into the union system.

Back in the day when I was a trade contractor, when there were public funded projects that absolutely required MBE, WBE participation to a certain percentage, and those entities did not exist in real life, individuals would form companies that met MBE, WBE requirements and they would act as brokers, passing your purchase orders on to vendors (for a fee), thus they were the contracting entities and you met your requirements. Total fraud, but it satisfied the bureaucrats where reason could not prevail. Hopefully this training and real hiring will signal a better result.

skyscraper Jun 29, 2017 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elevator1 (Post 7849469)
Back in the day when I was a trade contractor, when there were public funded projects that absolutely required MBE, WBE participation to a certain percentage, and those entities did not exist in real life, individuals would form companies that met MBE, WBE requirements and they would act as brokers, passing your purchase orders on to vendors (for a fee), thus they were the contracting entities and you met your requirements. Total fraud, but it satisfied the bureaucrats where reason could not prevail. Hopefully this training and real hiring will signal a better result.

I don't know that I would call it fraud, I would say it's dirty, I would say it's obeying the letter but not the spirit of the law, and it illustrates that you can't legislate diversity.

Knight Hospitaller Jun 29, 2017 2:54 PM

I wouldn't even call it "dirty." If there are no qualified entities, you have to make one up. It's a game that assuages political forces but bears little relation to reality. It's not like you can hand a hammer to any guy/gal on the street that meets a certain physical description and get the result that you want. I'm with MLK. Wouldn't it be nice if we simply judged contractors and workers by the quality and price of their work?

Elevator1 Jun 29, 2017 3:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knight Hospitaller (Post 7849627)
I wouldn't even call it "dirty." If there are no qualified entities, you have to make one up. It's a game that assuages political forces but bears little relation to reality. It's not like you can hand a hammer to any guy/gal on the street that meets a certain physical description and get the result that you want. I'm with MLK. Wouldn't it be nice if we simply judged contractors and workers by the quality and price of their work?

You are 100% correct. The old affirmative action requirements were not really in anyone's best interest. I used a poor choice of words with Fraud. Sham is more like it. It would be nice if the best contractor for that project got the work regardless of other influences and requirements. Sorry we are getting way off Schuylkill Yards here. I guess it is a slow news day.

Boku Jun 29, 2017 4:47 PM

Lol, y'all are so ignorant, I can't even. :rolleyes:

Knight Hospitaller Jun 29, 2017 6:24 PM

I suppose you "can't even" if your only response to whomever is "ignorant." At least I know enough Latin to know "ad hominem" argumentation when I see it.

1487 Jun 29, 2017 6:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elevator1 (Post 7849469)
Back in the day when I was a trade contractor, when there were public funded projects that absolutely required MBE, WBE participation to a certain percentage, and those entities did not exist in real life, individuals would form companies that met MBE, WBE requirements and they would act as brokers, passing your purchase orders on to vendors (for a fee), thus they were the contracting entities and you met your requirements. Total fraud, but it satisfied the bureaucrats where reason could not prevail. Hopefully this training and real hiring will signal a better result.

You are talking about 2 different things. MBE and WBE is an ownership thing, not a workforce diversity thing. Gov contracts have ranges for participation in which contractors are supposed to try to allocate a certain % to minority firms. In many cases there aren't a ton that provide services or materials that pertain to particular types of work.

Workforce diversity is a different issue that is largely related to the make-up of the trades in the area. Contractors do not hire labor directly if they are union. So the workers they get are reflective of what the union membership looks like.

1487 Jun 29, 2017 6:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knight Hospitaller (Post 7849627)
I wouldn't even call it "dirty." If there are no qualified entities, you have to make one up. It's a game that assuages political forces but bears little relation to reality. It's not like you can hand a hammer to any guy/gal on the street that meets a certain physical description and get the result that you want. I'm with MLK. Wouldn't it be nice if we simply judged contractors and workers by the quality and price of their work?

first of all the idea that "non minority" contractors do good work for the government on a regular basis is a joke. Poor contractors come in all colors and many of the larger firms that gets lots of local gov work don't get it because they are good.

The rules exist for a reason, even though they are flawed. Contractors develop long time relationships with vendors and subs over the years. When the contractor fits into one group generally the firms he buys and hires from fall into the same group- it may not even all be based on low pricing- it just familiarity and habit. The ranges force these contractors to engage minority or female owned firms so that some of this public money gets into their pockets. Has nothing to do with "quality"- most public work is low bid so you aren't choosing a contractor based on quality, reliability, competence, etc.

Philly-Drew Jun 29, 2017 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsbrook (Post 7848017)
.1% penalty for failing to satisfy diversity standards is a complete joke. How about a 2% penalty? I do think the contractors should be able to avoid a larger penalty, that should be implemented, by making a showing that they attempted to meet the standards and qualified, minority applicants did not exist. And if that's the case, it demonstrates a failing on the part of the city and community groups with respect to job training and programs to facilitate skilled labor.

How about some of the big players provide on the job training? It would allow people to learn good skillsets, make connections, and build their resume at the same time.

This seems so simple.

El Duderino Jun 30, 2017 4:46 AM

i think the main point here is to try to make opportunities more plentiful for those who historically have had fewer. quoting mlk assumes a whole bunch of equality that the system/free market/geography/whatever hasn't quite nailed down; i'm sure he wouldn't be celebrating the demographic numbers of the area this is meant to help.

Knight Hospitaller Jun 30, 2017 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philly-Drew (Post 7850264)
How about some of the big players provide on the job training? It would allow people to learn good skillsets, make connections, and build their resume at the same time.

This seems so simple.

Agreed. If you want historically disadvantaged groups to compete, it would be better to provide training rather than the legal equivalent of a golf handicap.

summersm343 Jun 30, 2017 3:33 PM

I hate all of you right now for this conversation lol. Please move on. Thanks :cheers:

Knight Hospitaller Jun 30, 2017 3:42 PM

^ Properly chastised. I was doing what I complain about.

PhilliesPhan Jul 3, 2017 9:29 PM

Deleted. Wrong thread.

summersm343 Jul 17, 2017 2:06 PM

Slight redesign to tower 1? Maybe this is the plan if Brandywine wins the RFP for the Cira II site?

http://payload515.cargocollective.co...c_Room_720.jpg

http://payload515.cargocollective.co...strict_720.jpg

http://www.stand-ground.com/Schuylkill-Yards

mcgrath618 Jul 17, 2017 2:28 PM

I like it. Nothing overly special about it, but I like it.

Boku Jul 17, 2017 2:43 PM

What am I looking at here? Looks like an additional building connected to the the original somehow. Strange.

mcgrath618 Jul 17, 2017 2:47 PM

It also looks like they slightly changed the tallest tower. I like it a lot.

summersm343 Jul 17, 2017 2:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boku (Post 7867291)
What am I looking at here? Looks like an additional building connected to the the original somehow. Strange.

Yes, I'm not sure. In the massing renderings released in May, this tower looks to be moved back on JFK..

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4156/3...45c86554_b.jpg

Maybe if Brandywine wins the RFP for the Cira II site, this tower will sit at the corner of 30th and JFK? And if not, it will be moved back? Not sure :shrug:

Hudson11 Jul 17, 2017 4:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boku (Post 7867291)
What am I looking at here? Looks like an additional building connected to the the original somehow. Strange.

something straight out of SHoP's playbook.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4206/...a9673f32_b.jpg
Squeezed by Keith Michael, on Flickr

SEFTA Jul 17, 2017 5:01 PM

delete

Human Scale Jul 17, 2017 5:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343 (Post 7867258)

Looks kiiiinda like a hotel proportion to me. Attached to the office building we already saw, with the addition of ballroom space with that pop out. Good mixed use. Good spot for a hotel of that size, right next to the station. And that side of the river has the shorter end of the stick when it comes to quality hotel options.

Maybe Omni Hotel will come back to us! The top of the building has a large panel that could support a hotel logo. If that top portion of the building is useable floor space, they could always do a glass effect where you see the logo from the exterior but not the interior.

Sorry I just traveled down speculation avenue. I'm bored.

iheartphilly Jul 17, 2017 6:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Human Scale (Post 7867495)
Looks kiiiinda like a hotel proportion to me. Attached to the office building we already saw, with the addition of ballroom space with that pop out. Good mixed use. Good spot for a hotel of that size, right next to the station. And that side of the river has the shorter end of the stick when it comes to quality hotel options.

Maybe Omni Hotel will come back to us! The top of the building has a large panel that could support a hotel logo. If that top portion of the building is useable floor space, they could always do a glass effect where you see the logo from the exterior but not the interior.

Sorry I just traveled down speculation avenue. I'm bored.

I'm in love with more modern design for Philly. If we can get businesses to locate here and building designs are well executed, it really shows us off as an economic success story and that Philly can thrive in the new economy. Hope to see this radical change in my lifetime.

SEFTA Jul 17, 2017 9:44 PM

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/...0Yards%204.jpg

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/...0Yards%203.jpg

cjPhilly Jul 21, 2017 7:58 PM

Just a minor update from Brandywine's investor conference call today:

"On the Schuylkill Yards project in the city of Philadelphia, we did achieve approvals in June for phase 1 which consists of about 1.3 million net square feet. We will start the design development process on those now. That will take 12 to 15 months. And then during that period of time, we'll also be launching our marketing campaign to try and find a large anchor tenant to start one of those projects."

summersm343 Jul 21, 2017 8:31 PM

^^Very nice!

dabcom Jul 21, 2017 10:02 PM

Wow.

christof Jul 22, 2017 1:07 AM

12-15 months from now? Sounds like the timeline has been pushed back a year from the original one...

jn00 Jul 22, 2017 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cjPhilly (Post 7872070)
Just a minor update from Brandywine's investor conference call today:

"On the Schuylkill Yards project in the city of Philadelphia, we did achieve approvals in June for phase 1 which consists of about 1.3 million net square feet. We will start the design development process on those now. That will take 12 to 15 months. And then during that period of time, we'll also be launching our marketing campaign to try and find a large anchor tenant to start one of those projects."

I wonder if this means that BDN didn't score Spark.

Daario Jul 24, 2017 9:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jn00 (Post 7872616)
I wonder if this means that BDN didn't score Spark.

I feel like Spark will move into one of UCity Square's new office spaces(once they get built.)

Nova08 Jul 24, 2017 9:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daario (Post 7874372)
I feel like Spark will move into one of UCity Square's new office spaces(once they get built.)

Spark currently holds about 100k sq ft of space in at least 3 buildings, if not more. That's a good chunk of space to become an anchor tenant somewhere.

But I don't think they'll be keen on operating from temporary space in 3+ buildings much past 2019, which means whatever building they go to really needs to get off the ground within the next 12 months. I forget the first building that is slowly going up now, will that provide enough space?

Urbanthusiat Jul 24, 2017 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nova08 (Post 7874399)
Spark currently holds about 100k sq ft of space in at least 3 buildings, if not more. That's a good chunk of space to become an anchor tenant somewhere.

But I don't think they'll be keen on operating from temporary space in 3+ buildings much past 2019, which means whatever building they go to really needs to get off the ground within the next 12 months. I forget the first building that is slowly going up now, will that provide enough space?

345k sqft total --3675 Market

127k sqft -- Cambridge Innovation Center
50k sqft -- Science Center
15k sqft -- Quorum
...
153k sqft remain for Spark.

Sounds about right for me.

hammersklavier Jul 26, 2017 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343 (Post 7867302)
Yes, I'm not sure. In the massing renderings released in May, this tower looks to be moved back on JFK..

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4156/3...45c86554_b.jpg

Maybe if Brandywine wins the RFP for the Cira II site, this tower will sit at the corner of 30th and JFK? And if not, it will be moved back? Not sure :shrug:

It looks kinda like it's a proposal that melds the SY Phase I and Cira II sites together. You can still see the Phase I footprint on the rear part of the building, especially in how it relates to Bulletin.

vegeta_skyline Aug 28, 2017 7:59 AM

What a massive project! Would give Philly a second downtown, really liking the design of the tallest tower as well.

summersm343 Sep 5, 2017 3:18 PM

Building near 30th St. Station that houses Sláinte Irish bar bought for $32M

Quote:

Brandywine Realty Trust has expanded its presence in University City and acquired for $32 million the building housing Sláinte Pub & Grill and Brightwood Career Institute.

The two-story, 91,000-square-foot property at 30th and Market streets sits among several of Brandywine’s other holdings in University City including: Cira Centre and FMC Tower at Cira Centre South, which the real estate investment trust developed; 3020 Market St., a 190,925-square-foot building it bought in 2011 for $8.85 million; and a redeveloped former U.S. Post Office building that it sold last year.

It’s not a surprise that Brandywine would seek to shore up its presence in University City and buy properties near its other buildings. One of the company's strategies has been to be the dominant owner of office properties in a submarket. It has effectively deployed that approach locally in Radnor as well as with trophy office space in the Central Business District.

In addition to the building's it already owns in University City, it also other interests in the neighborhood. Brandywine is involved with Drexel University in the development of Schuylkill Yards, an ambitious $3.5 billion new neighborhood that is expected to be constructed over the next two decades and looks to create a community focused on innovation. The development will take place on14 acres that Drexel has assembled over the years.

In addition, Amtrak is also moving ahead with the development of parcels around 30th Street Station. As a result of Amtrak’s vision as well as Brandywine and Drexel’s plans, that part of Philadelphia is expected to undergo over the next decade or so a transformation with billions of dollars of investment and construction activity.

The property at 3000-18 Market St. that Brandywine (NYSE: BDN) recently bought will be held as a future development site, said Jerry Sweeney, CEO of the real estate company. The parcel totals 37,444 square feet. A billboard on top of the roof of the building boasts a rendering of Schuylkill Yards and welcomes onlookers to the neighborhood. Brandywine has relocated its headquarters in space at FMC Tower at Cira Centre South from Radnor, Pa.
https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...s-sl-inte.html

iheartphilly Sep 5, 2017 3:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343 (Post 7911847)
Building near 30th St. Station that houses Sláinte Irish bar bought for $32M



https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...s-sl-inte.html

That's a premium to pay for and I bet when the time is right, it will be torn down for a new building. The location is prime.:tup:

summersm343 Sep 5, 2017 3:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartphilly (Post 7911873)
That's a premium to pay for and I bet when the time is right, it will be torn down for a new building. The location is prime.:tup:

This building will eventually be torn down -a long with the building immediately to the west of it - for towers that are a part of the Schuylkill Yards project.

If you look at this rendering:

http://drexel.edu/~/media/Images/now...A98F0D1A400B90

...the two towers on the left will replace the building that houses Slainte and the 3020 Market office building.

See site plan here:
http://www.schuylkillyards.com/plan.php

mcgrath618 Sep 5, 2017 3:39 PM

I predict that the first tower will start construction sometime in the first half of 2018.
Call it a hunch, but Brandywine can get stuff done.

City Wide Sep 5, 2017 6:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343 (Post 7911847)
Building near 30th St. Station that houses Sláinte Irish bar bought for $32M



https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...s-sl-inte.html


For alittle history about this building:
http://hiddencityphila.org/2013/05/s...market-street/

Doubtful as it is, I'd crap a brick to see the replacement look close to the drawing. Better yet would be for the new building to be built on top of what's there now. $32M seems like quite a large pile of cash for this site. Do any of you real estate types have any comment on the price?

skyscraper Sep 5, 2017 7:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by City Wide (Post 7912140)
For alittle history about this building:
http://hiddencityphila.org/2013/05/s...market-street/

Doubtful as it is, I'd crap a brick to see the replacement look close to the drawing. Better yet would be for the new building to be built on top of what's there now. $32M seems like quite a large pile of cash for this site. Do any of you real estate types have any comment on the price?

The price definitely seems high. I think if they had bought the building before they announced SY the price would have been way lower.


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